Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: TilDeath on January 02, 2009, 07:21:31 PM
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I shipped a system and when it arrived at the customer there was problems. I asked for a few pics and told him to let me call UPS. UPS agreed to pickup the delivery and return it to me. I did ship it insured. Tuesday I got a letter from UPS stating "No evidence of damage during transit." And they denied my claim for repair.
Today the friendly UPS man showed up at our office. With our undamaged box he wanted me to sign for. I asked him to wait one min, I grabbed my camera and took this picture
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/UPS-delevers-Undamaged-Box.jpg)
I signed and he went on his way. This is our "undamaged box" I took a few more shots of the box before opening it.
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/group.jpg)
Now lets look at the contents of the "Undamaged Box"
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/Ah-but-there-is-damage-inside.jpg) Totally trashed rig
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/Even-the-power-supply-was-broken-out.jpg) The Power Supply was broken away from the frame. The cases frame is bent in 3 places. But there is no evidence of damage during shipping.
This is how we ship. There is a difference between the two boxes I think, UPS did not.
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/How-we-ship-and-what-UPS-does-to-a-box.jpg)
Long story short, we are rebuilding for the customer and dealing with the Atlanta Journal Constitution (newspaper) and local TV stations showing how UPS is blind to their blunders in shipping at times.
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lol, I'm sorry....but that is really funny...in a bad kind of way. It's like a skit from saturday night live. I hope they pay up, that is crazy.
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Put some shoes on!
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That is messed up. I've never seen something that bad.
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i hate UPchuckS!!!!!!
i have never recieved a delivery on time, if you try to track the package they give you vague details at best and when ever you ask about the actual expected delivery time and date they are worse than the NYC cable company.
every package is covered with dirt and grime, boxes are dinged and always show signs of mistreatment.
but of course any damage to the product is never something that they could have done!
in my opinion they just sux!!
i have in the past (and still generally do) actually declined to order things online from companies that ship with only ups. if i cant get it shipped by another handler then i will do business with another company instead.
FLOTSOM
p.s. you got a serious case of UGLYFEETS!!!
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Wow! Can you imagine how far they would have had to drop that case for the PS to rip itself out like that? Almost looks like it fell out of the plane ;)
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OMG!! Why did they even deliver it?
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i hate UPchuckS!!!!!!
i have never recieved a delivery on time, if you try to track the package they give you vague details at best and when ever you ask about the actual expected delivery time and date they are worse than the NYC cable company.
every package is covered with dirt and grime, boxes are dinged and always show signs of mistreatment.
but of course any damage to the product is never something that they could have done!
in my opinion they just sux!!
i have in the past (and still generally do) actually declined to order things online from companies that ship with only ups. if i cant get it shipped by another handler then i will do business with another company instead.
FLOTSOM
p.s. you got a serious case of UGLYFEETS!!!
Really?
I ordered something from Gamestop and overnighted it. Was there the next day bright and early.
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The UPS guy I have is a cool cat and looks out for my stuff. He also waits until the evening so someone is home from work.
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I have reason to believe that your photo of the UPS guy is a fake.
Here is the real culprit.
(http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr138/Fugita69/ace_ventura_pet_detective_fake_pict.jpg)
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Put some shoes on!
Its my office I am always barefoot. This is the South (but not a redneck) prefer barefoot
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Problem is I think once you signed for it you're sorta screwed and took on the liability yourself.
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Problem is I think once you signed for it you're sorta screwed and took on the liability yourself.
No this is the condition it was in when it was sent back. I sent to customer, customer saw it called me I called UPS and they went and picked it back up. I giggle over they say no evidence of damage from shipping.
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photo shopped
and a darn good one at that
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photo shopped
and a darn good one at that
:confused:
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Not that you should have to, but would recommend shipping items insured. It may cost a little bit more, but they would pay for crap like that. Have had many boxes of fragile aircraft gyros that end up damaged due to shipping. Sure is nice when we can get our money back for the equipment and keep the busted stuff that we can fix and resell. :D
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HOLY CRAP! What a mess.
My girlfriend ordered me Season one and two of Dogfights at the beginning of December for Christmas. I knew she got it because she told me to make sure it was the right thing. Four weeks went by and nothing. I finally got a package last Saturday. The bag was ripped open, and nothing was inside it. One the package there was a stamp saying "This package arrived in Springfield, Mass with no contents" so somewhere in one of UPS's distribution centers, somebody decided they wanted my videos. I've emailed UPS, History Channel.com and nothing, can't get anyone to reply.
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Not that you should have to, but would recommend shipping items insured. It may cost a little bit more, but they would pay for crap like that. Have had many boxes of fragile aircraft gyros that end up damaged due to shipping. Sure is nice when we can get our money back for the equipment and keep the busted stuff that we can fix and resell. :D
I guess you missed this ...
I shipped a system and when it arrived at the customer there was problems. I asked for a few pics and told him to let me call UPS. UPS agreed to pickup the delivery and return it to me. I did ship it insured. Tuesday I got a letter from UPS stating "No evidence of damage during transit." And they denied my claim for repair.
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Not that you should have to, but would recommend shipping items insured. It may cost a little bit more, but they would pay for crap like that. Have had many boxes of fragile aircraft gyros that end up damaged due to shipping. Sure is nice when we can get our money back for the equipment and keep the busted stuff that we can fix and resell. :D
I did ship the computer insured. They initially denied my claim stating... "... no evidence of damage during transport". The claim is now under review since I disputed the denial.
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Shipping insured is more often than not simply a revenue generator, as most claims are denied based on "improper customer packaging" or any other excuse that they can use to avoid payment.
The USPS is terrible at paying insurance claims and deliberately make collecting so difficult that most people don't bother.
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Used UPS when we started our company and had the same problem....not to mention constant billing discrepancies. Went to DHL....they could never get anything there on time. Changed to Fed-Ex nearly a year ago and have yet to have one single problem!!
Fed-Ex baby!! :rock
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there are some vidoes on you-turbe from home security systems of houses showing UPS drivers pulling up, taking only a few steps from the truck and hurling the package at the door.
myself, I have never once had an issue with them..
I think its a regional, no all UPS people are created equal.
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I've worked in one of these parcel places and you wouldn't believe the stuff that goes on. Suffice to say a "handle with care" sticker isn't so much an instruction but a challenge to the vindictive.
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There is no way in heck they could shove the PS through the plexiglass window of the case without a lot of deliberate force.
Good luck winning with UPS though, they can be a real pain.
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Its 2:30 am EST, I finished the rebuild of the system so I can send it back out to the client. For those of you that dont know me, I build very very clean. Here is what it it looks like now and did before UPS got hold of it the first time.
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/rebuilt_1.jpg)
Cover off... oops droopy wire at the top, will fix before I send out. I am going to let it burn for 36 hours before I send it out.
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/rebuilt_2.jpg)
Night shot
(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/rebuilt_dark_both.jpg)
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looks good, till the box bowlers get ahold of it.
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Stupid question, what is the benefit of putting the PSU at the bottom of the case, rather than the top?
I'd imagine having it at the top would be better since it wouldn't heat the CPU/RAM/GPU.
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I suggest having pictures taken before you box everthing up, during the boxing, and during pickup ( one of you handing the item to the pickup guy). That way if anything happened you can just stop with the emails and just threaten to take them to court with the before and after pictures if they don't wanna pay up.
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What did the UPS guy say to you as u where taken the pic?
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I shipped a system and when it arrived at the customer there was problems. I asked for a few pics and told him to let me call UPS. UPS agreed to pickup the delivery and return it to me. I did ship it insured. Tuesday I got a letter from UPS stating "No evidence of damage during transit." And they denied my claim for repair.
Today the friendly UPS man showed up at our office. With our undamaged box he wanted me to sign for. I asked him to wait one min, I grabbed my camera and took this picture
...
Long story short, we are rebuilding for the customer and dealing with the Atlanta Journal Constitution (newspaper) and local TV stations showing how UPS is blind to their blunders in shipping at times.
What did it look like when the customer received the box?
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That is why i will drive over and pick mine up when it is ready.
Steve
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Shipping insured is more often than not simply a revenue generator, as most claims are denied based on "improper customer packaging" or any other excuse that they can use to avoid payment.
The USPS is terrible at paying insurance claims and deliberately make collecting so difficult that most people don't bother.
you're right. they'll try to tell him that there wasn't enough packing material. i think they say 1" between the contents, and the container. because....well...you know.....it's so simple a caveman can do it.....and they've got loaders that make cavemen look like geniuses.
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Ever consider "Bubble pack" OR any other type of "packing material"?? Seems kinda silly to ship a parcel like that without additional packing. When dealing with any freight company, y'all better make sure it's gorilla proof.
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That is messed up. I've never seen something that bad.
You ain't been around long then cause I've seen a lot worse and on several occasions, and I ain't talking about soft stuff like computers but solid heavy parts that you would be hard pressed to wreck with a sledge hammer.
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(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/rebuilt_2.jpg)
What are the cables with the red and blue leads coming off the PS? They LOOK like RCA's, ..VERY clean looking machine :aok
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Why not use Fedex or DHL every piece ive ever had delivered by them is in perfect condition. I know a guy that works at the UPS distribution joint here in springdale arkansas and the stories he's told me of how they treat merchandise in the delivery chain is disgusting and berderline criminal. I would tell UPS to put it where the sun dont shine and hire a different carrier...but thats just me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8re-VfMC1c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8re-VfMC1c)
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Alas, DHL no longer an option
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(http://www.overclocksource.com/builds/ups/rebuilt_2.jpg)
What are the cables with the red and blue leads coming off the PS? They LOOK like RCA's, ..VERY clean looking machine :aok
Those are the PS cables. That is a Tagan PS, I almost got that one instead of my PC & Cooling.
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Those are the PS cables. That is a Tagan PS, I almost got that one instead of my PC & Cooling.
The Hal 9000 is begging for somethin more than 425 watts to run the box along with the 8800 you gave me, that looks like good option....so the big, double-row beast that runs mb STARTS as one of those little plugs?
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Stupid question, what is the benefit of putting the PSU at the bottom of the case, rather than the top?
I'd imagine having it at the top would be better since it wouldn't heat the CPU/RAM/GPU.
One advantage is cable management, if you look at the PSU the fan is on the top and the Native cables are at the rear of the case allowing for them to be routed around the back of the MB tray. if it were top mounted the fan from the PSU would blow directly onto a HSF rising the CPU temp (maybe, jury is out on this one, I believe it does), the Native cables would be at the front of the case insuring the 20+4 cable would be completely exposed, and a rats nest of bundled cables.
This installation method assists by causing minimal air flow restriction within the case and keeps a system looking clean inside. Also any heat generated by the PSU is dissipated with the fresh air coming in from the two front fans.
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The Hal 9000 is begging for somethin more than 425 watts to run the box along with the 8800 you gave me, that looks like good option....so the big, double-row beast that runs mb STARTS as one of those little plugs?
My PSU costs are well below Newegg on the mid to high end PSUs. On entry level we are close. But almost always beat them.
Tagan 1300 499.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817814011 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817814011) my price 375.00 plus shipping
Tagan 900 179.00 (one shown in build) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817814013 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817814013) my price 168.00 plus shipping
PC P&C 1200 529.00 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703020 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703020) my price 465.00 plus shipping.
I can beat New Egg on almost every item. I should be getting the OK for the same rebates that OCZ (PC P&C) offers to newegg customers this week. If I can find you a better price on on something I will tell you.
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Maybe something here (http://www.shockwatch.com/) could help in the future? I'm not in the business, just sayin'.
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photo shopped
and a darn good one at that
:confused:
Your to easy Spikes :)
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Used UPS when we started our company and had the same problem....not to mention constant billing discrepancies. Went to DHL....they could never get anything there on time. Changed to Fed-Ex nearly a year ago and have yet to have one single problem!!
Fed-Ex baby!! :rock
We sell janitorial supplies and use parcel delivery sometimes. UPS claims were never paid. FedEx Ground is great.
HONK!
Gooss
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What did it look like when the customer received the box?
In case you missed it.
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I ship computers all the time.
But I always ship the slim box that's form-fitting around the case WITHIN A BIGGER BOX with an appropriate amount of packing material.
The boxes sometimes get screwed up, but I've never had a computer come through like that.
I can't say I am at all surprised given how it is packed.
I also have a client's Dell right here that was shipped to me directly so I can set it up for later this week. The tower itself is about 12" by 16" by 7" or so. The box it comes in is 21" by 23" by 15". There's at least 4 inches on energy-absorbing foam between the computer and the box in every dimension. I figure Dell must know something about shipping PCs around...
-Llama
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I ship computers all the time.
But I always ship the slim box that's form-fitting around the case WITHIN A BIGGER BOX with an appropriate amount of packing material.
If I were in the business, this is the way I would do it. I've had enough boxes in my life that have seen like they were shipped through an East bloc country when they've arrived at my door step. Last time I ordered a prebuilt system (circa 1999), my Dell box has a 6" hole in the side. Similar to that of someone kicking it (probably too lazy to pick up the box).
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I will never ship UPS if I can help it. The package rarely arrives in good condition and rarely in a timely manner.
I ordered concert tickets to take my son to some years ago several weeks in advance.
The place they were being shipped from was maybe an hour/hour and a half ride form my house.
I watched online for the next few weeks as they traveled up and down the east coast and as far west as Mississippi and twice within an hours drive from my house here in NJ.
The day before the concert they still hadn't arrived. So I called up the ticket company and they set it up so that if I hadnt received the tickets by the next day I could pick up replacement tickets at the gate.
5 minutes after we left for the concert. They arrived.
On another instance. An old squaddie of mine shipped me a computer UPS.
The box showed up all beat to hell and the CPU fan had fallen off and trashed the video card.
I remember hearing a story once where someone said that if you ship UPS to never mark anything as "fragile"
Its the same as saying. "Make sure you bust it up real good"
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I think we all have those nightmare stories. I shipped a computer once, and when it arrived, it had a nice 6 inch by 2 inch hole completely through the side of it. Obviously it was skewered by a forklift.
UPS refused to pay for the damage, citing the packaging was not up to thier standards. They went so far as to claim the hole was in the box when it was picked up. As I was the one who watched the driver pick it up, I am pretty sure I would have seen a hole of that size.
When the driver dropped off the computer, he did not wait for a signature, but according to UPS, there was a signature, but they could not read it.
By the way, pictures which do not include a time stamp are useless. Just FYI. They have this game pretty much figured out.
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I've ordered a few NZXT cases in the past and know exactly how well they're NOT packed. I wouldn't dream of shipping a complete build in the same packaging nor would I ever order one from a system builder knowing it would be shipped in such a slack fashion.
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I've ordered a few NZXT cases in the past and know exactly how well they're NOT packed. I wouldn't dream of shipping a complete build in the same packaging nor would I ever order one from a system builder knowing it would be shipped in such a slack fashion.
This is how "EVERY" Manufacture sends me components. We currently ship 15 plus systems a week in this fashion and never a problem before. The customer had NO EXPENSE added and the system was completely replaced for him. All he was out of a a few days time with a new system, which was his choice. He happens to be a AHII player.
The whole point to this post was that UPS said "There was no damage to the box", that's what I though was so funny about this situation.
That is why there are tons of builders in this world. We do take pride in our builds and do things other builders simply do not do. Every system we build the case is modded for cable management at no additional expense to customer, we sleeve fan cables at no additional expense, we load software (AHII the OS, BIOS update, Driver updates, Service packs etc) at no additional cost, and in this particular build were over 275.00 less then Newegg just for parts.
So IMHO one system being totally destroyed by UPS out of the thousands we shipped over the years is not to bad. BTW the customer has the ability to pay for the extra packing, we bring it to the UPS store and they charge is 49.99 to dbl pack. We could build it into our price, but on some systems its simply not worth the extra expense to the customer or ourselves. I have desktops I put out for 299.99. The average shipping cost of a system is just under 40.00 with insurance add the 49.99 extra container boxing and your at 90.00. Now add that to a 299.99 system (1/3 the cost) we would be out of business.
Shipping a system is like having car insurance, you dint have an accident every day but you do pay your yearly premium for the JUST IN CASE I do have one. That's our outlook on shipping systems there is always a chance. AS stated above the point of this post was UPS saying there was no damage to the shipping container
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UPS has still not paid out on this claim. UPS is *$*#&$*#&#*
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UPS has still not paid out on this claim. UPS is *$*#&$*#&#*
I was wondering about that the other day. Have you heard anything?
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I always have anxiety about UPS leaving the more expensive items on my apartment door step, so I put a note that says "UPS, please leave package in garage, and REMOVE this note" and I have an arrow pointing to my garage side door.. I leave the door locked but propped open, so when they close it it will be locked.
so far to the T, I get home, the note is gone, and the package is in my garage with the door closed and locked, after some of the horror stories Ive read I feel VERY lucky. Of course I always offer the guy a coke and am nice to him and I think that goes a long way.
I could go into a very long winded pissed off rant about how people treat those whom they depend on....
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WHAT CAN BROWN DO FOR YOU?
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By the way, pictures which do not include a time stamp are useless. Just FYI. They have this game pretty much figured out.
I don't know how it works in GA, but here you could at least sign an affidavit in front of a notary detailing the date the picture was taken. It might not have the exact same effect as a timestamp, but it would tell a jury you feel you are perjury proof.
Have you called your attorney? Every once in a blue moon lawyers are good for something you know :) Besides, this is property damage due to negligence... Unless GA law is drastically different, win or lose you won't be paying anything (aside from perhaps a portion of the judgement).
The tricky part will be finding a lawyer who will take the case. Have you built any machines for a local law firm or attorney? If so, call them/him/her.
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I was wondering about that the other day. Have you heard anything?
NO they are still claiming there was no visible damage to the box (choke, cough). My Attorney and myself brought the (ahem) so called undamaged box to UPS Corporate along with a TV News crew and a newspaper person. UPS's reply was no comment and there is no one here available for you folks to speak with. Claim is still being denied, statement from UPS is that the box had no visible signs of abuse and that I shipped the computer with damage. This is how I do business I ship completely trashed rigs to customers so they can send them back and I can bring claims to the shipping company.... idiots in my opinion.
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I ship computers all the time.
But I always ship the slim box that's form-fitting around the case WITHIN A BIGGER BOX with an appropriate amount of packing material.
The boxes sometimes get screwed up, but I've never had a computer come through like that.
I can't say I am at all surprised given how it is packed.
I also have a client's Dell right here that was shipped to me directly so I can set it up for later this week. The tower itself is about 12" by 16" by 7" or so. The box it comes in is 21" by 23" by 15". There's at least 4 inches on energy-absorbing foam between the computer and the box in every dimension. I figure Dell must know something about shipping PCs around...
-Llama
They destroyed the outer box that the system was packed in and it ended up being just the system box itself
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unless pictures were scanned, timestamp/EXIF info should be with the file i think. i'm not sure how it is in GA, but theres pretty much a variety of ways you can handle this claim. Easiest would be to ask your lawyer about consumer protection laws(you being the consumer), or filing a claim for conversion and/or "trespass to property" claim in lower civil court first.
sure lawyers get made fun of all the time, but i doubt some lawyer is going to take a case where total compensation is very minimal.
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unless pictures were scanned, timestamp/EXIF info should be with the file i think. i'm not sure how it is in GA, but theres pretty much a variety of ways you can handle this claim. Easiest would be to ask your lawyer about consumer protection laws(you being the consumer), or filing a claim for conversion and/or "trespass to property" claim in lower civil court first.
sure lawyers get made fun of all the time, but i doubt some lawyer is going to take a case where total compensation is very minimal.
THE Problem is, that ups has this down to a science. he's taken this farther than i took it when i got some radio control stuff that was obviously damaged by them. they said the same poop to me. mine wasn't as expensive, so i just took it for what it was......and have used everyone EXCEPT ups to ship things.
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Claim is still being denied, statement from UPS is that the box had no visible signs of abuse and that I shipped the computer with damage. This is how I do business I ship completely trashed rigs to customers so they can send them back and I can bring claims to the shipping company.... idiots in my opinion.
.. time to print all correspondence and see a lawyer. they just really want to see if they can get away with it. and they will if you let them.
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.. time to print all correspondence and see a lawyer. they just really want to see if they can get away with it. and they will if you let them.
Yep, this is now a matter of Principle.
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sure lawyers get made fun of all the time, but i doubt some lawyer is going to take a case where total compensation is very minimal.
Yeah, that's a problem you'll run into with any attorney that isn't a friend. If you do have a family attorney or can "borrow" someone else's, you could probably get them to fire off a few certified mails. No one likes getting certified mail from an attorney. It might be enough to convince them just to settle and avoid further hassle.
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wow thats amazing :huh
made me think of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V64r3q4FuA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V64r3q4FuA)
"Sounds broken."
"Most likely sir. I'll bet it was something nice though..."
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I would just file an action in small claims court. They have to respond or you default them, cost them cash and you don't need a lawyer.
I have found that around here the small claims judges seem to side with the little guy as well.
shamus
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"We're goin' downtown."
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I was up at Circuit City the other day, just for grins. They were down to the bare stuff. Mainly boxes of ipod arm bands and the selling of their wire and office chairs etc. They did have a micro-ATX computer that had been smashed to heck. A steel case that was smashed in a good 3-4 inches in parts. Must have been the victim of a car accident or something. A tag that said FireDog Special on it for $25.
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wow thats amazing :huh
made me think of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V64r3q4FuA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4V64r3q4FuA)
"Sounds broken."
"Most likely sir. I'll bet it was something nice though..."
THANKS For that clip.......feeling sick for the last few days, and working a 14 hour day yesterday, i was coming in kinda bummed out and dragging......it gave me a nice laugh. :aok
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:)