Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: ink on February 18, 2008, 07:11:18 PM
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well i just want to put out there that for those of you who dont know,
the SUICIDE DWEEBS do change countries as the numbers see fit, in other words we most often fly for the team with the lowest #ers, so if you shoot us down one day and then we are flying as your friendly,the next, dont think spy, think theres someone who flys for the fight.
to all you AHers
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Oh...I was expecting a rant :(
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I'm guessing that someone accused you of being a spy today?
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the 80th usually flies low number teams also. Good to see others trying to make the game better for the community.
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Greetings,
I check to see if Squadies are on. If not, I look to see if a couple of people I know are on. If not, lowest side.
Regards,
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I check the roster numbers first thing when I log in, if I'm not already on the side with lowest numbers I switch. I check the roster periodically while I am logged in and if the numbers show I am no longer on the side with the lowest, I switch again. :)
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I've finally gotten past my "staying loyal to a chess piece" stage. I've realized that it's about who you're flying with, not what country or whatever.
It's made the game a ton more enjoyable.:aok
donkey
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who are the suicide dweebs?
Swapping countries for the lowest #'s good for you!
How about game jumping?
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Originally posted by Shuffler
the 80th usually flies low number teams also. Good to see others trying to make the game better for the community.
Funny I made same arguement on AvA arena and got totally bashed over asking if numbers were so outa place if people would switch over.
However if numbers are low in one country, usually numbers are crazy in the other arena for that same country. I would say instead of hording one arena balance it out, always been my thing, but number caps too say otherwise.
What sucks is when you come on the "main" LW arena to see bishops with numbers like 50 rooks 125 knits 125 and goto other arena, you see they have numbers of 125 and 50 50 as followed.
Never could figure this out, I remember knights used to do this, you'd get numbers like 125 50 125 but in 2nd arena knights would have over 100 in it vs 40 40.
I do remember my old squad name was "death by eny" when this happens.
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It's funny. My squad rarely changes countries. We did on Sunday 'cause the Bish were so outnumbered in MW. Then we spent the rest of the night dealing with folks who thought we were there to spy.
Sheesh.
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Changing countries is fun! :aok
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My squad is in the middle of a country tour, every 2 months we switch countries, we were Rooks, now were Bish, next we'll be Knights. Were doing this to see if we find one country we like better then another.
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Once upon a time, before the MA's were split into the different arena's that we have now, I would have said country jumping was bad. Stay on one country, keep the numbers' consistent, try for balance, keep the gameplay good for everyone.
However, the way the setup is today, even with ENY factored in, balance is seemingly impossible. And the effect of the balance is worse, when you see the lower overall arena #'s. When you have fewer people in an arena, you don't need as many over one side or another to make a big difference. A 'horde' can be comprised of fewer people, and still have the same effect.
I know Dale (Hitech) Split the MA's to try to fix a perceived problem with the gameplay. But it seems' like the cure spawned more problems' than we origanally had.
So now, I say please jump to balance...But please do so responsibly. Don't simply go somewhere else, simply to try to get the most squad base captures, or because one team is on a roll, and you can get alot of vulch kills' off of the 'steam roller' effect. Jump to make this game better for everyone. Thank you.
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Originally posted by baine1
It's funny. My squad rarely changes countries. We did on Sunday 'cause the Bish were so outnumbered in MW. Then we spent the rest of the night dealing with folks who thought we were there to spy.
Sheesh.
You guys are ALWAYS welcome with our squad in Bishland Baine1! Pay no attention to those fembots that make baseless accusations! The AAs flew bish a couple of tours ago and I was happy to wing with 'em. Now that they are Rooks, I'm happy to fight against 'em!
The only players that I've ever accused of spying are the ones that DO spy.
For example, a (unamed squeaker) player was a rook, switched, flew a couple of missions that were both ambushed by a large amount of uppers AT altitude after a good tight NOE flight to a "backwater" base! No DARBAR showed during either flight and we encountered no "enemy" aircraft during either mission UNTIL we popped over the ridgeline and (shazamm) 20+ uppers were laying in wait. The only factor that differed from any number of succesful missions by the same planner (both before and after) was the inclusion of this player who's gameid I won't mention.
I have winged with squads from Rooks and Knights and have had the same guys wing with our squad (False Prophets). We've had fun both ways, but will never fight against our "original" countries. That way the spying accusations are not a factor. I have had nothing but respect shown toward myself or other squaddies when we do these "exchanges".
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For example, a (unamed squeaker) player was a rook, switched, flew a couple of missions that were both ambushed by a large amount of uppers AT altitude after a good tight NOE flight to a "backwater" base! No DARBAR showed during either flight and we encountered no "enemy" aircraft during either mission UNTIL we popped over the ridgeline and (shazamm) 20+ uppers were laying in wait. The only factor that differed from any number of succesful missions by the same planner (both before and after) was the inclusion of this player who's gameid I won't mention.
Maj.Issue: It is argued, that NOE 'sneak' missions, in which a group of players' attempts' to capture a base with no opposition, is actually more detrimental to gameplay, than spying is.
What you just described your mission doing, is claimed to be the destruction of gameplay.
As a matter of fact, the (unnamed squeaker) will actually stand in better regard with some members' of this community for his action of 'spying' - which you deplore - and he will actually get more kudos' for it.
Was the fight fun? I'd like to hear the other side of the story.
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Originally posted by FrodeMk3
Maj.Issue: It is argued, that NOE 'sneak' missions, in which a group of players' attempts' to capture a base with no opposition, is actually more detrimental to gameplay, than spying is.
What you just described your mission doing, is claimed to be the destruction of gameplay.
As a matter of fact, the (unnamed squeaker) will actually stand in better regard with some members' of this community for his action of 'spying' - which you deplore - and he will actually get more kudos' for it.
Was the fight fun? I'd like to hear the other side of the story.
I disagree on the NOE sneak missions. They happened in RL, why not in the game? I think spying is far worse. Sure, the RL wars have spys, but the risk was death.. Spying poses no risk in the game.
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Originally posted by Scca
I disagree on the NOE sneak missions. They happened in RL, why not in the game? I think spying is far worse. Sure, the RL wars have spys, but the risk was death.. Spying poses no risk in the game.
Neither do NOE missions, which also had the risk of death in RL. There is a reason why they were comparatively rare...
We do neither die from spying or NOE in this game ;)
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Originally posted by Lusche
Neither do NOE missions, which also had the risk of death in RL. There is a reason why they were comparatively rare...
We do neither die from spying or NOE in this game ;)
Well, I have "died" during several NOE missions. Since we have kill shooter, we can't take care of the spys..
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Originally posted by Lusche
Neither do NOE missions, which also had the risk of death in RL. There is a reason why they were comparatively rare...
We do neither die from spying or NOE in this game ;)
No, we don't die, Lusche.
Just everyone's interest in playing AH, that's all.
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Thats where the problem is. Everyone is flying for the lowest numbers side. No wonder one side has always more people.
Wait a minute :huh
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Originally posted by Bruv119
who are the suicide dweebs?
Swapping countries for the lowest #'s good for you!
How about game jumping?
we are the SUICIDE DWEEBZ , not a large squad just 3 of us.
my first 4 years in AH i was a BOP. no country jumpin alowed
so once i left them i desided to jump, the game has been way better for me, now i fight red guys to get my killz not green.
game jumping? ive played all the other flight sims none match up to AH.
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Originally posted by FrodeMk3
Maj.Issue: It is argued, that NOE 'sneak' missions, in which a group of players' attempts' to capture a base with no opposition, is actually more detrimental to gameplay, than spying is.
What you just described your mission doing, is claimed to be the destruction of gameplay.
As a matter of fact, the (unnamed squeaker) will actually stand in better regard with some members' of this community for his action of 'spying' - which you deplore - and he will actually get more kudos' for it.
Was the fight fun? I'd like to hear the other side of the story.
At the time the Bish [outnumbered again] were getting hammered. The intent of the "behind the lines" mission was to take pressure off the "front line" bases. So even though the base takes were busted, the number of players that upped to defend, took players from that besieged bases on the "front" and gave a little time for us to regroup. To spin it... a sucessful failure! another viewpoint would be an opportunity for the rooks to pad their scores in a 'turkey shoot". From my viewpoint is wasn't fun to fly 20 minutes NOE, only to get my heavy 110 bounced by several spixteens and LAs.
A deep NOE attack will change the dynamic of the battle and move initative [sp?] to the attackers.
I would rather make the opposition react to what I'm doing than to be the one that was trying to prevent them from taking my bases.
Changing countries for the purpose of telling the opposition what is coming is IMHO dishonorable! Do you hold a different opinion?
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Only thing that annoys me most, is NOE bomber missions. A set of 4-5 lanc groups go over a field and take down all hangers, and town before anyone has time to react and the base is already lost. Spies however my impression is if someone is going to spend an extra 15 dollars on a video game simply to shoot down a few goons is seriously in need of a new hobby. Saying that if someone wants to spend 30 dollars on a video game a month so be it! Hey I spent 200 on my flight setup, why can't the next guy spend little extra achieving his ultimate goal of shooting down the most goons a month?
Instead of paying 15 for a spy, simply watch your dar circles, when one starts flashing with no Dar around it, pretty good idea either a GV or NOE raid is Inbound. Much cheaper and taking an La7 up to intercept you can easily get 5k in a minute or two so your well and ready for defense.
just my 2 pennies.
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Originally posted by Scca
I disagree on the NOE sneak missions. They happened in RL, why not in the game? I think spying is far worse. Sure, the RL wars have spys, but the risk was death.. Spying poses no risk in the game.
Over water maybe, but your telling me that a squadron could fly low over the coast of France all the way to the Rhine and no one would have noticed or called it in to the LW? Doubt it.
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Originally posted by Scca
I disagree on the NOE sneak missions. They happened in RL, why not in the game? I think spying is far worse. Sure, the RL wars have spys, but the risk was death.. Spying poses no risk in the game.
And the risk of flying bombers at tree top in enemy territory would be what? 70 virgins? :O
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Originally posted by MajIssue
At the time the Bish [outnumbered again] were getting hammered. The intent of the "behind the lines" mission was to take pressure off the "front line" bases. So even though the base takes were busted, the number of players that upped to defend, took players from that besieged bases on the "front" and gave a little time for us to regroup. To spin it... a sucessful failure! another viewpoint would be an opportunity for the rooks to pad their scores in a 'turkey shoot". From my viewpoint is wasn't fun to fly 20 minutes NOE, only to get my heavy 110 bounced by several spixteens and LAs.
A deep NOE attack will change the dynamic of the battle and move initative [sp?] to the attackers.
I would rather make the opposition react to what I'm doing than to be the one that was trying to prevent them from taking my bases.
I have always disagreed with this logic. If you want to draw players away from the active front why not come into the rear base with alt and light up dar so they can all see where you are? I can assure you that will draw far more players that an NOE mission where all your going to get is vulched if you try to defend.
Be honest with us. I've heard this from many a player including veteran former squadies. the only reason for NOE is:
1. Take the base with no or limited resistance.
2. Drop hangers and ack without resistance in support of 1.
3. Setup the vulch fest.
Thing is, when the opposition does come up and the fight is on, to many times I have heard "This is a bust, lets go somewhere else". How does that help the other front being hoarded?
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Originally posted by Clifra Jones
Over water maybe, but your telling me that a squadron could fly low over the coast of France all the way to the Rhine and no one would have noticed or called it in to the LW? Doubt it.
Well, is 600 miles enough?
This was from more recent, but I think you will get the picture http://www.f-16.net/news_article1833.html (http://www.f-16.net/news_article1833.html)
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Originally posted by dedalos
And the risk of flying bombers at tree top in enemy territory would be what? 70 virgins? :O
Never tried an NOE bomber mission D, nor was bomber mentioned in the post until Adonai said he didn't like them, but thank you for sharing. Your contribution was "grand". :huh
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Originally posted by Scca
Never tried an NOE bomber mission D, nor was bomber mentioned in the post until Adonai said he didn't like them, but thank you for sharing. Your contribution was "grand". :huh
OK, no bombers. I will even assume nothing heavy either. What do you think the risk in would be in real life? I am guessing death but you seem to have a dif opinion so please give us your "grand" contribution. As a matter of fact, the spy would have a bigger chance making it out of the war alive than anyone would getting out of the mission.
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Originally posted by dedalos
OK, no bombers. I will even assume nothing heavy either. What do you think the risk in would be in real life? I am guessing death but you seem to have a dif opinion so please give us your "grand" contribution. As a matter of fact, the spy would have a bigger chance making it out of the war alive than anyone would getting out of the mission.
Hummmm... Another contribution, and one that happenes to be a little more "period". Doolittle raid (http://worldwar2history.info/Midway/Doolittle.html) (ya, they were bombers, and the base, mostly undefended, because it was a "suprise attack")
NOE's are dangerous true, but done.
Actually D, I was the one who brought up death..
Thanks again. :D, you are a real peach.
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Originally posted by Clifra Jones
I have always disagreed with this logic. If you want to draw players away from the active front why not come into the rear base with alt and light up dar so they can all see where you are? I can assure you that will draw far more players that an NOE mission where all your going to get is vulched if you try to defend.
Be honest with us. I've heard this from many a player including veteran former squadies. the only reason for NOE is:
1. Take the base with no or limited resistance.
2. Drop hangers and ack without resistance in support of 1.
3. Setup the vulch fest.
Thing is, when the opposition does come up and the fight is on, to many times I have heard "This is a bust, lets go somewhere else". How does that help the other front being hoarded?
I disagree... Vulching is limited due to the speed of the attack.
Take the base quickly... ABSOLUTELY
Minimal resistance... Ya Sure YouBetcha
If a NOE attack is performed correctly there will not be enough time for many to up... They will up from adjacent bases to squash the "beach head" before it gets bigger.
The desired result comes AFTER the rear area base is captured, where the focus becomes re-taking the base and not taking our frontline bases.
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Originally posted by Scca
I disagree on the NOE sneak missions. They happened in RL, why not in the game? I think spying is far worse. Sure, the RL wars have spys, but the risk was death.. Spying poses no risk in the game.
lol, how do you read that? All I am saying is that the risk of an NOE in real life was greater than the risk of being a spy.
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Leviathn, the CO of the Blue Knights used to make me switch sides so he could voulch me and patch his scor.
Just sayin.
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All the references to real life cause me to think, if an island or base can be taken by low bombers(NOE) and escorts or even some low(NOE)38's or 47's to gain a point of strategic necessity. Does it matter it it pisses off the defenders? No, not really. Look at Pearl Harbor. Did the US run the the forums to complain? No, no we didn't. Did we get our collective crap together, and start to organize an offense that was effective to win the war. Even here, we are here to win the war. Not score potato, gain perks, or boast about who gets their name on the index page to HTC. Those are bonuses. I've never played as anything but a rook, but flying with the JUGS, I fly with pilots from other countries, and it is good. There are a lot of good people that just want to play, let them.
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WHAT???? NOE BOMBER MISSIONS???? HOW DARE THEY?????
and I wasnt even invited to that one.:O
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i should try country jumping when none of the pigs are on, i might be the only rook below 10k!
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Originally posted by Adonai
Funny I made same arguement on AvA arena and got totally bashed over asking if numbers were so outa place if people would switch over.
Completely different situation. The AvA at the time was running their ongoing "war" where people were encouraged to pick a side and stay on it for the duration.
Normally, the AvA strongly encourages side switching to even the sides (and better the fights).
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Originally posted by E25280
Completely different situation. The AvA at the time was running their ongoing "war" where people were encouraged to pick a side and stay on it for the duration.
Normally, the AvA strongly encourages side switching to even the sides (and better the fights).
Just back from EW arena. 5-6 Bish and Knights on, attacking Rookland with only 1 noob defending (or better: sitting there). I was Knight at that time from earlier today, so I switched to Rook, after announcing it on CH1. Of course I was more or less called a lamer from some players on both sides happily battling buildings... :rolleyes:
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Originally posted by Lusche
Just back from EW arena. 5-6 Bish and Knights on, attacking Rookland with only 1 noob defending (or better: sitting there). I was Knight at that time from earlier today, so I switched to Rook, after announcing it on CH1. Of course I was more or less called a lamer from some players on both sides happily battling buildings... :rolleyes:
That's too bad.
Not sure what that has to do with my point about the Axis vs. Allies arena, though? :huh Perhaps you quoted the wrong person? Or am I missing a subtle point?
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I'm not sure what shuff is talking about, the 80th are very loyal to one country. If you aren't on one country all the time, then you don't have team spirit. That's what causes our team to lose the war, and if you lose the war you aren't having fun. Most of the war losing is due to furballers, who are the worst things to ever happen in the game, completely ruined it IMO.
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Originally posted by E25280
That's too bad.
Not sure what that has to do with my point about the Axis vs. Allies arena, though? :huh Perhaps you quoted the wrong person? Or am I missing a subtle point?
It's very subtle...
It's 5 am here and I merely hit "quote" instead of "reply" ;)
And Mensa, did you recently inherit a hook factory?
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Originally posted by Lusche
It's very subtle...
It's 5 am here and I merely hit "quote" instead of "reply" ;)
:rofl I was wondering. :aok
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First, I didn't take the time to read each and every reply in this discussion.
But, it's my opinion that if Hitech did not wish for any NOE factor in the game, he would have removed it years ago, or not included it in the program in the first place.
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Dont mind people switching sides, Hell i do it as well to even out the balence.
Just don't like people who switch then try to tell where the CV from there previous country is. have had to more than once to tell people to just keep it to them selves as it's in bad taste
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Originally posted by mensa180
I'm not sure what shuff is talking about, the 80th are very loyal to one country. If you aren't on one country all the time, then you don't have team spirit. That's what causes our team to lose the war, and if you lose the war you aren't having fun. Most of the war losing is due to furballers, who are the worst things to ever happen in the game, completely ruined it IMO.
well i hate to burst your bubble, but its NOT about winning the war, its about AIR COMBAT, and furballing is the backbone of that air combat,
in any case the game is different to different people and the main objective is to have fun, furballing to me is FUN its the only FUN.
but who em i to say how anyone else should play there game, except have fun.
to all you AHers
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There's one :).
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NOE missions are not a walk in the park..
in many ways they carry more risk than a convention MASS mission..
just for starters if you are spotted by just on enemy more than 2 minutes from target.. the mission is usually totally screwed considering the TYPICAL NOE mission consists of relativly few fighters.. mostly attack aircraft and goons.. with a few fighters thrown in to deal with fighters upping from the field to attack the strike package..
you cant compare what goes on in AH to what went on in real life and judge by it for the simple reason..
F.E.A.R
in real life fear of death was a major factor.. and was considered when planning attacks and such..
in AH if a mission is coming in what do you get? dweeb takes up LA7, blasts into the middle of the mission and kills (or tries to kill) the goon he has 0% chance of survival.. and if he fails the first attempt.. withing seconds hes back at it again.. over and over..
in one NOE mission that lasted about 6 miniutes from the moment we broke dar, till we got the capture.. I shot down 4 LA7s.. all flown by the same guy...
each time he would take off, and shoot along the deck towards the town (and goon) he wouldn't bother even trying to evade me or anyone else.. just take off eat a helping of jug slugs, re up.. second course..
I think he would have eventually got the goon of for no other reason than us running out of ammo.
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I keep waiting for Hubs or Grits to jump in this thread...
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Originally posted by Dragon
Look at Pearl Harbor. Did the US run the the forums to complain? No, no we didn't.
:lol Sure you did. If by forums you mean the radio and the news papers I am pretty sure the articles were not reading about the amazing stratigery and planing of the Rooks attacking the Bish at Pearl Harbor. I don't remember seeing anything about the honor and heroism of attacking an undefended base (kind of).
In addition, the members of the Rook squad that happened to be on the Bish side where identified as spying dweebs and put in camps.
See? It is just like real life. And btw, I don't know of any cases where 5 110s took a base
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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I switch countries routinely. I don't ascribe to the belief that there are any definitive, timeless attributes to any chess piece, therefore I do not feel any sense of loyalty (to a virtual chess piece?).
I fly to fight with an occasional bomb run to switch gears (or if the fights are ghey with runners). To maximize the fights I usually fly for the underdog.
I have no qualms about attacking a base and during the middle of the attack switch sides to defend it. Why? Because there were five people attacking and only one defending. More targets for me.
As to NOE missions, I like them. It's fun plus it sets up a really good chance of a good furball. Do you think the side that just lost that base doesn't want it back? Oh hell yeah they do.
NOE missions to capture the VH next to HQ are uber-ghey though. If you want to destroy HQ do it like a man with 50+ Vals or 10 B-17s.
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Originally posted by mensa180
I'm not sure what shuff is talking about, the 80th are very loyal to one country. If you aren't on one country all the time, then you don't have team spirit. That's what causes our team to lose the war, and if you lose the war you aren't having fun. Most of the war losing is due to furballers, who are the worst things to ever happen in the game, completely ruined it IMO.
I agree and wholeheartedly support your position sir! You are and always will be the beacon of reason and logic that guides us poor huddled masses to Nirvana
ack-ack
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
I agree and wholeheartedly support your position sir! You are and always will be the beacon of reason and logic that guides us poor huddled masses to Nirvana
ack-ack
:rofl
"Most of the war losing is due to furballers, who are the worst things to ever happen in the game, completely ruined it IMO"
And I thought it was called Aces High.
...-Gixer
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Originally posted by Ack-Ack
I agree and wholeheartedly support your position sir! You are and always will be the beacon of reason and logic that guides us poor huddled masses to Nirvana
ack-ack
Thank you AKAK, you're one of the few respectable people left here.
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I jumped a country once but I had to get a run at it.
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Personally, I hate it when you jump a country and it ducks so you fly over it and land on your head and everyone laughs.
ack-ack
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If one logs on and chooses a country and flys that for the session fine. If you kill me (and most of you have LOL), and as I re-up I see you rolling down the runway as a countryman, I don't care for that, it makes me want to commit treason and shoot you down. I do understand and agree with the logic of equallizing the sides, just pick a side and stay there for a while. Just my .02