Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: PFactorDave on July 22, 2008, 07:20:30 PM
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I've just about reached a point where I am tired of the twisty stick rudder control.
I know for a fact that I'm not flying as well as I could if I had a set of pedals.
I'd be curious to hear other peoples' opinions on the various brands of pedals before I spend $100-$150 on a set.
Thanks in advance. :salute
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I have the saiteks.works great...
Falcon23 :salute
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Check Ebay.... buy used and look for an old set of CH peds if you really don't want to spend a lot. You'll need a ps2 to usb adapter tho.
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Dave, wish I still had my pedals, I'd give them to you. Never did get the hang of them.
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Check Ebay.... buy used and look for an old set of CH peds if you really don't want to spend a lot. You'll need a ps2 to usb adapter tho.
CH never made a pedal that used the PS2 port, they were either analog or the current USB version. In either case, the OP should have no problem using an old pair of CH Pedals since most computers still have a game port he could use.
ack-ack
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I did forget what type of connection it was but either way you'll need a ____ to usb connector to make them work. I had two sets and two of my squad mates now use them since I bought new. They Love 'em
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I bought a set of CH USB Pro Pedals from ProVantage for about $90.
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<--- Agree with Falcon23. I was gifted (forget who, but thanks) a set of CH peds about 5 years ago...never felt really comfortable with them. Bought a set of Saitek peds after that and finally was comfortable making the switch from a twisty stick to the peds. The Saitek peds have adjustable foot rests as well as tension springs. I highly recommend them.
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Saitek Pro Pedals here.
a bit of a learning curve for sure when coming from a twisty, but well worth the investment (of time and money)
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Saitek Pro Pedals here.
a bit of a learning curve for sure when coming from a twisty, but well worth the investment (of time and money)
Well, I can't quite get used to a twisty stick. My wife laughs at me when I'm stomping a hole in the floor trying to kick the plane around.
Biggest problem I have with the twisty stick is I catch myself inputing some rudder even when I don't want to... Messed with the deadband a bit, which helped, but I really think I just need to get some pedals.
Do those Saitek pedals have the toe brakes?
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I've never owned Saitek peddals, just a few different types of joysticks/throttles. (X45, X52, and something earlier a few years ago). Still, Max's observation doesn't really suprise me:
"Bought a set of Saitek peds after that and finally was comfortable making the switch from a twisty stick to the peds. The Saitek peds have adjustable foot rests as well as tension springs. I highly recommend them."
I'm using CH stuff right now and my big complaint (and a common one I've heard) is that the company seems to go with the "One Size Fits All" philosophy. I found my Saitek controllers to be much more customizable (out of the box) and comfortable. Of course you can always get creative with the CH gear to make it work for you.
OTOH, the Saitek controllers I've used weren't exactly durable. They aren't bad compared to some other types, from what I've heard, but I've yet to hear a guy claim he's still using his original a decade later (watch one pop up now :D ). I have no idea if their rudder pedals follow this trend or not, and if I recall, they're a fairly new product, so no one really does yet.
Then again, if you really like the feel of them better, even if you only get 3-4 years out of them, maybe the cost of replacing them is worth it to you? Spread out over time that's not so bad.
You can probably find the Saitek peddals in your local best buy, and can likely find the CH ones in the home of your nearest fellow AH'er. Maybe someone would be willing to let you sit down and try them?
It is kind of a big investment to just jump into, but on the bright side, no matter which way you go, you won't know what you're missing :)
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[Do those Saitek pedals have the toe brakes?
[/quote]
Yes, you can use the brakes one of two ways. a pedal for each brake, or if you lazy like me, I use the right pedal for both brakes.
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Vudak cut yourself a piece of Styrofoam and glue it to the stick to raise your hand up a bit. After a couple of days the Styrofoam will conform to your hand.
or you could try applying a male enhancement product to the hand that holds your stick.
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Rudder pedals are HUGE if you fly fighters. They take some getting used to though. But , for getting inside an angle, jinking, or fine tuning an angle for a critical shot you almost have to have them. This will sound odd, but the hardest part about getting used to rudders will be resisting the tendency to over use them both in terms of the situations you use them in and the amount of rudder authority you apply when you do kick it.
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I agree with Zazen.
Percise rudder control is even more important if you're flying a fighter that has a slower roll rate like a P38.
The few students I've had that used a twisty stick had problems (unintentional snaproll mostly) and didn't really match up with someone that had pedals.
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I have CH ones.
At first it took some getting used to around about 2 weeks later everything started clicking.
Taxiing around the runway for the first time with them is worth the entrance fee :D
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Get the pedals it is so much better I have Saitek.
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Vudak cut yourself a piece of Styrofoam and glue it to the stick to raise your hand up a bit. After a couple of days the Styrofoam will conform to your hand.
I cut off a section of foam tubing and secured it to the joystick with a rubber band, same concept :)
I just don't know how he's going to adjust rudder pedals if he doesn't like the fit precisely. I suppose it could be done...
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Rudder pedals are HUGE if you fly fighters.
Lets say rudder usage is huge if you fly fighters. Pedals are good to have, but not essential IMO. They may help with precision a bit though.
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CH...period. If you waste your money on anything else, you'll be replacing/repairing them before you know it. Been there done that.
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I have CH ones.
At first it took some getting used to around about 2 weeks later everything started clicking.
Taxiing around the runway for the first time with them is worth the entrance fee :D
I would recommend rudder pedals (I've the CH and I have to stretch for the toe brake, but how often do you use the brakes if you are on the way to the ground with only one wing). :-( :furious They are definitely worth it in a dog fight. :noid :salute
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I use all Saitek gear, nearly 3 yrs on the FCS an well over a year on the pedals without a single glitch.
I used to have CH gear, and I like the Saitek pedals better that's for sure. They seem to be a wider stance than the CH stuff from what I remember.
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First off I don't use either, I can't walk & chew gum at the same time. My feet are NOT connected to my head, they go where they please. So for me rudder pedals simply do not work.
I have however seen, and flown with both CH & Saitek pedals.
My advice, go with the saitek.
They are considerably wider. Giving you a more secure feeling.
And to my unexpert feet they felt better.
If your feet are naturally coordinated, then yes, get a set of peds. You will have better control eventually.
You will also struggle for a while switching over.
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I've had both the older analog CH's and a new USB pair - and the older analog ones were constructed better. There is a very annoying hitch in the newer pair where they do not move smoothly through the entire travel.
My favorite pedals were my older analog Simpeds.
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First off I don't use either, I can't walk & chew gum at the same time. My feet are NOT connected to my head, they go where they please. So for me rudder pedals simply do not work.
You should have a couple of flying lessons ;) It'll bring your feet right into the equation :D
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OTOH, the Saitek controllers I've used weren't exactly durable. They aren't bad compared to some other types, from what I've heard, but I've yet to hear a guy claim he's still using his original a decade later (watch one pop up now :D ). I have no idea if their rudder pedals follow this trend or not, and if I recall, they're a fairly new product, so no one really does yet.
Durability, per se, has never been an issue with previous Saitek joysticks. I've never had one fall apart though I did lose a HAT button on an old Evo. I do find them to get sloppy as the Hall Sensors tend to "drift" in time. I retired my X52 (original flavor) about a year ago and bought a CH Fighterstick, which is flawless to this day.
Bottom line, Saitek peds and the X52 throttle are fine. If they could correct the nose bouce/drift on the X52, they'd have a great set-up at that $100 price point.
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I cannot say I've had any drift/bounce issues with my saitek setup
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Durability, per se, has never been an issue with previous Saitek joysticks. I've never had one fall apart though I did lose a HAT button on an old Evo. I do find them to get sloppy as the Hall Sensors tend to "drift" in time. I retired my X52 (original flavor) about a year ago and bought a CH Fighterstick, which is flawless to this day.
Bottom line, Saitek peds and the X52 throttle are fine. If they could correct the nose bouce/drift on the X52, they'd have a great set-up at that $100 price point.
I didn't mean to imply the things would disintigrate in your hands, Max :D
Saitek does have a good, deserved reputation for being one of the better-built affordable models, and in all honesty if they still made the X-45, I'd still be using one... BUT...
The "sloppiness" is not a unique thing, nor a small thing for everyone. I purchased several on E-Bay and found many completely sloppy from the previous owners use. They'll spike, slide out of position on auto climb, etc. They don't, after some wear and tear, (and not a whole lot, in my opinion) provide the kind of precision I like to have. Also, the X-45 starts off with great resistance to movement, and gradually gets less and less, making even going from one of the same model to the next a pain for the next few days.
Anyway, like I said, that's been my experience with their joysticks. Whether or not their rudder is any different, I don't know. It very well could be.
I'm still not suprised at all that everyone says the Saitek's are more comfortable.
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For me it was a huge learning curve, I almost quit trying a couple of times. But I am getting used to them and they definitely give you added performance. The only place I am struggling now is my gunnery and fine tuning my position to make a shot. If you get them don't get discoraged.
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Ranger try flying offline using the lead computing assistant. Use the tab key to enable it, and the ` (tilde) key to select targets. Some of the vets claim that turning off tracers will force you to aim at where the target will be when the ammo converges vs "walking" the tracers to the target. It seems that most shots require more lead than you think.
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P, you're at the same point I was. I recognized that twisty is more a niusance than a help, that it was affecting my other inputs and vice versa, and that ergonomically it limited me in what I could do (right v. left twist, comfort, etc).
I got a gift of old CH (non-PRO) gameport pedals. Simply 2 pedals on a base, each with its own servo, but both registering as the same axis in-game. You push the left down like a gas pedal and you get left rudder, right = right rudder. Left and right nullify each other out a bit, so that if you're pushing both down full it's almost centered.
Ancient technology compared to some pedals available, but danged if it isn't 2,000,000 times better than a twisty. Everything from taxing, hands-free takeoffs, formation flying, staying on the ball while landing, aiming, gunnery, high AOA manuvers that require much rudder, and let us not forget GV and bomber gunning without screwing up your heading unintentionally (this pissed me off as a bomber gunner with a twisty!!)
It's not just for fighters. They will allow you more control over whatever you want to do. The point is you've recognized you want that control. If you don't reach this point pedals will never help you, IMO.
Get some for cheap if you can. It took me 3-4 months to be 100% comfortable and get my rudder scaling right (and regain my aim), but it's so worth it.
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Gameport Non-Pro (these are what i have and they're 10years old and still kickin perfectly).
http://cgi.ebay.com/CH-Product-Pedals-Flight-Simulator-Like-New-No-Box-NR_W0QQitemZ190238076528QQihZ009QQcategoryZ80336QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
You'll need a gameport->USB adapter for these as well
USB pro
http://cgi.ebay.com/CH-Pro-Pedals-Flight-simulator_W0QQitemZ230273231024QQihZ013QQcategoryZ31215QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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Rudder pedals are HUGE if you fly fighters. They take some getting used to though. But , for getting inside an angle, jinking, or fine tuning an angle for a critical shot you almost have to have them. This will sound odd, but the hardest part about getting used to rudders will be resisting the tendency to over use them both in terms of the situations you use them in and the amount of rudder authority you apply when you do kick it.
Zazen is right here. My 2 cents: We play this game because it is so fun and rudder pedals add to that immensely. I'm still not use to mine but just like I said they are a blast! I use CH rudder pedals btw.
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OTOH, the Saitek controllers I've used weren't exactly durable. They aren't bad compared to some other types, from what I've heard, but I've yet to hear a guy claim he's still using his original a decade later (watch one pop up now :D ). I have no idea if their rudder pedals follow this trend or not, and if I recall, they're a fairly new product, so no one really does yet.
8+ years on my X45. :D
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Don't know if anybody has mentioned it, but the CH pedals are really closely spaced. Too close IMO for big feet. :) I have size 13 feet, and the Saitek Pro pedals work great for me.
Now the stick & throttle... CH all the way. :aok
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Don't know if anybody has mentioned it, but the CH pedals are really closely spaced. Too close IMO for big feet. :) I have size 13 feet, and the Saitek Pro pedals work great for me.
Now the stick & throttle... CH all the way. :aok
My ch pro pedals aren't. In fact that was one of the reasons I held off until I felt I absolutely had to do something. My shoe size is 12 and the pedals fit me nicely.
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I sold my CH pedals here a while ago. I'd definitely buy another set again. Don't know how well it would work with a Saitek X52 Pro stick and throttle, though.
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I sold my CH pedals here a while ago. I'd definitely buy another set again. Don't know how well it would work with a Saitek X52 Pro stick and throttle, though.
Sweet as.
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Go the Saitek ones, they have a much more comfortable stance and the wider track should translate to greater accuracy IMO.
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Go the Saitek ones, they have a much more comfortable stance and the wider track should translate to greater accuracy IMO.
Thanks. Not in the market for them right now, but I'll keep it in mind.
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My CH Pro pedals started spiking and have become non linear. I have to decide if I want to repair them or get something else. What I have read about the Simpeds sounds good but they don't seem to be available.
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8+ years on my X45. :D
Yep, they're still on Ebay brand new for about $50. I like 'em better than the X52 pro I just bought, for twice the money, lol!
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Well, I managed to catch my wife during a moment of weakness today. So I, as quickly as humanly possible, ordered a set of the Saitek pedals. Requested next day shipping, just in case she realizes what she has done and changes her mind! :D
Looking forward to getting them.
Thanks for all the input everyone.
:salute
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it'll take a little getting used to, but you won't regret it at all!
:salute
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it'll take a little getting used to, but you won't regret it at all!
:salute
Actually, I think it will be far far easier to get used to then the twisty stick I am currently using. The twisty stick is, in my opinion, very very uncomfortable. As it happens, I have a fair amount of real world "stick" time. Mostly in Cessna 152s and Piper "Traumahawks", but certainly in craft that use pedals.
Looking forward to getting back to what I feel is much more natural. :D
:salute
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If your peds don't include Velcro strips to keep 'em in place, buy a 20" x 1" section of top & bottom strip, cut them down to 10" and secure one side to the front and back of the base.
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My CH Pro pedals started spiking and have become non linear. I have to decide if I want to repair them or get something else. What I have read about the Simpeds sounds good but they don't seem to be available.
Jiggle the cable at the point where it goes into the pedals on the base. There is a design flaw in the Pro Pedals (all versions non-USB and USB) where the wires get pinched where the cable goes into the pedal base. Sometimes jiggling it gets the wires free until the next time they get pinched.
ack-ack
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Jiggle the cable at the point where it goes into the pedals on the base. There is a design flaw in the Pro Pedals (all versions non-USB and USB) where the wires get pinched where the cable goes into the pedal base. Sometimes jiggling it gets the wires free until the next time they get pinched.
ack-ack
That's good to know, my pedals should be delivered tomorrow. I'll watch for the pinch you speak of.