Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: rabbidrabbit on March 09, 2008, 11:16:51 AM
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080309/ap_on_re_as/afghan_silver_star_5 (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080309/ap_on_re_as/afghan_silver_star_5)
Good for her!
<S>
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While I am and willl always be against our women being so close to the action.
I do say good for her and WTG <S>
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Kudo's to her :aok I served with many female soldiers while in the marines and never had a problem with them. We all volunteered to do a job and i always felt as long as they could do the job they deserved the same respect as any other soldier. If you ever feel like you need convincing that a woman can serve do the research and read about the russian female soldiers in WWII. The one story that always just amazed and awed me was about 1 of the top russian snipers being a female.
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<S>Spc. Monica Lin Brown. Well done indeed and proof that there are still those typified by the sobriquet of "greatest generation" in service still today.
:aok
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Excellent, women being in combat is like the first black soldiers being allowed to fight for America. It really is a line of the same predjudice being knocked down. Same for gays fighting. It is proving what should have been known all along, it's the heart that counts and what's inside that matters.
Course i feel like much less of a man right now.....of course war and violence is the only way to prove your manhood anyway.......
Anyway :aok to her.
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You go girl!
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Excellent, women being in combat is like the first black soldiers being allowed to fight for America. It really is a line of the same predjudice being knocked down. Same for gays fighting. It is proving what should have been known all along, it's the heart that counts and what's inside that matters.
Course i feel like much less of a man right now.....of course war and violence is the only way to prove your manhood anyway.......
Anyway :aok to her.
your just a talking without any real idea of what you're saying huh?
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your just a talking without any real idea of what you're saying huh?
If women can do the job, what's the objection? Most of the objections I've heard are pretty similar to the ones used against blacks joining up. "It'll hurt unit cohesion!" "They don't have the right judgment under pressure!" "Their bodies are all wrong" "It's not them I have a problem with, it's the people around them that'll go to pieces!"
Puh-leez.
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If women can do the job, what's the objection? Most of the objections I've heard are pretty similar to the ones used against blacks joining up. "It'll hurt unit cohesion!" "They don't have the right judgment under pressure!" "Their bodies are all wrong" "It's not them I have a problem with, it's the people around them that'll go to pieces!"
Puh-leez.
I think it is more likely that a command would allow women who can't get the job done to stay in place, because it's the PC thing to do. Same with men though ~ it you can't get it done, you don't belong there. period.
Women just whine more when they're subjected to criticism about not making the grade (their standards are already cut to begin with... they should be able to make AT LEAST the sub-standard grades which have been set for them).
But hey, if they make the grade & can get it done ~ great. If not, get the heck out.
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Excellent, women being in combat is like the first black soldiers being allowed to fight for America. It really is a line of the same predjudice being knocked down. Same for gays fighting. It is proving what should have been known all along, it's the heart that counts and what's inside that matters.
Course i feel like much less of a man right now.....of course war and violence is the only way to prove your manhood anyway.......
Anyway :aok to her.
It's not the heart that counts at all. It's producing results. If you can't get the mission done ~ move aside so someone else can.
Looks like the gal here can get it done. Good for her :)
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IIRC the restriction on women in full combat role came from congress. I'm not entirely sure about that though.
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She did her job and saved lives while doing it. Great job on her part and I am glad that she is getting recognition. I just hope that it wasn't because of her being a woman as the primary reason for her getting the medal.
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If women can do the job, what's the objection? Most of the objections I've heard are pretty similar to the ones used against blacks joining up. "It'll hurt unit cohesion!" "They don't have the right judgment under pressure!" "Their bodies are all wrong" "It's not them I have a problem with, it's the people around them that'll go to pieces!"
Puh-leez.
For me its purely chauvinistic.
I do not deny that woman can do it.
for me its while they can.
They shouldnt.
Woman make babies.
Men take the lives of other womans babies.
before someone comments on the "babies" statement.
We are ALL some mothers baby. no matter how old we get
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Guys lets not reduce this to a man vs. woman, white vs. black debate. Just give the chick kudos for doing an outstanding job and move on. Man you guys here love to be negtive about everything. Go play a Wii or something. Get off the forums for awhile.
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I think it is more likely that a command would allow women who can't get the job done to stay in place, because it's the PC thing to do. Same with men though ~ it you can't get it done, you don't belong there. period.
Women just whine more when they're subjected to criticism about not making the grade (their standards are already cut to begin with... they should be able to make AT LEAST the sub-standard grades which have been set for them).
But hey, if they make the grade & can get it done ~ great. If not, get the heck out.
I am a retired USAF MSgt and supervised many young women through the years. I found them to be pretty much just like all the guys, they either performed their duties or they didn't and the same standards of job performance was required of both men and women. I had many that would work circles around some of the guys and I was proud to serve with them.
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080309/ap_on_re_as/afghan_silver_star_5 (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080309/ap_on_re_as/afghan_silver_star_5)
Good for her!
<S>
That is simply amazing that a woman is serving in the front lines like that in the 82nd Airborne Division.
How could such a petite little woman drag fellow soldiers over a hundred yards to safety?
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If women can do the job, what's the objection? Most of the objections I've heard are pretty similar to the ones used against blacks joining up. "It'll hurt unit cohesion!" "They don't have the right judgment under pressure!" "Their bodies are all wrong" "It's not them I have a problem with, it's the people around them that'll go to pieces!"
Puh-leez.
Well it's because they can't do the job. That's why the physical fitness standards are so low for them. If you made female PT standards the same as male PT standards, there wouldn't be any women left in the military. If a women can meet the same physical standards as males, and takes an oath not to get pregnant, then it wouldn't be a problem. When I was a remf I never saw one female that could do a correct pushup. But what are the graders going to do? Fail all the females?
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If women can do the job, what's the objection? Most of the objections I've heard are pretty similar to the ones used against blacks joining up. "It'll hurt unit cohesion!" "They don't have the right judgment under pressure!" "Their bodies are all wrong" "It's not them I have a problem with, it's the people around them that'll go to pieces!"
Puh-leez.
Speaking from experience...when my ship finally integrated women, the problem wasn't the women themselves, it was the men who didn't know how to act. They turned into a bunch of wild dogs with their noses in the air looking for a mate. In the meantime, the women did their job. That is my only objection to women in front line units and close quarters...boys fresh out of puberty with women parading around in front of them...not good for concentration.
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Bottom line.
A soldier saved the lives of five fellow soldiers while under fire. The soldier did what the soldier was trained to do and did it very well.
Now ask the five soldiers if they regret having their arses saved by a female soldier.
Some of you need to grow up.
<S>Spc. Monica Lin Brown.
:aok
Mac
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That is simply amazing that a woman is serving in the front lines like that in the 82nd Airborne Division.
How could such a petite little woman drag fellow soldiers over a hundred yards to safety?
We breed em tuff down here in Texas. I work with a few female officers that can fight,shoot,drink and pee standing up just as good as a man!! :rofl
And I tell you what......They are a lot meaner than most of our male officers.
WTG <S> Spc. Brown
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It's not the heart that counts at all. It's producing results. If you can't get the mission done ~ move aside so someone else can.
Looks like the gal here can get it done. Good for her :)
Yea she getting it done, thats what i'm saying.
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your just a talking without any real idea of what you're saying huh?
Do you know what your saying....cause you sure don't know what i'm saying.
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<S> :pray
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Well it's because they can't do the job. That's why the physical fitness standards are so low for them. If you made female PT standards the same as male PT standards, there wouldn't be any women left in the military. If a women can meet the same physical standards as males, and takes an oath not to get pregnant, then it wouldn't be a problem. When I was a remf I never saw one female that could do a correct pushup. But what are the graders going to do? Fail all the females?
Dude how ignorant are you ?
No really?
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I joined the RAF in 84 , back then my trade (air movements ) was an all male trade , not long after i got on SQN (BZZ)a questionaire was sent round about girls joining the trade , a vast majority were against it , citing reasons such as they cant lift the same as men , or they will just get all the easy jobs....
Anyway early 90's they let women in the trade , the world didnt end , the sky didnt fall in ...and....99.9999% of them could work just as well as the blokes , and the only ones put in the easy jobs were because the male snco's thought the women couldnt cope with the hard work....
There were a couple of girls who used the exscuse ..thats too heavy or thats too dirty .. but on the whole they were few n faR between and didnt go far in the trade.
My final example is a little and i mean little lass called Kate ...the girl worked her backside of and then could drink anyone ..an i mean anyone (yes i am a victim ) under the table , she never seemed to suffer hangover's either...the b1234tch!!!!!
So <S> to your young lady marine .....dont knock the females ...theyl get their own back in the end :)
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Female RAF pilot won the DFC recently too, first to do so.
(http://www.timesonline.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00299/goodman360_299866a.jpg)
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3508222.ece
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Bottom line.
A soldier saved the lives of five fellow soldiers while under fire. The soldier did what the soldier was trained to do and did it very well.
Now ask the five soldiers if they regret having their arses saved by a female soldier.
Some of you need to grow up.
<S>Spc. Monica Lin Brown.
:aok
i second that, <S>.
Mac
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I think it is important to note that while it is possible that some 6 year old child is an extremely good pilot... he may even save someones life.
the fact that he is.. that is not a good reason to lower the age to get a pilots license to 6 years old.
lazs
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Dude how ignorant are you ?
No really?
First off I think it's great that woman serve.....However, you seem to be the ignorant one as he is basically stating what military members see accross the board with the standard.
WOMAN HAVE LOWER PHYSICAL STANDARDS
That is a fact that is indisputable.
However, it's not the same as seperating blacks from white it's seperating the sexes period. Men and woman don't allways work well with eachother when working in close confined spaces. Then you throw in living quarters and latrines and what not and you end up with major logistical problems.
I'm not saying flat out it can't be done, I'm saying it can't be done on a broad scale.....the integration of woman into infantry/front line combat units.
Right about now you may be thinking it seems to be working in Iraq, BUT what you are ignoring is the fact that THERE ARE NO FRONT LINES IN IRAQ! Woman are serving everywhere. I personally think it's great when they can do their jobs. But then you have to look at the stats. 1 in 4 of them will end up preagnant within their first 3 years of serving. FACT! They cannot do their jobs if they are prego. The unit than loses a body wich they can't replace because she is still on their TO list.
Here's some more FACTS that I have experience with:
At the basic training level 1 in 5 does not graduate on time with tougher physical standards
1 in 4 arrives at basic training unable to do a single push ups
I see it every single day. Now i'm not saying I wouldn't go to combat with them....especially after I've trained them....however SOME of what SUAVE is posting is completly accurate.
Mixing of sexes has NEVER worked well in the military.
I've allways held the contention that until the military resembles the shower scene from starship troopers it will not mix well.
I think YOU are the ignorant one!
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Dam GunSlinger you need to get around the Real World more often. Stop looking at the World with just "American Eyes".
It seems to me that yer kinda worried that a female soldier could out do you in a PT test, under the male standards or in combat. If she did would you just laff it off and label her as a Dyke, Butch or a Lesbian to protect your own made up masculinity? Tell us how you fear...err feel?
It seems to work in South Korea, China and Israel to name a few.
Mac
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awmac.. seems to me that gunslinger laid it out very clearly and it very pragmatic about it... it seems that it is you who live in a fantasy world and have no idea what the real world is like.
I guess we will be seeing mixed gender boxing and football and.. well... why have gender be part of the olympics.. everyone is equal on your planet right?
The one with the purple sky and popcorn where 98 lb women kick the crap out of 6 200lb men at once.
lazs
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Dam GunSlinger you need to get around the Real World more often. Stop looking at the World with just "American Eyes".
It seems to me that yer kinda worried that a female soldier could out do you in a PT test, under the male standards or in combat. If she did would you just laff it off and label her as a Dyke, Butch or a Lesbian to protect your own made up masculinity? Tell us how you fear...err feel?
It seems to work in South Korea, China and Israel to name a few.
Mac
I'm mostly speaking from a broad sense here as I see it EVERY SINGLE DAY IN MY JOB! Woman in combat medic roles are great, there's no denying that and this young soldier is living proof. However saying it's prejudice and bigoted to keep them out of front line combat units is completely ignorant. These types of statements are usually made by those who have never served in those units. Just ask any of us who have served in those units.
Also keep in mind THIS ISN'T EUROPE CHINA OR N. KOREA it's America, what works for them doesn't mean it will work for us! I do believe a bunch of countries that have woman serving in those types of units are ENTIRLY made of that gender! I would have no problem with that, I bet they'd do well.
You cannot equate gender equality with racial equality the same way in every single situation....it's apples and oranges! You think I'm ignorant?????? try using a woman's bathroom in a shopping mall some day and see what happens to you.
As laz stated I think in very practical terms.....mostly based on my 12 years of service with the Military and my current job as a Basic Military Training Instructor.
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In my last post I did not use the term "ignorant" you did.
Congrats on your 12 Years, I did my 20.
BTW what happens when you go into the womans restroom at the mall?
:D
Mac