Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: detch01 on January 15, 2008, 04:29:09 PM
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Anyone in the community tried this?
I had my main system died on me and I've cobbled together a semi-playable system with spare parts I've had laying around. I'm running a K7 main board with an Athlon running at 1.2GHz and would like to bump the processor speed up without having to lay more than just a pumped up air cooling system.
Anyone have any advice, do's and don'ts in regard to this?
Cheers & thx
asw
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As in the ECS K7S5A main board? My buddy back in college had this motherboard, fried itself twice within a year. That's an old board :)
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Rule of thumb in overclocking: Keep your temperatures down, do only small increment increases in FSB and test each one with 2-3 hours of prime95 torture test to see if it's stable. It takes work.
Once the OC starts to fail in the prime test you need to take it a step down and you found your sweet spot.
You can increase the OC level by setting a higher CPU and ram voltage in the bios however this will dramatically increase heat production and you need to make sure you have a good cooler and good ventilation in your box.
Older AMD chips are not that good with OC but not horrible either. Where as with Intel chips I could bump my E4500 speed from 2.2 to 2.9 Ghz on aircooling straight away with full confidence it will boot up. :)
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what board is it ? and what cpu ? and what ram ?
i need the exact specs befor i tell ya were to clock it too ... (or open up my spare parts stash for ya )
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Need Info!
MB Brand & Bios Version
is the AMD processor a 1200 or true 1.2 ghz processor?
whats ya default clock and power/amp/volt settings?
whats ya FSB multiplier setting?
what is the limitations of your settings ( set values or 1 step at a time increments?
I had in the past got an actual 1150 mhz processor to bump up to 1.8 ghz AMD Socket-A type and had no issues...but trying to OC the ram caused all kinds of headaches.....and this was on one of them "ECS K7S5A PRO" MB's......
the computer is still running, and it ran AH2 ok with a Ati 9000 Pro 128 meg vidcard AGP / 512 meg Pc133 Ram..... 300 watt PSU 80 gig WD IDE HD...
Roscoroo, you fast........ listen to him, ASW he does this stuff all the time......( tinkerer he is ) :D
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Wow thx all :).
Roo, TC, here are my system specs:
bios: American Megatrends V 07.00T (02/04/2001)
SMBios Version 2.3 (whateverthehell that is)
CPU: x86 Family 6, Model 7, Stepping 1 AMD running at ~1.2GHz
Mainboard: PC Chips K7 model M825G
FSB: 333 MHz (dunno what the multiplier is - find that in bios settings?)
System Ram: 1 gig (333MHz DDR2700)
OS: XP Home (v 5.1.2600 SP2)
VC: ATI 9250 w/128MB ram on the card (AGP).
Anything I miss?
Cheers & thx again :)
asw
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"FSB: 333 MHz (dunno what the multiplier is - find that in bios settings?)"
now without knowing exactly what the cpu is (you need to pull the heatsink and get the number off of it) or just a sec cpuZ will do it ...(ill find it for ya )
example for clocking these .
cpu multiplyer 8 x 166 fbs speed= 1.3 ghz (166 = 333 on these amd's)
10 x 133= 1.3 ghz
8.5 x 166 = 1.4 ghz
9 x 166 =1.5 ghz
brb .
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http://www.softpedia.com/progDownload/CPU-Z-Download-6980.html (http://www.softpedia.com/progDownload/CPU-Z-Download-6980.html)
download this and run the cpu z .exe
then tell me or screen shot it for me ... this will sort of give me a idea whats what . but as in these amds they change there number to what they are clocked at . IE a 2500+ clocked at 11x200 with show up as a 3200+
you could have alot larger cpu in there thats currently showing up at a 1.2 ghz because of its clocking ... but in reality it could be anything .
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Will do - thx :). gimme a mo and I'll fire you off a screenie.
Cheers,
asw
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From CPUz:
Name: Mobile AMD Duron
Code Name Morgan
Package: Socket A
Tech: 0.18um Core voltage: ~1.5 v (seems to vary a tad over 1.5v)
Family 6, Model 7, Stepping 1
Ext Family 7, Ext Model 7, revision A1
Instructions MMX(+), 3DNOW!(+), SSE
Core speed 1200.2MHZ L1 Data: 64Kbytes
Multiplier x12.0 L1 inst: 64Kbytes
Bus Speed 100.0MHz Level 2: 64Kbytes
Rated FSB 200.0 MHZ
Need any of the other tabs (cache, mainboard, memory or sbd) ?
Cheers
asw
I just threw in another 256MB of 333MHz ram - figured it counhoit :)
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try 10 x 133 that will set it at 1.3 ghz its a mobile morgan cpu they only went to 1300 so thats as fast as I would push it for now ... also check your cpu temp when your in the bios screen ... restart and check it again after 5-10 mins ...it should be 48c or less idle temp ... or under 54c after running a game . if its above this clock it back to were it was .
some of these morgans would clock to 1.5---- 1.6 ghz but you gotta have a good temp monitor program and keep them under 54c , they stutter when they get too hot.
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Will do - thx again Roo :) Much appreciated. This should hold me until I find a better chip to put on this mainboard.
Cheers,
asw
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that board will only go to 2.0ghz (I believe its the same as my amptron 825)
so if you find a 2400+ thoroughbred or even a 2500+ barton cpu thats as much as it can handle .... Warning : stay away from Semprons and applebred cpu's there junk and ussually dont work on that board.
lets see if someone around here has one .... I'll ive got right now is a 1700+ athlon (1.5 ghz) , and a couple of 800- 1.3 athlon /morgans in my stash.
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I'll be crawling the used computer stores in town tomorrow looking for one.
Cheers & thx again Roo :)
I took a crack at over-clocking - musta done something wrong so I had to reboot the bios. I'm off to the intardnet for info . When all else fails, follow instructions....
asw
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rgr .. it might be arguing with ya ... and 13 x 100 might work or anouther combo
7.5 x 166 or 8.0 x 166
that equals 1300 ... some times you have to try different multiplycations with them ...
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The bios won't let me change the multiplier so I'm bumping up the CPU frequency a bit at a time - I have it running at ~1380MHz right now - seems to be stable at 47C. I'll give it a few more minutes, recheck the temp and then see how much it increases by running AH offline.
My video card is overclockable also - I'm not sure it's worth doing tho as I figure it's already outstripping my system (ATI 128MB 9250).
Cheers,
asw
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Originally posted by detch01
The bios won't let me change the multiplier so I'm bumping up the CPU frequency a bit at a time - I have it running at ~1380MHz right now - seems to be stable at 47C. I'll give it a few more minutes, recheck the temp and then see how much it increases by running AH offline.
My video card is overclockable also - I'm not sure it's worth doing tho as I figure it's already outstripping my system (ATI 128MB 9250).
Cheers,
asw
Invest $120-180 to a graphics card and you'll get double speed without any overclock.
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Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Invest $120-180 to a graphics card and you'll get double speed without any overclock.
The bottleneck on this system is not the video card, it is the processor so throwing a bigger and faster video card at it right now wouldn't do much but make my wallet lighter.
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I have one of these sitting around..axda2100dut3c. Its a thbred and was a good overclocker when I was using it.
Give me your addy and I will send it to you, have not used it in years and all I can tell you is that it worked when I retired the system.
shamus
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Shamus - many thanks, I greatly appreciate the offer. I'll pm you the details.
Cheers,
asw
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ASW,
use the ATI Cat 4.12 driver ( don't install CCC ( catalyic Control Center ) ( some people do use this, but it is extra software not really needed running in background )
use 512 textures , with 1 gig memory , I suggest preload textures to help ya
also try tinkering with the AGP apature ( my old PC is set to 256 meg Apature , and no assigned IRQ for PCI - checked for AGP use ( kinda going from memory here with out physically looking at BIOS on the PC )
you migt see an improvement running 1280 x1024 res over using 1024 x 768 Res ( I saw a noticeable improvement anyway )......higher res gave me roughly 8 to 12 more FPS.....
don't max out your refresh rate ..stay around 65 to 75 ( 70 is good choice ) ( might even want to lock it at 60 FPS in AH video setup )
run your detail sliders in AH around 1/2 way between performance/Detail to start off..then tinker with them each way to see how far you can go for detail without taking major FPS hit......
others might have some other tips for ya......
also, might help ya even more, if you can use a smaller HD ( 80 GIG or smaller )..less space to sift thru to access...... just another thought.....
good luck
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Thx TC - great info :). I checked my AGP aperture and it was set to 64 MB (ouch), I've bumped that up to the memory on the card (128MB). Also, I've found the same performance increase by running at 1280X1024 - dunno why it works. You'd think pushing more pixels would slow things down...
Re: the hard drive - this system had an 80gig in it but I have a 200gig HDD that is faster so I've popped that in and only installed what software I use regularly so most of it is free space. I figure if I keep it defragged I'll get the benefit of the extra speed. I might put the 80gig back in if I'm not happy with how this is performing and see if I get a bit more oomph out of the system.
Cheers & thx again,
asw
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Originally posted by detch01
The bottleneck on this system is not the video card, it is the processor so throwing a bigger and faster video card at it right now wouldn't do much but make my wallet lighter.
Lol right you had a _duron_ 1.2ghz lolz. Id forget about overclocking and spend $50 to a new CPU that's double performance. Having said that, ATI9250 is about 6 years behind current tech and will definately hold your system back if you have anything above Duron 1.4.
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Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Having said that, ATI9250 is about 6 years behind current tech and will definately hold your system back if you have anything above Duron 1.4.
LOL yup- that's next month's project :)
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Out of curiousity, could I do anything with this dinosaur? I've been trying to get a better system built for a few years now, but it just hasn't happened yet.
(html dump from CPUZ)
CPU-Z 1.40 report file
Processor(s)
Number of processors 1
Number of cores 1 per processor
Number of threads 1 (max 1) per processor
Name AMD Athlon XP
Code Name Thoroughbred
Specification AMD Athlon(tm) XP 2400+
Package Socket A (462)
Family/Model/Stepping 6.8.1
Extended Family/Model 7.8
Core Stepping B0
Technology 0.13 um
Core Speed 2004.7 MHz
Multiplier x Bus speed 15.0 x 133.6 MHz
Rated Bus speed 267.3 MHz
Instruction sets MMX (+), 3DNow! (+), SSE
L1 Data cache 64 KBytes, 2-way set associative, 64-byte line size
L1 Instruction cache 64 KBytes, 2-way set associative, 64-byte line size
L2 cache 256 KBytes, 16-way set associative, 64-byte line size
Chipset & Memory
Northbridge NVIDIA nForce2 400 rev. C1
Southbridge NVIDIA nForce2 MCP rev. A4
Graphic Interface AGP
AGP Revision 3.0
AGP Transfer Rate 8x
AGP Side Band Addressing supported, not enabled
Memory Type DDR
Memory Size 1024 MBytes
Memory Frequency 167.1 MHz (4:5)
CAS# Latency (tCL) 2.5 clocks
RAS# to CAS# (tRDC) 3 clocks
RAS# Precharge (tRP) 3 clocks
Cycle Time (tRAS) 7 clocks
System
System Manufacturer ASUSTeK Computer INC.
System Name A7N8X-X
System S/N xxxxxxxxxxx
Mainboard Vendor ASUSTeK Computer INC.
Mainboard Model A7N8X-X
BIOS Vendor Phoenix Technologies, LTD
BIOS Version ASUS A7N8X-X ACPI BIOS Rev 1009
BIOS Date 02/03/2004
Memory SPD
Module 1 DDR, PC2700 (166 MHz), 512 MBytes, Micron Technology
Module 2 DDR, PC2700 (166 MHz), 512 MBytes, Micron Technology
Software
Windows Version Microsoft Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 (Build 2600)
DirectX Version 9.0c
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Hubsonfire with a graphics card update that box should run older games. That Geforce2 400 is probably the weakest part of your system. It also looks like your cpu is stock clocked at the moment. Overclocking straight-out-of-the-box rarely gets you anything above 10% increase with AMD chips but it's worth trying if you want to try to revive the box.
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Hub what you might try is swapping out the PC2700 ram for PC3200 (DDR400). Your mainboard will run that (at least from what I found with google). After that, then I'd give the instructions Roo gave me for overclocking a try - bump it up a bit at a time and keep checking the temperatures until you've found the stable limit for you system. Just be very careful and take it slowly and you should (YMMV) be ok.
Cheers & GL
asw
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Instead of shelling money for new ram I'd get a faster CPU for the same money. Raiding that PC rating just to get a marginal overclock is the least cost-effective way imaginable to upgrade.
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hub can bump that 2400+ to 2.1 - 2.2 ghz if it has the cooling .
depends of his video card if it will be a perfomance gain .
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Stock cooling on it at the moment, and the vid card is an EVGA GF 7600GS. Have an SB Live Value soundcard, and a PCI modem, so I'm not using onboard sound, graphics, or the ethernet port.
In the past, I'd tried increasing my memory and CPU speeds, and couldn't get any higher % on the RAM, or higher multiplier on the CPU to boot up.
I read somewhere that some AMD chips in this line couldn't be overclocked, due to something in the physical construction of the chip, IIRC. Couldn't verify that, and the guy who helped me build the system, I haven't been able to get ahold of in quite some time. He was my only non-AH techgeek type, so I haven't messed with it lately, at least since the last upgrade of the vid card and the second stick of ram.
I've got XP sp2 of course, and have 17 processes with my stick software, MFD stuff, and AH running. I don't really play many other games, nothing current, and nothing that this rig doesn't run well anyway, but I would like to get a little more out of it for AH if I can. Shelling out another grand for some dental surgery in the near future, which makes a new build unlikely, at least for a while.
Appreciate the info, always good to learn more, (especially if it helps extend the life of this box, which I built back during AH2's beta) and overclocking is something I have practically zero experience with, aside from running my old vid cards a little harder.
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In any case trying to up your ram speed is the biggest waste of money you can imagine. Get a faster cpu for that money and you'll get real returns.
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Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
In any case trying to up your ram speed is the biggest waste of money you can imagine. Get a faster cpu for that money and you'll get real returns.
Upping my ram to pc2700 from what it was yielded 4 or 5 fps in a low alt big furball - that's not insignificant. It stands to reason an upgrade from pc2700 to pc3200 will do something similar.
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Hub , about the most you can do is get 3200 ram and that 2400+ will OC to 2.1 on air cooling / 2.2-2.3 on water ...the ram helps but the overclock on it from 2.0 is pritty much unoticable and very little gain . you need a 2500+ barton cpu to start getting any gain ... but there so old now unless its near free its better to start saving for a duo core ect .
you should be playing AH deciently with your setup ...(unless your trying to push a lcd monitor to the max)
mrs roo's pc is the same as yours but with a 9550 256 card in it and it runs AH nicely 35 -75 fps on 512 tex, No preload and performance slider at about 2/3 rds up ...(tuned for 512 ram that it has so it runs around 380 mem used and doesnt go over 480ish total used in furballs)
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Originally posted by detch01
Upping my ram to pc2700 from what it was yielded 4 or 5 fps in a low alt big furball - that's not insignificant. It stands to reason an upgrade from pc2700 to pc3200 will do something similar.
Unless you installed more ram in the process it's HIGHLY doubtful that happened. You're talking about a 5-10% increase in overall speed and no benchmark ever has been able to show a difference this big even with bigger ram speed difference.
This is a fact and you can look it up on any hardware testing site on the internet.
When your ram runs at the rated speed, it runs at that speed. If you clock ram higher to be async it usually degrades performance nothing else.
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Yeah Rosco, it's not bad at all, for what it is. Maybe nothing will blow up this year, and I can get around to building a new deathstar. :)