Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: Max on February 08, 2009, 09:24:08 AM
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My current system runs an EVGA Geforce 7600GT 256 mg card which runs AH quite nicely at 1920 x 1200 res.
Given the upcoming rendering upgrades, I suspect I'll be needing a bit more graphics horsepower. Using a budget of $150 +/- I see a lot of options out there...especially on the Radeon side of the road.
I'm up for any ideas for a replacement but would tend to rely more on those suggestions stemming from a card you are actually using.
Thanks :aok
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I generally go by what this site recommends since it breaks the products down into price ranges and they do a lot of benchmarking. They update it every month (not sure why February isn't done yet).
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card,2118.html
Best PCIe Card For $115 : Tie
Good 1600x1200 performance in most games; 1920x1200 in most titles with some lowered detail
Radeon HD 4830 Codename: RV770LE
Process: 55 nm
Universal Shaders: 640
Texture Units: 32
ROPs: 16
Memory Bus: 256-bit
Core Speed MHz: 575
Memory Speed MHz: 900 (1,800 effective)
DirectX/Shader Model: DX 10.1/SM 4.0
The new Radeon HD 4830 finally gives AMD something to compete against the legendary GeForce 8800 GT (as well as its identical sibling, the 9800 GT). Just as the 8800 GT is a crippled 8800 GTS, the Radeon HD 4830 is a crippled HD 4850. Both cards are excellent, while one winning over the other depends on the game or the image-quality settings.
GeForce 9800 GT (aka 8800 GT 512 MB)
Codename: G92
Process: 65 nm
Universal Shaders: 112
Texture Units: 56
ROPs: 16
Memory Bus: 256-bit
Core Speed MHz: 600
Memory Speed MHz: 900 (1,800 effective)
DirectX/Shader Model: DX 10/SM 4.0
While the Radeon HD 4830 offers the 8800/9800 GT its first competition in its price class, the card remains a strong contender and is still a viable option. However, it has been reported that some 9800 GTs have been found in the wild with 3-way SLI support.
PCIe Interface: $150 To $240
Best PCIe Card For $150 :
Good 1920x1200 performance in most games, some with lowered detail
Radeon HD 4850 512 MB
Codename: RV770
Process: 55 nm
Universal Shaders: 800
Texture Units: 40
ROPs: 16
Memory Bus: 256-bit
Core Speed MHz: 625
Memory Speed MHz: 993 (1,986 effective)
DirectX / Shader Model: DX 10.1/SM 4.0
The Radeon HD 4850 is the new people’s champion, instantly bringing yesterday’s $300 performance level down to the mainstream $160 price point. This card has a lot of potential when used on its own, and becomes a devastating force when paired with a second 4850 in a CrossFire configuration.
Best PCIe Card For $170 :
Good 1920x1200 performance in most games, some with lowered detail
Radeon HD 4850 1 GB
Codename: RV770
Process: 55 nm
Universal Shaders: 800
Texture Units: 40
ROPs: 16
Memory Bus: 256-bit
Core Speed MHz: 625
Memory Speed MHz: 993 (1,986 effective)
DirectX/Shader Model: DX 10.1/SM 4.0
For a few dollars over the base-model Radeon 4850, a 1 GB version is available. While raw performance is not all that different, the extra video RAM is helpful in some situations and with some game titles.
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Fulmar has some good cards in place for you but I still prefer NVIDIA chipset over the ATI. They run cooler for the most part and are a lot quicker to release driver updates. If you really check about you can get an EVGA, XFX and other 9800GTX+'s in the price range your seeking for instance
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130339 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130339)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130420 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130420)
To name a few
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I myself prefer Nvidia's chipsets over the years as well. I haven't owned an ATI product since 1996. Though my torrent computer has a cheap 9200 that I got for free.
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I've got an 512 8800 GTS and would probably buy the 9800 GTX+ if I were buying it today. It should be close to your price range. They are very similar cards.
I'm running 1680x1050 res locked to my refresh rate (59 fps) at full game graphic settings using high res textures, 16x antialiasing and 16x anistropic filtering and nothing slows my frame rates.
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Thanks for the input gents. As Pyro's suggested, I'll wait and see what kind of performance hit I get with the new graphics before upgrading.
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ATI in crossfire and Nvidea in SLI only give a 20-40% performance gain depending on the application and overclocking of a system. If one would spend 2x the amount on 2 video cards such as 4850, they would be better spending another $100 on a 4870 x 2. Same goes with Nvidea. A 8800 SLI, 9800 or even 9800GTX. The GTX280, 285 and 290 will outperform any card specified earlier in SLI. Fulmar is right you will get more performance but being a devastating force over the benchmarks of a 4870 x 2 ?? GTX 280, 285 or 290 and 4870 x 2 SLI or Crossfired respectably would be a devastating force! Another thing to consider with going Crossfire or SLI is potential problems. Some have had problems with Crossfire and SLI. I am not saying it is an everyday problem but some have had issues.
As far as Aces High, anything above the ATI 3870 or Nvidea 8800 will be more than ample with a decent CPU. There are some great buys on video cards out there as Fulmar posted earlier in this thread. Real decent cards can be bought between $50 and $150 by either ATI or NVidea!
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Somethings wrong or Im missing something, are they saying that you can get an 8800GT for $115? Two please! Look at the add on Toms page in the upper right hand corner 8800GT for $277.!!
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Somethings wrong or Im missing something, are they saying that you can get an 8800GT for $115? Two please! Look at the add on Toms page in the upper right hand corner 8800GT for $277.!!
You can get a 9800 GT (which replaced the 8800 GT) for just over $100.
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Yikes,
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Actually, $90-$124 depending on the exact model (clock speeds, etc.):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=Property&Subcategory=48&Description=&Type=&N=2010380048&srchInDesc=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&OEMMark=0&PropertyCodeValue=679%3A42536
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I might take a look for an XFX 8800GT Alpha Dog Edition for SLI
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I just installed the radeon hd 4870 and the graphics are awesome.. able to hook my hd tv directly to it...only drawback... when using my headset the audio comes from tv and the voice has to come from my headset placed around my neck. FYI I bought it at Best Buy for 180.00
Chipset Manufacturer: ATI
Core clock: 750MHz
Stream Processors: 800 Stream Processing Units
Memory Clock: 3.6GHz (900MHz DDR5)
DirectX: DirectX 10.1
OpenGL: OpenGL 2.1
HDMI: 1 via Adapter
DVI: 2
.
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ebfd11, if audio is coming from the TV and you wish it to come from the Headset simply change the Default Audio input/output. As such:
Long way>
Start-Control Panel-Sound and Audio devices-Audio Tab Change the Sound playback Default Device.
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Somethings wrong or Im missing something, are they saying that you can get an 8800GT for $115? Two please! Look at the add on Toms page in the upper right hand corner 8800GT for $277.!!
LOL. You can get ATI 3870 less than that and it outperforms the 8800GT and if you read Baldeagle's response you can get 9800GT for about the same price.
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LOL. You can get ATI 3870 less than that and it outperforms the 8800GT and if you read Baldeagle's response you can get 9800GT for about the same price.
No it doesn't. The 8800GT does a fair number on the 3870 depending on the game. Crysis/HL is about even, but ET, CoD, etc, the 8800 still outperforms it.
http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-charts-q3-2008/benchmarks,30.html
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LOL. You can get ATI 3870 less than that and it outperforms the 8800GT and if you read Baldeagle's response you can get 9800GT for about the same price.
:huh http://en.expreview.com/2007/11/26/hd-3870-crossfire-vs-8800gt-sli.html (http://en.expreview.com/2007/11/26/hd-3870-crossfire-vs-8800gt-sli.html)
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So what, if any, are the differences between the 8800GT and the 9800GT? I was under the impression that when the 9xxx line of card came out, they were intended to be a less expensive version of the 8xxx series.
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So what, if any, are the differences between the 8800GT and the 9800GT? I was under the impression that when the 9xxx line of card came out, they were intended to be a less expensive version of the 8xxx series.
Actually the 9800 series was intended to be a marketing ploy to rebrand and sell the old 8800 again. This was due to having no competition from ATI at the time. With the age of internet this scam was quickly caught on though and finally ATI caught up with the 4870 forcing Nvidia to release a real update the 2x0 series.
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Actually the 9800 series was intended to be a marketing ploy to rebrand and sell the old 8800 again. This was due to having no competition from ATI at the time. With the age of internet this scam was quickly caught on though and finally ATI caught up with the 4870 forcing Nvidia to release a real update the 2x0 series.
Marketing ploy? Obviously. Scam? Hardly.
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Actually the 9800 series was intended to be a marketing ploy to rebrand and sell the old 8800 again. This was due to having no competition from ATI at the time. With the age of internet this scam was quickly caught on though and finally ATI caught up with the 4870 forcing Nvidia to release a real update the 2x0 series.
Yep, for all intents and purposes the G92 8800 and 9800 cards of the same stripe (GS/GS, GT/GT, GTS/GTX) are the same cards. This excludes the 320, 640 and 768 Mb 8800's with the older GPU chips.
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http://arstechnica.com/hardware/reviews/2008/04/nvidia-9800-gtx-review.ars (http://arstechnica.com/hardware/reviews/2008/04/nvidia-9800-gtx-review.ars)
Heres the 8800 - 9800 story from Ars Technica
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(http://i435.photobucket.com/albums/qq77/AAdeath/vidcard1.jpg)
Pretty damn close but 9800GTX a winner. Think they are not the same card(At least the numbers are different :rofl). 9800GTX had some things a bit better I assume.
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Tom's Hardware - 3870 vs 8800GT - All Benchmarks (http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-charts-q3-2008/compare,753.html?prod%5B2074%5D=on&prod%5B2121%5D=on)
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The last nvidias I owned, I bought three new cards for three computers I had at the time. All had power backup and no problems. The cards in all three machines went bad within the next couple of months. I never have since nor never will purchase any nvidia product. Only cards I use now have the ATI chipsets. I have yet to have one go bad on me.
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Regarding the 8800/9800 cards. MANY people purchased 9800GT's, GTX's, with 8800 stickers underneath the new 9800 sticker. This happened OFTEN, not just an odd occurrence. They got lazy because ATi was nowhere near the 8800 performance at the time.
It happened and I even brought it up when I was looking to replace my old 7900GT. I was looking at BFG and they had more "sticker issues" than any other Brand. I stuck with eVga and am glad I did. I RMA'd my 7900GT (the Samsung RAM) and received a $160 8800GT without a single question asked.
I'm looking at the GTX 280 at maybe in the Fall, but I still love my 8800GTS KO.
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I RMA'd a BFG ti4600 a few years back for a dying fan, received a 5900XT
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I just can't bring myself to get another Nvidia card after the I bought the over priced 8600. I purchased an ATI 3850 and never looked back. Gave the 8600 to my mom and even she had problems with it. So we got a 3870 for her machine and no problems. My next card will probably be a 4850.
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My eVga 8800GT-SC started having wierd artifact issues, after a long while I took it apart only to find that they did not remove the vinyl/tape backing that goes over the thermal compound on the heat sink.. so my memory chips had a layer of vinyl tape between them and the thermal compound leading to massive overheating and as yet unknown long term damage
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
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My eVga 8800GT-SC started having wierd artifact issues, after a long while I took it apart only to find that they did not remove the vinyl/tape backing that goes over the thermal compound on the heat sink.. so my memory chips had a layer of vinyl tape between them and the thermal compound leading to massive overheating and as yet unknown long term damage
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
Two words: Lifetime Warantee.
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Two words: Lifetime Warantee.
QFT, but it might be void if he tampered with it.
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And if you didn't register your EVGA card within 30 days, you only get a 1 year warranty.
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And if you didn't register your EVGA card within 30 days, you only get a 1 year warranty.
eVGA has proven consistently that they are the top-dog when it comes to producing Nvidia cards....
Especially within the last couple years.. Their life-time warranty as well as their trade-in to upgrade option
are proof of the fact that they are confident enough in their product to offer these things..
Not all Nvidia graphics cards are built the same.. Some companies even knowingly put out a bad product..
In all honesty, I don't agree with loyalty to either ATI or Nvidia :salute.. Who ever gives me the best
quality bang for the buck with good customer support and warranty gets my business.. For the last few years, it's been
eVGA..
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The last nvidias I owned, I bought three new cards for three computers I had at the time. All had power backup and no problems. The cards in all three machines went bad within the next couple of months. I never have since nor never will purchase any nvidia product. Only cards I use now have the ATI chipsets. I have yet to have one go bad on me.
That's likely more a function of who produced the Nvidia cards that you bought much more so than the Nvidia technology itself. Buy cheap, get cheap be it ATI, Nvidia, ACME or whatever. My own experience with Nvidia cards produced by EVGA has been flawless. I don't care whose card technology I buy. But in the last few years Nvidia industry support coupled with something more than the cheapest card available has served me well. Cheapest, when considered foremost whether it be ATI or Nvidia, in my experience is a bad tradeoff for the total performance and ease of use of the overall package over time unless you have no other choice. Despite what others may say I've had no problems with driver support or stability in XP, Vista or various flavors of Linux. I also have not had to go to contortions to remove old drivers in order to install new ones and revert if need be.
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And if you didn't register your EVGA card within 30 days, you only get a 1 year warranty.
I always pass on to newer cards in 6-8 months anyway but I believe I tried to access something on their website and registered to do that. Maybe it was download the EVGA Precision applet...
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eVGA has been very reliable for me. My old GeForce MX440 SE is still running stong in my old machine and I've had no problems with my 512 8800 GTS or with my 780i motherboard. Even the recertified 8800 GTS I got a few weeks ago worked flawlessly (RMA'd though due to not being able to get vsync to work in SLI). Great driver support, great step-up program and a lifetime warrantee.
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I have tended to skip every 2 or 3 vid card generations, due to not getting much improved performance for the money with simple next-gen upgrades. I went from a 4200GT to 6800GT (5xxx series was a disaster) and just went from my 6800GT to a GTX260 when I upgraded my mobo/cpu recently. On the whole, I think this has worked out ok. The extra cost of the GTX260 over a last-gen card or a lower performing current-gen card is justified by not having thrown away money on 7xxx, 8xxx, or 9xxx series cards that wouldn't have run AH or my other games much better than my old 6800GT.
So I actually recommend biting the bullet and getting a fast card NOW and then skip a generation or two.
As for ATI vs. Nvidia, I have simply had better luck with nvidia cards. The ATI cards have some good features but for various reasons I have been really lucky and happy with my nvidia cards. The drivers seem pretty good to me, linux support is decent with the proprietary drivers (I'm not an open source purist... I just want my computer to work) and the image quality is nice. But both ATI and Nvidia current-gen cards are fast and give great image quality. Yea if you pick any specific dollar amount, you will be told that one card is a better deal than another, but if you buy performance instead of simply setting an arbitrary price limit, then it seems that nvidia has a slight edge. In other words, if you say "I don't need the fastest but I want a card that is just a step below the top of the line", you will find that you can get a really nice nvidia card for around $200-$250 that will be in general either slightly faster than an ATI card of the same price, or slightly cheaper than an ATI card that is as fast.
At least, that's what I have personally found to be true. But that's because I NEVER set an arbitrary price limit on computer hardware and then find the fastest part within the budget. Instead, I set a minimum performance spec and then buy whatever part seems to have the best bang for the buck while meeting or exceeding my required performance. That's why I ended up with an Asus P5Q (not the best, not the cheapest, but a great value), and an intel E8400 cpu (again not the fastest but certainly a great price for the performance). And of course my GTX260 (the older one with the fewer processors on the gpu) was a great value because at the time it destroyed any equivalent ATI card and it was priced a good $50 less than the slightly newer replacement nvidia GTX260s that had barely any performance increase.
So set a min performance level (use benchmarks to get an idea of what each card can do), and then buy the card that gives you the best bang for the buck above your minimum performance level. And buy a fast enough card that you'll be able to skip a generation or two before you buy another one. That's how you avoid getting hosed buying a vid card.
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I am running dual 4850s Crossfire. I don't plan on purchasing a vid card soon (I hope)
The performance of the crossfired 4850s' is exceptional.