Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Wilbus on June 20, 2001, 04:53:00 AM
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Now don't flame me.
It seams like the 190 A's engines die byt a single round, even 30 cal, and it dies right away (not necisarily the first shot you get hit by). No fuel leak, no radiator dammage, no oil leak, the engine just quits but the first little round that hits it.
Same thing with P38 enginges and I belive Yak engines too. I don't know about the Yak and P38 engine but teh 190 engine was know for being able to handle punishment, wich was one of the reasons Kurt Tank chose it.
Could this be a bug in the DM? I just refuse to belive the engine would quit rigth away after a very small caliber hit.
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/jg5wilbus.gif)
Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson
III/JG5 Eismeer
Livestock Liberation Front
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: ]
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I never really fly the 190's, but if that is the case I would agree that it needs to be looked at.
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Same experience here, A series and, mainly, 190F8 in deack missions. With this plane, most of ack hits kill the engine (no smoke).
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i have just the oppisite experience. the a's seem to die pretty fast but not from one 30cal ping. but the f8 seems to do great, i got pinged about 4 times on an ack run the other night and only lost an aileron.
-AKHog
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Would it kill you guys to go actually test this? It only takes two guys in the DA or the TA to see if your guess is correct or not. It's not likely Pyro will put something like this on the "to do" list based on what "it seems like".
It allways SEEMS like I die because everybody else has a better plane. It can't be because I got beat right? ;0 Heh. If you really want to identify a problem and get it looked at, do some testing and post the data. Otherwise you are just wasting your time and BBS space. :)
Lephturn
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Who wants to test it with me? I'll be online 22:00 GMT+1 - 24:00 GMT+1
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Reason I posted this Lephturn was because I wanted to know if other people have had the same experience. It seams as if they have and I'll do some test asap.
190 F8 engine dies about as easy as the A version but the rest of the plane can take a pretty good beating.
Mandoble, same thing, 1 ping, it dies right away and no smoke at all. just says "engine" in the dammage list.
Somebody care to do some tests with me?
[ 06-20-2001: Message edited by: ]
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Yes 190f8 and D9,then also A8 but much less,
suffer almost always of dead engine or oil leak,at the first ping.
I have made some comparision of durability whit 190f8 a8 and 109g10 whit oil leak,well 109g10 keep running for about 4 minutes more than 190a8 f8,and this is strange!!!
The FW was famous for his capacity of take punishment and bring the pilot home whit 1 or 2 cilinder ded.
Here the 109 keep flying much more time whit engine damage than 190. :rolleyes:
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It seems that the P-47's are missing 2 cylinders! hehe
(http://www.iaw.com/~general6/jug_engine.jpg)
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P-47 has only 16 cylinders??!?! Damnit we're getting short changed here!!!
:D
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Ooooohhh .. .that's why the P47 is 5MPH short with Wep!
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Yo,
This 190A engine damage issue has been up several times. Never have anyone given a reasonable explanation about it other than direct fuel injection to cylinders causing fuel spray all over the engine if hit. Who knows.
But, the fact is oil leeks in A series are extremely rare (think twice in my AH career).
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I agree. Oil leaks in the As are very uncommon. I get dead engine in As more often than any other plane. As a matter of fact, I am having a hard time recalling a 1 ping engine dead situation in any other plane that I frequently fly, which isn't the full planeset mind you, but a decent cross section (a6m5, 109's, p51d, p47s, C.202, F6f, f4u-1d, Tiffy).
I don't engage in HOs often, (unless I've recently bumped my head :eek: ), but in the 190-A5 I tend to get the 1 ping engine dead situation from air-to-air engagements. I've also noticed that the tail of the 190 seems to be about as likely to leave the plane as the tail of the P-38.
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: troxel ]
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Cc, havne't had an oil leak in a 190 A for a very long time, jsut 1 shot engine dead.
I and Mandoble did some testing in the TA, he or I will post some results soon.
I haven't died in the D9 for a while so I can say anything about it ;)
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Wilbus, you forgot the attachments in the mail.
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Yes I know, I sent you another mail right after that one, the films are there.
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Wilbus, try to send it again, no new mails on this side.
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Cc, very weird, sending it again.
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i havent had an oil leak either !! but then im not flying 190s heheheh
im driving tanks and stuff in WW2ol :D
its not AH for flying but the tanks are nicer i think.
Ive been asking about this 1 ping engine kill since the 190 arrived i think.Ignored all along.Ive made loads of ack runs in 190s and p51s and the p51 is much more durable to ack hits.It took on average 2-4 ack hits to take p51 down,many 1 ping wings off but nowhere near the same percentage as 190 ack runs with 1 ping engine kills(mainly 1st pass) followed closely by tail section removal (on 2nd passes usually).also when the engine is hit first pass in p51 you can get 3-4 more passes usually before engine dies.the 190 gets 1st pass then maybe 1-2 more deadstick before it has to ditch.Usually you cant even use all of your ammo in time.sucks after long flights in doesnt it?.
Its really not the job of customers to constantly test and try to prove what they perceive to be bugged i think.Its in HTCs interest to test it a little so if they havent got time, give one of the pilots a free month and set them test tasks.
I garentee yet again nothing will be said on this subject, never has been much concern over this i dont think :(
[ 06-21-2001: Message edited by: hazed- ]
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I won't rest untill it's fixed, I have a couple of pages written by Kurt Tank and yet more pages written by Ground attack, Sturmgruppe and different other 190 pilots, I'll post some from Kurt Tanks later.
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<S> Wilbus, this has happened to me many many times in 190A5. I had always assumed that 40mm hit had occurred, and maybe some of those were...but, if you need help testing, e-mail me or catch me on-line. cya.
trm
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Just had a dead engine AND oil leak from a single ping frontal attack (no I didn't try to HO, came out of a turn together with adversary)
Have experienced many one ping dead engines too in 190 without a oil leak.
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I have noticed this on the 190s, Dora included, and the P38. There is something that just kills the engine if any sort of hit occurs in the motor area. This doesnt happend so easily and quickly on any planes ive flown excepet the 190 and P38.
HTC please look ino it, its a real issue in your sim.
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<punt> :)
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I was amazed while doing field suppression with a 190a8 that I took 2 hits from ack while killing ack and never even had a red damage indicator.
I commented on it at the time to my squadies and they were also of the opinion it was a robust plane.
I dont think I had my hack running at that time so something is up.
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I thought the 190D9 used an inline engine, different from what the 190A series used?
Shouldnt it be more vulnerable than those radials?
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hmmm are the oil temperature limit corect what ve have now in 190 ???????/
in spit the limit is 150 C hehe , hehehehehe
in AH mean real life dont think so
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Animal, you'd think the inline would be more vulnerable, yep.
The only thing (that I know of) that would make the BMW 801 more vulnerable than other radials would be the fuel system. It had direct fuel injection which meant there was a fuel line to each cylinder. Lots of fuel lines under the cowl meant lots of opportunities for bullets or fragments to cut the fuel lines. The Fw 190A engines really seem to go up like torches on a lot of gun camera film and I think that could be the reason.
As far as the oil, I don't think the lubrication system on the 801 was much different from other radials, because it was basically (IIRC) an enlarged version of a P&W engine that BMW had been manufacturing under license. The only real unique thing about the 801's lube system was the oil cooler installation in the cowl ring. But I don't know if that would be any more or less vulnerable than the oil cooler locations on other radial-engined planes.
[ 07-02-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]
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i hardly ever get hit in the engine. but when i get hit with aa fire on my way down, pretty much all planes loose an engine.
but i dunno. the p47 seems pretty hardy though, i got pinned about 10-15 time up the front from a lancaster(i blew him up) and all i got was an oil leak.
rav