Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Majors on October 25, 2009, 10:56:17 AM
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Hi Mates
Don't complain very often, but feel I need to this time. I basically fly low level fighter bomber, or bomber in AH.
Having grown up during WWII, and served a number of years in the miliary, I am familiar with how radar worked back then.
Radar could not "see" approaching aircraft flying in at below 100 ft. In AH, coming into a target at 50 ft over water, the radar lights up at about 10 miles or so. This gives the enemy time to get airborne and make an intercept.
Low level should be a surprise attack, not the same as coming in at 10,000 ft.
Perhaps there may be some way to program low level attacks under the radar. This would certainly make life a little more pleasant for us poor old low level bomber drivers.
Any hope of this happening?
Cheers to all
Majors
249 RAF
Oldest Yank in the RAF
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They give you the benefit of the doubt by letting you fly under radar and not having your dot show up...this makes the enemy have no clue where you are coming from. There are some things that just have to be done to balance the game.
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For the main arena I'm in favor of dot radar down to the deck across the whole map, without the ability to destroy it. No hiding. How's that? :P
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Majors...just consider the MA's as being the noob sandboxes where pretty much anything realistic is taboo. I know you've been here a while...so you should be used to the settings by now. Considering your purported credentials have you made any "more realistic" recommendations to the staff that run FSO or scenarios?
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In AH, coming into a target at 50 ft over water, the radar lights up at about 10 miles or so. This gives the enemy time to get airborne and make an intercept.
Low level should be a surprise attack, not the same as coming in at 10,000 ft.
Perhaps there may be some way to program low level attacks under the radar. This would certainly make life a little more pleasant for us poor old low level bomber drivers.
The radar in AH doesn't sense you if you are under 500ft AGL. Neither dot dar, nor sector darbar will be triggered in any way if you are below that.
The only thing that will be triggered is the base alarm, which has nothing to do with radar. It even works when all country radar is down It's representing the countless observers on the ground, alarming the base. Even GV will trigger that if getting close enough.
And yes, if you come in on a base in an NOE raid it already IS a surprise raid. Do you actually want to remove the base alarm for such a raid too? If yes, did you think about the massive gameplay consequences? NOE raids are already very hard to defend against, when you get no alarm at all it's about impossible.
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The radar in AH doesn't sense you if you are under 500ft AGL.
Isn't it 200 AGL?
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Isn't it 200 AGL?
Thats what they say, i think its 500 but people say its 200 to make sure noone pops up.
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Isn't it 200 AGL?
Always has been 500ft, both for dar bar & dot dar.
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Majors...just consider the MA's as being the noob sandboxes where pretty much anything realistic is taboo.
The point of unrealistic radar is to blunt the unrealistic weapon of capturing territory with a few NOE aircraft. If we want realistic in the main arena, no more capturing undefended bases. QED.
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I think the base flashing is just a game concession but if it makes you feel better about it just consider all the fish boats and farmers you passed over and consider they gave the alarm. :D
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consider all the fish boats and farmers you passed over and consider they gave the alarm. :D
That's exactly what it was originally intended to mimic.
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flying at 501 feet the whole way to the target is so fun, they start getting pissed and then the yell at everyone to get down. :cheers:
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Remove radar aspect completely from the MA's, making all dots visible inside/outside/high/medium/low alt--everywhere, and one may as well make the "capturing territory" speel in HTC's parameter book disappear.
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Remove radar aspect completely from the MA's, making all dots visible inside/outside/high/medium/low alt--everywhere, and one may as well make the "capturing territory" speel in HTC's parameter book disappear.
And?
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Hi Mates
Many thanks for the responses.
Isn't the purpose of an NOE raid total surprise? How can you have that when the base starts flashing while you are still 10 miles out.
In WWII, the low level, surprise raid was the one that did the most damage. In and out before they could respond.
The acks in AH seem, at times, to be radar controlled. Never happened.
Also, if I didn't see any fishing boats on the way in, then the alarm shouldn't go off.
Whatever, I am not trying to start up any arguments with anyone.
Just think it would be very much more realistic if you could sneak in with an NOE raid and bust up a base.
See you all in the air (not on my 6 please)
Cheers
Majors
240 RAF
Oldest Yank in the RAF
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Majors,
Your ideas are good. But for sake of gameplay in the world of AH2, its important to have some element of balance. Your suggestion would be great for Special Events, Scenarios, and FSO. Those are where the realism is greatly accounted for. Say something to Daddog, or another FSO commander. I hope this helps! :salute
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if you could sneak in with an NOE raid and bust up a base.
I think you can do this just fine now. By the time the base starts flashing, it's extremely difficult to bust up a well organized NOE raid.
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Isn't the purpose of an NOE raid total surprise? How can you have that when the base starts flashing while you are still 10 miles out.
In WWII, the low level, surprise raid was the one that did the most damage. In and out before they could respond.
It still is a surprise, which is very difficult to response to - 20 players coming in that way are almost impossible to stop from getting that base.
But you really have to take into account how gameplay is being changed if you replace almost with completely.
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Visual and aural detecting was very important and highly developed in WW2. I don't think it's unreasonable at all for a base to be warned at the 10 mile range (actually, I believe it's 12 miles). I could even argue for dar bar to extend to the ground anytime you're over enemy territory to simulate reporting by ground troops, friendly civilians, etc.
I will also offer the personal opinion that rarely is a very large defense mounted in the short time available, anyway. If you have 3 or 4 dedicated fighters in your attack, they can usually deal with anything that gets up before it disrupts your attack if your attack plan is well coordinated and executed.
Regards,
Hammer
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I would say that the current Dar system works for fine for our cartoon war.
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Hi Mates
Many thanks for the responses.
Isn't the purpose of an NOE raid total surprise? How can you have that when the base starts flashing while you are still 10 miles out.
In WWII, the low level, surprise raid was the one that did the most damage. In and out before they could respond.
The acks in AH seem, at times, to be radar controlled. Never happened.
Also, if I didn't see any fishing boats on the way in, then the alarm shouldn't go off.
Whatever, I am not trying to start up any arguments with anyone.
Just think it would be very much more realistic if you could sneak in with an NOE raid and bust up a base.
See you all in the air (not on my 6 please)
Cheers
Majors
240 RAF
Oldest Yank in the RAF
How did that ploesti <SP> noe go?
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One other thing to add to all the other responses...
Don't just fly straight from your base to the base you want to bomb. Take the time to navigate a little and come from a direction they wouldn't expect. Not saying you do, but too many people are too lazy or impatient, so just fly straight to a base. Even if NOE, once the base starts flashing it's generally pretty easy to figure out where to look.
And yes, the base should still flash to alert people of the attack so they can up to try to intercept. This is a multi-player game and everyone who signs up does so with the expectation of engaging in fights with other people. The fact that some don't seem to want a fight is another matter - perhaps they should stick to offline missions.
This game is not a recreation of WWII, and should not (and seeming HTC agrees) take realism so far as to make it unappealing for the masses who pay money because they want to have fun fighting with WWII-era equipment.
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In the absence of radar, AVG Flying Tigers in China relied on a ring of observers to phone in when any inbound enemy aircraft was spotted. Worked well. And it's an interesting fact that enemy raids during the Battle of Britain usually required visual confirmation by the Observer Corps before the fighters were ordered to scramble; radar was good but not infallible. So, fair enough, keep the flashing base warning.
Good to see you're still in-'n'-kicking, Majors. I remember you were the man in the Ju52 we relied on to drop the drunks and capture the field back in the dark ol' dial-up days of WB. You were the Oldest Yank in the RAF then too.
:salute
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Hi Mates
Ploesti? Ahh yes, I remember reading about it in the paper way back then. That was our first try.
Better to ask how the surprise raids on Japanese held islands went in the Pacific? Low level surprise, with delayed fuses on the bombs!!! Can you imagine the havoc an old geezer like me down low in my A20 could wreak??? How about 10 of us???
Yes, the old Ju-52 ace in WB. Shot down three Me-262's in my old Iron Annie back then. And, I believe I was the oldest Yank in the RAF back then as well.
Keep the blue side up mates.
Cheeries
Majors