Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Custom Skins => Topic started by: Bark0 on March 28, 2009, 10:09:38 PM
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Hello everyone.
I would like to see some early war skins for early war planes. Like thew P-40B for example...It has a skin with the Old fashioned Pre-war star on it.Planes I would like to see it on:
-B-17
-C-47
-P40-E
-B25-C
-P-38
-P-39
etc.
:salute
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IIRC early war stars won't be accepted. Again IIRC the only reason that skin is there is because the unit retained the star for a while after the war started.
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I Heard in the next skin pack we are getting the night fighter P38. Is this true?
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I Heard in the next skin pack we are getting the night fighter P38. Is this true?
What night fighter would that be? We don't have a P38M
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idk buster told me we would get a black one.
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idk buster told me we would get a black one.
It would not be a historical skin however so I'd hope they don't add it. Unless they add a P38M of course, but that's really just a modified 2 seat P38L with radar and the operator jammed in behind the pilot so I'd see little point unless we went to a night arena. But then again the P38M would be way down the list of night fighters too since it saw so little use.
And I like 38s :)
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idk buster told me we would get a black one.
We had a black P-38J for a long while. It was completely inaccurate and made up, and was finally replaced. Pray to all your gods it never sees daylight again.
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Larry was working on a 38J skin which he showed me and told me was accepted. It looked real cool, can't wait to fly it. Maybe when he sees this post he'll give you guys a preview.
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Dan it was the half black half OD green PJ that you sent me "Miss Ann". I didn't get any emails back when I submitted it the first time so I'm going to try and update it some and submit it in a month or so.
For the thread starter, Any American paint schemes before Dec. 8th, 1941 will not be accepted.
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Thanks for your reply Larry I wasn't sure myself
(http://i419.photobucket.com/albums/pp278/B4B/black381.jpg)
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Wait, so 2 planes were painted like that, deemed unsuited, and repainted back??
Did they even see combat???
I think that a certain set of requirements is in place before simply just making the skin and submitting it. Must have seen combat, must have been armed (no PR planes, for example).
I think a little more info should be supplied to indicate this skin is worthy of inclusion into AH.
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Read it again krusty. It was an armed night fighter used IN a squadron and sent into combat. Thats enough for it to be put in game.
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The TWO planes were "from" a squadron, not flown in squad sorties or in any strength other than 1-at-a-time basis, and only flown for a short time before being reverted to older markings. Night intruder doesn't mean active combat. They may never have found anybody to kill (hence maybe why they were deemed unsuited??)
Again, no evidence so far that they're worthy of being skinned in AH.
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Again, no evidence so far that they're worthy of being skinned in AH.
And who are you to say that the information I have isn't "worthy"? Only person that has a say is skuzzy, and since you aren't him you have no say in its approval what so ever. So please don't worry about what evidence I have because its not up to you weather it gets in the game or not.
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And who are you to say that the information I have isn't "worthy"? Only person that has a say is skuzzy, and since you aren't him you have no say in its approval what so ever. So please don't worry about what evidence I have because its not up to you weather it gets in the game or not.
I can settle this argument I have photo's & profiles of all black p-38's that did see combat & not p38M's. I have passed them on to a skinner some time back.
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Wait, so 2 planes were painted like that, deemed unsuited, and repainted back??
There was only one specifically painted aircraft for every skin we have in game. There was only one "Big Beautiful Doll" WZ*I flown by Col. John Landers in the 78th FG.
We don't have generic skins.
On the other hand, the two P-38s were kind of one-offs. ;)
wrongway
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That is my point. There are camo standards, styles, themes, etc, that are applied to an entire squadron, wing, or even entire theater of operations...
Then there's 2 field-painted planes that proved unsuited for the task and were restored to previous markings.
How long did it take before they were proven "unsuited"? How many sorties at night did they fly? Where did they fly, was it even into hostile territory, or were they flown in tests first? Did they ever even run into any foes to shoot at?
They are basically day fighters being flown at night with no radar. Only ground radar and radio directions were used to point them at targets, and even in the densest of areas (over London during the night bombing) this was a futile effort.
Now put them in the pacific with 100's of square miles to patrol, no local radar, no local reports, just lone planes patrolling at night looking for something to kill....
Yeah. I'm really skeptical as to their "trial by fire" (combat). So unless there's a lot more info to back up the story on these birds, they're probably no more valid than state-side training units, or test schemes, or experimental prototype schemes.
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Hate to point this out but are you not using a double standard here In this thread? When in another thread that I had started you did not seem to take issue with a single black F4u-d so long as it was armed?
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,255962.0.html
Re: Can these 2 qualify?
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2009, 06:49:22 PM » Quote
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No unarmed or non-combat skins are allowed. The c-47 is out because it has pre-war markings and was only used state-side.
The F4u "Sally" should never have been included in this game. It has no guns. It was unarmed and did not see combat. Further, in-game it's garrishly pure white (blech) whereas it's supposed to be aluminum. The black version, if it's the same plane repainted (I'm unclear about that just reading the captions by the photos) should not be allowed for the same reasons (non-combat, unarmed plane). However if the black one was armed and did fly that way, then there's no reason it shouldn't be included.
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Picture said they did fly a number of sorties. now not trying to start an argument here, but I know at the time my computer was having issues, and Larry very kindly did the research for me. I'm assuming they didn't perform their job as well as the 8 AF brass thought they would during their intruder missions so they pulled the operation.
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That is my point. There are camo standards, styles, themes, etc, that are applied to an entire squadron, wing, or even entire theater of operations...
Just to clarify here..
Krusty, you are now arguing that ALLIED planes should only be accepted if they are like other alliied planes?
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That is my point. There are camo standards, styles, themes, etc, that are applied to an entire squadron, wing, or even entire theater of operations...
Then there's 2 field-painted planes that proved unsuited for the task and were restored to previous markings.
How long did it take before they were proven "unsuited"? How many sorties at night did they fly? Where did they fly, was it even into hostile territory, or were they flown in tests first? Did they ever even run into any foes to shoot at?
They are basically day fighters being flown at night with no radar. Only ground radar and radio directions were used to point them at targets, and even in the densest of areas (over London during the night bombing) this was a futile effort.
Now put them in the pacific with 100's of square miles to patrol, no local radar, no local reports, just lone planes patrolling at night looking for something to kill....
Yeah. I'm really skeptical as to their "trial by fire" (combat). So unless there's a lot more info to back up the story on these birds, they're probably no more valid than state-side training units, or test schemes, or experimental prototype schemes.
The problem with this is, the point of the custom skins is to have something NOT like everyone else, something unique. Hell, as long as it saw combat, the wackier it is, the better IMHO!
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Fencer, you twist my words, but i see the irony you're trying to get at. No that's nto what I meant.
Lyric: I hope they remove Sally from the game. At the time I didn't understand it was 2 paint jobs from the same plane. Hence I called it "the black one". Neither fits into the game.
Serenity (and this is a reply to Fencer and Lyric as well) I'm not saying "don't do unique and interesting skins" -- I'm saying "don't do the most bizarre skin just BECUASE it's bizarre. Make sure it saw combat, make sure it was on a front line plane."
We have very colorful P-40N skins we could make IF we had the P-40N in this game, only many of them were state-side training units and NEVER saw combat.
Well here we have a temporary skin that was painted on and removed in a short time and no verification if it ever flew in combat, or only training missions, or if the plane wearing it ever came within miles of an enemy plane.
I think the burden is to provide a BIT more info when such is the case.
I seem to recall a bright orange Ta152 (prototype color) that somebody was saying they'd skin and submit just because it was original.
Well that's not a valid skin for a reason, and IMO neither is this black 38 *unless* anybody can provide some more info.
I'm saying give us the bloody background on it! THEN once you've shown it's worth of being an AH skin go for it!
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Serenity (and this is a reply to Fencer and Lyric as well) I'm not saying "don't do unique and interesting skins" -- I'm saying "don't do the most bizarre skin just BECUASE it's bizarre. Make sure it saw combat, make sure it was on a front line plane."
We have very colorful P-40N skins we could make IF we had the P-40N in this game, only many of them were state-side training units and NEVER saw combat.
Well here we have a temporary skin that was painted on and removed in a short time and no verification if it ever flew in combat, or only training missions, or if the plane wearing it ever came within miles of an enemy plane.
I think the burden is to provide a BIT more info when such is the case.
I seem to recall a bright orange Ta152 (prototype color) that somebody was saying they'd skin and submit just because it was original.
Well that's not a valid skin for a reason, and IMO neither is this black 38 *unless* anybody can provide some more info.
I'm saying give us the bloody background on it! THEN once you've shown it's worth of being an AH skin go for it!
I see where you're coming from. I think the trick of it is, that these planes were deployed to combat with this configuration. The determination that they were unsuited for combat implies that they were tested in combat, and whether they actually engaged an enemy is, in my opinion, irrelevant, EXCEPT in the case of, say the Orange Ta-152H that may have engaged fighters on the way to delivery. The simple deployment to combat, and they attempt to meet the enemy, IMHO, qualifies a skin, no matter how short-lived the skin may be.
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Do you know they were deployed this way? It says they were painted this way, and deemed unsuitable for night intruder missions.
What does that mean? Some CO ran tests over a staging area over safe terrain? Somebody sent them out with no hope of ever seeing/engaging the enemy?
How brief a window before they were yanked out of that mission?
It's not as if they were sent into harms way, from the description of it (hence why I insist on more info in this P-38 instance)
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Do you know they were deployed this way? It says they were painted this way, and deemed unsuitable for night intruder missions.
What does that mean? Some CO ran tests over a staging area over safe terrain? Somebody sent them out with no hope of ever seeing/engaging the enemy?
How brief a window before they were yanked out of that mission?
It's not as if they were sent into harms way, from the description of it (hence why I insist on more info in this P-38 instance)
Yes they were sent into harms way. It was a pair of 38Js that were OD on top and black undersides. There were also two 51s used. I can give you the specific time frames too, but I'm on a laptop with a little guy next to me so the books are not in reach at the moment :)
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Hey Dan, hows Aces Highs next great P38G test pilot doing? Does he have a little S.A.P.P. Jr. patch on his shirts yet? :aok
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A couple of p38gs were painted black and used as night fighters.Lyric has pictures and info on these planes,i was skinning it for fun but now i can't complete it.
If anyone else wants to do it i am sure lyric will be willing to pass on his information if asked.
they were combat planes and they flew combat sorties.surly that would be enough to get it accepted.pictures and documentation.
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A couple of p38gs were painted black and used as night fighters.Lyric has pictures and info on these planes,i was skinning it for fun but now i can't complete it.
If anyone else wants to do it i am sure lyric will be willing to pass on his information if asked.
they were combat planes and they flew combat sorties.surly that would be enough to get it accepted.pictures and documentation.
Don't believe they were black. They were on the Canal. Not much reason for it in AH to be honest.
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Hey Dan, hows Aces Highs next great P38G test pilot doing? Does he have a little S.A.P.P. Jr. patch on his shirts yet? :aok
He had surgery to repair his cleft lip last Tuesday so he's recuperating. He's a Mustang guy too. Who'da thunk it? :)
Other then that he's doing well. 7 1/2 months old now. Thanks for asking :)
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Thats great to hear Dan. :aok
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Don't believe they were black. They were on the Canal. Not much reason for it in AH to be honest.
They are black.
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Hijack Much? :huh
So why aren't these stars allowed? IMO i don't see why. the B-25's Launched off the Carrier in the Dolittle raid Had those stars...and that was in April of 1942.
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Its not the stars that aren't allowed its some of the planes that they were painted on that weren't used after the U.S. joined the war. Just like some F4U4s that were used in Korea with the red, white, and blue star and bar. If the paint scheme wasn't used in WWII HTC will not allow it.
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They are black.
Hmm. Love to see the photos. Only one I've seen looks to be OD/Gray with the radar antenna out the side of the nose
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They are black.
Hmm. Love to see the photos. Only one I've seen looks to be OD/Gray with the radar antenna out the side of the nose
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I will give you a teaser.
This is one of the two aircraft I have.
(http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/7379/scan1bqh.th.jpg) (http://img15.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan1bqh.jpg)
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Oppps don't know what happened here?
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Yes they were sent into harms way. It was a pair of 38Js that were OD on top and black undersides. There were also two 51s used. I can give you the specific time frames too, but I'm on a laptop with a little guy next to me so the books are not in reach at the moment :)
I would be very interested WHERE they were tested, and for how long. Thanks, if you've got the info.
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Have all that good stuff in fact the pilot of one of these black p38's was an ace.
At work at present will put it all on later.
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There are B-17's that had the stars in the Battle of midway.
P-40's that had them
B-25's That were launched during the Doolittle raid had them
All these events Occurred in WWII BUT before the switch to the new American signal they HAD the stars.
America Joined the war in 1941. All these planes had the Stars.
So, Why not?
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Find a picture of a B17G with the marking you're talking about.
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Give me a week or two to find the site i found them on. Forgot to bookmark it. :mad:
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Give me a week or two to find the site i found them on. Forgot to bookmark it. :mad:
I predict the response will be, "That is not a B-17G".
wrongway
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(http://www.warbirdregistry.org/p38registry/images/p38-417630-main.jpg)
Crashed on glacier, July 15, 1942.
<--- Note We were at war then
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(http://www.warbirdregistry.org/p38registry/images/p38-417630-main.jpg)
<--- Note We were at war then
Didn't see combat. Lost on a ferry flight in Greenland.
wrongway
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So? It was a plane in WWII that had the star. Although It did not see combat, it is still a WWII Plane. There is no rule stating that a Plane HAS to see combat to be in the game.
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Au Contraire
* We will not accept skins containing the swastiska. NOTE: If you are making a skin that originally had a swastiska, just leave the spot blank where the swastiska would have been, or change the swatiska to the Iron Cross. Use your best judgement on this.
* We will not accept skins that alter the overall shape of the object.
* We will only accept skins that were historically used in World War II.
* Only submit the files/skins you actually change from the original.
* The text description file must be named by the object name, such as p51d.txt for a P51D skin, for example.
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* We will only accept skins that were historically used in World War II.
And just to put the icing on the cake. That isn't a historical WWII paint scheme.
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(http://www.netaces.org/skins/p47d11/skin14.jpg)
Hmmm. Interesting. This one never saw combat.
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There are B-17's that had the stars in the Battle of midway.
P-40's that had them
B-25's That were launched during the Doolittle raid had them
All these events Occurred in WWII BUT before the switch to the new American signal they HAD the stars.
America Joined the war in 1941. All these planes had the Stars.
So, Why not?
Bark0 the red center to the star was gone between Coral Sea and Midway. This would be May 42. You will not find a B17F much less a G with that marking. It was on B17Es at Pearl but not at Midway.
This was taken at Midway. Both 17s in the pic have the red painted out. You will not find a combat 38 with that marking. You will probably come across photos of Pre-May 42 P39s and P40s with the red ball as well as SBDs and F4Fs. But that's about it. The Doolittle raid was April 42 so those B25Bs still had them. The B25Cs like we have did not in combat.
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Dan, Im guessing you forgot the photo?
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Dan, Im guessing you forgot the photo?
ummm....er.... the 38J? It's the same one someone posted already. If I didn't know better, I'd think they'd saved the one I posted :)
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This was taken at Midway. Both 17s in the pic have the red painted out.
That's what I was talking about. I don't see any pictures. :)
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(http://www.netaces.org/skins/p47d11/skin14.jpg)
Hmmm. Interesting. This one never saw combat.
There is a post war P-51D and Yak-9U in the current skin pack as well. Sometimes they slip by?
wrongway
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There is a post war P-51D and Yak-9U in the current skin pack as well. Sometimes they slip by?
wrongway
If that can happen than why not now? does HTC look for the skin's online to see if they did see combat? If not, they should.
* We will only accept skins that were historically used in World War II.
:lol
the planes with the star on it WERE used in WWII. not for very long though.
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If that can happen than why not now? does HTC look for the skin's online to see if they did see combat? If not, they should.
Im sure you must turn in info that it did see combat service when you submit the skin
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There is a post war P-51D and Yak-9U in the current skin pack as well. Sometimes they slip by?
wrongway
Enlighten me as to the P-51D which is post war.
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(http://www.netaces.org/skins/p47d11/skin14.jpg)
Hmmm. Interesting. This one never saw combat.
I could be wrong, since it's been a while since this skin had its progress thread, but I seem to recall that rogerdee said it was an operational training unit, that did see some frontline combat. Not all the time, but did see some. At least, that's what I seem to remember.
If there's an inaccurate skin in the game, sometimes skinners omit facts or give wrong (or misleading) info to get it into the game. In these cases (IMO) the work is also sub-par and the skinner wanted to rush to get it in.
In these cases we can collect correct info and submit to HTC in an attempt to remove the skins from the game. I'm reminded of that god-awful black p-38 abomination of a skin we used to have that was 100% fictitious. It took a while to get HTC to do it, but they removed it from the game.
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Enlighten me as to the P-51D which is post war.
361FG/375FS by MachNix only because it has the post war "Buzz Numbers" on the lower surfaces of the wings.
The buzz numbers, the squadron and aircraft sides from the fuselage, were added post war to the underside to "discourage" pilots from tearing up the countryside by pulling stunts and flying low. Made it easier to "get their number" and report them.
If that can happen than why not now? does HTC look for the skin's online to see if they did see combat? If not, they should.
:lol
the planes with the star on it WERE used in WWII. not for very long though.
If HTC is made aware of discrepancies, the skin will be removed from the game. We used to have that travesty of a skin in that black P-38 that was a bit ETO and a bit PTO and not based on anything historic. It was thankfully removed.
We're still waiting to see a pic of something we have in game with an early war U.S. insignia that actually saw combat.
wrongway
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We're still waiting to see a pic of something we have in game with an early war U.S. insignia that actually saw combat.
:huh
(http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv260/Barkoed/ahss47.jpg)
This Is a P-40B Skin with an early war star on it. this Photo is Not Edited and is straight out of my Screen-shot Folder
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(http://www.netaces.org/skins/p40b/skin3.jpg)
I believe it's from Pearl Harbor, one of the two that got airborne to engage the Japanese.
The markings were changed afterward, but please note that since this happened ON the day war started, these were pre-war markings.
EDIT: Also:
(http://www.netaces.org/skins/f4f4/skin1.jpg)
I believe this was a Midway skin, still very early in the war. Not 100% sure, though.
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:huh
(http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv260/Barkoed/ahss47.jpg)
This Is a P-40B Skin with an early war star on it. this Photo is Not Edited and is straight out of my Screen-shot Folder
You mean one of those P-40B's that saw combat at Pearl Harbor.
See? You got your wish.
:)
Actually, anything that flew in the Battle of the Coral Sea would have been so marked too. So, SBD and F4F. Otherwise, there is nothing else currently in game that would have those markings that already don't.
wrongway
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Yea but that is Just 2 planes, I would like to see some more (Supporting the EW guys here).
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Yea but that is Just 2 planes, I would like to see some more (Supporting the EW guys here).
There honestly isn't much. What are you looking for? The P-40Es wouldn't have it, they're too late in the war, as are the Corsairs, the Hellcats, the Ponies, the Lightnings, the B-17s, the B-24s, the B-25s, the B-26s...
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The Wildcat was from the USS Ranger which was based in the Atlantic in 1942. I picked it because the AH F4F-4 has mirrored wings and it was one of the few F4Fs with the early markings on both wings top and bottom. IIRC the USN deleted the red markings from their insignia in the middle of 1942, just before Midway.
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The TWO planes were "from" a squadron, not flown in squad sorties or in any strength other than 1-at-a-time basis, and only flown for a short time before being reverted to older markings. Night intruder doesn't mean active combat. They may never have found anybody to kill (hence maybe why they were deemed unsuited??)
Again, no evidence so far that they're worthy of being skinned in AH.
Think this might be enough to fill the requirements?
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/110Gp20Miss20Ann_zps2b46ad1e.jpg) (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/barneybolac/media/110Gp20Miss20Ann_zps2b46ad1e.jpg.html)
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/220-pav_P-38J_Miss-Ann_0_zpsb49bb5ea.jpg) (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/barneybolac/media/220-pav_P-38J_Miss-Ann_0_zpsb49bb5ea.jpg.html)
http://forum.armyairforces.com/US-Intruder-Detachment-Little-Snoring-m199552.aspx#233703
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=24250
http://www.station131.co.uk/Visitors%20Images%20Page.htm
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Think this might be enough to fill the requirements?
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/110Gp20Miss20Ann_zps2b46ad1e.jpg) (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/barneybolac/media/110Gp20Miss20Ann_zps2b46ad1e.jpg.html)
(http://i1002.photobucket.com/albums/af142/barneybolac/220-pav_P-38J_Miss-Ann_0_zpsb49bb5ea.jpg) (http://s1002.photobucket.com/user/barneybolac/media/220-pav_P-38J_Miss-Ann_0_zpsb49bb5ea.jpg.html)
http://forum.armyairforces.com/US-Intruder-Detachment-Little-Snoring-m199552.aspx#233703
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=24250
http://www.station131.co.uk/Visitors%20Images%20Page.htm
Is that green and black?
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Is that green and black?
:aok
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:aok
That may be my next project
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That may be my next project
May want to check with Larry who is on this thread first. :aok
He started this plane first not sure if he will finish it.