Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: Larry on January 31, 2008, 01:03:56 AM
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I leave to go duel someone in the DA. I come back to see there are four rook and only one bish (who is afk in a tower on the other side of the map), and three rooks are milking one of our ports. (They cant say they wernt going to take it bacause when I got ther there were two LVTs and one C47 that had its troops running. I have a screen shot if one of you CMs need it. I also have a film but it only shows two of the three milkers.
I myself would like to see a punishment for people who are cought milking.
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(http://www.mistyvalley.com.au/mvjpegs/Milking.jpg)
Caught red handed:D
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i got mult SS's of AXIS milking at one point is was 7 AXIS and no allies i just jumped on to see who the map was going. I was going to send them in but i decided not to, but a hole 4 people, you know your going to get the base back why cry about it?
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See Rules #4, #5
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email it to me....
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Vans???? in a Hangar? camping??
I don't believe you for one second.
Edit: that guy deleted his post really quick!
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Yeah... Milkduds are what screwed us over a ways back. Sorry to see not much has changed in the lamer department in AvA.
Speaking of Lamer Departments... Guys if you're getting vulched, regardless of sides, up from another base. Please do not cry foul if you decide to up at a capped base and get popped on the runway.
Now given the distances in the Italy terrain, it might behoove us all to avoid vulching. At least let the guy get airborne before engaging.
Personally, I refrain from vulching in AvA and Scenarios... Don't consider it quite sportsman, wott!
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it seems that the allied CVs spawn within a very short distance of axis fields also. vanscrew and his buddies were repeatedly divebombing axis cvs in B26 and then augering for round two. they had one player who was allied for quite a bit then was on axis moving the CVs closer to fields where they could be attacked. I believe there were 16 allieds on v 6 axis at that time. in short order with nearly zero probability of defending they captured A28 a zone base and P107.
we spent the remainder of a very frustrating evening attempting to take back those easily milked based.
these guys are probably children, at least I hope they are and this is a game for no gain so really it doesn't matter much but if I am investing discreationary time in an endeavor and playing with my squad while combining with other squads to win, doing so inspite of the odds being heavily favored against my team the least I can expect is for the regulatory agency to provide a level field.
the allied players have an overwhelming capability to drop bombs from both heavily armed fighter/bombers as well as level bombers.
we are denied the 110G2 which could counter to a degree.
the allied CVs spawn on our shores, we spawn two hours away.
I have yet to see where the panser is available that could mount a credible defense agaist the swarms of M8s and M3s that blanket base captures.
soda mentioned to me that our bases take longer to come back because the allied bases are resupplied and they have a dedicated cadre of resuppliers. I'm not going to question that but I will point out that when it is 16 v 6 (not an atypical occurance) and my team does not have the capability to effectively pork ord and Vbase troops in a 200 mile radius it becomes futile and moot.
the allied players are gamey, the setup is skewed and if steps are not taken to correct it some of us will seek recreation elsewhere.
rant mode
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im in the AvA arena at this time and im in the tower at p116 and it seems to be getting shelled. at this time only myself and Matt Ter are in the arena. is this considered milk running???
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Unless the allies captured C112 or C106 they do not have any CV's that spawn right next to a base.
Axis and Allies can manually resupply their bases by using M3's. This is something that can not be turned on off for one side or the other. It works for both. The allies have made organized efforts to do this, the axis can do the same if they wish. Bases will regenerate after a period of time without any manual resupply, so u don't have to do it. But not doing so means you have to wait longer for your base to recover.
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Just out of curiosity is the resupply bug from ealier fixed? Myself and another axis pilot made 5 resupply runs each with nothing coming back up. That was at the beginning of the week. Seeing its ineffectiveness I stopped bothering to resupply.
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Originally posted by soda72
Unless the allies captured C112 or C106 they do not have any CV's that spawn right next to a base.
Axis and Allies can manually resupply their bases by using M3's. This is something that can not be turned on off for one side or the other. It works for both. The allies have made organized efforts to do this, the axis can do the same if they wish. Bases will regenerate after a period of time without any manual resupply, so u don't have to do it. But not doing so means you have to wait longer for your base to recover.
Ok, I've played for awhile but there's still a few things that are fuzzy to me. Supplies only bring up ack, ord, radar, and troops correct? Hangers and town buildings are not affected by supplies. Am I right?
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Originally posted by republic
Ok, I've played for awhile but there's still a few things that are fuzzy to me. Supplies only bring up ack, ord, radar, and troops correct? Hangers and town buildings are not affected by supplies. Am I right?
I'm a little fuzzy on it to since the AvA has not catered to this type of game play before.
I've seen it restore Radar in the game,
The others i'm not so sure about but from what I understand it should help hangers, towns as well as the ord, fuel, and troops..
I'm not sure if it works on ack though....
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Originally posted by heythere
these guys are probably children, at least I hope they are and this is a game for no gain so really it doesn't matter much but if I am investing discreationary time in an endeavor and playing with my squad while combining with other squads to win, doing so inspite of the odds being heavily favored against my team the least I can expect is for the regulatory agency to provide a level field.
Soda has already addressed your concerns about the carrier spawn points and the resupply mechanism. I'd like to respond to your other concerns if I may.
This is AvA,, and a sort of rolling plane set as well. You won't get a "level playing field" because that did not historically exist. This is probably not news. Nevertheless, Soda spent significant time trying to draw up aircraft lists, tied to the different periods of this war, which offered rough balance, depending on the planes picked by the commanders.
I follow both of the restricted forums. I see that, at one time or another, players for each side have perceived that they were outnumbered, or were flying inferior equipment, or were the victims of gamey tactics. I've personally flown both sides myself. While the A6M2 was a dominant aircraft during the first few days (i.e. before the Wildcat was added), I haven't seen an imbalance in aircraft types, except that the Allies have far superior bombers, which is just something you have to accept in any World War II reenactment. Again, this is not news.
the allied players have an overwhelming capability to drop bombs from both heavily armed fighter/bombers as well as level bombers.
we are denied the 110G2 which could counter to a degree.
[/b]
Someone should have told the Fuehrer about this in 1938 when these designs were being developed. The Axis will have the opportunity to select the 110G2 at a time when it became available to the real-world Axis. Should be something to look forward to.
I have yet to see where the panser is available that could mount a credible defense agaist the swarms of M8s and M3s that blanket base captures.
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And here you should be speaking to, and assisting, your commanders. This is a selection and placement issue. Sometimes people pick well, sometimes they don't. Part of the dynamic of a war game is living with both kinds of picks.
soda mentioned to me that our bases take longer to come back because the allied bases are resupplied and they have a dedicated cadre of resuppliers. I'm not going to question that but I will point out that when it is 16 v 6 (not an atypical occurance) and my team does not have the capability to effectively pork ord and Vbase troops in a 200 mile radius it becomes futile and moot.
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This is plainly something that works both ways. When the odds are 2v1 or 3v1 you will naturally not be able to fly resupply. The odds will turn your way later on, we've all seen it happen.
the allied players are gamey, the setup is skewed and if steps are not taken to correct it some of us will seek recreation elsewhere.
I probably can't think of any less constructive line to write in a thread like this. Fork and Soda have been busting their humps on this setup, as have the commanders for the two sides. If you have had history in this arena (and I believe that you have) you will recognize that the staff has generally spent more time in Axis planes over the years than in Allied craft. There is no Vast Anti-Axis Conspiracy, and I am offended that you suggest there is.
- oldman
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Truekill,
So what in the name of sam hill do you expect the opposing side to do whil in the middle of a war? Be glad it wasn't 11 to 1 as it could have been.
Immediately after taking A83 which by the way you abandoned to go romp in the DA, Allied command discussed whether we should proceed en masse or call it a night. CO said not really worth it because it won't count. Not everyone allied was actually on VOX range so not everyone got the memo.
Since you say it was only 4-1 then obviously 7 of us logged and left well enough alone.
Of the 2 base captures I was involved in last night, yes only 2 in 2-1/2 hrs, Axis command or lack there of, provided little to the defence of their bases. Both were abandoned after lack luster defences. The side balance during that time period was near even and my capture SS's show that. That port your talking about, Axis took it from us on one of those so called "milkruns" only an 1hr earlier.
So the heck, do we just sit in the tower and and put the war on hold until the enemy drags their rear outta bed, or do press on and use our temporary advantage in #'s to move the front? Are we supposed to stop playing the game, which the last time I looked still was just that, a game, or are we allowed to to continue enjoying something we pay for?
So in closing, What would have you done in that same situation Mr. TrueKill?
Please tell me what you expect of us.
BTW Frode, I apolgize for that HO last night. Your plane was so well camo'd in the terrain I actually could not completely make you out. My fault and I apologize .
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(http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff107/tymekeepyr/BeatDeadHorse.gif)
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I'm sorry that you are offended but how else can one perceive a CV killed with great effort by outnumbered players only to have it respawn and continue with one hour or perhaps less?
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Originally posted by heythere
I'm sorry that you are offended but how else can one perceive a CV killed with great effort by outnumbered players only to have it respawn and continue with one hour or perhaps less?
Now you know how the allies feel.. Our CV's have to travel half way across the map to see any action.. one of them takes 12 hours to make into a fight.
Axis have CV's in the fight with in 1 to 2 hours and you are complaining because we have 1 cv that was close to your base? Take a look at your ports compared to ours.
Each sector takes roughly 1 hour for a CV to travel.. now you do the math to see who has a CV advantage.
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(http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff107/tymekeepyr/milkrun-starwars-rwb-max.jpg)
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I have a new batch of cookies now where are the Axis cvs. ;)
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No offense TK but I've seen the same stuff done by Axis. I'm not anyone in charge on the allies side but I always do my best to stop any base captures by the side I'm on when the numbers are bad.
As 4440 said most of us logged off after we captured A82 or what ever that north A base was. So we can't control everyone actions when most of us log off.
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Originally posted by Bruv119
Vans???? in a Hangar? camping??
I don't believe you for one second.
Edit: that guy deleted his post really quick!
hehe i was camping a V-base hanger with my M8 waiting 15 min for the goons to fly in. I admit it :D :D .
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TrueKill,
I did not mean to offend you sir. But the AXIS seem to get away with milking bases when their are no allies on but you cry wolf when their are 4 allies and someone AFK. How were they suppose to know if he was afk or not? it just seem off.
Like i said i did not mean to offend you sir.
VC
Allied-XO
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I like milk, whole milk not 2% or skim.
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Originally posted by crockett
Now you know how the allies feel.. Our CV's have to travel half way across the map to see any action.. one of them takes 12 hours to make into a fight.
Axis have CV's in the fight with in 1 to 2 hours and you are complaining because we have 1 cv that was close to your base? Take a look at your ports compared to ours.
Each sector takes roughly 1 hour for a CV to travel.. now you do the math to see who has a CV advantage.
well strafing if that is indeed the case that is awful too. unless you guys have multiple CVs (we have two) your boats seem to be back in position within one hour.
my point isn't to have your boats further away or that the set up be more difficult for you. my point is that the set up should be as closely matched as possible for fun's sake. it's more fun for all if there is an equal chance of success.
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That is not true sir. When the arena reset, we have to take our CV's all the way back up. At least a 3 to 4 hour's before they would be useful again.
VC
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At one point you DID have a port just about 1 sector or less away.
Your CV spawned right off our coast in the backyard.
We took precations and measures to ensure that this didn't last long.
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Originally posted by heythere
well strafing if that is indeed the case that is awful too. unless you guys have multiple CVs (we have two) your boats seem to be back in position within one hour.
my point isn't to have your boats further away or that the set up be more difficult for you. my point is that the set up should be as closely matched as possible for fun's sake. it's more fun for all if there is an equal chance of success.
You had an equal amount of CV's to ours.. We just took them away from you. :)
Axis had two CV's at the south side of the map, that could be at an Allied base with in 2 hours tops. One of them spawned within 1 hour of the Allies south coast line , the other was roughly two hours away.
Your CV on the North Eastern side of the map could be at an Allies base with in 3 hours. Now that we have advanced it's much closer.
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with all the milking going on for the allied side I'm surprised there are any axis bases or CVs left.
VC before you go calling someone a liar you might want to check the facts. last night an allied CV was inplace off of 28 with the hour of many of us sinking one. there were lots of players on who can corroborate that fact.
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Strategery and Trickeration
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Originally posted by heythere
with all the milking going on for the allied side I'm surprised there are any axis bases or CVs left.
VC before you go calling someone a liar you might want to check the facts. last night an allied CV was inplace off of 28 with the hour of many of us sinking one. there were lots of players on who can corroborate that fact.
You ever take into consideration that there might have been more than one CV?
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Originally posted by heythere
with all the milking going on for the allied side I'm surprised there are any axis bases or CVs left.
VC before you go calling someone a liar you might want to check the facts. last night an allied CV was inplace off of 28 with the hour of many of us sinking one. there were lots of players on who can corroborate that fact.
i never once called you a liar, but last night i remember we had 2 Cv's off of that area. And like you said you should go check out the facts.
And this brings up something else. it's seems all the blame is put on the allies for milking. witch is funny as hell. The fact is AXIS milk more then we do. I log on every morning before school to see how's the AvA going and every day i see the same 3 or 4 people attack an undefended base.we let it go, and have not thought about it. we not want to start anything so childish. But it seems the Axis have the big ego's thinking they never milk witch is total bull. They know it and we know it. Remember when the Axis pushed the allied back to A2... that was milkers doing what they do best and take undefended bases. And Ive got the SS to prove it. It was about 8:30am est or so if i remember correctly. and before you go off on saying i was in their, i was only in their for a few sec seeing how it looked.
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z144/VansCrew/ahss2.jpg)
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VC accusations of milking coming from you are funny. I have watched you milk and bomb CVs with no one on. let it go this will only spiral downward from here.
I digress from further commentary regarding this topic or this contest.
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what ever dude unless you have proof shut up. As for this is done with competing with you like a 12 year old because your wrong.
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Vans that picture shows nothing more then three axis on. Unless you show some troops running to the maproom I dont think you can say they were milking.
4440 I dont think you and I are talking about the same thing. You were not on when I came back. Again would you take some time to read what Fork (a CM) typed:
Please do not capture bases if you do not have sufficient opponents. The term is 'milk-running' and is not considered professional conduct for the AvA.
You have strategic targets to keep you occupied.
If you have any issues with this occurring, please post your evidence in here. I have enabled attachments and pictures in this forum.
So yes, I guess you are supposed to suspend the war untill people are there to defend. You want to know what I would have done? Well a few times Iv come in and no one was in the arena I then take a Ju88 up from a back field and practice bombing with the old AH1 bomb site. If I dont feel like doing that I sit back turn on the TV and wait for someone to come on.
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Originally posted by heythere
I have watched you milk and bomb CVs with no one on.
Anyone else see a contradiction here? :lol
Anyways... I don't want to get involved, I've gotten in enough trouble about milkrunning. But, the Axis saying that they do not milk run and allies do is utter bull****.
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Originally posted by Larry
Vans that picture shows nothing more then three axis on. Unless you show some troops running to the maproom I dont think you can say they were milking.
4440 I dont think you and I are talking about the same thing. You were not on when I came back. Again would you take some time to read what Fork (a CM) typed:
Please do not capture bases if you do not have sufficient opponents. The term is 'milk-running' and is not considered professional conduct for the AvA.
You have strategic targets to keep you occupied.
If you have any issues with this occurring, please post your evidence in here. I have enabled attachments and pictures in this forum.
So yes, I guess you are supposed to suspend the war until people are there to defend. You want to know what I would have done? Well a few times Iv come in and no one was in the arena I then take a Ju88 up from a back field and practice bombing with the old AH1 bomb site. If I dont feel like doing that I sit back turn on the TV and wait for someone to come on.
Well I can tell you this...as I posted in another thread.
When I logged last night Allies held A84, A83, A28 & v93. I logged in a few times today to see if any players were online in AvA. I think I logged in about 4 times and saw no one online till about 4pm or 5pm est.
When I logged in then the Axis now owns all 4 of those bases. So either they weren't reset properly after the map reset or Axis went on a milk run.
Either way the Allies lost 4 bases today that we should not have lost. Fairly irritating as well is the fact we had our CV's set in place for attacks tonight and now they are several hours out of play because of the reset.
I realise no one can help the reset, but compiling about 1 base and 3 milk runners is nothing compared to what Allies lost today to the Axis. So consider your self lucky that the Axis apparently gained 4 bases with out any effort on your teams part.
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See thats the thing you cant proove that they were milked. As far as you know there might have been a few allied there when the axis took them, on the other hand they could have been milked. Kinda the same when I loged out at around 2am one night only to log on at 7am to see that axis had lost more then 10 bases and were pushed behind our lines.
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Originally posted by Larry
See thats the thing you cant proove that they were milked. As far as you know there might have been a few allied there when the axis took them, on the other hand they could have been milked. Kinda the same when I loged out at around 2am one night only to log on at 7am to see that axis had lost more then 10 bases and were pushed behind our lines.
I think it's pretty safe to say either they wern't reset properly or they were milked. Another allie said on channel tonight that he also logged on several times to find no one online.
Reguardless I thought it was a rule that any less thn 15 online was considered milk runs. Isn't that what you were complaining about in reguards to the port?
3 Allies and 1 Axis..at the port.
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Originally posted by crockett
I think it's pretty safe to say either they wern't reset properly or they were milked. Another allie said on channel tonight that he also logged on several times to find no one online.
Reguardless I thought it was a rule that any less thn 15 online was considered milk runs. Isn't that what you were complaining about in reguards to the port?
3 Allies and 1 Axis..at the port.
If there are under 15 people on any base you take will not count in no way is that a milk. A milk is taking a base that has no defenders.
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Originally posted by Larry
If there are under 15 people on any base you take will not count in no way is that a milk. A milk is taking a base that has no defenders.
Well in that case they can't be blamed that your guy was Afk.. for all they knew he could have been waiting in a GV or manned gun.
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Originally posted by Redlegs
Anyone else see a contradiction here? :lol
Anyways... I don't want to get involved, I've gotten in enough trouble about milkrunning. But, the Axis saying that they do not milk run and allies do is utter bull****.
no contradiction I logged on from a computer at work that will barely get 10 FPS in the tower. useful for watching you fellows pork and then say you never did. it takes good screenies though.
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Originally posted by crockett
Well in that case they can't be blamed that your guy was Afk.. for all they knew he could have been waiting in a GV or manned gun.
He had been on and afk for more then an hour. So when they droped the Vh and killed the ack I dont think they could have said that. I got on to see two lvts poping ord and troops, all ack dead same with the VH. I heard a rumble in the background and here comes the C47 around the hill droping his troops.
Again read the thing that fork said mainly the first line.
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Originally posted by soda72
email it to me....
Dude Soda, your youtube video is awesome.
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Originally posted by VansCrew1
i never once called you a liar, but last night i remember we had 2 Cv's off of that area. And like you said you should go check out the facts.
And this brings up something else. it's seems all the blame is put on the allies for milking. witch is funny as hell. The fact is AXIS milk more then we do. I log on every morning before school to see how's the AvA going and every day i see the same 3 or 4 people attack an undefended base.we let it go, and have not thought about it. we not want to start anything so childish. But it seems the Axis have the big ego's thinking they never milk witch is total bull. They know it and we know it. Remember when the Axis pushed the allied back to A2... that was milkers doing what they do best and take undefended bases. And Ive got the SS to prove it. It was about 8:30am est or so if i remember correctly. and before you go off on saying i was in their, i was only in their for a few sec seeing how it looked.
(http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z144/VansCrew/ahss2.jpg)
Err......How about we put in something that evens out the fields, just if its like 4-0 just next time some1 lands or is shot down, they are put to the other side, ally or axis. Ive seen it happen in plenty of games before.....
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Uh, how about no?
How about I picked a side, drew my line in the sand, and I'm daring the other guy to cross it. (I think that sounds familiar like I heard it somewhere)
All of a sudden, I can't fly with my squad? Now I have to fight them, no less? I didn't even get a choice in it?
Lemme think................
Uhhhhh, how about no!
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Originally posted by VonMessa
Uh, how about no?
How about I picked a side, drew my line in the sand, and I'm daring the other guy to cross it. (I think that sounds familiar like I heard it somewhere)
All of a sudden, I can't fly with my squad? Now I have to fight them, no less? I didn't even get a choice in it?
Lemme think................
Uhhhhh, how about no!
:rofl it's amazing what some folks will think of.
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(http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff107/tymekeepyr/termodeadesao_logo_milkrun.jpg)
Helping dweebs take bases since the beginning of flight sims.