Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Boroda on January 22, 2008, 01:34:03 PM
-
(http://www.deanreed.de/images/film/1975blutsbrueder017.jpg)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Reed
Did any Western people hear about him?
Just read his letter to Solzhenitsyn, 1971. Some people, even Americans, understood that food is more important then "freedom of speech" back then. When you have nothing to eat and bombs are falling on your home - the last thing you will care about will be "freedom of speech".
http://www.deanreed.de/presse/1971-ogonjok.html
Open letter of Dean Reed to Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Dear colleague by art Aleksandr Isayevich!
I, as an American artist, must reply on some of your charges, published by capitalist press all over the world. In my opinion, they are false charges and the peoples of world must know, why they false. You stamped the USSR as deeply sick society, struck by hatred and injustice. You say that the Soviet government could not live without the enemies, and entire atmosphere in the hatred, which does not stop even before the racial hatred. You probably speak about my native land, but not about yours. Indeed precisely America, but not the USSR, it wages wars and creates the stressed situation of possible war, in order to give the possibility to its economy to act, but to our dictators and military-industry (VPK) to acquire still more wealth and power on the blood of Vietnamese people, our own soldiers and all freedom-loving peoples of world. Sick society is at my native land, but not at yours, Mr. Solzhenitsyn!
Specifically, the USA, but not the USSR, became the most violent society, which the history ever knew. America, where the Mafia has more economic power, than even the largest corporations, and where our citizens cannot walk at night along the streets without the fear to undergo the attack of criminals. Indeed precisely in the USA, but not in the USSR, their fellow citizens killed in the period with 1900 more people, than it perished American soldiers in both World Wars, and in Korea and Vietnam! Specifically, our society is considered convenient to kill any progressive leader, who finds courage to raise voice against some our injustices. That is what a sick society is, Mr. Solzhenitsyn!
Further you speak about the racial hatred. In the USA, but not in the USSR for a period of two centuries remain unpunished the murders of the Negroes, whom they hold in half-slavery. In the USA, but not in the USSR the police beats and arrests any Negro, who attempts to appear in defense of his rights.
Then you say that the freedom of speech, the honest and complete freedom of speech - here is the first condition of the health of any society and ours also. Attempt to extend these thoughts among the suffering peoples, forced to fight for existence and to live in spite of your will under the oppression of dictators, who are held in authority only because of the aid of the USA.
Tell about your thoughts to people, whose health consists only in the fact that half of their children dies during the delivery, since they do not have money for the doctor, and they suffer entire life without the medical service.
Tell about this to people of capitalist world, whose health lies in the fact that they spend entire life in the fear of unemployment. Tell to American Negroes, as much them helped in fact the freedom of speech in the process of their rightful fight for the equality of rights with the white, when after two centuries of the freedom of speech in an American-like kind in many regions of the USA they think that to kill Negro is like to go to bear hunting!
Tell to the workers of capitalist world about your ideas about the freedom of speech as of the first condition of health, if because of the shortage of money their children cannot develop their mental abilities in the school, and therefore they will never learn to read! You speak about the freedom of speech, while the major part of the population of the world is still speaking about the opportunity of learning to read! No, Mr. Solzhenitsyn, your definition of the freedom of speech as the first condition of the health of society is faulty. The first condition consists in making the country of healthy mentally, moral, spiritually and physically, so that its citizens would read, write, work and to live together in peace.
No, Mr. Solzhenitsyn, I do not admit your first condition of the health of society and especially in your definition and context. My country, known for its freedom of speech - this is a country, where the police will attack participants of peaceful marches. In my country peaceful marches are permitted, and so far war continues in the same time, since demonstrations, evidently, do not change at all the policy of government. Do you really think that VPK, which rules in my country and in a half of the world cares about the freedom of speech? Its rulers realize, that they and only they possess ability to make decisions. Truly the freedom of speech is in the words, but not in reality.
You stated that the USSR does not march in step with XX by century. If this is true then this is because the USSR goes in front by one half step of XX century! Do you really propose to your people to abandon the role of a leader and advanced guard and to return to the inhuman and cruel conditions existing in the remaining part of the world, where the injustice truly abounds in the atmosphere of almost feudal conditions of many countries? Mr. Solzhenitsyn, in the article it is also said, what you - long-suffering writer from the Soviet Union. Apparently, this means that you much suffer because of the absence of moral and social principles, and that your conscience torments you during quiet night hours, when you remain one by one with yourself.
It is correct, that the USSR has its own injustices and deficiencies, but indeed everything in the world is relative. In principle and in reality your society is trying to build really healthy and fair society. The principles, on which is built your society, are healthy, clear and fair, while the principles of my society are cruel, mercenary (selfish) and unfair. Obviously, there can happen some mistakes and injustices in life; however, there is no doubt that a society built on fair principles has more prospects to come to fair society, than that, which is built on injustice and exploitation of a man by man. Society and government of my country are behind the time, because their sole purpose consists in to keep a status quo in the entire world. Specifically your country attempts to make progressive steps into the name of humanity, and if it is not perfect sometimes and stumbles at times, then we must not condemn entire system for these defects, but must greet it for its courage and striving for laying new ways.
Sincerely yours, Dean Reed
It's probably a translation back from Russian, but I hope you can get the idea.
-
Best I can tell... dean reed was a has been that never was and a commie..
no use for the guy and his opinions especially since he knows nothing of American life. He never worked here except in some la la land and he lived mostly in commie countries.
don't agree with anything the guy said about the two systems.. communism seems far more cruel to me.. both in theory and in practice.
lazs
-
Originally posted by lazs2
don't agree with anything the guy said about the two systems.. communism seems far more cruel to me.. both in theory and in practice.
The problem is that you never lived under what you call "communism" and still make conclusions because "you saw it on TV".
Don't you agree with his sentence about food and freedom of speech? What is more important? Look, I was born in Leningrad, if it means anything to you...
-
Did any Western people hear about him?
Until right now, when you posted it here on this BBS...personally, no.
And reading this translated from Russian back into english is simply a pain. The translation changes' some of the inflections on what is meant. I'd rather read his original letter published in english.
-
freedom of speech is more important than food. especially if the food is extorted from others. I don't want anyone taking food from others to give to me. I will get my own food.
lazs
-
Originally posted by Boroda
Don't you agree with his sentence about food and freedom of speech? What is more important? Look, I was born in Leningrad, if it means anything to you...
freedom of speech is one of the things that has allowed us to continue to fight against food shortages like the USSR had.
-
looks like Dean Reed is using his freedom of speech which is not very important.
:confused:
-
dear god.
john and i are in agreement again.
(dogs and cats)
always nice to see that most of us agree on the basics. the rest is just filler really.
-
Must be quiet in the bread line Comrade.
-
Originally posted by lazs2
freedom of speech is more important than food. especially if the food is extorted from others. I don't want anyone taking food from others to give to me. I will get my own food.
Go starve and feel comfortable just because you can shout anything you want at any corner so no one will listen.
-
What? Huh? I can't hear you.
Let me see if I have this right....
I can have plenty to eat but must keep my mouth shut...or... I can be hungry and voice my opinion about it.
If I say something will they take my food away? If they take my food away can I then say something about it?
-
it beats the heck out of wait in line for toilet paper and if you dissent you get sent to gulag or house arrest.
-
Originally posted by Boroda
Go starve and feel comfortable just because you can shout anything you want at any corner so no one will listen.
the US produces so much food the govt has to pay farmers not to plant so much and they still have to give some away to other countries.
-
boroda.. you are assuming that it has to be one or the other... food or freedom..
That is a huge.. and false... assumtion.
Can you tell me how many sane Americans starved to death in the great depression? (hint.. the number is less than one so far as I can find)
lazs
-
and when we has breadlines in the depression...americans could still speak their minds.
-
Originally posted by JB88
it beats the heck out of wait in line for toilet paper and if you dissent you get sent to gulag or house arrest.
That's "Putin" it more clearly. I think he's "Stalin" for time here. Most would rather take a long walk on a short pier "Andropov." Does anyone want to claim the stains on the "Lenin" here?
-
Until You posted it here I never heard of Dean Reed, and from what I can tell I didnt miss anything by not knowing... he couldnt have been that big of a deal... never saw a VH1 Behind the Music show about him.
The problem is that you never lived under what you call "communism" and still make conclusions because "you saw it on TV".
Yea, all those lines for food and toilet paper were all made up, plus all those clips of people getting shot... all special effects to keeps us out of the workers paradise...
-
Originally posted by Airscrew
Until You posted it here I never heard of Dean Reed, and from what I can tell I didnt miss anything by not knowing... he couldnt have been that big of a deal... never saw a VH1 Behind the Music show about him.
Yea, all those lines for food and toilet paper were all made up, plus all those clips of people getting shot... all special effects to keeps us out of the workers paradise...
Who the Hell is Dean Reed?
BTW I heard that the long lines have been merged...Bread and Toilet Paper lines are now known as....
Waiting in line for the "Chit Sandwich".
-
Originally posted by AWMac
That's "Putin" it more clearly. I think he's "Stalin" for time here. Most would rather take a long walk on a short pier "Andropov." Does anyone want to claim the stains on the "Lenin" here?
Instant classic.
-
Originally posted by Boroda
Go starve and feel comfortable just because you can shout anything you want at any corner so no one will listen.
Silly russians, don't you know that these things are not mutually exclusive?
boroda you been listening to the party tapes again?
-
Originally posted by JB88
and when we has breadlines in the depression...americans could still speak their minds.
Did it help?
"Breadlines" is a thing forgotten since 1947 here. Bloody Bolsheviks got rid of mass starvation.
breadline
Firefox knows "breadline" but no "firefox"
Lazs, I said I am from Leningrad. Did you ever meet people who had an experience of starving to death? Did they mention freedom of speech?
-
yes. it helped.
and why not have both?
-
Poor Boroda...
Not feeling like a "Super Power" anymore?
Try....
(http://viagra-picture.org/wp-content/viagra-picture.jpg)
Mac
-
Specifically, the USA, but not the USSR, became the most violent society
Maybe.
Just another reason why the USSR would never have beaten us ::Shrug::
;)
-
Originally posted by AWMac
That's "Putin" it more clearly. I think he's "Stalin" for time here. Most would rather take a long walk on a short pier "Andropov." Does anyone want to claim the stains on the "Lenin" here?
Putin wanted to be a modern JVS and failed. I said it back in 2000, you can search for my posts.
Russia now is the country with as much personal freedom as you can want. Yes, we traded free medical care, as good as at Cuba, for idiots barking at every corner ("freedom of speech").
-
soooo, do you just come to american boards to exercise your freedom of speech or do you have your own places to bark on every corner?
:D
-
Originally posted by AWMac
Poor Boroda...
Not feeling like a "Super Power" anymore?
Try....
(http://viagra-picture.org/wp-content/viagra-picture.jpg)
Mac
OH the fun i could have.................
-
What??? Best medical care in Cuba?
:rofl
Ohhh my sides... Roger Moore has influenced even the Russians...
:lol
The Cubans are just risking their frikken lifes to swim to Florida to renew their prescriptions.
:rofl
That is soooo Fidel Funny!!!!
:rofl
Mac
-
Originally posted by Boroda
Did it help?
"Breadlines" is a thing forgotten since 1947 here. Bloody Bolsheviks got rid of mass starvation.
Odd. My mother visited Russia about 10 years ago.
Thats not what she said she saw. Or I should say didnt see.
One other notation she noticed though.
Most of the Russians she ever saw smile were the younger ones
Almost all the the older ones looked miserable
On a more personal note I know a guy who defected from the former U.S.S.R
One of the hardest working men I ever met
His stories of contentment under communist rule was ENTIRELY different then yours.
I remember him telling me afte the fall of communism his mother comming over to visit. They went food shopping here together.
upon seeing all of the goods readily available to whomever wanted to buy thenm and without the lines down the block she started to cry ,sobbing"Its not fair!"
Course in a communist society everyone is supposed to be equal.
But as is usually the case. Some are more equal then others.
I imagine from the way you say it. you were form the "More equal" portion of the community.
Now you really are more equal literally. and your bitter because of it
-
Boroda, this is your chance, organize the other bolsheviks and have a second bolshevik revolution, break out the red flags, throw out the capitalistic lackey government.
everyone join me in singing the international.
-
Originally posted by Boroda
Putin wanted to be a modern JVS and failed. I said it back in 2000, you can search for my posts.
Russia now is the country with as much personal freedom as you can want. Yes, we traded free medical care, as good as at Cuba, for idiots barking at every corner ("freedom of speech").
Need you be reminded that that very same freedom of speech is what allows you to speak your mind on these boards and call Gorbechev a traitor without government probing your orse with a cattleprod for doing so.
-
Originally posted by JB88
yes. it helped.
and why not have both?
FDR helped, not "freedom of speech". People like Lazs try to hate FDR, but "facts are stubborn things".
You can have _both_ if you are lucky enough to live in countries that don't have permafrost.
Can you remember your relatives who have really starved in last 200 years? I have plenty. Most of them could shout anything they wanted as Lazs, but they preferred to work. Or Serve. I am a first "civilian" man in my family in 3 generations.
I have to say again that I was born in Leningrad. I was born in 1972, my Father moved there in 1944, right after the siege was broken...
-
was that before or after the purge?
-
Originally posted by JB88
soooo, do you just come to american boards to exercise your freedom of speech or do you have your own places to bark on every corner?
:D
I am far from supporting comrade Putin.
I voted for Communists at the last Parliament elections.
No one came and arrested me.
well let me light a non-fire-safe-cigarette
-
Originally posted by JB88
was that before or after the purge?
POOOF...! (here we have cheap tobacco of excellent quality)
I am bored of telling my family story again here.
-
Originally posted by Boroda
You can have _both_ if you are lucky enough to live in countries that don't have permafrost.
don't worry, global warm... i mean climate change is coming and it will thaw out the permafrost then you can grow food.
-
Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Need you be reminded that that very same freedom of speech is what allows you to speak your mind on these boards and call Gorbechev a traitor without government probing your orse with a cattleprod for doing so.
Really?
In the Soviet times I didn't have anyone "probing my arse".
Now I don't have anyone doing that things either.
Maybe we'll get back to discussing "food vs freedom" again? Like freedom of speech vs bombs falling on your house.
-
Originally posted by john9001
don't worry, global warm... i mean climate change is coming and it will thaw out the permafrost then you can grow food.
Just in 20,000 years or so. 20,000 years ago we had 1km (3300ft) of ice right here above Moscow.
-
looks like we traded about even.
:cool:
(http://peebucket.com/sitebuilder/images/yakov33-147x181.jpg)
-
....!!!
Do you really think that VPK, which rules in my country and in a half of the world cares about the freedom of speech?
VPK = MIC, Military-Industrial Complex.
Silly translation.
-
Originally posted by JB88
looks like we traded about even.
:cool:
(http://peebucket.com/sitebuilder/images/yakov33-147x181.jpg)
You mean that Jew at your picture was traded for... WHOM?!
-
People don't get shot trying to leave my country.
-
Originally posted by bj229r
People don't get shot trying to leave my country.
They didn't shoot anyone leaving my country either.
-
boroda.. I see it is not going as you hoped.
you can have freedom of speech and food.. why would you not?
If people in permafrost are starving then I would suggest that permafrost is not yet ready for human habitation.. nor is sand for the most part.
Food without freedom is worthless. survival is the first thing but it is not everything.
as for FDR.. he didn't limit free speech and he didn't get us out of the depression ... WWII got us out of the depression.. FDR's programs are about to put us back into one that we will have a hard time getting out of.
No one starved in the depression. Most of the "bread lines" were from private charities.
There is no reason.. to limit free speech or the right to keep and bear arms or the right to be secure in your person or.. any of a number of other human rights that are given us by god.
The government doesn't make food out of the silence of no free speech.
communist countries build walls to keep people in.. free countries build walls to keep people out. and.. not many walls at that..
lazs