Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: ra on June 20, 2000, 05:50:00 PM
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This plane is going to rule the MA, I hope it is accurately modelled. Sure climbs fast.
ra
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Uh, why does it have an AUX fuel tank? The A-8 had an extra tank in the rear fuselage, the A-5 didn't.
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Uh, why does it have an AUX fuel tank? The A-8 had an extra tank in the rear fuselage, the A-5 didn't.
Yep, seems like a mistake to me, A-8 was the earliest 190 that had AUX tank for MW 50 or additional fuel.
Well, in next patch it will be corrected (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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jochen Jagdflieger JG 2 'Richthofen' Aces High
jochen Geschwaderkommodore (on leave) Jagdgeschwader 2 'Richthofen' (http://personal.inet.fi/cool/jan.nousiainen/JG2) Warbirds
Thanks for the Fw 190A-5 HTC!
Ladysmith wants you forthwith to come to her relief
Burn your briefs you leave for France tonight
Carefully cut the straps of the booby-traps and set the captives free
But don't shoot 'til you see her big blue eyes
[This message has been edited by Jochen (edited 06-21-2000).]
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Well, the Yak-9 is gonna rule it too. Has all the advantages the 109 has and none of the flaws.
The A5 climbs decently but nowhere near the new rocket o' the sky, the Yakatak (credits go to (cannot remember just woke up) for that word (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)).
A5 topspeed seems a little lower than A8 - or is it just my imagination?
Also, should be a field modification to remove those pesky mg's.
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StSanta
II/JG2
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/santa.gif)
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Done some offline tests yesterday with 190A8/A5/G10/Yak. All of them with 50% fuel and no external stores (both 190 with 4x20 conf).
1 - 190A5 climbs much better than A8 at SL. About 700-800 fpm better.
2 - 190A5 climbs identical to A8 at 10k (3100-3200) fpm.
3 - 190A5 climbs better than A8 above 20k.
4 - 190A5 takes more time to refrigetate a hot engine than A8.
5 - 190A5 takes only 2.5-3 secs to hammerhead (vertical inversion), 190A8 about 4-5 secs.
6 - 190A5 guns have even worse ROF than 190A8.
7 - Not absolutely sure, but it seems to me that 190A8 acceletares much better than A5 in 0g dives.
8 - Low speed handling of A5 is noticeably better than A8, hi speed handling is almost identical.
9 - Yak has 200-250 fpm climbing advantage over A5 at 10k.
10 - 109G10 has about 500 fpm climbing advantage over Yak at 10k. This difference seems to minimize at higher altitudes.
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Actually the A-5 will out-climb the Yak up to 4k.
These are approximate climbrates I have observed with 100% fuel and max. power(100% in Yak, WEP in A-5).
Yak-9U.
Initial: 3600fpm.
At 6k drops off to 3200fpm at 8k.
8k to 15k improves slightly to 3300fpm.
15k drops off to ceiling.
Fw 190A-5.
Initial: 4000fpm.
4k drops off to 2800fpm at 10k.
10k to 20k improves to 3000fpm.
20k drops off to ceiling.
The Fw 190A-5 top speed is only about 400mph at 20k. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Originally posted by ra:
This plane is going to rule the MA, I hope it is accurately modelled. Sure climbs fast.
ra
Oh why when the LW nuts we get a good plane people start to whine?
A5 had much less wingloading than A8
A5 had much better powerloading than A8
That means that A5 must climb WAY better than A8. And that it should be faster (still have to test the fast thing because I think that 190 are too slow higher than 15K)and accelerate better, too.
Just happens that many people here still think that 190A was crap. well it wasnt. and we are going to rock in it!
About the AUX tank...A5 had provision for MW50 and GM1...and that means that it had a tank for the fuel for those boosters----->aux tank
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Ram, out
Fw190D9? Ta152H1? The truth is out there
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://members.tripod.com/JG2/)
(http://nottosc.tripod.com/ram190.gif)
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 06-21-2000).]
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RAM, the rear tank was not fitted to the A-5.
The engine of the A-4 and later models had the capability to use MW 50, but none of the necessary equipment(Ie: rear tank) was actually installed until the A-8.
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About the AUX tank...A5 had provision for MW50 and GM1...and that means that it had a tank for the fuel for those boosters----->aux tank
No, only A-8 (and later) had AUX tank. If you find a real A-5 and look itäs belly behind cocpit you won't see anything interesting. In A-8 you will find a hatch that is used to access the AUX tank which was used as a fuel tank or MW 50 tank, the first one were more common I think.
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jochen Jagdflieger JG 2 'Richthofen' Aces High
jochen Geschwaderkommodore (on leave) Jagdgeschwader 2 'Richthofen' (http://personal.inet.fi/cool/jan.nousiainen/JG2) Warbirds
Thanks for the Fw 190A-5 HTC!
Ladysmith wants you forthwith to come to her relief
Burn your briefs you leave for France tonight
Carefully cut the straps of the booby-traps and set the captives free
But don't shoot 'til you see her big blue eyes
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All I know is the A5 is a seriously fun ride... got into a low turnfight with one surprised pony. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) At sea level, you had better seriously respect its climb, speed, and acceleration.
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The P-38 was a seriously fun ride when it was first released.
ra
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BTW, that fast climb is only initial... after 5K or so it drops off, and even more so above 10K. I don't know if it is accurate, but I won't be found in much else for a while. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I took a pony yesterday down SW, I went practicing some turn fighting with the A5.
I was ok, didn't impressed me, i could stay in his 6 while we both ended on the ground.
but off course, you guys are thinking :' they were A5 dweebs, if it would had been me you would be dead'. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy:
I took a pony yesterday down SW, I went practicing some turn fighting with the A5.
I was ok, didn't impressed me, i could stay in his 6 while we both ended on the ground.
but off course, you guys are thinking :' they were A5 dweebs, if it would had been me you would be dead'. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
A5 trying to solve a combat against P51 with horizontal and substained turns at low speed and on the deck ?? Yep, it seems dweed for me (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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For comparison, funked's USN Fw 190A-5 page: http://members.xoom.com/mikewaltz/F-TR-1102-ND.htm (http://members.xoom.com/mikewaltz/F-TR-1102-ND.htm)
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yeah the p-38 used to be fun when it first came out.
now I have fw190s hanging with me in the vertical, outzooming out diving out turning me in the p38.
hope your 190a5 dosnt suffer the same fate
perhaps i should just sit still and watch the ufo show
[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 06-21-2000).]
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Originally posted by Citabria:
yeah the p-38 used to be fun when it first came out.
now I have fw190s hanging with me in the vertical, outzooming out diving out turning me in the p38.
hope your 190a5 dosnt suffer the same fate
perhaps i should just sit still and watch the ufo show
First: how much fuel did you r 38 had?. How much the 190?
Second: what altitude where you at?
Third: did the A5 had outboard cannons? (90% sure it hadnt)
Fourth: wich was the speed?
Come on citabria the other day I managed to win angles on a P38 in my 190A8!! if the 190 driver knows his office you are ded meat.
And BTW if you come with a high level fighter to turn with an Specialized low level fighter on the deck, then dont whine because he beats you.
190A5 handles like a dream. Jeallous?...I can understand it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
As i said in other thread, until someone comes with hard numbers data about A5 too uber, stop whining.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Ignore it folks, The A5 is fine, the aux tank is prolly cuz HTC got in a hurry due to all the "Wild,Harmful,Ignorant,Nasty,Eruptions" on the BB (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
As for Citabria, humph, cit, yer a good stick, but all in all I think you'd complain that the sheep are over/under modelled if your beloved P38 happened to miss one (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) chill baby, itsa game.
Me, I'm glad they gave us 3 new planes and a new ground vehicle, cool effects (even at the cost of FPS, whaddya gonna see in a smoke cloud anyway?) and carry on the tradition of improvment and exspansion of what is already a blast, So stop hammering on them for a bit willya? whaddya want HTC ta get tired of the crap and sell? We really want another IEN nightmare? Huh YEAH I'M TALKING TO YOU!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
people don't show any gratitude for honest effort nowadays just all this sports type trash talking crap, somebody needs ta blow this stinking planet off the map. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
ARRRRGH! I don't wanna talk ta yas no more today.
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pzvg- "5 years and I still can't shoot"
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Ram;
Do you fly the AH P-38?
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
"Though some art vets, all art dweebish"
Jedi
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I ran a couple A5s down in my P-38 no problem. The A5, however, provides serious competition for the Pony as the best BnZ ride now. It's fast, it can HO a F4U and perhaps come out on top.
I can see after 5 months of the Cannon Hawg and the Pony, LW drivers are defensive about the performance of this ride.
XX
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Originally posted by Minotaur:
Ram;
Do you fly the AH P-38?
Answer: yes
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The A5, however, provides serious competition for the Pony as the best BnZ ride now. It's fast, it can HO a F4U and perhaps come out on top.
The A-8 is faster, has more powerful guns with more ammo, it has more armour and more fuel than the A-5. I'd say it is a better BnZ type than the A-5.
It's all just a big mind trick. The A-5 isn't anything spectacular in the AH planeset.
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Originally posted by juzz:
The A-8 is faster
It only should be that under 1K isnt it?...over that should be faster.
has more powerful guns with more ammo, it has more armour and more fuel than the A-5. I'd say it is a better BnZ type than the A-5.
[/b]
seen from that view, yes...but remeber that A5 can win snapshots impossible for an A8. REmember,too that A5 can zoom better than A8. IMHO A5 is much better BnZer for repetitive bounces ,while A8 loses its E after the second or third bounce.
It's all just a big mind trick. The A-5 isn't anything spectacular in the AH planeset.
Agree 100%. BUt A5 is MUCH MORE COMPETITIVE ARENA PLANE than A8. Fw190A8 needed a lot of teamwork (I'm more used to lonewolf,tho), A5 can hold its own better.
What happens here is that people cant stand to see a GOOD 190. They have some resort in their minds that made them think "that plane was crap". Well Fw190A was the best 1942 plane around the world. Was one of the best,if not THE best in 1943. But in 1944 was crappy because with the same power than A5, the 190A8 was far heavier.
People here cant admit that the powerloading of the 190A5 makes it to have a fast turning rate at high speeds. And as A8 people we are used to keep speed high, A5 handles like a wargod on our hands. People simply cant stand a competitive 190, is some mental closure...G10 (still the best plane here IMHO) sees very little whinin. A5, wich in fact is much more vulnerable than P51 or P38, or 109...sees endlessy whining.
A5 is competitive. In good hands is a very good plane. just as anything here. A8 had serious problems on the defensive. Now yoou people MUST work for your kills.
Pissed? I'm sorry.
Mino, BTW P38 is one of my favorite rides out of LW set. I rarely fly it because I'm in love with 190 and 109. but I did it a lot in past tours and I do it a lot in the TA.
The problem here is that under 10K 190 is VERY powerful, while P38 is designed for high altitudes. The fact that low on the deck it can fight too, doesnt hide that it fights in 190's kingdom.
and if you fight in the other's kingdom, then you'll have problems.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 06-22-2000).]
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<<<What happens here is that people cant stand to see a GOOD 190.>>>
Ram, you are trying to read peoples' minds. Why don't you take them on their word that they are just concerned about the modelling of a new plane, in this case the 190A-5?
I would be interested to see how the 2 cannon 190A-5 matches up against the 109G-2 and 109F-4 in sustained turn and climb with 50% fuel. In a 1 on 1 knife fight I would prefer the A5 to either of these planes, and that doesn't seem right.
I've had a couple of 20K+ fights in the A-5, and it didn't do badly at all. Other than the 109G-10, the A-5 is better by far than all other 109s.
ra
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I must say I used to prefer A-8 over G-10 when I flew them in AH.
Why ?
Control feel. As simple as that.
190 can't outturn many planes. But it can outmaneuver them.
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Ram;
You got your dream plane and I truly share your joy. Consider however that the P-38 is not nearly as popular nor as exalted as the FW-190. This means that the P-38 does not get the across the board attention that the FW-190 does among players.
When the P-38L came out it performed well, and I guess too well. HTC modified the flight model, the masses of AH were satisfied. They did not especially like this plane because it was clearly "Non-Superior" and that it was a good target for them to shoot at.
IMO the P-38 should perform better and I just might guess that Citabria thinks so also. A hunch on my part, I'm assuming that Citabria is simply voicing his frustration and concern in singular fashion. We P-38 fans seem to be a silent bunch. Considering in respect the many LW fans, who voice their opinions over and over and over again. Being heard in the multitudes.
To my experience, the P-38 does not fight nearly as well as it was reputed to be able to do. It was called "The Fork-Tailed Devil" by the LW and I suspect for some good reason. Considering, for the most part, it is closer to "The Fork-Tailed Target" and more players than not are content for it to remain thusly.
The 190A-8 already does exceedingly well in the MA and I suspect the 190A-5 will do equally or even perhaps better. I will assume that you are content that 190's, in general, are doing or do well. With those feelings you are perhaps in the near majority. There are alot of LW fans who play AH. Face the music, truly it is cannon armed planes that have the best chance of excelling.
One last thing to keep in mind. It is the planes that DO WELL and are VERY POPULAR that get squeaked about and scrutinized the most.
Good Luck and Brace Yourself! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
"Though some art vets, all art dweebish"
Jedi
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What was changed on the P-38L?
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Originally posted by Minotaur:
Ram;
When the P-38L came out it performed well, and I guess too well. HTC modified the flight model, the masses of AH were satisfied. They did not especially like this plane because it was clearly "Non-Superior" and that it was a good target for them to shoot at.
Mino that's not nearly true. P38 held E so much that it was unable to land!! someone posted NUMBERS on Drag in P38 and demonstrated that it had way too few drag. Pyro checked it and fixed it.
THat happened only 4 days after p38's release. Right now I only hear whines about A5, but not hard data. come here and put some numbers on A5, demnostrate it is too uber, not simply write it. For me A5 handles as expected. ANd so I expected this whines.
[/quote][/b]
IMO the P-38 should perform better and I just might guess that Citabria thinks so also. A hunch on my part, I'm assuming that Citabria is simply voicing his frustration and concern in singular fashion. We P-38 fans seem to be a silent bunch. Considering in respect the many LW fans, who voice their opinions over and over and over again. Being heard in the multitudes.
To my experience, the P-38 does not fight nearly as well as it was reputed to be able to do. It was called "The Fork-Tailed Devil" by the LW and I suspect for some good reason. Considering, for the most part, it is closer to "The Fork-Tailed Target" and more players than not are content for it to remain thusly.
[/b]
dunno, but the few times I flew in P38 I loved it, especially at high altitudes.
The 190A-8 already does exceedingly well in the MA and I suspect the 190A-5 will do equally or even perhaps better. I will assume that you are content that 190's, in general, are doing or do well. With those feelings you are perhaps in the near majority. There are alot of LW fans who play AH. Face the music, truly it is cannon armed planes that have the best chance of excelling.
A8 does good because the pilots, not the plane. If you dont believe me go and take one... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).I even got one before and killed 3 enemies in a sortie, 2 A5s (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) and one niki (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
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190 A5 - nice plane, if it's over modelled in what ever area change if not leave it.
simple (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by jmccaul:
190 A5 - nice plane, if it's over modelled in what ever area change if not leave it.
simple (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Would be nice change to get overmodelled german fighter for a change.. and I do not mean overmodelled torque now.
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Originally posted by juzz:
What was changed on the P-38L?
I know that it had very good E-retention, this gave it an excessive zoom climb in some peoples opinion. (Most noticeably HTC's (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) )
I'm not sure this was because it could not land. It had trouble (as did the N1K2 and others) landing up until flap drag/lift was fixed. However; maybe this was how its high E-retention was first noticed and/or presented to HTC.
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Ram;
LOL (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
IMO the best pilots are those that are most successful in the P-51D, F4U-1D(oops), 109G-x (no gondola) or the P-38L. Considering the upper echelon of the more successful MA plane types.
Consider how the F4U-1C overshadows the F4U-1D. They are the same A/C. An imaginary 190A-TB (Tweety Bird) with only 6 x 13.7mm MG's would fall to the same fate. The 190A-TB would be cast out for favor of its cannon equiped brethren the 190A-8(5) just like the F4U-1D.
Check the stats. For the most part any plane with cannon do better in the MA, with the noticable exception being the P-51D.( <Salute!> ) Those with 4 (or 3) cannon seem to do noticably better than the rest. Last time I took the time to analyze the data it was #1 F4U-1C, #2 190A-8 and #3 109G-10. (The combined stats of the A8 and G10 approximately equalling those of the 1C)
The N1K2 also does very well, but the Typhoon I'm not sure about. Hardly anyone flies it. I suspect the Typhoon's performance is just too far out of the "comfort easy zone" of what most "play for score/success" players prefer.
The MA favors big guns and relatively competive A/C performance. However; the better the performance the better its success. Hang 4 cannon on any of the MA's top performers and you get a winner. IMO the 190A-5 is a sure thing, should be alot of fun! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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It was not my intention to de-rail this thread, but I am fairly certain this might have been what has happened. To those readers I apologize.
Good Luck and Have Fun! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
"Though some art vets, all art dweebish"
Jedi
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IMO the best pilots are those that are most successful in the P-51D, F4U-1D(oops), 109G-x (no gondola) or the P-38L. Considering the upper echelon of the more successful MA plane types.
Consider how the F4U-1C overshadows the F4U-1D. They are the same A/C. An imaginary 190A-TB (Tweety Bird) with only 6 x 13.7mm MG's would fall to the same fate. The 190A-TB would be cast out for favor of its cannon equiped brethren the 190A-8(5) just like the F4U-1D.
Check the stats. For the most part any plane with cannon do better in the MA, with the noticable exception being the P-51D.( <Salute!> ) Those with 4 (or 3) cannon seem to do noticably better than the rest. Last time I took the time to analyze the data it was #1 F4U-1C, #2 190A-8 and #3 109G-10. (The combined stats of the A8 and G10 approximately equalling those of the 1C)
[/b]
ok...then check my tour3 stats on P51. THat was the only time I flew it seriously. I average a 2-1 K/d in 190. I averaged 3-1 in P51.
If you give me 6x50 cals (not 13mm plz) I'd be happy in my A5, not the A8 because A8 cant do anything but snapshots. And in a Snapshot the cannon is a must be.
IMHO p51 and G10 are "easy" to survive in them ,as they can run out from any enemy.
but that is only my view.
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 06-22-2000).]
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Ram;
LOL (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
So sorry, I thought we were talking about the planes in general and not precisely your stats or your skill. I take for granted that your skills are better than average. <S!>
I am a mediocure pilot, but I do very well in the A8 and now the A5. This is because I am adjusting my fighting style away from the dependence on TnB "saddle up" to the dependence on bigger guns and snap shots.
Heck, I even like the Typhoon. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
"Though some art vets, all art dweebish"
Jedi