Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: mtnman on December 18, 2009, 01:20:52 PM
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I was wondering how people who have been using an X52 for awhile have their stick mapped? I'm going to have to relearn a new stick anyway, so curious about other folks' ideas.
This is how I map mine. I'm not sure how bomber/gv friendly it is, I just fly fighters primarily...
The text is small, if I have time later I'll re-do it.
(http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m309/Mtnman_03/SaitekX52StickBlank.jpg)
(http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m309/Mtnman_03/SaitekX52ThrottleBlank.jpg)
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Thanks Mtnman
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Thanks, I was going to be asking shortly how everyone has the X52 mapped. This is great! :cheers:
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The key things that I think help me out the most with the way things are mapped are- using the pinky-shift for look up, and especially using the HAT switch on the throttle for flaps and sliding my head left/right.
That makes a huge difference in my ability to quickly/easily keep close tabs on my six.
Using the pinky switch rules out using the SST software though.
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I read in the other thread someone is using the throttle forward detent for WEP and the back detent for engine off... Does that have to be set up using the Saitek software, I assume?
I haven't yet had a chance to experiment with the new stick, so I'm not sure what I'm getting into as far as getting things programmed... I really like the idea of the forward throttle detent for WEP though... I would love to save that button for other uses.
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I haven't played with the throttle mapping for WEP and engine off, so I don't know about that.
I initially used the SST Software, and once I figured out how to do it I found it pretty easy. I prefer not to use it though, so I haven't used it in the last few years.
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this is how i set mine up. i dont use the sst software.
i have the pro but i did have the normal x-52 which was mapped slightly diffrent due to the pro not being able to map the scroll wheal at the back of the throttle.i used that for flaps and the button on it for combat trim on/off
STICK
trig 1 : fire primary
trig 2 : fire global
a : squad vox
b : local vox
c : change weapons
fire : secondary weapons
pinkie : view up (used with hat gives all views u need)
lower hat : flat views ( hat up = forward - up)
upper hat : up - flaps up down - flaps down -left head down - right head up
t1 : gear up/down
t2 : map
t3 : damage list
t4 : auto hold attitude
t5 : auto level
t6 : auto climb
THROTTLE
slider : zoom in/out
small rotary : rpm
large rotary : ele trim ( needed for mossie furballing if u loose control)
I : toggle zoom
d : wep
e : auto/manual trim
rear hat : head position move flat plane
i have rudder pedals so i dont use the twisty stick. does any1 who has pedals use the twisty stick and if so for what?
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Do you have any suggestions for where to map 'Select engine 1', 'Select engine 2' and 'Select all engines'? I currently have them on the throttle hat switch, but I think I'll change those to what you use (yes, I do love my two-engined planes and hammerheads ;)).
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I read in the other thread someone is using the throttle forward detent for WEP and the back detent for engine off... Does that have to be set up using the Saitek software, I assume?
I haven't yet had a chance to experiment with the new stick, so I'm not sure what I'm getting into as far as getting things programmed... I really like the idea of the forward throttle detent for WEP though... I would love to save that button for other uses.
Yes, you can do that through the SST software. I'll put in every step just in case someone isn't that familiar with mapping things.
Launch the SST profile editor, load up the profile you use and then scroll down to "Throttle" and set it as "Bands". Now select "Edit Bands" and add three band dividers by clicking on the white window. You'll now have four separate bands but don't worry about their exact position yet. Starting at the top band, map it as "P" (for WEP), leave the second band unmapped, map the third is "E" (for engine start/stop) and then leave the bottom band unmapped. Now slide the upper divider up to 10%, the second divider down to 90% and the third divider to 91%. Now save the profile, load it, and start AH.
Pull up the clipboard and go to options/controls/map controllers. Select your Z axis and make sure it's mapped to "Analog Inputs Throttle 1." Now select Advanced and move your throttle so that it's somewhere between the upper and lower detent. Select "Calibrate Axis" and calibrate your throttle but ONLY move it between the upper and lower detents, don't go all the way forward or back, move just till you first feel the detent resistance. What you're doing is telling AH to give you 100% of your throttle movements between the detents. Now accept the calibration, pick a plane and start up.
You should have normal throttle control from idle to full power as you move the throttle between the detents. Once you push past the upper detent (forward) you should get WEP. When you pull the throttle back through the detent and bring engine power down WEP will be automatically deselected. When you move the throttle down past the second detent you'll be momentarally hitting the "E" button to shut the engine down and then when you move it forward you'll hit the "E" button again which starts the engine up.
Depending on your throttle you may have to play with the position of the bands in SST and the throttle calibration a bit to get things working smoothly and reliably. You want to make sure you're getting full power just below the upper detent as WEP will not work if the throttle calibration doesn't give you full power before selecting WEP. If this is a problem then recalibrate or move the upper band up a little bit. You do the same with the third band and move it down some if you keep accidentally shutting the engine down inadvertently.
It takes a little while getting used to this set up and it doesn't work well if your detents are worn and weak as you may not feel them in the excitement of a fight. I've used this with the X52 and X52Pro and like it a lot but I had to disable it when my detent broke on the Pro. That's the biggest drawback to the X52. Saitek doesn't make them to last forever but it's a good system for the price.
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Yes, you can do that through the SST software. I'll put in every step just in case someone isn't that familiar with mapping things.
Launch the SST profile editor, load up the profile you use and then scroll down to "Throttle" and set it as "Bands". Now select "Edit Bands" and add three band dividers by clicking on the white window. You'll now have four separate bands but don't worry about their exact position yet. Starting at the top band, map it as "P" (for WEP), leave the second band unmapped, map the third is "E" (for engine start/stop) and then leave the bottom band unmapped. Now slide the upper divider up to 10%, the second divider down to 90% and the third divider to 91%. Now save the profile, load it, and start AH.
Pull up the clipboard and go to options/controls/map controllers. Select your Z axis and make sure it's mapped to "Analog Inputs Throttle 1." Now select Advanced and move your throttle so that it's somewhere between the upper and lower detent. Select "Calibrate Axis" and calibrate your throttle but ONLY move it between the upper and lower detents, don't go all the way forward or back, move just till you first feel the detent resistance. What you're doing is telling AH to give you 100% of your throttle movements between the detents. Now accept the calibration, pick a plane and start up.
You should have normal throttle control from idle to full power as you move the throttle between the detents. Once you push past the upper detent (forward) you should get WEP. When you pull the throttle back through the detent and bring engine power down WEP will be automatically deselected. When you move the throttle down past the second detent you'll be momentarally hitting the "E" button to shut the engine down and then when you move it forward you'll hit the "E" button again which starts the engine up.
Depending on your throttle you may have to play with the position of the bands in SST and the throttle calibration a bit to get things working smoothly and reliably. You want to make sure you're getting full power just below the upper detent as WEP will not work if the throttle calibration doesn't give you full power before selecting WEP. If this is a problem then recalibrate or move the upper band up a little bit. You do the same with the third band and move it down some if you keep accidentally shutting the engine down inadvertently.
It takes a little while getting used to this set up and it doesn't work well if your detents are worn and weak as you may not feel them in the excitement of a fight. I've used this with the X52 and X52Pro and like it a lot but I had to disable it when my detent broke on the Pro. That's the biggest drawback to the X52. Saitek doesn't make them to last forever but it's a good system for the price.
Fantastic Mace, thanks for taking the time to write that up for me. Really appreciated!
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I posted my SST profile so you can try it, although you'll need to do the ah calibration and probably adjust the bands as mace described:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,280177.msg3533016.html#msg3533016 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,280177.msg3533016.html#msg3533016)
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I leave button 7 unprogrammed for use with Ventrilo. 27, 28, 29 are the mode switches so i leave 28 empty as a rest position. Its neat to be able to leave the switches on whilst calibrating the bomb site. It allows you to do other stuff while its calibrating. This with no saitek software running...................... ......
(http://www.btinternet.com/~fulltilt/AH/x52.jpg)
(http://www.btinternet.com/~fulltilt/AH/x52pro.jpg)
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only difference between yours and mine mtnman is the "I" and "E" button on throttle is for flaps and the 2 Rotary and slider are for trim of elevators, rudder, and aileron. I fly the F4u most of the time and wanted easy access to trim and flaps.
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THROTTLE
slider : zoom in/out
small rotary : rpm
large rotary : ele trim ( needed for mossie furballing if u loose control)
I : toggle zoom
d : wep
e : auto/manual trim
rear hat : head position move flat plane
What is the RPM? I know what RPM is, but not sure what you are controlling in the game.
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being able to control the rpm and manifold pressure (throttle) i can set the engine fuel performance IE: if im low on fuel i can set the engine to max endurance instead of full power.
hope this is what u were asking
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What is the RPM? I know what RPM is, but not sure what you are controlling in the game.
You're changing how many rotations per minute your prop makes. If you look at your control panel, and see the RPM, you'll notice that it stays the same whether you are at full throttle or at idle. What you don't see is that although the prop is still spinning the same speed, the angle of deflection for the prop is different. It isn't taking as big of a "bite" out of the air, and/or producing as much thrust at a lower throttle-setting as it is when the throttle is maxed...
max throttle and max RPM is where you want to be while fighting (it's where you'll get the best speed and acceleration), but you're burning lots of fuel at that setting. Once you're level and "up to speed", you're not really gaining that much speed, and don't really need much acceleration, so for traveling back and forth between fights you may want to reduce throttle and RPM to get better mileage. Reducing throttle helps, but not as much as reducing both. I generally only reduce my settings while RTB low on fuel.
To see the "best" settings, just open your clipboard and click on E6B. Looking down, you'll see the max cruise, max power, etc, settings. You just adjust your RPM and throttle to those settings...
Another way to use RPM is to reduce RPM to a minimum on a multi-engined plane if one engine stops (damaged). A propeller spinning fast creates more drag than one spinning slow. Er, rather, the drag is what makes the prop spin faster... Taking this a step further, say you find yourself in a fighter, RTB, and your engine quits (but the prop is still spinning). Reducing the RPM to its minimum setting will allow you to glide quite a bit further...
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Mtnman I could never get my rotary wheels to work :cry with or without the SST,
hope ya dont mind I stole your pics and revamped to reflect my set-up :D
(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w246/fieldsofink/SaitekX52StickBlank.jpg)
(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w246/fieldsofink/SaitekX52ThrottleBlank.jpg)
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To get the rotary keys to work you have to set them to a "band". In SST with your current profile opened find the rotary key and right click. Pick "banding". Use your mouse to click on the edges of the band to drag it up or down making smaller or larger. A band can be set to very narrow (0-10%) or wide (0-45%). A three band set up would be band 1 0-25%, band 2 26-74% and band 3 75% - 100%. You can make as many bands as you want. Each band corresponds with a key or control input.
After you have say 3 bands then double click and enter the key for what you want to do. Leave the center band set to nothing. You use the center one as a dead band. Now if you roll the wheel one way it will trigger that key.
Elevator trim uses "K" and "I" so you could set one band to K and the other to I. You could also set the middle band to combat trim on. This way if you roll the whell to K and then want to reset you roll the wheel to the mid point. I set the middle band to nothing and use another key on my stick to turn combat trim on and off.
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To get the rotary keys to work you have to set them to a "band". In SST with your current profile opened find the rotary key and right click. Pick "banding". Use your mouse to click on the edges of the band to drag it up or down making smaller or larger. A band can be set to very narrow (0-10%) or wide (0-45%). A three band set up would be band 1 0-25%, band 2 26-74% and band 3 75% - 100%. You can make as many bands as you want. Each band corresponds with a key or control input.
After you have say 3 bands then double click and enter the key for what you want to do. Leave the center band set to nothing. You use the center one as a dead band. Now if you roll the wheel one way it will trigger that key.
Elevator trim uses "K" and "I" so you could set one band to K and the other to I. You could also set the middle band to combat trim on. This way if you roll the whell to K and then want to reset you roll the wheel to the mid point. I set the middle band to nothing and use another key on my stick to turn combat trim on and off.
cool bro, I am gonna try that, that would open up the 4-way hat on throttle.
well i tried but it still would not work so I re-downloaded the SST software, and it works, BUT the rotaries are horrible, I open up the control panel and they keep sliding without me touching them, so screw it I am just gonna stick with how I have it set-up now.
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Ink,
You have to calibrate them in game just like your sitck and throttle. The become like an axis control and have to be calibrated.
In game under options - calibrate joystick move all the controls and the rotaries full on and off. That should fix the prob
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To get the rotary keys to work you have to set them to a "band". In SST with your current profile opened find the rotary key and right click. Pick "banding". Use your mouse to click on the edges of the band to drag it up or down making smaller or larger. A band can be set to very narrow (0-10%) or wide (0-45%). A three band set up would be band 1 0-25%, band 2 26-74% and band 3 75% - 100%. You can make as many bands as you want. Each band corresponds with a key or control input.
After you have say 3 bands then double click and enter the key for what you want to do. Leave the center band set to nothing. You use the center one as a dead band. Now if you roll the wheel one way it will trigger that key.
Elevator trim uses "K" and "I" so you could set one band to K and the other to I. You could also set the middle band to combat trim on. This way if you roll the whell to K and then want to reset you roll the wheel to the mid point. I set the middle band to nothing and use another key on my stick to turn combat trim on and off.
This is totally dependant upon what you are trying to map to the rotaries and bands don't usually work very well for things like trim. When you set them to bands they can act as digital inputs (i.e., as the "K" and "I" keys) but it's much better to use the analog controls as analog inputs otherwise, unless you keep moving the control back to the dead band, you'll get continuous key presses which can do bad things like lock up your controller. You can set the analog controls as straight analog (Pitch, Roll and Yaw, Throttle, Trim, views, brakes and RPM), or as both (as I wrote about regarding using the throttle to control engine On/Off and WEP). Another advantage to using analog inputs is that you can pre-set them. For instance, you can go ahead and roll your rotary to give you full up elevator trim. While flying around with combat trim on everything works normally but toggle CT off and the elevator trim will move up. This works well for airplanes that compress as you just toggle trim off when you get too fast in a dive and the trim will bring the nose up. You can also pre-set your trim to your preferred settings for a turn fight and just toggle CT off when you get in a knife fight.
I use Rotary 2 for Rudder Trim and Rotary 1 for Field of View (Zoom). Since I use TrackIR I use my POV coolie hat for pitch/roll trim (this is what the actual coolie hat on a real stick is used for) To set the Rotaries for analog open SST and make sure that these analog controls are unprogrammed. (You only have to do this if you use the SST software, otherwise you can just map the rotaries in AH) Then, open AH and go to Map Controllers. Rotary 2 is called "Y Rotation" and Rotary 1 is "X Rotation" (Trip's post shows this). Spin your rotaries and you should see the value next to the names change. Also, the Slider can be mapped but it's a crappy control and I've found it to be very "spiky" in all my X52's so don't use it for anything. After you map the analog inputs you must calibrate them as Agent360 mentions.
Also, another trick that works real well is to set the X and Y axis of the throttle mouse switch to three bands. Since the stick is momentary (i.e., it's spring loaded to return to center) you can set both axis to bands and not have to worry about continuous key inputs as long as you leave the center bands unprogrammed as Agent360 mentions. Mine are set as: Up=flaps up, Down=flaps down, Forward=WEP, and Back=Dive brakes. Using SST you can also map "shift" functions for those four settings and use them for something like gunner's positions.
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Mtnman I could never get my rotary wheels to work :cry with or without the SST,
hope ya dont mind I stole your pics and revamped to reflect my set-up :D
No problem Ink, I stole them from someone else, hehe!
I use the rotary wheels the way Mace explains. I haven't used the SST programming for several years.
I also do the pre-set thing like Mace explained for the trims. I trim (combat trim off) for straight/level at about 275, and leave the trims "there" while I fly around with CT on. When I want manual, I just turn off the CT, and my trims move to where I had them pre-set.
And, like Mace says, you must calibrate them, as well as the RPM if you have that set on the slider.
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ya I have been messing around but my rotaries are shot, it the Saitek control panel they are not only "spiking" they completely drain all the red, I am tired of the damn thing, I want to go CH as soon as this stick dies that's the route I am going, or maybe the "couger" definitely not interested in these new "pressure sticks" that don't move.
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ya I have been messing around but my rotaries are shot, it the Saitek control panel they are not only "spiking" they completely drain all the red
my big rotary (which i use for rpm) has started doing the same thing, although not spiking - after a while the rpms just drop off slowly, although a quick nudge resets it. annoying :furious
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Here's mine... some are mapped from within AH (And left blank in the SST software) while others are programmed through SST.
For example, my EJECT command.. well I have to hold down the shift trigger, then hold down the encased button for two seconds.. then it sends the "ENTER ENTER ENTER" command. When I release the button, then it sends the "O" command.
It's still a work in progress and I have some stuff programmed that I almost never use and may have omitted it from here... but all the commands listed in my charts get used quite regularly:
(http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj256/AHMerciful/Woot%20BOC%20Pictures/SaitekX52StickBlank.jpg)
(http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj256/AHMerciful/Woot%20BOC%20Pictures/SaitekX52ThrottleBlank.jpg)
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how is it u got the slide and rotary 1 mapped for some reason it won't let me map them
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How did you mp the mouse controller for trim up,down,right,left? In SST or in AH ? And how ? Thank you.
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how is it u got the slide and rotary 1 mapped for some reason it won't let me map them
Yes plz answer this for me aswell,other than using the SST program I cant seem to make the scroll wheel work either.
:salute
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How did you mp the mouse controller for trim up,down,right,left? In SST or in AH ? And how ? Thank you.
That must be done in the SST software but it's easy. Open up the profile using the SST Profiler and find the Mouse X and Y Axis (they're at the bottom). Set both Axis as "bands." It will default to three equally spaced bands for each axis and you assign your trim buttons to the upper and lower bands leaving the center band unassigned as a deadzone.
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Yeah what mace said... have to do it from SST software... like I said... many of my commands are left blank in SST but programmed from within AH... but some (including all of my shifted commands) had to be done from SST.
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how is it u got the slide and rotary 1 mapped for some reason it won't let me map them
Both of these can be assigned in AH without using the SST software. Just go Options/Controls/Map Controllers and you'll see the slider and rotaries (labled Y Rotation and X Rotation). Highlight the one you want and select Modify, then "Analog Inputs" and select the analog function you want from the list. Remember that you have to calibrate these as analog axis which you can do individually from the Map Controllers page or if you choose the global "Calibrate Joystick" function.
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Yes plz answer this for me aswell,other than using the SST program I cant seem to make the scroll wheel work either.
:salute
I see no way of mapping the scroll wheel in AH without SST Morf. Without SST running AH doesn't even seem to see the wheel.
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Silly question here, but since I haven't had a chance to fiddle with my new X52 yet, I'll ask anyway...
Is the SST software something that I will have to start (assuming I want to use it) everytime I play AH? Or will it auto start itself everytime I start my computer and simply run in the background?
On a side note, I really appreciate the discussion in this thread. When I do finally have the time to break out the new stick, this thread will be very helpful in setting it up.
:salute
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Silly question here, but since I haven't had a chance to fiddle with my new X52 yet, I'll ask anyway...
Is the SST software something that I will have to start (assuming I want to use it) everytime I play AH? Or will it auto start itself everytime I start my computer and simply run in the background?
On a side note, I really appreciate the discussion in this thread. When I do finally have the time to break out the new stick, this thread will be very helpful in setting it up.
:salute
NO you dont need it at all, you can just shut it off so it don't start at all,go to-start-run-(type)msconfig-startup tab-deselect the saitek-OK, it is just more running in back ground that is not needed.
INK
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NO you dont need it at all, you can just shut it off so it don't start at all,go to-start-run-(type)msconfig-startup tab-deselect the saitek-OK, it is just more running in back ground that is not needed.
INK
Unless I want to use it for some of the mapping features mentioned previously? Yes?
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Unless I want to use it for some of the mapping features mentioned previously? Yes?
correct :aok
but really every thing you need is in the mapping through AH.
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correct :aok
but really every thing you need is in the mapping through AH.
Except using the throttle detents for WEP and Engine On/Off, right? Those are the features that interest me the most.
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Except using the throttle detents for WEP and Engine On/Off, right? Those are the features that interest me the most.
ya that is cool, I got those mapped to buttons, my system is not so new so it is easier and less work on CPU.
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Both of these can be assigned in AH without using the SST software. Just go Options/Controls/Map Controllers and you'll see the slider and rotaries (labled Y Rotation and X Rotation). Highlight the one you want and select Modify, then "Analog Inputs" and select the analog function you want from the list. Remember that you have to calibrate these as analog axis which you can do individually from the Map Controllers page or if you choose the global "Calibrate Joystick" function.
While you CAN map these from within AH, you CANNOT map these to do what I wanted without SST... for example... my slider is set for LEFT33%=F1 View (interior), MIDDLE34%=F3 View (Exterior), RIGHT33%=F4 View (God's View).
The Scroll wheel CANNOT be mapped without SST... scrolling one way sends the signal to increase zoom... other way decrease zoom (is it ] and [? I forget). Also clicking the wheel turns zoom on/off (Z). Doing the same thing with shift enabled (bottom trigger) brings the clipboard up (ESC), and zooms the map in/out.
Also, holding the SHIFT and holding the "safe" button under the flap for longer than 1 second sends the "ENTER ENTER ENTER" command for eject... and releasing that button sends the "O" command for open chute. This way ejection is automatic, but also requires extra steps in case i hit it in error.
Lastly, SHIFT+C sends "/" to open the vox lists and text input.... and releasing SHIFT+C sends the "ENTER" command... This way I can depress it, see who is in range or who is logged on in my squad... then release it to make the box go away.
I have several other macros programmed this way.. none of which can be done without the SST software.
Yes it does have to run in the background.. yes you can set it up to autoload at bootup.. no it does not use that many resources... I'm pretty sure that my TRACK-IR running in the background probably uses 50% more resources than the SST software (if not more)... then again with my new(er) system and windows 7, I don't even bother to turn off my anti-virus and with ALL SETTINGS maxed except self shadows... I never see a dip below 55FPS and no stuttering. Turning self-shadows on causes very slight stutters from time to time but I don't feel like it's THAT much of an improvement in eye-candy.
E7300 @ 2.8GHZ
4GB DDR3 RAM
9800GTX+ 512MB DDR3 PCI-eV2
X52+SST+TrackIR+TurtleBeach USB Surround Sound Headphones (using their own drivers)
1024 Textures W/ Hi-Res
AA Maxed out with AH slider
All sliders set to FULL DETAIL
All advanced options on except self shadows (completely off)
Win 7 Home Premium 64bit
320MB SATA2 WD HardDrive (nothing fancy)
Avast Home AV
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That must be done in the SST software but it's easy. Open up the profile using the SST Profiler and find the Mouse X and Y Axis (they're at the bottom). Set both Axis as "bands." It will default to three equally spaced bands for each axis and you assign your trim buttons to the upper and lower bands leaving the center band unassigned as a deadzone.
Clever, I never thought of doing that. Of course I know exactly what your talking about. Thanks, I'll try it.