Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: moot on January 03, 2008, 02:36:15 AM
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Does anyone have it? I need to know about one small anecdote in it.
When is the second volume supposed to come out?
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a whole book just about my Dora?? :eek: :D
gimme gimme gimme!
is this the book you are talking about?
http://www.amazon.com/Focke-Wulf-190-Dora-Jerry-Crandall/dp/0976103451/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1199394734&sr=8-1
$115??? :O
man I'd love that book though :aok
found it for $75
http://cgi.ebay.com/FOCKE-WULF-FW-190-DORA-BY-JERRY-CRANDALL-EAGLE-EDITIONS_W0QQitemZ280188332531QQihZ018QQcategoryZ378QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p1638.m118
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Too rich for my blood, I fold.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Too rich for my blood, I fold.
I'm seriously thinking about the ebay one :t
though I wont be able to buy food for a few weeks... I can live off $.25 burritos for that long right?
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Somewhere in that book there's a part about an overall red-orange Ta152. That's all I'd like to know about.. No need to quote it, I'd just like to know what it says that could help with doing a skin of it for Aces High.
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Originally posted by JB73
I'm seriously thinking about the ebay one :t
though I wont be able to buy food for a few weeks... I can live off $.25 burritos for that long right?
Too late, I bought it already! Will let you know how it is.
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Bodhi can you let me know about that part on the orange 152 when you find it?
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wow how many pages is that book it is abit expensive
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Originally posted by JB73
I'm seriously thinking about the ebay one :t
though I wont be able to buy food for a few weeks... I can live off $.25 burritos for that long right?
Buy the amazon one, eat the 99cent generic pepperoni pizzas, save the boxes for breakfast, the have roughage and essential inks for vitamins.
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Get it from Crandell himself. $85
or get the leather bound version signed by 9 190D9 drivers for $175
http://www.eagle-editions.com/dorabook.htm
I have the two JG 300 volumes. Well worth every penny. Photos and artwork are amazing. They weren't by Crandell but they're from the same bunch.
http://www.eagle-editions.com/jg300.htm
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Guppy have you seen any 152s not painted in the usual colors like the ones we have in the game now?
There's supposed to be a passage in JC's book about a red-orange 152, do you remember that?
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The JG 300 volumes are by Jean-Yves Lorant and Richard Goyat and translated from French to English by Neil Page (aka FalkeEins).
His website is here:
Kaczmarek - A German view of the air war 39-45. (http://members.aol.com/falkeeins/Sturmgruppen/contents.html)
Neil Page. Jerry and Judy Crandall post over at TOCH (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/index.php)
There is a thread over there discussing the Fw 190 Dora vol. 1 book - nothing about the colored Ta 152s moot asks about. I have the book on order but haven't received it yet - a lot of folks seem to be impressed with it.
Those concerned with 'price' remember hobbies are expensive.
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Originally posted by moot
Bodhi can you let me know about that part on the orange 152 when you find it?
I should have it Monday or Tuesday. I will let you know what I find.
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Originally posted by moot
Guppy have you seen any 152s not painted in the usual colors like the ones we have in the game now?
There's supposed to be a passage in JC's book about a red-orange 152, do you remember that?
I don't have the new Crandell book on the D9. Based on the description there isn't anything on the Ta152 in it though as it's limited to the D9 series in both volumes if their website is accurate.
I have the Dieter Hermann book on the D9, but nothing in there either.
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I have a profile of a red-chinned Ta152H, scanned from the pages of a book some time back, but it didn't say anything about it (it was a brief mention of the 152).
I'd love to know if there's more to suppot the existence of this plane, as I've posted the profile before and nobody's knowns squat about it.
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Well that might be it. This is what I was told:
"The odd ball out however is in the new Jerry Crandall Dora-9 book where reference to an overall orange-red Ta152,which was flown by the Kommodore, Obslt. Fritz Auffhammer when he returned it to Rechlin Technical Centre after evaluation."
Krusty, I must have missed that scan of the profile, do you still have it up somewhere?
Thanks for the links Wotan :)
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Will re-post this evening. Am still at work and I have to reupload it. It has a caption and I think it might have been JG11 (???) but I can't recall for sure.
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Originally posted by JB73
I can live off $.25 burritos for that long right?
Your colon may be ruptured by then.
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Originally posted by moot
Krusty, I must have missed that scan of the profile, do you still have it up somewhere?
Sorry about that, forgot to upload it!
Here it is. JG301, not JG11 (couldn't remember at the time)
(http://www.nakatomitower.com/ta152h1_1.jpg)
Color's a bit dark. Looks like 2-tone green camo.
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Thanks!
What book is that from?.. The reich defense band doesn't match 301's usual colors... Are there any other references to its origin, e.g. who flew it, or where it flew?
That is probably not the plane I was thinking of. I was specificaly told it was "overall red-orange".
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The book? Something generic from the library, a while ago (probably scanned it 6 months ago). It was on a page with other graphcis (including the emblem you can see) so it didn't discuss this plane in detail. It talked breifly about late war planes, but was an "overview" type of book.
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It doesn't look right.. might have been drawn based on a second hand report or something.
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Well it was one of those books where they didn't try to do the ...say... Gunston-quality profiles. Most of the graphics looked a little like that (more cartoony, less shadows/depth). However, I can't think the artist would just paint it from imagination. Generally, even inaccurate artwork has a basis.
I've been hoping there's some other reference to this, so that I could skin it. I've not found what inspired this artist just yet.
EDIT: I heard that JG11 stole/took one of the 152Hs for "testing" (basically combat testing), and the single yellow band is the JG11 colors.
I wonder if it's just mis-labeled as JG301?
Anybody know of any JG11 TA152 references we can compare it to?
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I wouldn't trust it without some sort of photo back up. I'm sure some of the LW experts here would know better, but as with any profile, it's often the artist's interpretation. Too many times it's found not to be accurate.
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I didn't say the artist painted it from imagination, just that it didn't look right. I did say it looked like a profile made based on a second hand report or something.
A JG11 Ta152 (http://wp.scn.ru/en/ww2/f/462/2//9).
Where did you hear about the testing Ta152s JG11 borrowed from '301?
There's supposed to be a book with lots of info on JG301, including their 152s, but it's not due for a few months yet. The author won't spill any beans at all... PITA for us skinners :p
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Originally posted by Guppy35
I wouldn't trust it without some sort of photo back up. I'm sure some of the LW experts here would know better, but as with any profile, it's often the artist's interpretation. Too many times it's found not to be accurate.
Totally agree
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There's no picture of the orange 152, but a profile, a copy of the flight report, and a reason given for the paint scheme.. So it's in there.
Anyone found it yet? :)
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If it was a non-combat paint scheme (i.e. pure prototype testing) you probably won't see it as an AH skin, FYI.
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I don't think it was a prototype.. We'll know for sure when someone with the book reports on the anecdote. :)
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Just an example
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Moot, did you try asking on the LEMB?
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The response on those boards are usualy a little stiff, if there's any at all... Bodhi and a few others have said they'd be looking into it, that's good enough.
Maybe I'll give the LEMB a try - unless you've already got some pull on the right LEMB users? :)
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Sorry bud, don't post there, just use it for research once in a while. But I'm all for more 152 skins :D
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Edward Schacklady's "Butcher Bird" has a sketch of an all yellow A6 claimed flown by von Graff in a training unit (Blindflugschule) when it was shot down in July 27th 1943.
Some TA sketches too but no yellow or orange variant. It was also mentioned that night fighter units painted their planes black and Mediterranean 190 trainers were sometimes all white.
If the yellow (or orange) is a Blingflugschule colour then I doubt any TAs were used by them.
One possibility of course are the prototypes which ranged from Ta152V6 to V28 (all registered as experimental) or S-1 trainer version from the production patch.
-C+
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Graff's yellow 190a has been since debunked. I read a bit about it a while ago.
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So has anyone found it yet?
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Originally posted by Krusty
Graff's yellow 190a has been since debunked. I read a bit about it a while ago.
Care to share where at? Pierre Clostermann's book is pretty clear that this occured. Of course his book may have one or two things wrong.
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Originally posted by Fencer51
Care to share where at? Pierre Clostermann's book is pretty clear that this occured. Of course his book may have one or two things wrong.
You dare question the all knowing Krusty!?! He seems to be more than capable of just debunking anything he deems not right.
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Did you find that part on the orange paint scheme Bodhi? It's supposed to have a profile of it, and some text explaining the reason it was painted that way.
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Moot,
Got the book yesterday. Found the orange-red Ta 152 on page 155.
It says:
On 22 March 1945, the Kommodore of JG 301, Obslt. Fritz Aufhammer climbed into his all Orange-Red Ta 152 that he had been evaluating, in order to return it to the Luftwaffe proving ground at Reichlin. Because he felt uncomfortable flying a new type fighter that the trigger-happy Flak crews had not seen before, he ordered this Ta 152 to be painted a bright Orange-Red overall, including the spinner and over painting the JG 301 fuselage bands. The only thing not overpainted were the national markings necessary for identification.
On this flight, Hptm. Roderich Cescotti was asked to fly escort in a FW 190 D-9 "Green 1". The purpose of the trip was to return the Ta 152 ro Reichlin for adjustments, but more importantly to meet with engineers and officials from the Focke-Wulf factory to discuss the technical problems that were causing delivery delays in getting this new fighter to Aufhammer's JG 301. After hearing one excuse after another, Obslt. Aufhammer had heard enough. In a burst of anger and frustration he blurted out, "I don't care about your problems, you can kiss my prettythang! I need these machines right now!"
On page 151 there is a excerpt page from Hptm. Roderich Cescotti's log book showing that he escorted Obslt. Aufhammer's Orange-Red Ta 152 to and from Reichlin on 22 March 1945. They are listed in his log book as Flight Entry 1441 and 1442.
It seems to me that it existed as more than a prototype. I guess the best way to find out if it saw combat would be to see Aufhammer's logbook from 13 March 1945 on.
On page 152 it also mentions that on 13 March 1945, the promised 30 to 50 Ta 152's were not delivered due to production delays. It also says that Aufhammer pulled the few Ta 152's from III Gruppe and reassigned them into a small unit designated the Stabsschwarm.
I will post scans later today.
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Thanks!
Did it say if it was armed?
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No, it doesn't. I'd suspect it probably was, but I figure that without looking at Aufhammer's log book we will never know. The reason I think it was armed, is because of the earlier mentions of Ta 152's being pulled into one small unit on the 13th, while Aufhammer was taking the aircraft for adjustments at Rechlin on the 22nd.
Again, good bet it was, but so far impossible to verify. It sure would be cool to see his log book though.
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Bodhi's smart-arse comment aside, there are many references to it online. The yellow Graff myth has been perpetuated in print in several cases. All of them seem to stem from a single French pilot's comments about thinking he saw an all-yellow 190. The thinking is that he got it wrong, and that the bright yellow cowling streaking past at full speed could look like more yellow.
All accounts of the yellow 190 come from this, or from direct references to this pilot's single account. It's never been substantiated by any other sources as having existed. Graff was a well known ace, and if he had really flown a bright yellow 190, there would be tons of proof. He was quite willing to customize his ride (tulips, orange cowl, lightning bolts on the sides, fuslage art, etc) but never anywhere has it been mentioned he had a yellow 190.
EDIT: I skinned 2 of his planes in AH. I did a lot of checking on the matter, being curious about the yellow 190, some year ago or more.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Bodhi's smart-arse comment aside, there are many references to it online. The yellow Graff myth has been perpetuated in print in several cases. All of them seem to stem from a single French pilot's comments about thinking he saw an all-yellow 190. The thinking is that he got it wrong, and that the bright yellow cowling streaking past at full speed could look like more yellow.
All accounts of the yellow 190 come from this, or from direct references to this pilot's single account. It's never been substantiated by any other sources as having existed. Graff was a well known ace, and if he had really flown a bright yellow 190, there would be tons of proof. He was quite willing to customize his ride (tulips, orange cowl, lightning bolts on the sides, fuslage art, etc) but never anywhere has it been mentioned he had a yellow 190.
EDIT: I skinned 2 of his planes in AH. I did a lot of checking on the matter, being curious about the yellow 190, some year ago or more.
Krusty, because you can not find proof of it does not mean it does not exist. I would believe a combat pilot that saw the aircraft far more than I would any others who either write about it, or claim to "research it".
Hell, you claim that the F6F-5P was not delivered with cannons, when in fact over a thousand were delivered to the UK.
My comment is not smart prettythang, it is the truth. You are right back to acting like a "know-it-all" again. How many times is it going to take for you to realise that you are not a "expert" or a "historian". It takes far more than casual gaming and skinning to become a historian, one of the chief requisites is: "never ruling out something without concrete proof that it is wrong."
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First, don't try twisting what I've said in an unrelatd thread. I never said F6F-P wasn't DELIVERED with cannons. I said almost none SERVED with 'em.
[EDIT: Oh, and you forget to note that I'm only quoting every resource there is, and even WW agrees on the matter of the F6F-Ps and 20mms]
Oh, and should I have to prove that MG151/20s weren't in the cowl guns of 109K-4s? Hrm.???
Should I have to prove that P-38s weren't painted black for daytime use in WW2? Hrm...????
Some things are so obvious and so commonly accepted. The yellow 190a Graff is a debunked myth. Just accept it. I dunno why YOU're getting so up-in-arms anyways.
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Just because it is commonly accepted does not make it right. In 1490, it was commonly accepted that the world was flat.
You can try and turn this around all you like. It makes no difference. Everyone knows that you are a self proclaimed "know-it-all" that never admits when he is wrong! Do two year old 90 foot pines ring a bell?
Grow up and stop acting like a 12 yr old. Stop acting like an authority and listen instead of telling people they are wrong.
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Bodhi what about those scans? :)
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Sorry few problems at the end of the day. I will try to get to it at lunch time.
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Your correct Krusty, the all yellow 190 has been 'busted'.
Christer Bergström:
The whole story about Major von Graff/Graf commanding JG 2 "Richthofen" and flying an all-yellow Fw 190 originates from Pierre Clostermann's "The Big Show". In my book "Graf & Grislawski" (published in August 2003) I examined that closely.
In the latest edition of "The Big Show" (published in 2004, with the foreword written in September 2003), Pierre Clostermann made this new addition regarding the pilot of the all-yellow Fw 190:
"Later we learned that it was not Graff, but maybe Oesau". (p. 50.)
On the orange/red 152, since the pilot was worried about flak it was most likely only the underside that was painted, like on the Doras that were so painted.
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Originally posted by MiloMorai
Your correct Krusty, the all yellow 190 has been 'busted'.
Christer Bergström:
The whole story about Major von Graff/Graf commanding JG 2 "Richthofen" and flying an all-yellow Fw 190 originates from Pierre Clostermann's "The Big Show". In my book "Graf & Grislawski" (published in August 2003) I examined that closely.
In the latest edition of "The Big Show" (published in 2004, with the foreword written in September 2003), Pierre Clostermann made this new addition regarding the pilot of the all-yellow Fw 190:
"Later we learned that it was not Graff, but maybe Oesau". (p. 50.)
On the orange/red 152, since the pilot was worried about flak it was most likely only the underside that was painted, like on the Doras that were so painted.
How does that debunk an all yellow FW190?
As for the Ta 152, the book is very clear in that in was painted all over in Orange/Red and that everything was painted over except the national insignia.
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Moot, did not get to the scans again today. Will do it tomorrow morning.
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Originally posted by Krusty
Well it was one of those books where they didn't try to do the ...say... Gunston-quality profiles. Most of the graphics looked a little like that (more cartoony, less shadows/depth). However, I can't think the artist would just paint it from imagination. Generally, even inaccurate artwork has a basis.
I've been hoping there's some other reference to this, so that I could skin it. I've not found what inspired this artist just yet.
EDIT: I heard that JG11 stole/took one of the 152Hs for "testing" (basically combat testing), and the single yellow band is the JG11 colors.
I wonder if it's just mis-labeled as JG301?
Anybody know of any JG11 TA152 references we can compare it to?
In fact, Stab/JG11 did not "steal" (1) Ta, they had 4-6 at one time. Gentlemen sometimes you have to look at the men who were there during the chaos of '45., to fill in the holes in the history, the links in the chain. I have argued this before. The Stab/JG11 Ta's were not used for combat and only for "famialarization" flights. Hptm. Bruno Stolle, Kommander of JG301 was also acting Kommander of Stab/JG11 for a few months. What would you fly if you were Hptm, Stolle, on your way to and from Rechlin and Leck? And if you had operational Kommand of every Ta in theatre, what would you get your "mates" seat time in?
Anyway, (4) Stab/JG11 Ta's (unarmed) were jumped by RAF spits on a transfer flight to Leck. (2) crashed, (1) belly landed, and (1) was later captured by the Brits. Wk #150-010. Yep thats right! Green 4 supposed JG301 bird, in the National Air and Space Museum is actually a Stab JG11 ride, as documented below, by Cottbus, as well as Wk # 150-009.
Sorry Moot, no info on that colorful one at the moment. Do not believe it is the missing Stab/JG11 ride(s) though.
Free the Ta152!
(http://www.freewebs.com/ahjg11/ta152werk1.jpg)
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Originally posted by Bodhi
How does that debunk an all yellow FW190?
As for the Ta 152, the book is very clear in that in was painted all over in Orange/Red and that everything was painted over except the national insignia.
Do you know who Christer Bergström is? He is in a better position than you are.
As for the 152, it was only a suggestion.
On page 152 it also mentions that on 13 March 1945, the promised 30 to 50 Ta 152's were not delivered due to production delays. It also says that Aufhammer pulled the few Ta 152's from III Gruppe and reassigned them into a small unit designated the Stabsschwarm.
He did so because he received an order to hand over the a/c to the Geschwaderstab.
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Originally posted by MiloMorai
Do you know who Christer Bergström is? He is in a better position than you are.
Bergstrom is an excellent author, but I do not believe he knows all. Especially considering the chaos in the Luftwaffe in '45.
I never said I was an expert and I have never debunked anything on this board or anywhere else without solid proof. The only reason I got into this argument is that I hate seeing some people on this board read a couple of books and think they are an flipping expert. Especially when they are proved wrong on many occasions. It's rediculous.
As for my beliefs on history, I have a tendency to believe those who was actually there, and generally not someone that rules something out completely even though there is no definitive proof.
A for them handing over the aircraft to JG 11, hell they never built the minimum of 30 promised. So, the reasoning of production delays definitely seems to fit the bill.
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Graff's plane had marking G3+SL but another book does not recognize such unit number to exist. G2, G6 and G9 did exist though.
Only Blindflugschule that used single engined fighters was 10.
http://www.ww2.dk/air/schule/b10.htm
-C+
Edt. G3+ NJG 101 (101st Night Fighter Wing)
http://www.rlm.at/cont/archiv02_e.htm
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You got a burr in your undies Bhodi? Relax, chill.
The III./JG301 152s went to Stab JG301. The order to do so was issued March 13 1945. Stab JG 11 did not get their 152s til the end of April 1945 and most likely came from Rechlin as no two were alike.
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Stamf,
couldn't help but notice 150 027 is{was} a 152 C,tested with MK103 30mm.
Too bad it doesn't qualify to make it into the game.:cry
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Originally posted by MiloMorai
You got a burr in your undies Bhodi? Relax, chill.
The III./JG301 152s went to Stab JG301. The order to do so was issued March 13 1945. Stab JG 11 did not get their 152s til the end of April 1945 and most likely came from Rechlin as no two were alike.
Regarding the burr, your comment above is what raised that.
As for the Ta 152 machines, that is exactly what I posted with regards to the D9 book's info.
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Moot,
our scanner at work just crapped out. Sorry but it is in almost constat use all day long.
I will try and hook the one I have at home again and try again tomorrow.
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Dang, talk about bad luck...
Thanks for the effort. :)
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Just one scan Bodhi? :)
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got the CD late this afternoon for the drivers... why they could not email it was beyond me. Should be back up tomorrow.
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Luftwaffe im Focus Edition No. 13 has a photo of 'newly-discovered photo of Ta 152 H-0, "White 7", W. Nr. 150007.'
I don't have Issue 13 but you want to inquire here:
Ta 152 H-0 photo in "LW im Focus #13" (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=11579)
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Woohoo! :D One more.
Thanks Wotan.
I have in my notes that WN 007 was also a Black 3 at some point...
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The one image of a Stab/JG11 Ta152 I have found. I can not however (yet), verify the artists source.
(http://www.freewebs.com/ahjg11/2_9.jpg)
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WN 150007 is visible on two pictures of Peltz' inspection visit to JG301, in Harmann's book. Its caption says the plane is labeled "Black 3".
The serial on the rudder definitely ends in 07, but the number before that is hidden.. I don't remember the exact serial number allocations, but it went as high as 168 or so. The picture is dated mid march '45, and IIRC production ended sometime in february. I might be wrong on that, but if not there's only two possibilities, 007 or 107.
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007 was certainly "Black 3" at one point in time. Even with the numerous Wk# to a/c "mistakes" made, and discovered more and more with time, multiple sources make 007 "Black 3" for part of her service life.
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Stampf, do you have any info on any 152H numbered "Black 14"?
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Not an H, no. Off the top, I believe it is one of the Stab/JG26 rides. A "one of a kind" Ta152C flown by Classen I think, maybe Katz. Maybe both, they were a formidable pair and getting those 2 or 3 Ta's into the Stab was Major Goetz's doing. He brought those two men to the Stab for the sole purpose of winging together in the Ta.
I don't think there is any known photo's of the 26th rides, yet discovered Moot, only some pilot logs and memoirs on the subject. Let me dig around for something more solid for ya.
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I've only seen a Black 14 on the Wings Palette profile, and that's listed as a JG301 152-H. I thought it'd make a good skin as it's a shades of grey scheme.
Let me know what you find :)
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Bump!
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AHF - Focke-Wulf Ta 152. Only one survived! (http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=131660)
Moot did you get that template from Goodwood?
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I did, and thanks for that link.. I had most of these already but some were new :D
That Erich is the guy that's supposed to put out a book on JG301. It's not due for a year more by the looks of it, though. It's a shame, because he says he's got info on all the unknowns brought up so far in all the Ta152 threads I've found on the net.
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Moot, I've got a skin I'm workin on so der Stampfenfurher has another one for the stable. I'm less than an artist visually. I'm more of a music guy, hence the DJ business. (Give me your demo's from your band and I'll gold plate it though) I've got panel and rivet lines, and most of the basics if you want to finish it. I have been trying to get refs for the paint.
I'm not proud, and I wont cry in meine beir if it doesn't end up saying xxxx by VonMessa. I just wanted a JG11 TA fur die Gruppe. I'll send it to you layers and all if you like. It might even get finished faster that way.
I have no concrete facts at hand, but.....
If I'm not mistaken the National Air and Space Museum has one of Kurt Tank's finest in its collection (maybe the one we are talking about here) that used to have some disgusting British roundels on it (no offense to our friends across the pond, but you wouldn't put a Ford Oval where the Chevy bowtie belongs... blasphemy) When they went about restoring it they removed the "re-paint" job and found the original markings, paint, swastika, etc. I believe the Reichsdefense band they uncovered was solid yellow which would make it a JG11 ride.
Anyone please correct me if I am wrong. As I said, I have no facts at hand, and I am at work right now.
Let me know about the skin, Moot. The faster it gets finished, the more sleep I will get at night, and the more I will accomplish at work (shhhhh, don't tell the boss)
-Dan
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Sure, you can send it to me. I'll only be able to start working on it in about a week, though.
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PM me with your email.
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That Erich is the guy that's supposed to put out a book on JG301.
He has been 'pimpin' that book for years - the I have all the answers but you will juts have to wait and see appraoch.
Apparently his cousin [?] was a Sturmjäger
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Hey,
I did not know you were still active on these forums.
Good to see you are though. (any chance of a AHII 4./JG53)
or atleast a chance to wing with you in the MA some time?
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That's a shame, he had me hooked for a while :)
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Originally posted by DaddyAck
Hey,
I did not know you were still active on these forums.
Good to see you are though. (any chance of a AHII 4./JG53)
or atleast a chance to wing with you in the MA some time?
I don't have AH2 installed any more - there was an AH 4./JG 53 - that is the Staffel started after I left 3./JG 2. We all moved over to fly Il-2 exclusively and I am the only original guy left,
The other 10 came later - Josf, Hertt, Jagr, Cuzn all come from Warbirds - JG 14.
Anyway Phase 2 of Kurland will start soon - and like I said in that email I do apologize over not making sure you had an aircraft in the last mission - the R/T was blowing up as we coordinated that raid on Cirava AF. I had 5 other flights on whisper trying to time our attacks. It turned out well for us and the base was leveled - in the last 15 minutes a suicidal Pe 2 came screaming in and took out our last 10 engineers. After that we flew up to Hasenpoth. Josf and Jagr caught several FA guys trying to land their points - Josf and Jagr killed 2 = a clipped wing LF.Vb and a Vb and made another crash. We lost the phase by 23 points. Had we got Cirava we would have won easily.
fyi Daddyack is 4./JG53_Dadyack Zelda - Weiß 8: (http://4jg53.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=38&Itemid=53)
(http://www.4jg53.org/myimages/panelnumbers/white8.png)
Wotan
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Originally posted by moot
That's a shame, he had me hooked for a while :)
He is serious about the book - it's just he has been making it sound like it was right around the corner for years.
As I understand it is still a ways off from publication.
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Yeah, he's serious.. I'm serious, everybody's serious :p I'll believe it when I see it.
Bodhi - What happened to the scan(s)?
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Scanner at work is toast and home computer is as well... maybe if I feel ambitious on Monday I will haul my scanner in to work.
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Haven't forgot about this Moot. Still diggin, and diggin...
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Thanks both :)