Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Gorf on August 04, 2000, 04:05:00 PM
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Quick question, I keep hearing comments in books and stories abot a Fw 200. I have checked threw my little library and find nothing on it? Any ideas ... anybody?
Gorf
!@^@!
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4-engined bomber used mainly in anti-shipping role, not all that great. It's called the Condor, look it up here: http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/condor.html (http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/condor.html)
ra
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THANKS!
Gorf
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Originally posted by ra:
4-engined bomber used mainly in anti-shipping role, not all that great
as an antiship plane,hell,yes, it was THAT great...
Thank god Goering didnt like to cooperate with Kriegsmarine on Atlantic operations (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by RAM:
as an antiship plane,hell,yes, it was THAT great...
Thank god Goering didnt like to cooperate with Kriegsmarine on Atlantic operations (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I hear it "lit up" like a Betty (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
- Jig
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It had a reputation for a weak spine- it would break apart in the middle quite easily. Once the Royal Navy started deploying carrier and catapault aircraft in the region the Fw200 had a much more difficult time of it. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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FW-200 was an passenger-plane first with U.S- built engines (Wasps ?).
After conversated <sp> to wartime use its weight raised so much that in landings its wings didn't last if landing was a little bumpy.
I'll try to find few pics, I know I got em somewhere (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Finnair's predecessor Aero ordered couple FW-200's to Helsinki's olympia games -40 but Luftwaffe took them (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
edit: FW-200 has also another fuel problem: Some of them exploded "without reason". They thought that there could be some fuel leaks near landingears and if pilot used brakes too much when rolling over heated brakes could be a reason for some explosions.
When Hitler came to Finland to visit Mannerheim's birthday he came with his own "Condor" (Story tells that our pilots allmost shooted him down. Too secret trip you know... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)).
When Hitler's plane landed (I don't remember to which field)its brakes started to smoke and first thing after it stopped a Finnish engineer runned next to landing gears with fire-extinguisher. Also Japan used them as a sea-patrouilling.
Staga
[This message has been edited by Staga (edited 08-04-2000).]
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I heard about its structural weakness too, but not about the fire problems...
Anyway what it did it a great plane for 1940-43 was that from france it could reach any point of the north atlantic, so it was able to do a big and invaluable work for the wolfpack tactics, searching and shadowing convoys, and even doing antiship runs...
But the lack of cooperation between the armed branches (in fact they mutual hating) prevented this plane to be used at its full potential.
And yes, once Carriers were added to convoys, Fw200's effective career was over (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
but it was a very respected threat to the allies (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
It was a very liked plane in Germany, many high officers trusted it as they own transport planes...even Hitler had its own private Fw200 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 08-04-2000).]
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Originally posted by RAM:
I heard about its structural weakness too, but not about the fire problems...
Anyway what it did it a great plane for 1940-43 was that from france it could reach any point of the north atlantic, so it was able to do a big and invaluable work for the wolfpack tactics, searching and shadowing convoys, and even doing antiship runs...
But the lack of cooperation between the armed branches (in fact they mutual hating) prevented this plane to be used at its full potential.
And yes, once Carriers were added to convoys, Fw200's effective career was over (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
but it was a very respected threat to the allies (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
It was a very liked plane in Germany, many high officers trusted it as they own transport planes...even Hitler had its own private Fw200 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 08-04-2000).]
If I'm not mistaken, the Fw-200 set a world time record by flying to Tokyo from Berlin in peace time in like 40 hours.
The thing about the fires was the engine fuel connections were exposed under the wings, and just a hit or two could set them off. It was even more vulnerable to ground fire.
I'd still like one...be nice to have a German heavy bomber. Fw 200 C-8/U10 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I hear the Fw 200 got into "galleon" dog fights with Sunderlands with frequency during the anti-shipping strikes.
- Jig
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Not a FW but look at this beauty (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Me-264 Amerika bomber (http://visi.net/~djohnson/prototyp/me264.html)
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(http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/lrg0760.jpg)
Type: Maritime reconaissance bomber, missle platform, and transport
Origin: Focke Wulf Flugzeugbau GmbH, in partnership with Hamburger Flugzeugbau (Blohm und Voss)
Engine:
Type: BMW-Bramo Fafnir 323R-2 nine-cylinder radial
Number: Four
Horsepower:
1,200hp at 2,600rpm with Methanol-water injection for take-off and emergency
1,000hp at 2,500rpm at sea level
950hp at 2,500rpm at 13,124ft (4,000m)
Fuel:
Standard Fuel Capacity: 1,773 Imperial Gallons (8,060 Liters)
Overload Fuel Capacity: 2,190 Imperial Gallons (9,955 Liters)
Type: N/A
Dimensions:
Wing span 32.84m
Length 23.46m
Height: 6.3m
Wing Surface Area: 1,270.14 Sq. Ft.
Weights:
Empty: 12,951kg (28,550 lbs.)
Loaded: 22,700kg (50,045 lbs.)
Performance: Fw 200 C-3/U4
Maximum Speed:
190mph (306kph) at sea level
224mph (360kph) at 15,750ft (4,800m)
Maximum Continuous cruise:
172mph (277kph) at sea level
208mph (355kph) at 13,125ft (4,000m)
Economy cruise:
158mph (255kph)
Range at Economy Cruise:
2,210 mls (3,556 km) With Standard Fuel
2,760 mls (4,440 km) With Overload Fuel
Service Ceiling: 19,030ft (5800m)
Armament:
Forward Dorsal Turret:
One 15mm MG 151/15, One 20mm MG 151/20 Or One 7.92mm MG 15 with 1,000 rnds mounted in hydralically operated FW 19 turret
Ventral Gondola:
One 20mm MG 151/20 with 500 rnds. manually aimed at front
One 7.92mm MG 15 with 1,000 rnds. manually aimed at rear
Beam:
Two 7.92mm MG 15 Or Two 13mm MG 131 with 300 rnds.
Aft Dorsal Position:
One 13mm MG 131 with 500 rnds.
Bomb Load:
4,626 lbs. (2100kg) carried in ventral gondola and beneath wings
Missle Load: (C-6 to C-8 models)
Two Hs 293 Anit-Ship Missles under outboard nacells
Avionics:
Fw 200 C-8: Fug 200 Hohentwiel Search And Bombing Radar
Total Production: 276
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If you can find a version with any defensive fire capability I would be all for it.
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<<<as an antiship plane,hell,yes, it was THAT great...>>>
Ram, it was THAT great until people started shooting back at it, at which point it was useless. Same as the Ju-87, but not as historically important.
172 mph max cruise? It could escort C-47s maybe.
ra
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Originally posted by Kieren:
If you can find a version with any defensive fire capability I would be all for it.
The Fw 200C-8/U10 carried four 13mm MG 131 in the dorsal and beam positions, and a 13mm MG 131 or 20mm MG 151 in the ventral gondola.
It is rather slow and ungainly, 220 mph with a 19k ceiling.
The Hs 293 ATG missles sure would be a neat thing (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
It's anti-shipping radar might prove useful once we get ships.
- Jig
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How about new paratrooper plane, Fw 200 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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I say we instead of getting the Fw-200C when time comes should get the Ju-290A:
(http://home14.inet.tele.dk/snefens/Ju290.jpg)
Junkers Ju 290A-7 of studmuffinr 5, Mont de Marsan, France, 1944.
Although it resembles the Fw200 much with its dolphin-like nose and 4 engines it is not a development from it. Apparent visual differences are the twin tail fins and the smaller belly bulge.
The specifications for the reconnaisance bomber version (A-7):
Type: Long-range maritime reconaissance bomber
Powerplant Four 1,700-hp BMW 801D 14-cylinder radial piston engines.
Dimensions:
Wing span: 42.00m (137ft 9.5in)
Length: 29.15m (95ft 7.75in)
Height: 6.83m (22ft 4.75in)
Wing Surface Area: 203.60 Sq.m. (2,191.60 Sq. Ft.)
Weights:
Empty: 33,005kg (72,764 lbs.)
Max Loaded: 46,000kg (101,413 lbs.)
Performance:
Maximum Speed: 440 kph (273 mph) at 5800 m (19,030ft)
Cruising Speed: 355 kph (220 mph)
Range: 6,090 km (3,784 miles)
Service Ceiling: 6000m (19,685 ft)
Armament:
Forward Dorsal Turret: One 20mm MG 151/20.
Rear Dorsal Turret: One 20mm MG 151/20.
Ventral Gondola, forward: One 20mm MG 151/20.
Ventral Gondola, rear: One 13mm MG 131.
Nose/cockpit: One 13mm MG 131.
Lateral positions: Both one 20mm MG 151/20.
Tail: one 20mm MG 151/20.
Load: 3000 kg (6,614 lb) or three Henschel 293, 294 or FX-1400 Fritz-X missiles
Avionics: Fug 200 Hohentwiel Search Radar and FuG 203b Kehl missile equipment.
Production:
1 prototype
2 Ju 290A-0
5 Ju 290A-1 (Transport. Two were used at Stalingrad)
3 Ju 290A-2 (reconnaisance bomber)
3 Ju 290A-3 (A2 with new engines, BMW801)
5 Ju 290A-4 (revised gun turrets)
29 Ju 290A-5 (Increased armor protection, improved defensive armament)
1 Ju 290A-6 (50 Seat transport intended for Hitler)
12 Ju 290A-7 (missile capability added)
2 Ju 290A-8 (A7 with minor changes)
3 Ju 290A-9 (long range reconnaisance with added fuel)
1 Ju 290B (High alt version)
Total: 67
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"Head-ons are for pilots that don't know what their next move should be"
Ltn. Snefens
RO, Lentolaivue 34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34)
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Gentlemen, he must be pretty busy right now or he'd have already cleared this issue up for you but I'm sure Nath-BDP will soon drop in and explain things.
For now, rest assured that he will be able to show you that this aircraft was one of the finest examples of design, engineering, manufacture ever to grace the skies of the globe. No other country or manufacturer ever came close to the excellence inherent in this 4-engined beauty.
It is, after all, a German product!
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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As odd as this sounds, I think I like the idea of a Ju 290 more than an He 177. Somehow, with all that firepower bristling from every orifice I think the Ju would be more likely to get to target. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Well kieren...maybe,but a 60-production run aircraft would hear a lot of cries here about it being modelled.
And He177's speed doesnt hurt, either (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Ram,
Remember that we are getting Ostwind, with lesser numbers (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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You're right, Ram. Still, you have a plane about the same size and speed as a B-17 (with more firepower), the ceiling of the Lancaster, and the load of a B-26.
And I wouldn't cry about the low production run. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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The Condor comes in a close second to the "Connie" in the looks category. Imo the "Connie" is THE aircraft with the most graceful design and style ever made. A veritable Duesenburg of the air (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I'ld LOVE to see the Condor added. The Connie too, someday. A little side note: the Connie was a spinoff of the XB-30 design which was to be a competitor for the B-29 bomber. Here's an 8th AAF C-69 Constellations:
(http://www.usaaf.com/aircraft/classes/images/c69.jpg)
-Westy
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Did this Ju 290 actually ever see combat? If so, do you know where and how it fared? My hat is off to you I thought I'd heard of every single plane ever built in WW II. This one is a new one on me and it's a bastard of an airplane!
Maybe it had a small produciton run but consider this. In the main arena, unlike actual history, there is no built in assumption that the axis forces are on the ropes and are essentially conducting only defensive operations. In the bishop, rook and knight countries, both offensive and defensive opps take place. Therefore it would be nice to model a few axis built heavy bombers (though I'm no fan of the he 177, it probably should be put in eventually) and this one is really formidable. I would reccomend modeling it, along with some of the italian heavy bombers for earlier war heavy strikes, such as the Cant Z.1007 Alcione (3 engine heavy bomber) The Sm. 79 (three engine medium bomber / torpedo bomber) and especially the Piaggio P.108 (4 engine heavy bomber - 8 12.7mm mg's, 7,716 lb bomb load or 3 (!!) torpedoes)
DB
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http://uboat.net/technical/ju290.htm (http://uboat.net/technical/ju290.htm) http://canopus.lpi.msk.su/~watson/ju290.html (http://canopus.lpi.msk.su/~watson/ju290.html)
Here's some links. Especially the first seem quite good. I found out the pic I showed was not an A-7, but an A-5. A-7 looks like this.
(http://www.cnd.net/~kais/ac/support/ju290a-7.jpg)
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"Head-ons are for pilots that don't know what their next move should be"
Ltn. Snefens
RO, Lentolaivue 34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34)
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I know it was used quite alot the last 6 mos of the war anyway by the LW "special missions" group KG-200. It's range and load were suited perfect for thier clandestine and resupply missions. The Ju-290 would make an awesome and valid addition to AH.
-Westy