Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Fokker on April 17, 2001, 07:51:00 AM
-
I would like to see an arena where one side could only use axis planes and the other only use allie planes.
They did this in Warbirds and that arena became the most popular. It was called the WW2 arena.
-
Hmm..from what I've seen in AGW, it becomes an Allied vs Axis with 70 on one side and 30 on the other...not good considering the nature of the posts I've read over there since implementation.
FYI: Don't expect HTC to follow WB's path, expect WB's to follow HTC's path. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I'm certainly game for anything to an alternative to the Main. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum8/HTML/001260.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum8/HTML/001260.html)
[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 04-17-2001).]
-
No thanks. The Axis vs Allied arena has done more damage to the WB's community than any single idea yet. Its a continuous gangbang with side switchers constantly floating back and forth for the plane of the day.
Not here, please, not here.
------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
-
Originally posted by Vermillion:
Its a continuous gangbang with side switchers constantly floating back and forth for the plane of the day.
Well, the only saving thing here in AH is that we have a 12 hour side switching rule, WB's is 10 min I think...
-
Have the AH arena set to a 72 hour time limit between switches.
-
Instead of an MA and an Axis & Allies arena, how about an ETO and a PTO arena? Still fly what you want in the arena's but the planeset is limited to the specific theater. I know there would be debates on aircraft used in a theater but you get the basic idea.
Example: Tired of fighting N1k's and Corsair's? Go to the ETO and fight 109's, 190's, Spits, etc.
Needs work I know.
[This message has been edited by Apache (edited 04-17-2001).]
-
In the allie/axis arena numbers will change just like it does in any other arena. MA in AH is not imune towards this.
I found the WW2 arena very nice, and many other must have too, since it fast became the most popular arena.
With the choice of all planes at any time, there will not be a switch of side because of the plane of the day.
However, that made an effect which where realistic. At the start of the tour there where always more LW planes than allie planes, this changed towards the end of the tour. Just as it did in reality during WW2.
-
But thats the point Fokker, I don't want to recreate the outcome of WWII day in and day out. The AvA is great if you like to fly Allied iron, but if you like Axis planes, forget it.
I love scenarios, and in my opinon thats the place for such things.
I don't want to fly for a side where its a foregone conclusion that if I log on tonight I will find out that my side is outnumbered by 2-1 or 3-1.
If the Axis vs Allied arena's were such a huge success, why haven't player numbers went way up when a flat rate was introduced? Because in my opinon, alot of players hate the AvA. True some really like it, especially a very vocal minority on AGW. But some players will follow the herd (the old "critical mass" discussion) no matter which arena type they prefer.
The others just log off, and cancel their accounts.
I think many of us here in AH are quite familiar with whats going on in WB's and how the AvA arena there is doing.
------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
-
That is not right. Remember that when it was introduced in WB they had had the AH style for years.
They kept the MA after ww2 was introduced, so both parts should be happy. The ww2 arena became the definetly most popular.
If both MA and a ww2 arena where set up in AH we would soon find out what players like. Having a ww2 arena is much like having a SE available at any time, and SEs are popular.
-
The other argument about how WB and AW is doing now has nothing with the arenas to do. At present AH is the sim offering most variation. WB still has no ground vehicles and only an AI controlled fleet.
My reason for leaving WB was just that AH offered more. Not the way the arenas was setup.
We will get a fairly good test of all this when WW2OL comes online. WB3 is also on its way with more content. The competition amongst sims will harden.
I am certain that the WW2 arena setup has a large player base. If AH do not have such an alternativ i am afraid they will all leave for WW2OL.
-
Originally posted by Fokker:
We will get a fairly good test of all this when WW2OL comes online. WB3 is also on its way with more content. The competition amongst sims will harden.
I am certain that the WW2 arena setup has a large player base. If AH do not have such an alternativ i am afraid they will all leave for WW2OL.
WW2OL's main emphasis is on ground stuff. It is a totally different kind of game than AH or WB.
Camo
------------------
Camouflage
XO, Lentolaivue 34
www.muodos.fi/LLv34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34)
Brewster into AH!
"The really good pilots use their superior judgement to keep them out of situations
where they might be required to demonstrate their superior skill."
-
I still have my account with WB and are often in to see how the development of WW3 is progressing.
I am also following the WW2Ol closely. I dont think I am the only one. We will always be looking for the game that offers most of what we like. Loyalty to one special game can only take a small toll of less value.
WW2OL will cost 9$ a month to play. Some will look at that as important. WB is at present at the same cost as AH. Rumours has it that AH will become more expensive.
I like AH best at the moment, but the game must evolve and take into account that variation in gameplay and content is a great must, even for those who mainly do A2A, like I do myself.
-
Originally posted by Fokker:
Rumours has it that AH will become more expensive.
I call roadkill on this one. I have never seen or heard any mention of this by any HTC employee.
-
Camouflage, if you have not looked at the WW2OL site yet, you should. Then you will see that they put a lot of emphasis on the A2A part and the flight model.
However, it is clearly a game that emphasis a WW2 teather, with a lot of variations in units you can man - in air, on ground and at sea. A game like that will attrackt players from all those games that specialises on one of those areas, because the variation is fun, and one has to expect a huge number of players.
Even I, who prefer the A2A game, is attracted by the great number of different targets this represent. I sure do also see the challenge of flying cover for ground forces like infantry and other units. And, on the other side, attacking the same units.
If the flight modell in WW2OL is good, comparable to AH, the WW2OL sure will seem to offer more value. To me the WW2 teather will be such a value.
I like AH, and that is why I would like AH to evolve in a way that makes me stay. However, I and other hardcore players sure are keeping a close eye on what goes on outside AH.
-
couldnt have said it better fokker so i wont <S>
------------------
Hazed
3./JG2 (http://members.home.net/winyah999/3jg2.htm)
-
I know that WW2OL will be a revolutionary game once its released. But to say that AH players will flock to WW2OL, is a bit premature, to say the least.
Like I said, these two games have a totally different scope. AH (and also the upcoming WB3) are 95% air combat, WW2OL is totally focusing on the ground war. The air forces are "limited" to their historical role, ground support. Atleast if the country commanders want to win the war. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
One serious thing you're overlooking, is the fact that it will probably take a few years until the WW2OL planeset is anywhere near AH or WB. If I understood correctly, for the first few scenarios (France and BoB) the axis jagdflieger are limited to flying the 109E and 110C. Then there's the Stuka and He111. But somehow "they will all leave for WW2OL" doesn't sound too convincing.
The $9 price tag on WW2OL is very reasonable. I'm sure many AH players will get a WW2OL account as well. I know I probably will. But I'm 100% sure that WW2OL will not quench my A2A needs. Absolutely positively sure. Thats why I will keep my AH account as well. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Camo
[This message has been edited by LLv34_Camouflage (edited 04-18-2001).]
-
What Camo said! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
True WWIIOL shows great promise (the concept), but until its released to the public, thats all it is.
Promises and screenshots.
(FYI thats how I feel about any unreleased game, its all hype until you bring it to the table.)
------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
-
There is no reason to believe WW2OL will only be promises and screenshots. The open beta will probably be out in may. So it wont be long until we can taste it.
-
How well would Axis/allied arena work? Allies would have atleast four most popular (and easiest) planes, N1K2, F4U-1C, Spit IX and P-51. Axis would only have Dora.
How fun would that arena be?
Separate ETO and PTO might work better but that would divide player base which is not good.
------------------
jochen / Gefechtsverband Kowalewski
Units: I. and II./KG 51, II. and III./KG 76, NSGr 1, NSGr 2, NSGr 20.
Planes: Do 17Z, Ju 87D, Ju 88A, He 111H, Ar 234A, Me 410A, Me 262A, Fw 190A, Fw 190F, Fw 190G.
Sieg oder bolschevismus!
-
I enjoyed AW's Pacific and ETO game rooms, we should do it.
-
Originally posted by Jochen:
How well would Axis/allied arena work? Allies would have atleast four most popular (and easiest) planes, N1K2, F4U-1C, Spit IX and P-51. Axis would only have Dora.
slap me if i'm wrong, but wasn't the N1K a japanese plane? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
back to the topic:
i think this kind of arena could be fun, if only to offer an alternative to the MA; and quite frankly for the amount of money that HTC receives from its subscribers it should implement this if there is enough support for the idea regardless of whatever direction they wish to go in. obviously we couldn't FORCE them to do it, but ignoring market demands is a very stupid thing for any company to do. having said all this, i doubt it would be that fun until the axis side have a decent number of bombers to match the allies.
[This message has been edited by Toady (edited 04-18-2001).]
-
Thats my point Fokker, none of us know what WWIIOL will be like (except for the closed beta people). So until its released to the public, its nothing.
When it comes out, then it can be judged by its own virtues.
------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
-
Originally posted by Jochen:
How well would Axis/allied arena work? Allies would have atleast four most popular (and easiest) planes, N1K2, F4U-1C, Spit IX and P-51. Axis would only have Dora.
Why the hell is it that German fans constantly equate Axis = German and Allies = American, British, Italian, Japanese and Russian? It gets really bleeping old.
Here are the major nations:
Allies
United States
Soviet Union
United Kingdom
Axis
Germany
Japan
Italy
What does this mean? It means that the Axis have the 2nd most popular plane in AH, thats what it means. Yes, shocking as it is, despite HTC's Allies bias (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif), the N1K2-J is indeed an Axis fighter.
Please people, go read some history books, or own up to the fact that it isn't an Axis vs. Allies issue, but rather you guys whinning that Germany doesn't have the best fighter and you can't reconcile it in your mind that Japan produced and good fighters.
------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother
Bring the Spitfire F.MkXIVc to Aces High!!!
Sisu
-Karnak
-
Thats right Karnak.
That axis has a lack of buff alternatives was mended in WB by making B26 available to axis. That could be done in AH too until more axis buff alternatives became available.
-
Fokker,
You are right that the Axis lack bomber capacity.
Temporary solution would be to allow general access to bombers. Long term solution would be for HTC to add the He177 Greif and H8K2 "Emily" for the Axis.
------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother
Bring the Spitfire F.MkXIVc to Aces High!!!
Sisu
-Karnak
-
Originally posted by Fokker:
I would like to see an arena where one side could only use axis planes and the other only use allie planes.
B]
An axis vs. allies arena is a bad idea.
Splitting the plane sets between ETO and PTO is also a bad idea.
These have been done before in other games.
-It splits the community.
-It deprives the areans of the variety of the full plane set and the match ups get stale.
The arena in AH is a combat game using WW2 weapons, not a recreation of WW2. Historic match ups are for scenarios and events.
-
I'm all for an Axis vs. Allies arena, but we don't have enough of the right planes for that to work right now.
Allies have:
US- one version of one heavy bomber, one version of one medium bomber, sufficient mid-late war escort fighters/fighter bombers, no attack/light bombers, some mid-late war navy fighters, one navy bomber
Britain- not enough spitfires, a tempest, typhoon, no hurricanes, one heavy bomber, no medium bombers, no attack/light bombers, one naval fighter
Canada- A? we need all the plywood aircraft we can get here
Russia- three fighters/interceptors, Russia ain't got squat
Axis has:
Germany- decent numbers of mid-late war 190's, decent numbers of mid war 109's one lousy mid war medium bomber, no attack/light bombers, no decent fighterbombers, no heavy bombers
Japan- they got them a Jap zero, soon enough a He.100 and a UFO, no bombers, no fighterbombers, no attack/light bombers, no medium bombers, no heavy bombers, no naval bombers, practically no naval or army fighters
Italy- ohhh the shame
Misc. other capitulating countries- Fin 109?
Hey if HTC can quadruple the planeset and quadruple the number of aircraft variants, perk everything after 1942 or 43, uberperk post 1943 junk, and snafuperperk 1945 monsters, we might do all right with an allies vs. axis arena.
I’m all for an arena that forces 42 or 43 planes on the poor players, the US would still have all the best light/attack/medium/heavy bombers (minus a few guns in the front), faster early war bombers to, and our uberdweeb P-38, the P-47 to, maybe the P-51B. The brits would get furball spits a pleanty and everything else. The Japanese would be very balanced. …and Germany will have kick bellybutton interceptors, good medium bombers and attack bombers, which is the way the 3./JG2 likes it.
-
You forgot to mention brazillian P47 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
-
...yes and the Brazilian P-47, and the Polish spitfire!
What we really need is more nationalist chinese air force biplanes! TURN WITH ME ZEKE!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHA! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
------------------
Majortom
3./JG2 (http://members.home.net/winyah999/3jg2.htm)
"Flyers of the Richthofen Jagsgeschwader were a bunch of egotistical, over-confident air prima donnas. They were drunk with victory; they competed with one another for mention in communiqués. Individual glory obsessed them in their mad scramble for public acclaim."
-Edgar Meos
[This message has been edited by Major Tom (edited 04-19-2001).]
-
Verm, It suprises me to hear someone with a lot of knowledge of WWII AC not be interested in a AvA arena...Really it does.
I played a game that had 4..later 5 countries...all historical countries but all enemies. And the times that I visited WB's the most ppl were in the AvA arena.
Everyone's entitled to their opinion of course but it perplexes me why anyone would not want historical matchup's. Then again I'm a one country guy, and only fly a few planes. There's enough models of my favorite planes that I'd of course be happy with early or late war set ups.
But....I don't fly games for just something to do...I fly then sorta as sport, and a little cause I want the only thing close to actually doing it. And part of that "doing it" for me is historical settings.
To each his own though.
------------------
(http://www.luftjagerkorps.com/images/sigs/wingnut.gif)
The quality of the box matters little. Success depends upon the man who sits in it - Baron Manfred von Richthofen
[This message has been edited by Wingnut_0 (edited 04-19-2001).]
-
Aside from scenarios, the most fun I ever had in a sim was flying axis in the ETO AvA arena in AWIII . To me, pork arenas are for quakers and practicing for scenarios . But for the moment it's the only one we have in AH .
-
Wingnut, the reason I have formed my opinon, is that I have tried both flavors (MA vs Historical), and found that for a full time arena the historical is quite bitter for my tastes.
Don't get me wrong, I love Scenarios, and put alot of work into the ones we have in AH, and use to do the same back in AW.
But the problem is that too me, the historical matchups quickly become very boring, and very limiting, when flown on a full time basis.
For instance say we're in the middle part (pre Pony and A8) of the RPS in the Axis vs Allied Arenas over in WB's. Most every fight you get into with fighters will be a Spit IX versus either Fw190A4 or the Me109G6, and the Allied Medium & Heavy bombers will be rolling back the Axis bases like clockwork (No matter what you do the Axis will never compete with the Allies in the bomber category). Also there probably be a 2:1 numbers advantage for the Allies.
After about 5 sorties, this bores the ever living crap outta me, from either side. Its just not fun. The fights are constantly against one or maybe two different plane types, depending on where in the RPS you are, and which is the "plane of the day". And there is always a serious numbers imbalance, in the two sided fight.
*shrugs* I dont' know more to say than that. I've tried both, and prefer what we have here currently for a main arena format. And I get my "historical" fix in Scenarios and Snapshots.
------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
-
Vermillion must have gotten a tottaly different picture of the WW2 arena than most other pilots. There is no question about that arena quicly becomming the most popular.
I kind of liked the limmited plane set in the early part of the tour, and the fact that you met planes that was matched historically correct.
In the early part of the tour LW had the edge most of the time. In the late part of the tour this changed in allie favour. Just as it did in real life.
This represented an extra challenge to both allie and axis side. The only real lack I found was the lack of comparable axis bombers to the allie bombers. In here AH already have the Arado bomber, which makes this balance better then in WB.
You will still have the opertunity to fly the plane of your choise. It only means that you some times will change side to have it. That is just fine to me.
-
Fokker,
Before you tell us how wildly popular the WWII arena is in Warbirds, you should be aware that a lot of us read AGW, and periodically fly WBs, or at least did. The WWII arena is a constant source of arguments, with one side complaining the other has better aircraft, sideswitching causing gangbangs, etc. There may be a way to make Allied vs Axis successful, but most ex-WBs players would be very leery.
bowser
-
True the WWII arena is debated constantly on the AGW, but often it more about details like introduction date of the A4 or Pony.Anyway the dabate isnt more sinister than what we see on this board on gangbanging ect :=)Overall the arena is reasonally balanced IMO - still play there from time to time, allways LW.
I would like a WWII arena myself - or a HA "on the side".HTC has clearly stated that they do not want to set an HA up, and as they have made a virtue out of *not* doing what WB does I doubt if we will see any action taken.At least for a good time to come.
I agree with Fokker that if (!) WWII Online delivers we will see a flux of players pretty soon.WWII Online has announced only a short open beta, and people generelly dont want to pay for two games.That might speed things up a bit here..
danish
-
Originally posted by Suave1:
Aside from scenarios, the most fun I ever had in a sim was flying axis in the ETO AvA arena in AWIII . To me, pork arenas are for quakers and practicing for scenarios . But for the moment it's the only one we have in AH .
The AWIII AvA arena was exactly the same land grab porkfest that the regular areans are, but with a different map and only a few planes available for each side.
They should not split the plane sets just because a few luftwaffles are scared of the PAC planes in the MA.
-
Yup WW2 arena is great fun to play IMHO. It gives me more feel of simulation and i try to rtb alive after every sortie. Role play element comes in there.
Vermillion stated he doesnt like real matchups for long and these get boring. I feel just opposite. I learn much more about enemy different aircrafts capabilities, new tricks and new tactics when im facing same planes constantly. I've learned how to fight spit V in 109e or 109f4 as anyb other RL matchups. In current AH arena i never could have enough time to concentrate on one type to learn all those things.
For example how many here knows if you can use spiralclimb in 109e4 against spit V?
Or which is faster Spit V or 109f-4 at 5km altitude? I find these things interesting...not boring.
Also i think these long range neon signs which hang in air over planes could be turned off in WW2 arena. Suprises and SA are large factor in ww2 era aircombat. In fact majority of fighter vs fighter kills came where victim never saw attacker. I think icons are gamey.period. I could call it auto SA (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
But icons are necessary in current main because you have to fight nikis and chogs with nikis and chogs...my trial time was boring because i mostly saw only these two planes. In contrast fights in my 190a8 against la-5fn, p51s, spits and p47s were great experiences...p47s and p51s i saw rarely though...only once in larger formation in 2 week period. And yes those icons were almost shouting "190 here!" to hordes of chogs.
AH sure looks beautiful and I like FMs here...best flightsim I ever played. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[This message has been edited by illo (edited 04-20-2001).]
[This message has been edited by illo (edited 04-20-2001).]
-
S!
Agreed.We could use somekinda ETO/PTO stuff here,if not an AvA.And those neon signs.Why not just turn off enemy icons and set friendly icons to very short range(less than 3k) and disable the automatic laser range totally(from buffs too).As LLv34 trains with icons off it adds VERY much to this game.Shooting is more accurate(must judge distance better),SA develops much faster since U have to scan the air space constantly and can't time Your moves by looking at the icon telling the distance to/from enemy AC.And the color of the plane plays an important rule too.Not too easy to spot a B26/Ju88/UFO/109/190(for example) against the ground and the USAF planes scream their presence against the ground with silverish finish (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
What I am trying to say here is that we could get rid of ICONS/RANGE.Then IMO buff guns lose a part of their lethality,even they are beefed up at the moment,fights are no more spray & pray,U can use terrain to escape,need to get good SA etc.Friendly icon could be a simple dot above the plane or as now the name WITHOUT range.U would know U are less than 3k away since U can see the icon (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)Training arena could have everything on.Scenarios should have short range friendly icon only,since the planeset is usually axis vs allies.And to get rid of C47 for axis..give us Ju52!End of whine...
------------------
DB603
3.Lentue
Lentolaivue 34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34/)
-
Good points about icons. I have often wondered how it would work to have the choise of icons or not. Today we can turn off icons if we want, but they will still show for the enemy. How would it work if it also went off for the enemy?
In this case it would suit both those who want icons, and those who dont.
I can see myself using icons on for long range detection, and as soon as I go into combat I turn icons off to make it more challenging for both me and the enemy.
The reason for icons today are many. The most important is to compensate for the lack of real sight. In the sim you can not reqognise enemy types at the same distance as you can in real life, thus icons helps.
However, when close up the icons are more anoying then helping.
In an arena where enemy can have same plane as yourself icons are neccessary. In an axis/allie arena we should have the choice to turn it off.
-
Bowser, what I am saying is that the WW2 arena in WB beacame the most popular very fast. Thus most pilots must have liked it more than MA.
There will always be whiners. To make a scenario without whiners is truly impossible. I have some faith in what the majority find to be best.
-
Montezuma, it makes you looks stupid when you respond in a thread without reading it . Nobody here is suggesting turning the ma into a ha . Secondly who are these "few luftwaffles" that are scared of pac planes ? And thirdly, who said that there wouldn't be pac planes in an ava arena ? And yes the protocol for base capture in AvA arenas was no different than in the pork arena . The reason why it didn't suck like the pork arenas is because it had historical match ups of contemporary planes in maps resembling actually geography. That is why it appealed to wwII aircraft enthusiast, and also the reason it was unpopular with.. others .
-
"...Bowser, what I am saying is that the WW2 arena in WB became the most popular very fast. Thus most pilots must have liked it more than MA...".
I was flying WBs at the time of the switch. It had been planned for a long time, and everyone was looking forward to it. It was some time I think before people realized the pitfalls. I won't go into them, you can read about them in any number of threads on AGW.
It's very hard to populate an arena. The "herd" mentality rules. People will go will the numbers are. To say most people are big fans of the WWII arena because that's where most people fly isn't entirely accurate. Myself and a lot of people flew there because everybody else flew there. Didn't mean we liked it, and for a lot of us, was the reason we left WBs.
bowser
-
Bowser - I was there too - both before and after the switch. To start with they kept both MA and WW2 arena. After a while MA was shutt down. I dont think that would have happened unless the conclusion with the majority was that WW2 was the best.
Those who liked the MA style still had, and still have the combat arena. Today those 2 arenas are the once used in WB. The MA is dead.
I think we should learn a bit of this and see how we can improve things in AH instead off just ruling out experience like this.
I dont believe many left WB for the arena reasons. Those who have left for AH, like you and me, left because AH offered more at the time we left. The day another sim offer more than AH, we will change again. That is how it is.
If we want AH to stay the best sim, we should all do what we can to influence that it evolves and stayes the best. I am sure HiTech, Pyro and the others listen and that they are able to evaluate the different suggestions.
I look at this Gameplay feedback tread as an important tool they have established just for that reason. I dont expect that all my suggestions, or others will be used, but it is important that we give feedback. Constructive feedback.
I am an hardcore online player, who have been online for hours everyday for about 10 years now. I have seen many sims and games, and have a fair idea about what people find fun, challenging and entertaining. And I for sure know that we are always looking for the game that offers the most. Thus we change from time to time.
I am sure HT is aware of this and that he will do what he can to keep AH the best WW2 flight sim there is. To do that he will depend on constructive feedback from the users like us.
I have already ordered my copy of WW2OL, which will be issued in may. Next month. The reason is not to leave AH in the first instance. The reason is to find out if it will offer more. And to follow the development closely.
For the same reason I still have my WB account, and are in there quite often to follow the development of WB3.
-
Originally posted by Suave1:
The reason why it didn't suck like the pork arenas is because it had historical match ups of contemporary planes in maps resembling actually geography. That is why it appealed to wwII aircraft enthusiast, and also the reason it was unpopular with.. others .
Exactly what I said, porking landgrab with limited plane sets and a new map. It was boring.
It also isn't even close to history unless you can recreate the tactical conditions that the planes flew under. No one has yet figured out how to do that in a persistant melee arena.
In AW I lead over a dozen fighter groups in major scenarios, so I know a little bit about historic match ups.
-
DB 603 i couldnt sum it up any better (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
If people want realism they will want just that.
Gunnery comes way more realistic..situations look like the ones seen in actual ww2 guncams.
Timing your moves needs much more skill. Pilots do more mistakes.
That's what I want.
[This message has been edited by illo (edited 04-21-2001).]
-
If I read these answers correct there seem to be a need for two arenas in AH, much like what has developed in WB during many years of experimentation.
One arena like WBs "Combat Arena", where you get all the help tech can give to find targets fast. Where furballs and quake entusiasts will have a ball.
Then we should have an arena like WBs WW2 arena for those who like more realism and historic gameplay.
I dont think it is possible to combine these rather different views in the same arena.
In WB I used both arenas from time to time. Some days I just wanted an intense shoot out as in the Combat arena, and other days i felt like doing WW2 stuff. It was quite convenient realy, and much less whining then you see in MA.
However, there will always be whiners. I dont think there is a solution to get totally away with that (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
-
My 2 Cents worth on this never ending topic…
At the moment HTC can do whatever they want and 99% of people will stay because the players have no other real options until the likes of WW2OL & Target Korea come online. (I don’t think anyone would leave AH for WB’s or AW?) Even then who knows what sort of quality we will get from the new sims
For myself I want a HA “type” arena that runs 24/7 even if it is empty a lot during the week. Flying out of Australia I have been unable to catch “any” AH historical events up until the friday night snapshots (? or is it check 6) came into being and the “Hostile Shores” event. (It’s a 4am roll for me btw)
If it were left up to me I’d do something like this:
Reduce the current MA to 2/3 size, allow 10K air starts for buffs from a couple of rear bases per country. Disable all (or most) scoring … rename the arena to “Practice Arena” (or furball Arena (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif))
Set up a “Allies ver Axis” Historical Arena that runs full time 24/7, maps & plane set rotate monthly. Setting as we have for the current events (like “HS”). During the week is would run like a normal arena with HA settings, but on the weekends (worldwide weekend not just the US) it would run more like a special event, targets and objectives for each side. I think it should to be as “automated” as possible. No side swapping for the weekend (once you pick a side and are locked in then you get the mission lists for the weekend). A server could record all the info (loses,damage,aces etc) for each side and dump it all into a web page for the given event showing how the war is going.
I could rant on with ideas all day but I feel all this will fall on deaf ears as usual so I’ll leave it at that for now.
I know some love to furball and some want to fly only historical, cant AH offer both? (a damm radical idea I know ! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif))
I’ve also wondered what the ratio of squads in AH are mixed plane types (axis & allied) ver historical (one side only) …. I wonder how many of the historical squads will leave AH if another sim offers a historical theater with the same quality flight model?
I’d like HTC to at least try something HA like “before” another sim “forces it” to do so rather than lose many of its player base.