Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Kaw1000 on August 01, 2008, 11:58:11 AM
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http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/07/31/MNSH122TA3.DTL&feed=rss.bayarea
Man OH Man...this women just doesn't get it. What a disgrace!! I can't even stand looking at her.
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"But Pelosi, who has opposed offshore drilling throughout her two decades in Congress, insists opening new areas to drilling won't lower gas prices in the short term."
That's the general problem with Congress. They only think about the short-term and what will/will not help themselves get re-elected. We need a federal government that can think long-term beyond their own term in office.
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Dumb squeak
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we don't have the refining capacity for all that oil anyway... so when they say short term... they mean it will take years before this will have a positive effect on pricing anyway. This is a wedge issue that is meaningless.
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Yeah, we don't have the refining capabilities for the 80-some billion barrels to be pumped. You know, cause we're gonna refine every barrel tomorrow. :rolleyes:
We need to be self-sufficient oil producers. We need to STOP refining and buying from the world oil market. We can do this by drilling and pumping our own resources which will drop the price of gasoline in the next five years. Then, the demorat congress can implement their new taxes on gasoline and we'll still pay 4 bucks a gallon.
I'm glad our government cares about whats best for us. I sure doubt I could survive otherwise.
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Oil companies have been blocking alternatively fueled vehicles for years, not investing in refineries, and raking in unthinkable profits. Do you really think drilling off-shore is going to stop them from doing the same for as long as they are allowed to do so? Since Katrina, some knobsuckers have been just raking in the loot at US citizens cost.
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Yeah, we don't have the refining capabilities for the 80-some billion barrels to be pumped. You know, cause we're gonna refine every barrel tomorrow. :rolleyes:
We need to be self-sufficient oil producers. We need to STOP refining and buying from the world oil market. We can do this by drilling and pumping our own resources which will drop the price of gasoline in the next five years. Then, the demorat congress can implement their new taxes on gasoline and we'll still pay 4 bucks a gallon.
I'm glad our government cares about whats best for us. I sure doubt I could survive otherwise.
This is right on the money!!!!
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Pelosi could best save the planet by dropping off of it, preferably soon.
No new areas exploited since 87, no new refineries since then as well. Any wonder why there is a reliance on foreign oil? If this keeps up we'll no longer be an industrialized planet, just a subsistence farming one if the planet keeps getting "saved" like that.
Maintain the current level of industrialization with more oil sources, open the door to new, not stop gap technology for at least fuel purposes, and get on with it. Slamming the door and doing nothing else is counter productive.
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Pelosi could best save the planet by dropping off of it, preferably soon.
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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So we can't refine it, but we can sell it to other country's that can....flood the market
Prices go down!! Oil and Diamonds are one in the same, Diamonds are plentiful
But they just hold supply back to keep prices high.
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Oil companies have been blocking alternatively fueled vehicles for years, not investing in refineries, and raking in unthinkable profits. Do you really think drilling off-shore is going to stop them from doing the same for as long as they are allowed to do so? Since Katrina, some knobsuckers have been just raking in the loot at US citizens cost.
Have you ever compared what the federal gov. rakes in on taxes per gallon of gas to what the big bad oil companies do on the same gallon of gas?
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"But Pelosi, who has opposed offshore drilling throughout her two decades in Congress, insists opening new areas to drilling won't lower gas prices in the short term."
That's the general problem with Congress. They only think about the short-term and what will/will not help themselves get re-elected. We need a federal government that can think long-term beyond their own term in office.
2 words
TERM LIMITS
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Pelosi could best save the planet by dropping off of it, preferably soon.
agree.
Unfortunately, Pelosi is not the problem. When you let greedy scumbags determine your livelyhood, do you think they are gonna have your best interest at heart? No, they are going to take everything they can from you allowable by law. We should have went away from fossil fuel years ago.
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Just a thought. Since so few moved back to NO, that seems a prime location for the first new refinery in about 20 years. There is already a large oil infrastructure there now, primarily natural gas at this time, but that could be expanded. It's a start.
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It doesn't really matter if we let them drill offshore or not. We don't (not can't) refine what we have now. We don't because when you're making record profits, there's no reason to go to the huge expense of offshore drilling, just to make some whining consumers' happy. Especially when your lobbyists' are cheaper to keep congress off your back. In turn, Congress keeps' the American people off of the Oil company's back. Of course, the American people are the whining consumers. You see, even if congress ok's things like offshore drilling, or more refinery's, It's still up to the Oil company's to build/drill there. And even if they do, they are the one's to determine whether or not to produce the new assets'. I imagine they will, in time...but only when their other fields' run dry, and they absolutely have to. They like the prices' where they are.
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Have you ever compared what the federal gov. rakes in on taxes per gallon of gas to what the big bad oil companies do on the same gallon of gas?
talk that somewhere else. Oil companies do not improve my roads, they do not take care of the weak and elderly, they do not support an army to keep my country safe, they do not seek to improve the lives of me or my children or my grandchildren, they only want to rape me.
Exxon-mobile 12 billion in profits in 3 months. :rolleyes:
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Have you ever compared what the federal gov. rakes in on taxes per gallon of gas to what the big bad oil companies do on the same gallon of gas?
They are only obligated to show those numbers to the IRS and themselves, Donzo. Yes, the gov't. likes increased consumption as well. You'll never truly know their profit per refined gallon, though, unless you work in a Chevron/Texaco or Shell/Mobil head office.
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we don't have the refining capacity for all that oil anyway... so when they say short term... they mean it will take years before this will have a positive effect on pricing anyway. This is a wedge issue that is meaningless.
WELL, HEREIN LIES PART OF THE PROBLEM i've been talking about for a few years now.
oil companies, and power companies, seem to do the same thing. they get paid...sometimes a fair price......for the services they render. no one can possibly have a problem with that. they make a profit too. again, no possible problems. that's what we're all in business for.
the problem, is that they seem to never invest in expanding their capacity, or improving their services with some of those profits. had the oil companies been looking to the future, they'd have seen that they may want to add a refinery or two. same for the power companies.
they more than had the means to do it all along. now that we/they're in this crunch, all anyone can do is to say it won't do any good now.
so it's obvious, they STILL don;t look down the road. what about 10 years from now when the refinery is producing..and more effeciently than the old ones? or that new power plant that's preventing the rolling blackouts?
sometimes it makes ya wonder how the deciding powers in these companies got to their positions as it is.
top it off with the fact that investing 10 years ago would have increased todays profits for them.
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It doesn't really matter if we let them drill offshore or not. We don't (not can't) refine what we have now. We don't because when you're making record profits, there's no reason to go to the huge expense of offshore drilling, just to make some whining consumers' happy. Especially when your lobbyists' are cheaper to keep congress off your back. In turn, Congress keeps' the American people off of the Oil company's back. Of course, the American people are the whining consumers. You see, even if congress ok's things like offshore drilling, or more refinery's, It's still up to the Oil company's to build/drill there. And even if they do, they are the one's to determine whether or not to produce the new assets'. I imagine they will, in time...but only when their other fields' run dry, and they absolutely have to. They like the prices' where they are.
Ok I'm starting up a new oil company...any investers out there??? :lol
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talk that somewhere else. Oil companies do not improve my roads, they do not take care of the weak and elderly, they do not support an army to keep my country safe, they do not seek to improve the lives of me or my children or my grandchildren, they only want to rape me.
Exxon-mobile 12 billion in profits in 3 months. :rolleyes:
If that's the way you really feel then stop buying gas. And I'm not being sarcastic here.
If they are so evil, don't send them 1 penny more of your money.
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talk that somewhere else. Oil companies do not improve my roads, they do not take care of the weak and elderly, they do not support an army to keep my country safe, they do not seek to improve the lives of me or my children or my grandchildren, they only want to rape me.
Exxon-mobile 12 billion in profits in 3 months. :rolleyes:
I thought the purpose of the taxes the federal gov was to improve roads and bridges. You think it is supposed to go toward that other stuff, too? :confused:
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we don't have the refining capacity for all that oil anyway... so when they say short term... they mean it will take years before this will have a positive effect on pricing anyway. This is a wedge issue that is meaningless.
Ever hear of a speculator? If they thought for one second we'd start off shore drilling the price of crude would drop immediately. Hows that for short term.
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Check out the first chart and first table on this site: http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/1139.html (http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/1139.html)
It seems that total taxes on gas have by far out weighed total profits by oil companies since around 1981.
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Ever hear of a speculator? If they thought for one second we'd start off shore drilling the price of crude would drop immediately. Hows that for short term.
Right!! Its been said that just the talk of it has made the price go down!! And its going down.
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Just think about what happened to the price of onions when it became illegal to speculate on them back in 1958.
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Ok I'm starting up a new oil company...any investers out there??? :lol
Are you choosing your lobbyist to congress from the O'club??? :O
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Lets use everyone elses oil up first, then when we have the only oil left we can do what Americans do best......Gloat and flip the rest of this crummy world the bird :D
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Ever hear of a speculator? If they thought for one second we'd start off shore drilling the price of crude would drop immediately. Hows that for short term.
That's true, Bronk; but if those speculator's are wrong, then the price shoots' even higher. Look at what happened to speculating in the real estate market during the late troubles' in that market...
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Here's the real reason: "She believes a vote would only help the GOP blame Democrats for high gas prices"
Pretty much the same reason Obama gave for refusing to acknowledge the "surge" in Iraq was a good idea.
These two democrats are typical of politicans who care only about their personal and their parties power. They don't give a rat's bellybutton about what's good for the future of Americans. We truly deserve what we get. Maybe when gas hits $10/gal people will begin to wake up.
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I have a ton of my earnings wrapped up in oil companies and you should too. There is a lot of bad information out there. The oil companies dont build new refineries because they expand the ones they have to process the ever increasing demand and they do this all the time. If they didnt then the price of gas would be triple what it is now. Otherwise your right about pelosi and her crowd. If you put her next to a goose and tested for brains the goose would win.
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Have you ever compared what the federal gov. rakes in on taxes per gallon of gas to what the big bad oil companies do on the same gallon of gas?
Yes I have. Federal government wins 11:1
Oil companies $0.09/gallon
Feds $1.16/gallon (currently)
The higher the prices go the more the Feds make while the oil companies profit remains the same.
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Is there anyone in this country besides the totally blind leftists who see that everthing that hits her desk is politically motivated?
Is there not one issue that's in the best interest of the people that she can let up with the rhetoric and serve the WHOLE people...not just the one's who worship Teddy Kennedy as a COD?
It's really in her political best interest.
Former Speaker of the House Tip O'Niel was respected by both parties. He was a Boston democrat, but if something was for the best of the whole people--party politics went out the window. Poor guy is probably rolling in his grave right now.
ROX
ROX
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What bothers me the most is they wont even allow a vote on it. WONT ALLOW A VOTE....>WONT ALLOW DEMOCRACY TO HAPPEN!
That bothers me the most that in this representative republic of ours ONE FREAKING MORON has the power to stop the will of the people from being voted on.
In addition if you think off shore drilling wont effect the price of gasoline in the short term you are a typical dim witted American. It's short term thinking that got us into this mess. It WILL drop the price (a little) however it's the long term strategic effect of have it and not need it vrs need it and not have it.
When it comes to energy we need a sound long term strategic plan. The current democrat plan is to do nothing and try and save the world from getting warmer. THAT is Pelosis overal objective. She likes gass at $4 a gallon becuase people will use less of it. It's good for her sucidal envrionmental dreams.
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She likes gass at $4 a gallon becuase people will use less of it.
People will use less of it and guess what, they will want to raise taxes on what is being used in order to keep their coffers at the same level. :rolleyes:
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Like Glenn Beck says: "Time for the pitchforks and torches..."
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What bothers me the most is they wont even allow a vote on it. WONT ALLOW A VOTE....>WONT ALLOW DEMOCRACY TO HAPPEN!
Pelosi is on the verge of blocking another bill: In this case bill H.R. 6691 : a bi-partisan law that would lift the ban on pistols in DC:
http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/pelosi-opposes-gun-bill-but-may-allow-vote-2008-07-31.html
This woman is the worst example of a career partisan politician. :mad:
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I believe that's the fine people of D.C. to decide... not congress.
BTW... this absolutly kills me how uppity you fine folks are getting. A politician being political? My laws! Seriously... where was this righteous indignation during the 12 years congress was controlled by the Pubs...they blocked hundreds of bills :rofl
you guys kill me :rofl :rofl :rofl
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2 words
TERM LIMITS
Can I get an AMEN! :pray
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What bothers me the most is they wont even allow a vote on it. WONT ALLOW A VOTE....>WONT ALLOW DEMOCRACY TO HAPPEN!
That bothers me the most that in this representative republic of ours ONE FREAKING MORON has the power to stop the will of the people from being voted on.
In addition if you think off shore drilling wont effect the price of gasoline in the short term you are a typical dim witted American. It's short term thinking that got us into this mess. It WILL drop the price (a little) however it's the long term strategic effect of have it and not need it vrs need it and not have it.
When it comes to energy we need a sound long term strategic plan. The current democrat plan is to do nothing and try and save the world from getting warmer. THAT is Pelosis overal objective. She likes gass at $4 a gallon becuase people will use less of it. It's good for her sucidal envrionmental dreams.
If they do let us vote be careful....a no vote means yes a yes vote means no!!
Oh AMEN!!!!
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the problem, is that they seem to never invest in expanding their capacity, or improving their services with some of those profits. had the oil companies been looking to the future, they'd have seen that they may want to add a refinery or two. same for the power companies.
The "Not in my backyard" barriers are what is keeping any more refineries from being built. As an example here is one being stalled in SD.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/15/sd.refinery/
In ND, the state government itself is going to build a refinery using eminent domain because the environmentalists continue to block one being built by private oil companies.
http://www.reuters.com/article/oilRpt/idUSN2364316120080123
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The "Not in my backyard" barriers are what is keeping any more refineries from being built. As an example here is one being stalled in SD.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/15/sd.refinery/
In ND, the state government itself is going to build a refinery using eminent domain because the environmentalists continue to block one being built by private oil companies.
http://www.reuters.com/article/oilRpt/idUSN2364316120080123
you got me on that one.......
i keep forgetting that people want to benifit from everything, as long as they don't have to see/hear/smell/deal with it otherwise.
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you got me on that one.......
i keep forgetting that people want to benifit from everything, as long as they don't have to see/hear/smell/deal with it otherwise.
Off shore drilling is 25 - 50 miles and beyond. It's not amatter of "see/hear/smell/deal with it "
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Off shore drilling is 25 - 50 miles and beyond. It's not amatter of "see/hear/smell/deal with it "
WELL, THE A-HOLES THAT ARE complaining about it seem to think so. because they're soooo dangerous. it might hurt the little fishes. it might leak oil.
i know it's far...but thought more on the order of 15 miles.........now i know better. it doesn't matter though.
the people that don't want them, fail to realize how much it would help the local economy too.
anyway..i say drill where we need to drill. get the resources we need.
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I would like to make a couple of points here. Newt Gingrich made some statements on FOX NEWS last night that gives the lie to the argument that new drilling would have no effect on the price of oil in the short term. He stated that the mere fact of Congress voting to allow such drilling would have a stimulating effect on the market, and a drop in the market price would certainly follow.
Another point was that ten years ago, Bill Clinton vetoed a measure that would have allowed offshore drilling, using as his justification, that it would take ten years for it to lower prices. So, here we sit, ten years later, and the democratic leadership in Congress is making that same argument to justify another ten year delay.
Are these the people we actually want to make such decisions?
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This just in......................
Anyone following this?
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Dems_turn_out_out_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall
and the comments below the article are interesting.
IMHO think it's a good move on the Reps part but still probably just a dog and pony show.
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Gunns,
They were talking about refineries not wells. Those are not offshore hence folks like to make sure they don't have one in their backyard to affect their property values.
That's why I say build a couple refineries in NO. There is lots of vacant land that no one wants and I'd bet that the oil companies would take particular care with building dikes around them.
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I would like to make a couple of points here. Newt Gingrich made some statements on FOX NEWS last night that gives the lie to the argument that new drilling would have no effect on the price of oil in the short term. He stated that the mere fact of Congress voting to allow such drilling would have a stimulating effect on the market, and a drop in the market price would certainly follow.
Another point was that ten years ago, Bill Clinton vetoed a measure that would have allowed offshore drilling, using as his justification, that it would take ten years for it to lower prices. So, here we sit, ten years later, and the democratic leadership in Congress is making that same argument to justify another ten year delay.
Are these the people we actually want to make such decisions?
They could get the produced oil to market faster than 10 years' if they did so desire. The 10 year thing is probably bogus, I'll admit; However, If we'd already drilled it 10 years' ago, we would have 10 years' less reserves left, when you think of it that way.
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Nope if they drilled it 10 years ago, by their time table, it would be just getting to market now. No loss in reserves as it wouldn't have been used in the last 10 years.
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Nope if they drilled it 10 years ago, by their time table, it would be just getting to market now. No loss in reserves as it wouldn't have been used in the last 10 years.
True-for offshore platforms, It's slower to get going, due to platform construction, and depending on the actual depth under the seabed of the oil deposits' they are looking for, the actual drilling of a well could go from as little as a week to months.
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We need to be self-sufficient oil producers. We need to STOP refining and buying from the world oil market. We can do this by drilling and pumping our own resources
The US currently produces something over 5 million barrels of oil a day. It uses about 20 million.
There is no reputable source that claims US oil production can quadruple. In fact, reputable sources claim that using oil from the areas that are currently off limits would add about 1 million barrels a day.
As to refineries, the oil companies have been expanding capacity for years. The US now has refining capacity for about 18 million barrels of oil a day, more than 3 times US oil production.
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True that may be over the US only production but they are definitely not capable of 3 times the DEMAND of the finished product, no matter what the source of the crude.
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The "Not in my backyard" barriers are what is keeping any more refineries from being built.
It's not just nimby anymore, it's banana: build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything.
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It's not just nimby anymore, it's banana: build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything.
:rofl :rofl :rofl :aok
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Not a Nancy fan in anyway, but the idea that off shore drilling is an answer to our oil problems is a bit far fetched.
Does anyone really think that the oil companies are going to sell oil at less than market price? They are in business to make money. If OPEC sets the price of oil at $150 a barrel does that mean that a US oil company will sell it at $100? Not a chance.
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Not a Nancy fan in anyway, but the idea that off shore drilling is an answer to our oil problems is a bit far fetched.
Does anyone really think that the oil companies are going to sell oil at less than market price? They are in business to make money. If OPEC sets the price of oil at $150 a barrel does that mean that a US oil company will sell it at $100? Not a chance.
With more supply on the market the price will fall on its own.
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Ya that's the theory but unless its a large supply spike it won't affect the price that much. A few off shore oil wells won't make us independent.
It was theorized in the 1950s by a MIT(?) professor that oil production would peak domestically around the turn of the century and world wide shortly there after. Domestic production has peaked. That may be an artificial peak though. (IE; shutting down domestic refineries, voluntary lack of production domestically)
Best (most optimistic) estimates are that world wide production will peak around 2029. Given the rising demand in Asia and falling supply world wide. Looks like any relief will be short lived. We have needed a sound energy policy since the 1970s but it hasn't happened and it probably won't until it's too late.
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With more supply on the market the price will fall on its own.
Agreed 100%. In fact just a serious threat of increasing our own supply would bring it down aggressively. Had that bill gone through, oil prices would have started dropping immediately.
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Ya that's the theory but unless its a large supply spike it won't affect the price that much. A few off shore oil wells won't make us independent.
It was theorized in the 1950s by a MIT(?) professor that oil production would peak domestically around the turn of the century and world wide shortly there after. Domestic production has peaked. That may be an artificial peak though. (IE; shutting down domestic refineries, voluntary lack of production domestically)
Best (most optimistic) estimates are that world wide production will peak around 2029. Given the rising demand in Asia and falling supply world wide. Looks like any relief will be short lived. We have needed a sound energy policy since the 1970s but it hasn't happened and it probably won't until it's too late.
:aok
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Yes I have. Federal government wins 11:1
Oil companies $0.09/gallon
Feds $1.16/gallon (currently)
The higher the prices go the more the Feds make while the oil companies profit remains the same.
I wonder where the 38 billion in tax revenue from the evil oil companies 12 billion profit gets put? Maybe on roads, health care, Army supply and pay or, maybe, tax stimulus?
The evil oil company that is out to get you, they pay for all your services but the goberment still comes to you with their hands wide open. Do you get a choice? Nope. You can choose not to buy gas.
Who's evil?
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Upon seeing some photos in the National Enquirer of Senator Ted Kennedy on a boat while in a compromising position with a woman not his wife, Senator Heflin is said to have remarked, "Well, I see that Senator Kennedy has changed his position on offshore drilling."
And that 11.68 billion in net profit? that's after tax profit? That's after they paid the effective income tax rate of 49%? that means that the Feds got nearly 11.5 billion income from ExxonMobil?
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talk that somewhere else. Oil companies do not improve my roads, they do not take care of the weak and elderly, they do not support an army to keep my country safe, they do not seek to improve the lives of me or my children or my grandchildren, they only want to rape me.
Exxon-mobile 12 billion in profits in 3 months. :rolleyes:
Would you happen to know how much of their revenue they paid to the gov in taxes?
edit: yeah...what Holden said ^^^^
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Ya that's the theory but unless its a large supply spike it won't affect the price that much. A few off shore oil wells won't make us independent.
It was theorized in the 1950s by a MIT(?) professor that oil production would peak domestically around the turn of the century and world wide shortly there after. Domestic production has peaked. That may be an artificial peak though. (IE; shutting down domestic refineries, voluntary lack of production domestically)
Best (most optimistic) estimates are that world wide production will peak around 2029. Given the rising demand in Asia and falling supply world wide. Looks like any relief will be short lived. We have needed a sound energy policy since the 1970s but it hasn't happened and it probably won't until it's too late.
but don't forget..in the 50's they still thought that oil came from dead dinosaurs.
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Each side ended the summer session playing their little partisan games.
Pelosi blocked drilling and the Republicans blocked putting brakes on speculators.
"Senate Republicans blocked a bill aimed at curbing speculation in oil markets, while a similar bill and several others by House Democrats _ including a plan to encourage drilling in already available coastal areas and in Alaska _ failed to advance after party leaders brought them to the floor under procedures that required supermajorities to pass. That procedure blocked Republicans from forcing a vote on opening new areas to oil drilling.
Republicans have been pressing to allow oil exploration in areas that are currently off limits, including the eastern Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic and Pacific coasts. They have been relentless in their assault on Democrats over the topic, even though opening the Outer Continental Shelf to new exploration wouldn't put any oil on the market for a decade or more.
Democratic leaders have been resolute in blocking new offshore exploration, even as oil patch members and moderates in the party support the idea. It's clear that if a vote were allowed, new offshore drilling plans would be allowed.
"Congress shouldn't leave its business unfinished while American wallets are drained at the pump," said Rep. Ander Crenshaw, R-Fla.
After the House officially adjourned and the C-SPAN cameras were off, a few dozen Republicans remained on the floor giving impassioned speeches about Democrats' decision to adjourn without a vote on their energy plan.
"Republicans will not go quietly," said Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind. "Let us demand that the president of the United States ... call a special session of this Congress on energy."
Democrats believe they can weather the criticism since voters are hardly sympathetic to the big oil companies pressing to lift the drilling restrictions. They perform better than Republicans in opinion polls on energy _ despite the shift in opinions favoring offshore drilling _ as well as on most other issues."
Remember. We are talking about people who are party members first and Americans second
Neither side really gives a flying ____ about you or your woes.
But thats ok. Keep screaming about how bad the other side is. Whichever side it is you happen to be screaming about, and how they are going to drive this country to ruin.
Its what they count on. Keep ya distracted enough to prevent any real change.
While both sides together, each in their own way drive us into a deeper and deeper hole.
They arent fighting to help you. If you look at it closely you have to be completely delusional to think either side really wants to help you.
They only care about getting their party into power.
They fight over which side gets to screw you
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The argument about lack of refineries is false
Cianbro, a huge construction company here, just opened a huge fabrication facilty and won a huge contract to build segments for a new refinery. Every day I drive by, you can see these huge assembliees being assembled. They are then floated down river and barged to the new refinery site...
http://www.cianbro.com/press/newsview.asp?sid=1807
http://nbbusinessjournal.canadaeast.com/journal/article/345819
So capacity will be there by time we get drilling!
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They arent fighting to help you. If you look at it closely you have to be completely delusional to think either side really wants to help you.
They only care about getting their party into power.
They fight over which side gets to screw you
Quoted for Truth.
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...reputable sources claim that using oil from the areas that are currently off limits would add about 1 million barrels a day.
ANWR *alone* can generate 1 million barrels a day based on 25 year old estimates that are built on oil costing $20-25/barrel through 2020. Hint=>There's really a lot more ANWR oil at $125/barrel. The US has an enormous amount of oil but it's mostly off limits.
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The oil companies will make more money with lower prices. If the price per gallon were to drop to 2 bucks or lower, but the oil companies retaine the profit level per gallon sold(9-10 cents?) the increase in gas bought will make them get higher profits. Basically they sell more gas when the prices or lower but they keep their 10 cent per gallon profit. it's like selling a 5 things and getting 10 cents per item or selling 10 things and getting 10 centsper item . What would you rather do?
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The oil companies will make more money with lower prices. If the price per gallon were to drop to 2 bucks or lower, but the oil companies retaine the profit level per gallon sold(9-10 cents?) the increase in gas bought will make them get higher profits. Basically they sell more gas when the prices or lower but they keep their 10 cent per gallon profit. it's like selling a 5 things and getting 10 cents per item or selling 10 things and getting 10 centsper item . What would you rather do?
An 8% profit margin is based on cash flow, not commodity flow.
If they make 8% on 100 billion dollars it equals 8 billion, regardless of how many gallons are sold.
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agree.
Unfortunately, Pelosi is not the problem. When you let greedy scumbags determine your livelyhood, do you think they are gonna have your best interest at heart? No, they are going to take everything they can from you allowable by law. We should have went away from fossil fuel years ago.
You mean like congress!
BTW Beer companies actually have higher profit margins. We just don't drink as much beer as we use oil.
There was a study done about deca-millionaires here recently. The #1 contributing factor to their success was integrity. Integrity in their personal lives, avg length of marriage is 28 years, integrity to their customers, and integrity to their suppliers.
They're trying to build a refinery here in Indiana but they are being blocked at every turn by democrats disguising themselves as environmentalist. You can now stop your neighbor from building a deck if it casts a shadow over wet grass under the Clean waterways act (or something like that).
It's gotten rediculous and beyond.
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We just don't drink as much beer as we use oil.
You just now get it, it's not how they do it to us, it's the power that they do it in.
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Her highness blocks the vote, then tries to stop our representatives from speaking!
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Dems_turn_out_out_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall (http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Dems_turn_out_out_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall)
I will be glad when she is gone.
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You just now get it, it's not how they do it to us, it's the power that they do it in.
So your remedy is, what?
Tax them more?
49% not enough?
What would be enough in your eyes?
I get the feeling that you would not be satisfied until they are PAYING to sell their product (no profits at all)
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Ok.. what I hear from this guy and that on the board is...
"There is no need to drill for oil cause it won't help for at least 6 months to maybe 5 years from now"
"It doesn't matter if we find oil cause we don't have the capacity to refine it"
"we need to develop wind and solar and moonbeam power"
All of this crap is just excuses to do nothing. The democrats do it because high gas prices mean public transportation and misery and pain and... BIGGER GOVERNMENT.
Some of the guys here are just sit on their hands doom and gloomers or... they are democrats and don't want to admit that their party is Waaaaay over the line here onto the wrong side of this.
We need to drill for the oil.. we need to talk about wind and shale oil and coal and nuclear and solar and moonbeam power and anything else.
We need to do it all at the same time.
What is the worst that could happen if we drill? we have a glut of oil? sooooo much that we can't refine it? Ok... cool.. then we will know we have to build a few more refineries..
We simply must attack this problem from all angles at the same time.
lazs
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the Dems know we have to drill. They just want to delay until after the election. They don't want conservatives to get the immediate drop in oil prices that will come when drilling plans are announced. Again, they are fully invested in failure so they can get the whitehouse...
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I get the feeling that you would not be satisfied until they are PAYING to sell their product (no profits at all)
You just treat them like any other business.....but it's not like that. This is a business about being slaves to a product. Why, when you know what they have been doing to get more money out of us, would you blindly back a company that continues to rake in the highest profits in the history of mankind, while we pay the highest prices in our history for their product? Do you not relate the fact that while we are paying more and more, they are making more and more profit. The big oil companies are as guilty as the speculators, lobbyists, and arabs for raping us over the last 3-4 years. Don't be fooled. :aok
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we don't have the refining capacity for all that oil anyway... so when they say short term... they mean it will take years before this will have a positive effect on pricing anyway. This is a wedge issue that is meaningless.
we have the capacity too refine up too 11 million barrels of our own oil!! (not including the 5 too 6 million of our own that we refine right now) , today, maybe more!!
we have this capacity because we stop importing that oil from overseas!
the two largest offshore drilling companies both say that we can have that oil in the system in 1 too 6 years! this frees up foreign oil for other places.
the Chinese or the cubans or some other country is going to pump that oil and sell it too us if we don't do it ourselves, only they wont do it as well or safe as we will and we will still be sending 700 billion or more to them instead of keeping that money here at home !!
why on earth would we want too keep giving the rest of the world our money?
once we become less dependant on oil, thru alternative energy , we could then become an oil exporter, and start to get some of the trillions of dollars back, that we have paid too the middle east!
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You just treat them like any other business.....but it's not like that. This is a business about being slaves to a product. Why, when you know what they have been doing to get more money out of us, would you blindly back a company that continues to rake in the highest profits in the history of mankind, while we pay the highest prices in our history for their product? Do you not relate the fact that while we are paying more and more, they are making more and more profit. The big oil companies are as guilty as the speculators, lobbyists, and arabs for raping us over the last 3-4 years. Don't be fooled. :aok
and you back who ?
the U.S. gov made 1.3 trillion in revenue last quarter on fuel sales alone!! they didnt explore for new oil, they didnt drill for more oil, they didnt pump it in your tank, they just stuck there hand out and took it from you!! now who just raped the american public?
how will more taxes on fuel help this problem?
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the U.S. gov made 1.3 trillion in revenue last quarter on fuel sales alone!
where did that come from?
shamus
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1.3 trillion/quarter does seem high
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You just treat them like any other business.....but it's not like that. This is a business about being slaves to a product. Why, when you know what they have been doing to get more money out of us, would you blindly back a company that continues to rake in the highest profits in the history of mankind, while we pay the highest prices in our history for their product? Do you not relate the fact that while we are paying more and more, they are making more and more profit. The big oil companies are as guilty as the speculators, lobbyists, and arabs for raping us over the last 3-4 years. Don't be fooled. :aok
You can ride a bike, walk, etc. If you choose to live miles away from your job that is your choice. Heck the Amish use horses and don't drive. Sometimes they ride in cars though.
You are one sour fellow Skyrock. Aren't you a teacher? Glad you don't teach my kids. I look back now and count my blessings that I had some very forward looking teachers.
As far as the speculators go I'm not sure about that. For one when gas surges people start cutting back. Like what is happening today. Eventually the market corrects itself.
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Her highness blocks the vote, then tries to stop our representatives from speaking!
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Dems_turn_out_out_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall (http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Dems_turn_out_out_the_light_but_GOP_keep_talking.html?showall)
I will be glad when she is gone.
What does it take to change the Speaker of the House? (Besides her not getting re-elected that is.)
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let's take a vacation!
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll566.xml
you can find out if your representatives voted to go on vacation instead of working for us the people.
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let's take a vacation!
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll566.xml
you can find out if your representatives voted to go on vacation instead of working for us the people.
Here in California, Waffle, They went on vacation only after making sure they had the money to afford one. They did that by passing a law that enabled them to pay state employees' (of all branches, including corrections, Law Enforcement, fire, everything) just minimum wage.
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Oil companies have been blocking alternatively fueled vehicles for years, not investing in refineries, and raking in unthinkable profits. Do you really think drilling off-shore is going to stop them from doing the same for as long as they are allowed to do so? Since Katrina, some knobsuckers have been just raking in the loot at US citizens cost.
:noid :noid :noid
Yes, the oil companies bought up all of those 100 MPG carburetors. :rolleyes:
Sure, the oil companies didn't invest in refineries (the ones they can't build due to government regulations and "environmentalists lawsuits). :rolleyes:
Yep, UNTHINKABLE profits. To the tune of far less than a dime on the dollar, one of the lowest profit margins in the business world. :rolleyes:
The GOVERNMENT takes in more TAX REVENUE on a gallon of fuel than an oil company makes. But Hell, don't let the TRUTH get in the way of a good conspiracy theory and witch hunt.
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The GOVERNMENT takes in more TAX REVENUE on a gallon of fuel than an oil company makes.
That's true for gasoline, but probably not true for oil.
Exxon produced about 4.5 million barrels of oil a day last year, and earned a profit of something over $40 billion. That works out at about $24 a barrel, just under 60c per gallon.
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That's true for gasoline, but probably not true for oil.
Exxon produced about 4.5 million barrels of oil a day last year, and earned a profit of something over $40 billion. That works out at about $24 a barrel, just under 60c per gallon.
Your equation leaves out many parts and facets of Exxon's business. In addition to producing their own oil, Exxon also *buys* more oil on the open market than they produce, so your calculated profit/gallon is at *least* 50% too high. Also, Exxon is made up of many multi-billion dollar companies that do *zero* oil production/refining/delivery. Businesses like natural gas, real estate, etc. The profit from these other business should be removed from your calculation.
For gasoline (not all oil, but a large % of it) Exxon's profit, according to my back of the envelope calculation, is some 16 cents/gallon. ($4/gallon*8% margin less 49% tax rate) That's surely an incorrect number but it's a number. ;)
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Oil companies have been blocking alternatively fueled vehicles for years, not investing in refineries, and raking in unthinkable profits. Do you really think drilling off-shore is going to stop them from doing the same for as long as they are allowed to do so? Since Katrina, some knobsuckers have been just raking in the loot at US citizens cost.
You know that for every gallon of gas sold, the gas companies get only like $0.4 right? Everything else is taxes and shipping it other places.
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let's take a vacation!
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll566.xml
you can find out if your representatives voted to go on vacation instead of working for us the people.
With many Americans in dire straits over fuel prices, home mortgages, and lack of good television, everyone should take note that the democrats in congress have abandoned them. If this doesn't cause sweeping changes in congress come November, we deserve what we get.
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With many Americans in dire straits over fuel prices, home mortgages, and lack of good television, everyone should take note that the democrats in congress have abandoned them. If this doesn't cause sweeping changes in congress come November, we deserve what we get.
i don't know if you noticed but obama changed his position on offshore drilling!!!
i guess he realized that with 75% of Americans wanting offshore drilling he could not win!!
i hope the rest of those Dem's don't figure that out, it will be fun to wave at them as they leave washington
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i don't know if you noticed but obama changed his position on offshore drilling!!!
i guess he realized that with 75% of Americans wanting offshore drilling he could not win!!
i hope the rest of those Dem's don't figure that out, it will be fun to wave at them as they leave washington
The man is a hustler pure and simple. All is does is craft carefully composed doublespeak - and the rare time that he does appear to take a stand on something, he always leaves himself an out and keeps everything open ended. When public opinion goes against him, he very quickly changes his stance. He's changed positions on the War in Iraq, The Right to Bear Arms and now Offshore Drilling - all suddenly in the last month (!!!).
If you want to know where the man really stands, look at his past: his past voting record, his origins, and the people he's been in league with for the last 20+ years.
I don't think McCain is that great a candidate either - but he's a fundamentally more honest man, plus he speaks what he thinks with minimal doublespeak. Unlike Obama, you know where he stands on things.
..come November, Vote American.
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Your equation leaves out many parts and facets of Exxon's business. In addition to producing their own oil, Exxon also *buys* more oil on the open market than they produce, so your calculated profit/gallon is at *least* 50% too high. Also, Exxon is made up of many multi-billion dollar companies that do *zero* oil production/refining/delivery. Businesses like natural gas, real estate, etc. The profit from these other business should be removed from your calculation.
Last quarter Exxon made $10 billion profit on their upstream operations (production), about $1.5 billion on everything else. Production averaged 3.8 million barrels of oil equivalent a day.
That's closer to $29 a barrel.
You could try to separate out gas and other operations, but I suspect they are a bit less profitable than oil at the moment, and that would push oil profits higher per barrel. (eg if oil made up half the 3.8 million barrels, and 60% of the $10 billion profit, then the profit per barrel of oil climbs to getting on for $35 a barrel.) That's just guessing, though, but I think it's safe to assume that the oil side of the business is not much less profitable than natural gas.
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Last quarter Exxon made $10 billion profit on their upstream operations (production), about $1.5 billion on everything else. Production averaged 3.8 million barrels of oil equivalent a day.
That's closer to $29 a barrel.
Thanks for the education on upstream/downstream. I see you are correct there is much less profit coming from downstream refining of their purchased oil.
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It doesn't really matter if we let them drill offshore or not. We don't (not can't) refine what we have now. We don't because when you're making record profits, there's no reason to go to the huge expense of offshore drilling, just to make some whining consumers' happy. Especially when your lobbyists' are cheaper to keep congress off your back. In turn, Congress keeps' the American people off of the Oil company's back. Of course, the American people are the whining consumers. You see, even if congress ok's things like offshore drilling, or more refinery's, It's still up to the Oil company's to build/drill there. And even if they do, they are the one's to determine whether or not to produce the new assets'. I imagine they will, in time...but only when their other fields' run dry, and they absolutely have to. They like the prices' where they are.
Do a fact check before you post utter nonsense. Or do it like Dimocrats and spew utter nonsense LOUDLY and often.
from http://auto.howstuffworks.com/gas-price1.htm
Here's the breakdown on a gallon of gas
73% of the price is oil cost
11% of the price is taxes
10% is refining
6% is distribution and marketing
Gas is not $4 a gallon because of refining problems despite what nonsense Dimocrats spew LOUDLY and often.
Gas is $4 a gallon because of oil supply and anticipated oil supply.
A shift in US policy regarding drilling would drop oil prices immediately because anticipated supply would increase.
But when Dimocrats are short on facts, as they often are, they just shut people up, they take away peoples voice, they don't allow them to vote.
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People need to give their congress representatives hell for going on vacation without voting on drilling. Call and write them often. In my case, I don't think it would do much good. He's a Dimocrat under indictment for taking bribes and having $90,0000 in his freezer. Guess who?
I really don't think a stern email from a constituent would affect him. Lord knows laws don't.
One of the joys of living in a gerrymandered congressional district.
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Easy way to write your reps:
House: https://forms.house.gov/wyr/welcome.shtml
Senate: http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
You can send a message to all your reps in a very short time.
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you can send a better message in november.
<donald trump voice> "pelosi your fired".
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you can send a better message in november.
<donald trump voice> "pelosi your fired".
She's from Kalifonia - they'll elect her God.
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Last I knew she wanted San Fransico to suceede...and pay for everyone to have sex changes if they wished it.
Whacked area that lady is from.
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Looks like the Republicans will keep the issue alive by returning to the House floor on Monday to keep the discussion going:
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Republicans_to_go_back_on_the_floor_Monday_to_talk_gas_prices.html (http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Republicans_to_go_back_on_the_floor_Monday_to_talk_gas_prices.html)
She just does not get it:
Pelosi was grilled by host George Stephanopolous on ABC's "This Week" over her refusal to allow an offshore oil drilling vote on the floor before the House adjourned for the five-week August recess, but Pelosi was having none of it.
"What you saw in the Congress this week was the war dance of the hand maidens of the oil companies," Pelosi said. That's what you saw on the Republican side of the aisle."
She will not allow a vote simply because she knows the vote would be in favor of allowing drilling...even with dems in the majority.
edit:
Wow, I never really listened to this woman speak before. She really is retarded:
http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5504708 (http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5504708)
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She doesn't get it but her office is secure, well not as Speaker. Unlike Obama I give her a thumbs up for sticking to her beliefs, sorely misguided as they are.
<added>
She gets my thumbs up only because I believe this could destroy the democratic party.
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Nancy Pelosi is whacky, Obama is whacky and there are tons of Congressman that are out of touch. But I heard some things about McCain today about him flip flopping on Social Security tax increases and he seems whacky too. Good grief can we not get some intelligent thoughtful people to our elected positions? In the end we are the ones to blame.
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Do a fact check before you post utter nonsense. Or do it like Dimocrats and spew utter nonsense LOUDLY and often.
from http://auto.howstuffworks.com/gas-price1.htm
Here's the breakdown on a gallon of gas
73% of the price is oil cost
11% of the price is taxes
10% is refining
6% is distribution and marketing
Gas is not $4 a gallon because of refining problems despite what nonsense Dimocrats spew LOUDLY and often.
Gas is $4 a gallon because of oil supply and anticipated oil supply.
A shift in US policy regarding drilling would drop oil prices immediately because anticipated supply would increase.
But when Dimocrats are short on facts, as they often are, they just shut people up, they take away peoples voice, they don't allow them to vote.
I wish what you've said is true. I wish that the link you quoted could be trusted, and I wish what I said were utter nonsense. The reason I've said this, Is because I've spent the better part of a decade working in the oil industry. In that time, I've gotten around and have been able to talk to people inside of it. Plant operators of all types, refinery men, shippers, you name it. They used to laugh when they told me all of the funny money schemes' that actually happen when oil starts to move from the well to the gas station.
Let's take Chevron/Texaco for example. You might not know this, but on paper, it's actually quite a few smaller companies' bundled together. What they do, is buy and sell their product back and forth to themselves' all the way down the chain. It gets' sold from the field production unit to the shipping branch; The shipping branch's then sell it back into their refining division. Their refining division, once their done with it, finally sells' it to their various retail outlets. All of these branches are divided up regionally, so there are quite a few of them scattered around. This allows' the large oil companies in essence, to report their operating costs' with the addition of the repeated buying/selling tacked on as a way to get a larger write-off. However, all of the profits' eventually end up in corporate central HQ when all's said and done. Those percentage numbers' you've got up there? I would'nt trust those any more than GWB would believe that Obama would make a better GOP disciple than McCain.
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The two largest cost components are easy to determine.
The crude oil component is simply the price of oil divided by the amount of gasoline you get out of it. A barrel of crude contains 42 gallons. Obviously it makes different products, but gasoline is one of the more valuable. Simply divide the cost of oil, say $125 a barrel, by 42. That's $2.98 a gallon. That's about 74% of $4.00
Taxes are actually understated because it includes only fixed price taxes. If a state taxes a percentage of the price, it's not included. Federal gasoline tax is 18c a gallon, which works out at 4.5%. Independent sources average total state and federal taxes at close to 50c a gallon, which would be about 12% of the total cost at $4 a gallon.
That leaves about 14% for the oil companies to play with to cover refining, distribution and retail.
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All of these branches are divided up regionally, so there are quite a few of them scattered around. This allows' the large oil companies in essence, to report their operating costs' with the addition of the repeated buying/selling tacked on as a way to get a larger write-off. However, all of the profits' eventually end up in corporate central HQ when all's said and done. Those percentage numbers' you've got up there? I would'nt trust those any more than GWB would believe that Obama would make a better GOP disciple than McCain.
In the US, consolidated accounting doesn't work the way you think. If Company X bought something for 1 cent and then simply did paperwork transactions to sell it back and forth to themselves and/or various subsidiaries and eventually sold it to the public for $1.00, Company X would have consolidated income of 99 cents and they would pay tax on that 99 cents. There's no hiding from the tax man. Take an accounting class or take a CPA to lunch and ask how the tax system really works.
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Looks like the Republicans will keep the issue alive by returning to the House floor on Monday to keep the discussion going:
http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Republicans_to_go_back_on_the_floor_Monday_to_talk_gas_prices.html (http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0808/House_Republicans_to_go_back_on_the_floor_Monday_to_talk_gas_prices.html)
She just does not get it:
She will not allow a vote simply because she knows the vote would be in favor of allowing drilling...even with dems in the majority.
edit:
Wow, I never really listened to this woman speak before. She really is retarded:
http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5504708 (http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5504708)
Yep...she is...and the first thing she said was...."It's a failed policy of this Bush/Cheney Admin. , Big oil men". :confused:
"They (repubs) will have to get imaginative" to get in drilling in a bill SHE wants. Who in the F does she think she is?
Guns people....guns...full tanks of gas...and a staright highway to the capital steps....and REMOVE all these people from office.
Just sipmply point...and tell em...your FIRED.
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Yep...she is...and the first thing she said was...."It's a failed policy of this Bush/Cheney Admin. , Big oil men". :confused:
"They (repubs) will have to get imaginative" to get in drilling in a bill SHE wants. Who in the F does she think she is?
Guns people....guns...full tanks of gas...and a staright highway to the capital steps....and REMOVE all these people from office.
Just sipmply point...and tell em...your FIRED.
I soooooo wish such a thing would happen BUT................ WAY TO MAY Bilderbergers n Trilaterals n such doin their best to run our country....
If they saw it coming they would have some part of the Military waiting for you....... so ya MIGHT have to shoot your way in..........UNLESS you made it somehow clear what your intentions were and even then....
You would have to have elections soon as possible.....
You would probably have to appoint a temporary Pres and cabinet ... so who? Ron Paul?
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I wish what you've said is true. I wish that the link you quoted could be trusted, and I wish what I said were utter nonsense. The reason I've said this, Is because I've spent the better part of a decade working in the oil industry. In that time, I've gotten around and have been able to talk to people inside of it. Plant operators of all types, refinery men, shippers, you name it. They used to laugh when they told me all of the funny money schemes' that actually happen when oil starts to move from the well to the gas station.
Let's take Chevron/Texaco for example. You might not know this, but on paper, it's actually quite a few smaller companies' bundled together. What they do, is buy and sell their product back and forth to themselves' all the way down the chain. It gets' sold from the field production unit to the shipping branch; The shipping branch's then sell it back into their refining division. Their refining division, once their done with it, finally sells' it to their various retail outlets. All of these branches are divided up regionally, so there are quite a few of them scattered around. This allows' the large oil companies in essence, to report their operating costs' with the addition of the repeated buying/selling tacked on as a way to get a larger write-off. However, all of the profits' eventually end up in corporate central HQ when all's said and done. Those percentage numbers' you've got up there? I would'nt trust those any more than GWB would believe that Obama would make a better GOP disciple than McCain.
The breakdown of expenses in a gallon of gas comes directly from the US Dept of Energy. If you don't think its true, well there isn't much I can tell you. Refinery costs have DROPPED since 2005, not risen. Gas isn't going up because of lack of refineries, its going up because of the price of oil. But you keep both fingers in your ear saying "nanananananana." I absolutely expect that from a Dimocrat and would be shocked by something more logical. Please, don't shake my world.
Breaking news - Obama's latest flip flop includes drilling. Imagine that.
Even more breaking news. Senator Mary Landrieu (D-Louisiana) thinks Pelosi is off in space also. She announces a bi-partisan "group of ten" Senators that support offshore drilling, clean coal technology, while we perfect solar and wind energy technology. So while Pelosi is "saving the planet" its nice to know there are some sane Democrats in the senate. Hopefully this break is the beginning of the end of Pelosi's career. That woman is absolutely crazy.
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How long has the offshore debate been bouncing around now? 35 yrs.? It only becomes a hot topic now?
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How long has the offshore debate been bouncing around now? 35 yrs.? It only becomes a hot topic now?
Well how many people were writing about the industrialization of China during the Clinton administration?
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I soooooo wish such a thing would happen BUT................ WAY TO MAY Bilderbergers n Trilaterals n such doin their best to run our country....
If they saw it coming they would have some part of the Military waiting for you....... so ya MIGHT have to shoot your way in..........UNLESS you made it somehow clear what your intentions were and even then....
You would have to have elections soon as possible.....
You would probably have to appoint a temporary Pres and cabinet ... so who? Ron Paul?
It's not really about any one person....We all have a favorite canidate.
It's common sense and doing a job that you were hired to do. In my job I get an annual evaluation. If after a couple of years of being evaluated in a BAD (I think we all agree congress is bad) way than I will probably get fired. At the very LEAST no raises or perks. Time off will be slim and my job performance will either pick up or I'm out.
why is it that these extrahunks are allowed to stay in Washington and do............nothing. Year after year. It's because we all continue to vote em back in. Or , don't vote and they stay by default. Congress is OUR business. We hire , and we can fire.
It's become a tic for tac soceity. If I can't have my way then by god you'll not have your either and I'll do all I can to make sure of that. The president may untimatley have to answer for things....But it's congress that starts things rolling....If your teaching your kid to do something , yet will not give him or her the tools needed....then you shouldn't expect great things from them and should take part of the blame for their short comings.
Some want to just blame Bush....Bush can set policy...but Congress makes laws that help that policy....and IMHO.....THEY are the ones that should ultimatley take the blame for things not being done now.
Instead.....we get the same ole same ole B.S. from the same ole same ole B.S. artists known as the politicians. Only we can change that.
When you go vote this November.....put away the party lines....put away differances.....
and vote every frikin one of em OUT OF OFFICE....and become a term limit voter like me.
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How long has the offshore debate been bouncing around now? 35 yrs.? It only becomes a hot topic now?
Maybe it has something to do with $4+/gal gasoline?
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On Sunday morning in an interview with George Stephanopoulos, in response to why she wouldn't allow a vote on drilling, responded in all seriousness the she "has a planet to save." She is in desperate need of psychotropic drugs. Its not enough to represent a congressional district, not enough to keep congress moving along, she has to be the savior of a celestial body, billions of years old. Her destiny is to save the third planet from the sun. She was dead serious and she is absolutely deluded. Without a doubt, we have a crazy Speaker of the House. She needs thorazine.
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Remember the Reps played this game as well blocking a vote on speculation.
The perfect point was made on CNN tonite
Neither candidate wanted a vote on this issue because they wanted this political football to still be in play in Nov.
Once again both parties playing party politics at our expence.
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How long has the offshore debate been bouncing around now? 35 yrs.? It only becomes a hot topic now?
What's your point?
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Remember the Reps played this game as well blocking a vote on speculation.
The perfect point was made on CNN tonite
Neither candidate wanted a vote on this issue because they wanted this political football to still be in play in Nov.
Once again both parties playing party politics at our expence.
While I agree with you on that point....they still went on a 5 week vacation.....ALSO at our expense.
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I wish what you've said is true. I wish that the link you quoted could be trusted, and I wish what I said were utter nonsense. The reason I've said this, Is because I've spent the better part of a decade working in the oil industry. In that time, I've gotten around and have been able to talk to people inside of it. Plant operators of all types, refinery men, shippers, you name it. They used to laugh when they told me all of the funny money schemes' that actually happen when oil starts to move from the well to the gas station.
Let's take Chevron/Texaco for example. You might not know this, but on paper, it's actually quite a few smaller companies' bundled together. What they do, is buy and sell their product back and forth to themselves' all the way down the chain. It gets' sold from the field production unit to the shipping branch; The shipping branch's then sell it back into their refining division. Their refining division, once their done with it, finally sells' it to their various retail outlets. All of these branches are divided up regionally, so there are quite a few of them scattered around. This allows' the large oil companies in essence, to report their operating costs' with the addition of the repeated buying/selling tacked on as a way to get a larger write-off. However, all of the profits' eventually end up in corporate central HQ when all's said and done. Those percentage numbers' you've got up there? I would'nt trust those any more than GWB would believe that Obama would make a better GOP disciple than McCain.
Almost all companies do this. In the end there is a usaually and not always a consolidated return. No cheating the taxman. There is going to be a paper trail. If it is not correct or if there is fraud they will be caught. Guarantee. I use to know this stuff. There is a ton of Internal Revenue Service laws and rules regarding this stuff. Are there ways to lower taxes legally. You bet. I Anyway there is no hocus pokus to any of it.
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What's your point?
Maybe it has something to do with $4+/gal gasoline?
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Maybe it has something to do with $4+/gal gasoline?
Be careful, we don't want an event horizon.
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;) homage.
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The breakdown of expenses in a gallon of gas comes directly from the US Dept of Energy. If you don't think its true, well there isn't much I can tell you. Refinery costs have DROPPED since 2005, not risen. Gas isn't going up because of lack of refineries, its going up because of the price of oil. But you keep both fingers in your ear saying "nanananananana." I absolutely expect that from a Dimocrat and would be shocked by something more logical. Please, don't shake my world.
I'm not telling you as either a democrat or a republican. I'm telling you as someone who's both worked in the oil industry, and has had several contacts in it. I'm just putting it out there; you read into it what you wish.
Almost all companies do this. In the end there is a usaually and not always a consolidated return. No cheating the taxman. There is going to be a paper trail. If it is not correct or if there is fraud they will be caught. Guarantee. I use to know this stuff. There is a ton of Internal Revenue Service laws and rules regarding this stuff. Are there ways to lower taxes legally. You bet. I Anyway there is no hocus pokus to any of it.
They have some ways of hiding things after a fashion, Getback. I wasn't implying that they always follow the law, either.
I do believe that ever since the ENRON scandal many companies are sticking more to the straight and narrow, but the large multinational oil corporations (Which means just about any of them, anymore) Are able to use their overseas assets' to hide things if they wish. I remember talking to a lease superintendent who once asked me if I wanted to take my Vacuum truck to Burundi to take Brine water to a Drilling rig. I told him I didn't have trans-continental ability. He just laughed, because they were charging off a rig expense to an overseas operation.
You're right, in that there's a paper trail, and that someone would get caught. It just depends on how hard the gov't. is gonna look, I suppose.
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I'm not telling you as either a democrat or a republican. I'm telling you as someone who's both worked in the oil industry, and has had several contacts in it. I'm just putting it out there; you read into it what you wish.
I've worked in the oil industry too. I dispatched tug boats (more accurately, push boats)that pushed oil barges. I have contacts in the oil industry. Most of them are tankermen but I know a few welders, fitters, roughnecks, helicopter pilots and cooks too. What type of expertise are you implying? Why so coy? If you were a field engineer for Schlumberger, say so. If you were a laborer on a derrick, I can understand the elusiveness, but don't claim expertise.
What inside expertise do you have to dispute refinery cost make up less than the tax cost of a gallon of gasoline (10%) and that they have done down since 2005? If the problem was refineries, that cost would be rising not falling ( as they rose after Katrina when refineries shut down). If you want to debate, do so with facts, not by alluding to some authority you may or may not have. If you really do have an inside track, it should be no problem for you to post documents published in industry specific publications giving perspective not covered here. All I see from you is some conspriracy theory and we should take your word because you worked in the "oil industry."
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didnt know if anyone else new about the fact that 25 too 30 republicans are still in congress holding out for a vote! pelosi, turned out the lights and turned the camera's off on friday and is now threatening to turn off the a/c if they dont leave the building! c-span wanted too turn the camera's back on but pelosi told them no!