Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: stephen waldron on May 23, 2008, 10:13:06 PM
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I hear alot in Aces High about working with others to accomplish a mission. But in reality i see scant evidence of it in the game. As the member of a bomber squadron, i really can't tell the difference between flying in a squadron or flying alone. It appears the only thing you have going for you is the "herd" mentality. The idea if four bomber formations are flying together, you have a 1-4 chance of being attacked and shot down.
The experienced fighter pilot is NOT intimidated by squadrons of B-17's numbering in the dozens of planes. They know the other bomber pilots are not going to render themselves "blind" to what's going on around them by taking up a gun position to help save a friendly formation under attack. Not even for a second. So there's no difference between attacking a single formation or a squadron consisting of several formations.
This is just ONE example of what i'm talking about. I could site dozens of others that occur on a regular basis. Like calling for assitance at a threatened base, and then BUGGING OUT just as the help arrives. Happens all the time. I don't even pay attention to requests like this anymore.
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Maybe you're just in the wrong Squadron?
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Are you flying Rook? That may be a problem.
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ugh, sounds like you w/ the wrong group.
you should be VERY picky with who you pick as a squad.
they are not all created equal.
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Perhaps you don't understand the point of the Main Arenas. They are there to have fun. For some, fun is organizing the crap out of their time online. Me...I'm about having fun. I have to do the organization crap 5 days a week for a paycheck. I have no great desire to do it in my entertainment.
If you really want organization, try FSO or scenerios. The MA's are about chaos....and that is as it should be. :)
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ask your self this. how serious are you compared to your squad. its like lute said, if your serious then be picky. i had a couple of squads ask me to join before i made my dission to go with LCA. having the chance to fly with them is a big plus to see how they run things to better help make you dission :aok
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Listen to NB. He is really old, and really wise. Granted, he is not as wise as he is old, but he is fairly wise.
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As near as I can tell, Squads are like minded folks just having a good time. Mine happens to like flying P38 light bombers with a historical theme. Since it's PTO based, we prefer shooting Japanese planes first, but we're not picky. And we die to just about any plane out there.
Put us in a scenario where it matters and you won't find a more organized on task bunch of 38 drivers. Throw us in the MA and you'll likely find us on the deck turning and burning til we kill em all, or as in my case I hit the ground in a million pieces.
To me there is no "war' in the MA, just a bunch of bases that all look the same. other folks see it as a grand strategy to take all those lookalike bases.
To each their own, but expecting chess piece wide cooperation and tactics is not what the MA is about.
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Listen to NB. He is really old, and really wise. Granted, he is not as wise as he is old, but he is fairly wise.
:rofl :rofl :rofl
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The experienced fighter pilot is NOT intimidated by squadrons of B-17's numbering in the dozens of planes. They know the other bomber pilots are not going to render themselves "blind" to what's going on around them by taking up a gun position to help save a friendly formation under attack. Not even for a second. So there's no difference between attacking a single formation or a squadron consisting of several formations.
Don't know who YOUR flying buff missions with, but I'd be finding different people to fly with if I were you, cause there's lots who fly together in tight boxes and put up a heck of a rain of fire, be it one fighter or, 5 or 6 attacking.
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The experienced fighter pilot is NOT intimidated by squadrons of B-17's numbering in the dozens of planes. They know the other bomber pilots are not going to render themselves "blind" to what's going on around them by taking up a gun position to help save a friendly formation under attack. Not even for a second. So there's no difference between attacking a single formation or a squadron consisting of several formations.
Maybe I'm not an experienced enough fighter pilot, because I know that having 4 gunners (x3 when considering drone gunners) firing at me is more lethal than having lone pilot 14503839 in his B-17 formation firing at me from 2.5 out. Not even for a second.
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Put us in a scenario where it matters and you won't find a more organized on task bunch of 38 drivers. .
In Operation Downfall, I had the pleasure of leading alot of SAPP members flying P38Ls in the 'what if' scenario of the invasion of Japan. One flight really depicts us in a scenario, where we get as serious as we ever get...
We were fully loaded with 2-1k eggs and a full load of rockets on each wing heading to a Japanese airfield. Unfortunately, we got bounced by 2 squadrons of Japanese fighters. With very solid team work and real smart flying, my crew dispatched both squadrons of Japanese without a single loss and no one dropped a single bomb or rocket to lighten their load.
A few minutes later our fully loaded P38s completely flattened the base (hangers, guns and vh), and scored even more kills as another Japanese squadron was caught taking off there got the remainder of our bombers and rockets on their heads.
Definitely the most incredible time in a scenario... I'm not sure how we did it, I can't even hit an airfield with an egg in the MA and to see us in the MA you'd wonder how we can even take off.
Alot of us get more serious in that type of atmosphere while still keeping it 'fun'.
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I've heard about "scenarios" and "special event" playing. Both on squadron level and with individual pilots taking part. And it does sound like a higher standard of co-operation and organization exists in these venues. That's great. However, these venues are extremely LIMITED. Lasting a few nights over a period of a few days. Not much there to interest someone who spends hundreds of hours a month playing Aces High in the main arenas. Playing in a special event amounts to an enjoyable, but regretably MINOR diversion from the Arena Game.
Perhaps when "Combat Tour" comes out, Aces High will be able to offer something more substantial to players who are looking for more historical realism and organization in the game. I doubt i'll spend another night in the main arenas after it does. I'm just not a "chaos" and "fun" loving kind'a guy. I've seen the Elephant.. and i take wargaming VERY SERIOUSLY.
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Recently, I had disbanded my squad and have gone over to the Jokers Jokers. All of the major people like Joker, and Atil11a haven't been on wil I was there untill last night. It was the absoloute most team work I have even been on, wile I was having fun on top of it all.
We had taken over 6 bases, by ourselves.
I has been a long time since I had sny kind of fun in the MA, and last night broke that streak.
For example, we went to a base last night just to pork and vulch in GVs. I sat there in a Tiger, and wtched everyone of the Jokers die, by some guy in a Lanc, no one realy cared. So me, the last one standing, fought there in my Tiger for about 15 min. or sotaking out all of the planes that uped on my side. My squaddies were all tring to take the base.
By the time I died, I was Tracked, no pintle, and was running low on ammo, but the worst thing was that I was holding 18 kills. When I dided, most likely I would have flammed about how this guy killed me, but because of how much fun I had, I realy didn't care.
It's a tragety that I lost that many kills, but I still realy don't care
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In Operation Downfall, I had the pleasure of leading alot of SAPP members flying P38Ls in the 'what if' scenario of the invasion of Japan. One flight really depicts us in a scenario, where we get as serious as we ever get...
What year was this?
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I fly Rook and there have been many, many times Ive been flying bombers alone, called for assistance, and had help come.
Ive flown with several rook bomber squads that have an "all for one, one for all" mentality. Just the other day I had technical issues while flying formation and had the main formation slow down for me to catch up even tho we were being shadowed by fighters. Several fighter escorts went down trying to protect my bombers.
So my experiences have been completely different. I myself have dropped into a sea of red many times to help a fellow rook. And I would do so even if I didn't like the guy.
There have been times Ive landed 3,4,5 bomber kills cause a total stranger came to the aid of shot up bombers who put out a call for help. And I wouldnt hesitate to do the same. Under certain conditions it isn't historically realistic for a bomber formation to slow down for a cripple. At those times I dont expect anyone to slow down to help. But often, in fact more then often, Ive had escorting Jugs or Ponies brave a sea of red to help my bombers.
So my expereinces have been very positive. Not "perfect" but "positive". Thats why I stay Rook no matter what the eny.
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...As the member of a bomber squadron, i really can't tell the difference between flying in a squadron or flying alone...
Sounds like you're not in the right squad. If a squad is organized, it makes a huge difference. On our squad mission last night we flew Zeros and Peggys and did surprisingly well against all the late war kit.
Squad AAR from Friday
May-23: The 78th and friends flew two Rare Bird missions. The first was pretty quiet, but the second was a hard fight. At one point a Me-262 attacked the bombers but was hit by Kten's 20mm, after that the speed of the Ki-67s meant that it was actually a harder fight for the Zeros than it was for the bombers. All the way home, the buff drivers listen to the escort try and work their way out of the hot zone and to their credit only one escort was lost. Bomber losses would have been even lighter if it wasn't for a jet that followed the group all the way home and vulched the bombers as they tried to land. Trukk got revenge however by launching in another jet and shooting him down.
(http://www.78th.org/images/photos/0805/20080523-0.jpg)
(http://www.78th.org/images/photos/0805/20080523-1.jpg)
(http://www.78th.org/images/photos/0805/20080523-2.jpg)
(http://www.78th.org/images/photos/0805/20080523-3.jpg)
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Check out FSO, Friday Night Squadron Ops.
We recently set a new attendance record of 500 online.
One life event, orders are sent out via email ahead of time.
Axis vis allied, so no p51's fighting p51.
Short icon range, tends to be much higher pucker factor.
Fights tend to scatter out low like they did in real life.
Ohhh and did I mention cooperation?
Fighters escorting bombers, fighter sweeps trying to find enemy bombers.
Attack sorties, both high and low. You name it FSO has either got it or has had it.
Frames run 3 fri nights in a row with one night off. Then a new setup, so it never gets stale.
However, you do need to be prepared to fly any plane in the set. To be willing to change sides at least sometimes.
And you need to be attached to an accepted squadron, so that you get orders, etc.
FSO is IMO the very best flying possible in AH. But then I'm biased. :)
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As others have said, you are definitly in the wrong squad.
Back in the days of Air Warrior, I lead a three wing squad of over 60 players. While we weren't very good, we were well coordinated with a bomber wing and two fighter wings providing advanced attack and escort. We'd often fly from different fields and flatten strategic targets and nearby fields in advance of our main assult.
When I moved here in 2001 I decided to lone it, but last year, after winging with a few guys in fighters, I started a small squad dedicated to that purpose. At our peak there were seven of us, and out of that, there was really only one with whom I had the right chemistry. We could fly lock wing formation and always knew we had each others backs. Some left, some disappeared. Now there's only two of us left and, although we've decided to stick together, we rarely see one another so I'm pretty much a loner again.
Even at that, I get a lot of cooperation from my fellow Bish. Not always, but most of the time. Whether it's checking a towns status for a capture or clearing my six or doubling up on a buff formation the key is communication, just as it was in the squads. In my experience, you're only as alone as you want to be in this game, even as a loner. Finding the right chemistry with others to make the sum greater than the parts is another matter. It's an elusive quality but when it happens it's magic.
Take your time in choosing a squad. It sounds like you jumped right in with the first person to throw out an invite.
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I've heard about "scenarios" and "special event" playing. Both on squadron level and with individual pilots taking part. And it does sound like a higher standard of co-operation and organization exists in these venues. That's great. However, these venues are extremely LIMITED. Lasting a few nights over a period of a few days. Not much there to interest someone who spends hundreds of hours a month playing Aces High in the main arenas. Playing in a special event amounts to an enjoyable, but regretably MINOR diversion from the Arena Game.
Perhaps when "Combat Tour" comes out, Aces High will be able to offer something more substantial to players who are looking for more historical realism and organization in the game. I doubt i'll spend another night in the main arenas after it does. I'm just not a "chaos" and "fun" loving kind'a guy. I've seen the Elephant.. and i take wargaming VERY SERIOUSLY.
I was actually working on typing a long explanation of why your view is flawed. Then I realized that you are too new to understand. Give it a few years, then tell me that you have seen the elephant and that you understand what you have seen. :)
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"As others have said, you are definitly in the wrong squad."
"we rarely see one another so I'm pretty much a loner again. "
The guys are right, shop around and you will find a better fit for you. Bald, the POTW would love to cure your loneliness with an invite. Let me know...
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Not much there to interest someone who spends hundreds of hours a month playing Aces High in the main arenas.
Hundreds? Dude.
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why not start your own squad and invite other, teamwork minded peoples?
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why not start your own squad and invite other, teamwork minded peoples?
Damn you Furby!! We will not put up with that kind of logic around here!! :uhoh
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I hear alot in Aces High about working with others to accomplish a mission. But in reality i see scant evidence of it in the game. As the member of a bomber squadron, i really can't tell the difference between flying in a squadron or flying alone. It appears the only thing you have going for you is the "herd" mentality. The idea if four bomber formations are flying together, you have a 1-4 chance of being attacked and shot down.
The experienced fighter pilot is NOT intimidated by squadrons of B-17's numbering in the dozens of planes. They know the other bomber pilots are not going to render themselves "blind" to what's going on around them by taking up a gun position to help save a friendly formation under attack. Not even for a second. So there's no difference between attacking a single formation or a squadron consisting of several formations.
This is just ONE example of what i'm talking about. I could site dozens of others that occur on a regular basis. Like calling for assitance at a threatened base, and then BUGGING OUT just as the help arrives. Happens all the time. I don't even pay attention to requests like this anymore.
You must fly in a diffrent game than I.. Just about every sortie I fly I run into what some might try to call teamwork. I think you just have the wrong word for it.
I call them Gangtards.
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I think this thread also shows good co-operation and teamwork in that everyone has pointed out where stephen is wrong.
WTG us.
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High five!
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Bunch a back slapping gang tards. ;)
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Team work, cooperation, and realism exists in this game. You just have to seek it. This game is 100% dependent on the player base as far as gameplay goes, so sitting around complaining that no one else does it isn't going to do much. You have to findpeople that do things the way you like, and fly with them.
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Trollus Unintentionus.