Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: whels on September 21, 2009, 01:13:18 PM
-
I now have a Intel quad 9550 with 4 gig of Ram (2 x 2 gig), and a 1 gig video card.
since XP32 only sees 3.2 gig of ram (including video card mem), im loosing the extra
ram i have.
Should i go to XP64 or Win 7? is Win 7 ready?
whels
-
I only played around a little with XP 64-bit when it first came out, but Windows 7 is ready. I've played around with the RC's for a while, and installed the 32-bit version a few weeks ago on a laptop.
I've been using Vista 64-bit for a year at home, and Windows 7 runs faster on a PC with less RAM and a slower CPU.
In my view, the only reason to stay with XP 64-bit and not go to Windows 7 would be if you're using older peripherals where drives may not be available.
mir
-
I now have a Intel quad 9550 with 4 gig of Ram (2 x 2 gig), and a 1 gig video card.
since XP32 only sees 3.2 gig of ram (including video card mem), im loosing the extra
ram i have.
Should i go to XP64 or Win 7? is Win 7 ready?
whels
Win 7 is less than thirty days from release.
-
which version should i get? I surf alot, play 2 online games, and a few offline games/sims.
i currently use XP Pro (32 bit).
-
Whels,
I have been using Win 7 Ultimate 64bit for a while now.
checked it out during beta, then upgraded it to the Win 7 Ultimate RC 64bit version last MAy when it went public as the Rlease Candidate
and most recently downloaded and installed through my MSDN technet subscription, the Enterprise version of Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit... inwhich I can purchase my license when it goes public and will not have to reinstall.......
from my experience it blows windows XP away and have had nothing but shear enjoyment and satisfaction from using it
I also have not had any issues arise regarding driver problems or Software not wanting to work in Windows 7, whether it be 32bit or 64 bit..everything seems to work BETTER, for me anyhow..... YMMV......
-
Just to clarify, you need 64 bit Win7 to see all your RAM. I believe both versions come on the DVD.
-
You need that last little bit? For what?
IMO better to stick with xp at this point.
Either vista or Win 7 is going to take more hardware to get the same performance your seeing with XP.
So I really don't see the advantage just to get that last bit of ram.
Of course you could always partition and dual boot if your curious.
-
You're not just getting more RAM Ghost, with Win 7 you're also getting DX11. AH2 doesn't use it but for a game machine it makes a difference. I have a dual boot XP 32bit/Win 7 64bit. I've probably booted XP 3 times in the last 2 months. I haven't checked the newest version of AH2 but 2.14 ran better on Win 7 than on XP for me.
-
Windows 7 Professional x64 is my suggestion.
-
between my WinXPpro 32 bit partiton and my Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit partition, the Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit completely blows away windowsXPpro....it gives my LCD monitor screen rez 5 more frames over WinXP
winXPpro- monitor max screen rez using 1280x1024 = 70 mhz
Win7Ultimate 64bit- monitor max screen rez using 1280x1024 = 75 mhz
windows 7 Ultimate lets me utilize my total 4 gigs of ram
windows 7 ultimate 64bit, Ah2 never sees a hicup and stays pegged with detail set to the new 4 miles, and all other graphic detail settings maxed out using 1280x1024 screen rez and the hires texture package
in winxppro 32 bit..when smooth shadow is enabled I experience a loss of 30 to 40 fps....not so in win7 ultimate........
I have it set up in a dual boot configuration , using the same computer for both OS installations
My Computer Specs:
Antec 900 Case with (4) 120mm fans ,(1) 200 mm fan ( fans have washable/changable filters on them )
ASUS M3A32-MVP Deluxe with WiFi
AMD Black Edition 6400 X2 running @ 3.21 ghz currently reported by cpu-z 1.52 ( full Load running 37/38 degree C )( Stock OEM heatsink/fan )(checked with everest software)( using Artic Sliver 5 thermal compound )
ASUS HD 3870 512 meg DDR4 ( full Load running 40/42 degree C )
(4) Corsair 1 Gig DDR2 800 memory sticks 4-4-4-12
ASUS DVD-DL RW with Lightscribe SATA
ASUS DVD-ROM SATA
(2) hitachi 320 gig SATAII HD's, (1) hitachi 160 gig SATAII HD, (1) hitachi 120 gig SATAII HD
PC Power & Cooling 750watt Silencer PSU
Roswell 9 in 1 Card Reader with 1.44 Floppy Drive
Sound Blaster Fatality Extreme Gamer Professional Sound Card
-Note one of the 320 gig HD's ( my main one I am using most often is partitioned as a Dual Boot with 2 OS's as follows:
1st HD partition has Windows XP Professional SP3 32 bit
2nd HD Partition has Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit (Enterprise MSDN Technet Legal Copy)
thru all the recent patches and new AH versions, I only experienced 1 problem in Windows 7, for some reason which might have been my mistake to begin with, it picked up my onboard HD audio, my Video Card HD audio and my Sound Blaster Fatality Extreme Gamer Professional Sound Card and they were all enabled at the same time, which caused my mic not to work in game..I noticed though it did the same thing on the Windows XPpro partition as well....a quick disabling of the Video HD audio and the Onboard HD audio fixed my mic issue I was having.......
in windows XP pro I experienced a few warps/stutters in I think patch 6 and patch 7........have not experienced anything of the like in windows7 OS.....
outside of the arena wide disco's/game freeze alot of us had back during the last Scenario and one of the FSO's.........
as Ghosth's posted,, I agree that Vista may take more hardware to experience the same or close to same as xp, but I disagree that Win7 will require more.........my personal experience has showed me Windows 7 utilizes a persons PC setup/hardware far better than WinXP does........
I have tested/checked out and used WIndows 7 since around November/Dec of last year, and in my view Windows 7 has been near Rock Solid since they released the Windows 7 RC candidate back in May of this year.......
YMMV.......
-
If you want to overclock or use multimedia codecs to watch movies a 32-bit Win7 would be an excellent choice.
x64 has driver enforcement meaning ati tray tools etc. will not be able to run without disabling driver enforcement during every bootup. Also some codecs will fail in x64.
Unless you do some very special stuff that makes you need more than 2Gb of ram at once (meaning you need a 64-bit version of the program) then go x64. If you run AH and regular internet etc. go with 32-bit.
People have a common misconception that they 'lose' some of their ram without realizing they can't use it in the first place if their software is 32-bit.
-
Nonsense. Vista has driver enforcement and out of hundreds of programs I have ever installed I have never had one that did not have a digital signature.
-
Nonsense. Vista has driver enforcement and out of hundreds of programs I have ever installed I have never had one that did not have a digital signature.
Ati tray tools is one example. I know, I have Win7x64 and it gets disabled every bootup if I forget to disable driver enforcement. If you haven't used it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
99% of userbase have no real reason to use x64. It only brings incompatibilities that are unnecessary unless a specific need for a 64-bit enviroment exists.
My only motivation for using x64 is I'm running compatibility tests and do testing on large databases. For gaming use it's just shooting yourself in the leg.
There are some rare cases x64 is necessary such as having dual 1gig display cards. But again 2 gigs of videoram is 90% wasted in 99% of the applications today.
-
It only brings incompatibilities that are unnecessary unless a specific need for a 64-bit enviroment exists.
have not experienced none of these for nearly a year......
For gaming use it's just shooting yourself in the leg.
only game I play specifically is AH2, and have only experienced Greater Improvement of Game play, Game features, etc....... with Win 7 64bit verses WinXPpro 32 bit
My Autocad MEP 2009 works significantly better in Windows 7 64 bit, than it ever did in Windows XP pro 32bit..........and when I upgraded to the 64bit version of Autocad it only got even better results......
but everyone will have differing results, I am sure.........
Unless you do some very special stuff that makes you need more than 2Gb of ram at once (meaning you need a 64-bit version of the program) then go x64.
People have a common misconception that they 'lose' some of their ram without realizing they can't use it in the first place if their software is 32-bit.
completely agree with this as well........ except there is a work around on the MS tech boards that lets a person use significant amount of more ram in a 32 bit windows environment........but I would not post it here for the everyday internet surfing individual to try and manipulate ( read as totally mess up their system )....... they can go search for it on their own and take their own risk :D
-
Unless you do some very special stuff that makes you need more than 2Gb of ram at once (meaning you need a 64-bit version of the program) then go x64.
While it doesn't apply too much to a gaming environment, it's worth remembering that even if you only run 32 bit programs, more available RAM means that running more programs simultaneously can mean less swapping to disk and significant improvements in performance - even if each application can access no more memory than it could under a 32 bit OS. This wouldn't matter as much of course if Window's programs made efficient use of memory - but many do not.
IMO, of course - but 64 bit is the future.
<S>
-
It's worth remembering that most people never past 2Gb limit even when doing heavy multitasking and certainly never during gaming. Again, unless the game is some very exotic 64-bit version.
There's so much misinformation around about memory and OS versions. People are falling for urban legends about ram and 64-bit systems. While they may be 'nice' to have, they're not necessary for the vast majority. Add in the few incompatabilities that do still exist it's a safer option to go 32-bit.
Having said that I don't see major problems with selecting x64 Win7. Unless you plan to run ati tray tools or other driver based overclocking / tweaking tool. Or watch any exotic codec videos. Or plan to buy cheap ram that will fail in dual channel mode / 4G+.
x64 will _not_ affect your gameplay in AH2 in any perceivable way if you count out 30% reduction in framerates. x64 will do nothing to AH2 that 32-bit Win7 won't do.
-
only game I play specifically is AH2, and have only experienced Greater Improvement of Game play, Game features, etc....... with Win 7 64bit verses WinXPpro 32 bit
My Autocad MEP 2009 works significantly better in Windows 7 64 bit, than it ever did in Windows XP pro 32bit..........and when I upgraded to the 64bit version of Autocad it only got even better results......
What you've experienced is the memory management improvements inherent to windows 7, not x64. Gameplay or game features are the same in AH2 regardless if you play it on Win98 or Win7 x64.
-
It's worth remembering that most people never past 2Gb limit even when doing heavy multitasking and certainly never during gaming. Again, unless the game is some very exotic 64-bit version.
There's so much misinformation around about memory and OS versions. People are falling for urban legends about ram and 64-bit systems. While they may be 'nice' to have, they're not necessary for the vast majority. Add in the few incompatabilities that do still exist it's a safer option to go 32-bit.
I don't think it's urban legend so much as it is that we're approaching a crossroads where at times, it does make a huge difference - and sometimes not always where you'd expect (i.e. photoshop and video manipulation processes). A current version of the Bloomberg terminal (for example) can utilize as much as 450 MB of available RAM under XP 32 Bit. Outlook can use another 150 MB, and Excel is pretty much open ended depending upon the spreadsheets you load. And in the just totally ridiculous department, I've seen Chrome chew through another 500 MB of RAM with 6 to 8 tabs open on user's systems, depending upon the sites browsed to - and it's just a stinking browser, for goodness sake.
If we're speaking generalities, then I'd agree that changing a working XP installation from 32 to 64 bit "just because" isn't likely to be a good deal when evaluated on the effort/reward frontier. But if you are building out a new system, and planning to do Win 7 - then I personally think that there's never been a better time to adopt a 64 bit OS.
To specifically answer Whels, I'd sit tight until after Win 7 is released, and if I was to make a change at all, I'd go Win 7 64 bit. I'd not even consider XP 64 at this point. And Vista? Vista anything right now is like counting to 5 with the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch - it's "Right Out".
The reality though is that unless you have a lot to gain from a 64-bit OS I'm in the leave it alone camp (or has been suggested, add another partition if necessary and dual boot) until and unless you have a problem that requires an OS reinstall. (And even 600 to 700 MB of RAM is not "a lot to gain" unless you find yourself regularly using up all that's in the machine, which as MrRiplEy is pointing out, is generally not the case for most home users).
By the time you "need it", the world will be in an even better place for letting you use it hassle-free.
<S>
-
I went from XP Pro 32 bit to Vista Ultimate 64 bit and I'm not looking back in regret. I have a PC that can handle it. FR's are still pegged at 60Mhz due to the DVI connection of my LCD.
-
I don't think it's urban legend so much as it is that we're approaching a crossroads where at times, it does make a huge difference - and sometimes not always where you'd expect (i.e. photoshop and video manipulation processes). A current version of the Bloomberg terminal (for example) can utilize as much as 450 MB of available RAM under XP 32 Bit. Outlook can use another 150 MB, and Excel is pretty much open ended depending upon the spreadsheets you load. And in the just totally ridiculous department, I've seen Chrome chew through another 500 MB of RAM with 6 to 8 tabs open on user's systems, depending upon the sites browsed to - and it's just a stinking browser, for goodness sake.
If we're speaking generalities, then I'd agree that changing a working XP installation from 32 to 64 bit "just because" isn't likely to be a good deal when evaluated on the effort/reward frontier. But if you are building out a new system, and planning to do Win 7 - then I personally think that there's never been a better time to adopt a 64 bit OS.
To specifically answer Whels, I'd sit tight until after Win 7 is released, and if I was to make a change at all, I'd go Win 7 64 bit. I'd not even consider XP 64 at this point. And Vista? Vista anything right now is like counting to 5 with the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch - it's "Right Out".
The reality though is that unless you have a lot to gain from a 64-bit OS I'm in the leave it alone camp (or has been suggested, add another partition if necessary and dual boot) until and unless you have a problem that requires an OS reinstall. (And even 600 to 700 MB of RAM is not "a lot to gain" unless you find yourself regularly using up all that's in the machine, which as MrRiplEy is pointing out, is generally not the case for most home users).
By the time you "need it", the world will be in an even better place for letting you use it hassle-free.
<S>
XP=700Mb max, Bloomberg 450Mb, Outlook 150Mb, AV 40Mb, Excel 200Mb (high estimate), browser with huge amount of tabs open 500Mb. Left from available 3.2Gb at this time: 1160Mb which is more than any mainstream game will demand. So you can have all that junk open and still play AH2 or COD4,5, Crysis ..?
The x64 hype is just that, hype.
-
Is AW still limited to 2 gigs of memory or did that change with the update?
-
AH (I presume you mean) is a 32 bit Windows application. As such, it's limited to 2 GB of non-shared RAM, in addition to the 2 GB of Kernel "RAM" (or more technically, addressable space) that's shared by all 32 bit apps.
<S>
-
What you've experienced is the memory management improvements inherent to windows 7, not x64. Gameplay or game features are the same in AH2 regardless if you play it on Win98 or Win7 x64.
Well, Autocad mep (and other autodesk products too) is a native 64 bit software and works better in 64 bit environments.
-
So in other words what you guys are saying:
-is that more than 2 of ram is not need, but if its only a few bucks for 4 go for it.
-If windows xp or whatever works well with AH then no need to get windows 7 for now, unless ur trying to dump vista for some specific reason and not just because its "the new thing that just came out"
-No need to switch to 64 bit because most games only use 32 bit and its not really an improvement
am I correct in these assumptions? or am I just as confused as when I started reading the thread.
semp
-
Exactly - or very nearly close enough. With the addition of one more point, which is:
Going to 64 bit also increases the likelihood that you will experience more difficulties with drivers as one of the trade-offs.
<S>
-
Exactly - or very nearly close enough. With the addition of one more point, which is:
Going to 64 bit also increases the likelihood that you will experience more difficulties with drivers as one of the trade-offs.
<S>
Not so much any more.
-
Well, Autocad mep (and other autodesk products too) is a native 64 bit software and works better in 64 bit environments.
Like I said only very rare programs that are 64-bit will benefit from x64. There are even a couple games that are coded 64-bit. But only a couple. They're lame attempts in selling x64 with completely artificial 'enhancements' in x64 mode. A bit like Crysis and DX10, all those fancy effects could be enabled in Dx9 and worked faster :)
People are victims of misinformation and marketing.
If for example have never used Autocad mep and I'm fairly confident I never will. Nor do I have a single 64-bit game. On linux side I do have 64-bit software, mainly database where the benefits are obvious. For gamers / regular users 32-bit is going to be the optimal solution for many years to come.
-
IMHO, I use xp64 for my gaming computer and I'll stick with that until either I reinstall (for being too slow and making winblows happy) or I get some sort of Windows 7 legal CD and key.