Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: expat on August 03, 2008, 05:08:13 AM
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http://news.uk.msn.com/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=9106413
And before anyone starts the usual gun debate , this is not the reason why i am posting this ,it doesnt matter what weapon was used to kill his mother could've been a knife would've ended up the same result .What bothers me is where on earth does a 12 year old go and get the idea to kill his mother !!??! Christ when i was 12 i was more bothered with climbing trees and playing football .
I cant help feeling we have somehow lost the plot :(
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not much information to go on... I mean what was the video game he was hooked on? What was the ethnic background? What was the caliber? What was the argument about? Was the kid on ADD Drugs? What was the economic background of the family?
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None of that should matter Holden , because my parent's didn't earn much makes it OK to go kill my mother ....nah That's just an excuse
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No, we have to look at all these factors to truely understand the motivations of... wait... has anybody ever understood this type of thing before?
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I bet he'll be out to kill again when he turns 18. I believe the writings of Dr Spock is the main reason children commit crimes such as these.
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About thirty-five years ago there was an episode where two brothers attacked their mother at a rest area while on a road trip. They chopped up the body and shoved it down the outhouse. What I'm getting at is that this is nothing new. There has been mental illness and disfunction since the beginning of time and people have been saying "we've lost the plot" for just as long.
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not much information to go on... I mean what was the video game he was hooked on? What was the ethnic background? What was the caliber? What was the argument about? Was the kid on ADD Drugs? What was the economic background of the family?
Please elaborate on this one if you could.
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I think he was being facetious.
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The child is lucky he wasn't my kid. He wouldn't have been able to be taken to the county juvie detention facility. He would have been lucky to need a hospital after I got done with him.
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Why doesnt matter now does it? Whoever owns the handgun left it accessible to a child and should be held criminally responsible.
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So was it a quick "pop" in a fury, or was it a kid that would have killed his mom with anything he had his hands on...or anything in between?
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No, we have to look at all these factors to truely understand the motivations of... wait... has anybody ever understood this type of thing before?
No worries Holden, it was a good poke at the usual suspects. Well done.
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Why doesnt matter now does it? Whoever owns the handgun left it accessible to a child and should be held criminally responsible.
Perhaps you were never a kid nor have attempted to hide a christmas present from a kid.
Short of an armed security guard and electronic thumbprint identification services, a Kid will find and get what he wants.
The solution is that the kid needs to know that he WILL be beaten to within an inch of his life for messing around with it.
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Ye Shall Invoke the wrath of Rule-7
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When the killer was asked "Why did you kill everyone in the house? " His reply was...."Well...they was home."
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^
"Thank Godddd we got .... ppppenetentiaries!"
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Perhaps you were never a kid nor have attempted to hide a christmas present from a kid.
Short of an armed security guard and electronic thumbprint identification services, a Kid will find and get what he wants.
The solution is that the kid needs to know that he WILL be beaten to within an inch of his life for messing around with it.
In my house guns are locked away in safes (some are biometric) except the ones I or my wife have on us. You have to proactively protect the ones you love even from themselves.
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Take it easy on the boy, he's an orphan.
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Take it easy on the boy, he's an orphan.
What? He would still have a mother if he didn't shoot her! It's not like some stranger was thieving & she was shot protecting her family... the dang kid is the one who did the shooting.
Besides, any mother who's got an undisciplined, spoiled little brat of a 12 year old with a hot enough temper to cause physical harm to other family members is a freaking idiot for not securing the handguns in the home.
*edit* kid probably could have used a few good bellybutton beatings long before then as well.
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What? He would still have a mother if he didn't shoot her! It's not like some stranger was thieving & she was shot protecting her family... the dang kid is the one who did the shooting.
Besides, any mother who's got an undisciplined, spoiled little brat of a 12 year old with a hot enough temper to cause physical harm to other family members is a freaking idiot for not securing the handguns in the home.
*edit* kid probably could have used a few good bellybutton beatings long before then as well.
Not poking this towards you or anything, Texmom, but...It's kinda like all the mom's I see taking their kids' out to football practice. The ones with dads, well, alot of them, even knowing they gotta start running in 95-105 degree heat, quietly put on their gear, get ready for practice, and trot out their warmup laps. The ones' that are managed by their moms...The kids' are arguing with their mothers' like adults; They keep trying to talk back to their coaches, refuse to run or get in drills when their told. Then, when they're doing punishments for getting out of line on the field, they don't try to do it, or, in a lot of cases, just take off their gear and go sit on the sidelines. If a kids' dad sees it, you can see them get grabbed by the facemask, and after some loud words, some of those kids' run off like the fear of god suddenly jumped down their throats, but...The moms' just yell a little, and then back off on the punishments. As a matter of fact, even with these same kids, you will see the mothers' come off the sideline and complain to the coaches' because they may think that running 10 100 yrd. sprints' at the end of practice is too much. They just let the children play them.
The gist of what I'm getting at, is that this woman might have had one of those kind of relationships' with his mother. He might have been alternately babied, with threatened punishments not backed up. As Holden said, who knows. Maybe the mother let him get away with so much, he literally thought he could get away with...murder.
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Yeah, I see that could be a possibility. At 12, she would have still had almost complete control of the entire family environment. If it was beyond her control, then it's her responsibility to put it into the hands of professionals who are capable of maintaining control.
If he thought he could get away with murder, a lot of getting away with a lot of things led up to it. I'm just a little bit sorry for the kid to have a fked up life... his mom should have been steering him in a different direction. And at 12... they're wayyy past the age of understanding right from wrong/consequences.
Not feeling tooooo much sympathy for any of them.
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Thank God I live in Canada :aok
My Guns are ALL locked up in a safe. Although my vehicles and quads all have their keys in them all the time, and the house is never locked. I have never lost anything. :O
My kids (all six) have learned respect for guns and we only use them for hunting or target practice.
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Thank God I live in Canada :aok
Nothing bad ever happens in Canada.
WINNIPEG — Long before he was accused of the gruesome beheading of a fellow passenger on a Greyhound bus in Manitoba, Vince Weiguang Li was a quiet and hard-working custodian at Grant Memorial Church.
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Mine are in the bedroom, but I have issued a wish for a gun closet for my birthday :cool:
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Poeple are capable of all kinds of cruel things. Nothing surprises me anymore.
And its gotten worse since we chased God out of our lives and started raising our kids in an aura of cheap violence.
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I grew up with guns all around me.. most kids on the block had guns in their homes that were accessable.
Sadly.. with the lack of parental guidance and the feminization of America.. you need to keep em locked up now.
lazs
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In my house guns are locked away in safes (some are biometric) except the ones I or my wife have on us. You have to proactively protect the ones you love even from themselves.
When I was growing up, the guns my father owned were locked up in safes and cases too.
I knew where to get all the keys and what all the combos were. He never told me an ounce of that info.
But I knew that my life might have ended, not by the gun, but by him for screwing around with that stuff.
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Not poking this towards you or anything, Texmom, but...It's kinda like all the mom's I see taking their kids' out to football practice. The ones with dads, well, alot of them, even knowing they gotta start running in 95-105 degree heat, quietly put on their gear, get ready for practice, and trot out their warmup laps. The ones' that are managed by their moms...The kids' are arguing with their mothers' like adults; They keep trying to talk back to their coaches, refuse to run or get in drills when their told. Then, when they're doing punishments for getting out of line on the field, they don't try to do it, or, in a lot of cases, just take off their gear and go sit on the sidelines. If a kids' dad sees it, you can see them get grabbed by the facemask, and after some loud words, some of those kids' run off like the fear of god suddenly jumped down their throats, but...The moms' just yell a little, and then back off on the punishments. As a matter of fact, even with these same kids, you will see the mothers' come off the sideline and complain to the coaches' because they may think that running 10 100 yrd. sprints' at the end of practice is too much. They just let the children play them.
The gist of what I'm getting at, is that this woman might have had one of those kind of relationships' with his mother. He might have been alternately babied, with threatened punishments not backed up. As Holden said, who knows. Maybe the mother let him get away with so much, he literally thought he could get away with...murder.
I gotta agree with frode. I see it all the time. I do alot of service calls and I go to alot of different customers homes. I see kids with just a mother or a "dont care" step-father getting away with things that in households with a active father figure they would dream of doing.
Lately I have even had to say something due to some lil brat either trying to jack my tools or bassically getting under my feet while im trying to fix a problem that ussually the brats caused in the first place!
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I grew up with guns all around me.. most kids on the block had guns in their homes that were accessable.
Sadly.. with the lack of parental guidance and the feminization of America.. you need to keep em locked up now.
lazs
they ain't locked up at my house and I'm already taking my four year old granddaughter to the range.
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When I was growing up, the guns my father owned were locked up in safes and cases too.
I knew where to get all the keys and what all the combos were. He never told me an ounce of that info.
But I knew that my life might have ended, not by the gun, but by him for screwing around with that stuff.
The kids that come in this house are not screwed up nut cases with delusions of a safe-crackers career. If I caught a kid trying to get into a gun safe I wouldnt kill them and what you said about that implies someone needed help alright but it wasnt the guns that screwed them up.
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The solution is that the kid needs to know that he WILL be beaten to within an inch of his life for messing around with it.
Not if he shoots first. ;)
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It all boils' down to intent, in any case. Let me put it this way; It's tragic that this mother was killed. It's tragic anytime someone is shot and killed, whether it's a family member, friend, or complete stranger. However, the firearm was simply the tool or the way used. I pick up the local paper on a Saturday or Sunday morning, and see a total death toll 5-10x as great simply from Drunk Drivers. Yet, the restrictions' on buying Alchohol pale in comparison to those related to firearms' ownership. Timothy McVeigh killed dozens, yet how hard is it to buy either Diesel Fuel or Fertilizer?
It's a sad time for those people, and I hate to turn this into a political rant in that aspect, but...Honestly, the biggest mistake here that these people might have made, was simply raising their child properly. Until we know more about they're background, it's hard to say where the problem stems. But IMHO, they did something wrong, if it get's to the point where a child commits pre-meditated murder.
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It all boils' down to intent, in any case. Let me put it this way; It's tragic that this mother was killed. It's tragic anytime someone is shot and killed, whether it's a family member, friend, or complete stranger. However, the firearm was simply the tool or the way used. I pick up the local paper on a Saturday or Sunday morning, and see a total death toll 5-10x as great simply from Drunk Drivers. Yet, the restrictions' on buying Alchohol pale in comparison to those related to firearms' ownership. Timothy McVeigh killed dozens, yet how hard is it to buy either Diesel Fuel or Fertilizer?
It's a sad time for those people, and I hate to turn this into a political rant in that aspect, but...Honestly, the biggest mistake here that these people might have made, was simply raising their child properly. Until we know more about they're background, it's hard to say where the problem stems. But IMHO, they did something wrong, if it get's to the point where a child commits pre-meditated murder.
I agree with all that. You sure said it with better manners than I did.
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Guns don't kill people, kids that play video games do.
ack-ack