Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: denniswilha on January 31, 2010, 09:36:25 PM
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I have a intel i5 750 processor [quad core]
4GB DDR3-1333 memory
1TB SATA Hard drive
NVidea GeForce GTS250 1GB video card running on Windows 7 home premium
I am constantly getting 1 second frame freezes, or frame stutters. I have stopped every process possible and running this thing as bare bone as possible and cannot stop the freezes, I have a wonderful connection.
I read a post by Skuzzy on frame shutters that stated the onboard sound can cause this problem, i am not running any sound packs just the original ones with the standard install, I am running the Hi Res pack. Is anyone else having this issue?
My older dual core system with XP didn't do this. Any help greatly appreciated. <S>
Almost forgot, I also have the Matrox TripleHead2Go running 3 monitors but have never had an issue with it.
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I have heard this time and again. Even with higher end cards then yours. Think it honestly has to do with the Nvidia driver. On some cards rolling back to a much older driver cures the problem.
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NVidia has been making some really serious errors in some of the later drivers. We currently use the 190.38 drivers, in house, and those seem to be ok.
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link for above named drivers
Note they are OS specific
Windows Vista, Windows 7
http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_32bit_190.38_whql.html
Windows XP
http://www.nvidia.com/object/winxp_190.38_whql.html
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Thanks so much, I will roll back or install the older driver and see if that fixes the issue. I really like the NVidea cards but if their not gonna keep up with fixes I may turn to the other side. What would be a good choice for a 1 gig crad that runs the game trouble free with everything maxed out?
I know I opened up a can of worms here. Thanks again for the help.
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4850 ati :old:
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I've installed a new sound card :
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Gamer
It sounds great, but still game freezes. I tried going to the link that Drediock provided for the older driver version and upon install it says its not for Windows 7 {64 bit} system. and terminates install. I may have forgotten to tell ya its Windows 7 64 bit. Is there a driver for Nvidea that will work for a 64 bit windows 7 version?
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So easy a caveman can do it:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_64bit_190.38_whql.html (http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_64bit_190.38_whql.html)
Using Drediock's original link, just changed the 32 to 64...
Also, please tell me you disabled that "aero" interface on your windows profile...make sure the nvidia control panel is set to give anti-aliasing control to AH and turn the anti-aliasing in AH up a couple of notches...uh, what anti-virus are you using?
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Oversight my part. Forgot about 64 bit. I did the same thing when trying to install ESET on my sister in laws new laptop last week. LOL
Sorry bout dat
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So easy a caveman can do it:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_64bit_190.38_whql.html (http://www.nvidia.com/object/win7_winvista_64bit_190.38_whql.html)
Using Drediock's original link, just changed the 32 to 64...
Also, please tell me you disabled that "aero" interface on your windows profile...make sure the nvidia control panel is set to give anti-aliasing control to AH and turn the anti-aliasing in AH up a couple of notches...uh, what anti-virus are you using?
how do i let AH control anti-aliasing, I had been running it with it off. I use CA {computer associate} for security, virus software, but I usually go into services and stop it completely before running the game.
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Open Nvidia control panel and look under "manage 3d settings":
(http://ded.zenblue.net/L4D_PC/Nvidia_ControlP.jpg)
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Does this happen when you talk or press the T or f12 keys?
If so adjust your hardware accelerator to 3/4 in dxdiag.
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After changing to the older Nvidea drivers I havn't had a flicker yet, I also set antialiasing to application controlled, cranked up on everything else and I have a great picture and incredible sound, Thanks guys foir all the help and info. <S> :banana:
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WOW!!!!
After playing for about 10 minutes I have had 2 or 3 frame freezes {shutters}. I am at a total loss here. I set my textures to 512 and still got the freezes, I know this video card can handle 512. Does anyone have any ideas or things I can try to narrow down were my bottle necking is happening, and also the hard drive is a 7200 rpm I was afraid it might be it, that should be allright to run this game. Any help will be appreciated greatly.
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WOW!!!!
After playing for about 10 minutes I have had 2 or 3 frame freezes {shutters}. I am at a total loss here. I set my textures to 512 and still got the freezes, I know this video card can handle 512. Does anyone have any ideas or things I can try to narrow down were my bottle necking is happening, and also the hard drive is a 7200 rpm I was afraid it might be it, that should be allright to run this game. Any help will be appreciated greatly.
Was it while you were using vox?
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Determine what else is on the same IRQ as your video card. If it's a USB connector, move any devices plugged into that connector to a connector on a different IRQ.
Other than that... I'm not coming up with many ideas. Your hardware should run it beautifully based on what you've posted. Unless your hard drive is failing, it shouldn't be a factor at all.
<S>
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It does seem to happen while using vox or listening to someone speak.
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It does seem to happen while using vox or listening to someone speak.
Hardware acceleration on your sound card...lower it 1 or 2 notches.
Do you get the stutters in offline mode?
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sorry not real familiar with windows 7 yet, but I cannot find any hardware accelerator anywhere for video or sound.
I havn't tried playing it offline yet, guess I'll go fly around a bit and let ya know, I usually start getting them within 5 minutes. Also I have another video card in another machine here, the one i'm using is a Nvidea GTS250, the other is a GTX280, I know the 280 is bigger but was told I probably would not notice a difference. Can running the Matrox TripleHead2go with the 250 be the problem, I never had issues with the 280 running it, but it was also on a XP system. Sorry for all this crapp, any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks for your input and time guys.
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I get a stutter every now and then while shooting planes and explosions during offline play, but have really narrowed it down to online play while using vox, or listening to chatter, happens badly when with several people at once. How do I get to the hardware accelerator on my sound card. Its a sound blaster Xtreme gamer? Thanks again guys. :aok
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There is no hardware acceleration for sound cards in Windows Vista or 7. That had to do with DirectSound, which no longer exists in Windows 7 and Vista. All sounds play through the normal Windows sound API. It was the only way Microsoft could figure out how to force DRM into the sound system.
Try disabling "ReadyBoost", "Superfetch", and "Windows Media Player Network Sharing Service" services, in Windows 7, and see if that helps.
If you have an iPod, then kill the iPod software and see if it helps. iPod software for Windows is petty nasty.
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I have allready disabled superfetch. Cannot find Ready Boost. I disabled Windows media Player Services will play sometime throughout today and definately will know tonight during FSO. I also Have a squadie that has a new i7 machine with windows 7 and he's having the same issue with the studder {freezes}. Is this just an issue with 7 or quad core machines?
I do not have itunes or any other software installed on this system it is a bare system just for gaming, I have installed Aces High and Call of Duty Modern Warfare2 on here and thats it, I make sure and turn off Steam before I play also.
Can someone post a list or is there a list of all the services that can be disabled or stopped on a machine? i currently have 63 running and the CPU is at 0 to 1%. I can shut down my Virus software and a few little things and get it to 57, buit have not got a clue how or what I can stop to get it down to the lower 40's or even in the 30's. Thanks again for the help.
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What anti-virus are you running? Norton and McAfee cannot really be disabled as they replace system files which continue to do what they do no matter what.
Maybe Microsoft removed "ReadyBoost" from Windows 7. That would be a good thing.
What type of sound chips/boards are you using? I could easily see USB connected headsets being more problematic than a decen sound board. Onboard sound ships are next in line as being higher in overhead than a good sound card.
Then again, this could simply be a resource issue.
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Im running CA Internet Security Suite Plus 2010. I also have disabled the onboard sound card and have a Creative Sound Blaster X-fi Extreme Gamer.
I went into Windows Task Manager and also set the Priority to High, and checked Affinity and all cores are being used. How many stream processes are used ona video card in aces high if textures are maxed running High res pack? I did some checking and my GTS250 has 128 cores. But even when I lower the textures to 512 i still get the shutters. My squaddy also has these stutters, I'm in texas he's in Minnesota, I have an i5 and his is an i7. Could this be an i series processor issue? Oh and my headset is not USB.
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I played tonight in FSO and got the shudders, I'm really thinking its the i series quad processors issue. Remember the update for the dual cores, might be time for a quad core update.
I might try dedicating two of the cores to running the game and see if it acts as if it's only a dual core.
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Gamebooster is very good freeware for shutting down software in the background.
I have problem at 9.15 everynight AH minimize's I have sat there with Task manager open looking for a process calling out but nothing lol, game does not close it just minimizes.
I use track IR and might get 1 stutter every now and then.
(Did not know about iPod software will disable mine)
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When you installed the sound card did you disable your onboard sound and remove the drivers?
Sounds like you have a conflict there.
cheers,
RTR
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No, I disabled the onboard sound before i installed the sound card. i was having the studder before i installed the card, i thought maybe the sound card would fix the problem if the onboard couldn't handle it. It's just a problem with Aces High. I play COD4 Modern Warfare 2 and don't have a problem at all. When I played with my dual core system I never had this problem, guess HiTech just needs to figure this out if its a i series processor issue. Beware!!!!! If your looking into an i5 or i7 unit do your homework and make sure this isn't happening to everyone with this type of system.
If it's just mine , I'd like to know anyone else thats using an i5 or an i7 system. Maybe if its just mine then I know it can be fixed , if its everyone then it's the game.
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It is not the Intel quad core CPU's causing this. The Wife's computer is an Intel i7 and it runs the game smooth as silk. It is also running Windows XP.
I would lean more towards the anti-virus/security program being a potential issue. However, simply disabling it may not cure the problem if it is that software causing/amplifying the issue.
The 'dual-core' fix we issed was specific to AMD multi-core issues. Intel has never been an issue, except in a few laptop models where they deliberately disabled one of the hig resolution clocks to save power.
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I don't know if you've tried shutting down your Anti-Virus (it's early and I haven't read every single post), but I would go with Skuzzy and say try turning it off. I run PCTools security (all of it, AV/Threatfire/Spyware Doctor), but if I don't turn Spyware Doctor to "game mode" I will get 1 second screen freezes the whole time, it will happen with every game if I leave it on normal. Just something to try if you haven't already. :)
The stutters happened in both XP and Windows 7 if I left it on, otherwise it was smooth as silk so it was definitely the Anti-Virus causing stutters.
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Glad to hear that Skuzzy, this way I know mine can be fixed. I have gone as far as disabling my virus protector in services, but I will fully uninstall it and check to see what happens, I bought this computer a week before Christmas and installed the virus software the day i got it so i have never played the game without it installed. I will post later what happens. I also will delete and do another full install of the game. Thanks again for all the help and suggestions. <S>
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OK , I unistalled my antivirus software, and did a full reinstall of the game. I had the glitches for about the first 15 minutes , about 4 or 5 i'd say, then they started going away, after about 30 minutes to an 1hour, didnt really keep track of time they stopped. I left the game on all durring the super bowl, then got back on and played and only had 2 studders in about 2 hours time.
I went into Nvidea setting and upped the pre-rendered frames from 3 to 6, i have been playing awhile now and havnt had one yet. If it was the software why is it still giving the studders, just not as frequent?
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What's Windows automatic updates set on Dennis? Win7 has a lot of background monitoring processes going on...it could be one of those or it could be a setting in AH.
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I actually turn off windows updates, and have used this site for shutting down processes, I have gotten it down to 46.
http://www.blackviper.com/Windows_7/servicecfg.htm
I use the columns for tweaked and safe
I just don't understand how it plays COD4 modern warfare2 so well and has trouble with Aces High. It may just be a setting somewhere, just have not been able to track it down. I'm ruling out any hardware issues {hard-drive} mainly because it plays the other game so well. I have monitored my frame rates during the freezes and it doesn't effect the frame rate not a glimpse. My frame rate usually is around 175FPS and during a heavy fight with several around its about 115FPS which I know these are great which lead me to beleive again its not hardware or internet related, my ping in the game ranges around 45. Like Skuzzy had said about his other system with i7 processor runs the game fine but he has XP on it. This does seem to happen more during VOX use. but i have seen it on offline mode without vox.
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How are you guys getting such high frame rates with vsync on? :huh I'm stuck at 59-60 and I've got a Geforce 250GTS 512MB... :headscratch:
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Turn Vsync off for performance, when its on it locks the frame rendering to your monitors refresh rate which is probably 57. You won't loose and picture quality with that card.
And this isn't my problem I've tried it both ways, if someone wants to share their settings for a GTS250 1gig video card that migth help me out I'm all ears at this point.
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You only turn off vsync for testing purposes. DO NOT disable it just to play the game. You can create all manner of problems when running with vsync off.
It has nothing to do with performance. Running without vsync enabled simply means you are drawing the same frames over and over again, or worse, stomping on partially drawn frames.
Aces High already triple buffers the frame draw. Having NVidia do it in the drivers just causes a situation where more wierdness can occur. Rubber bullets, lost network packets are but two of the potential problems you can cause when running with vsync disabled and/or having a bunch of pre-rendered frames drawn.
Aces High is a very CPU demanding game. High fidelity flight modeling is always more demanding than any first person shooter. Anyone want to doubt that just needs to look at the supercomputers used to simulate realtime flight, versus just needing an Intel 386 to model a person running around in a game world.
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Do u have a lot of films saved?
Semp
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How are you guys getting such high frame rates with vsync on? :huh I'm stuck at 59-60 and I've got a Geforce 250GTS 512MB... :headscratch:
frame rate can can also be determined by refresh rate of monitor you are using, My four year old Dell monitor has a refresh rate of 75 while my Samsung TV omitor is 60 frames.
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Should I change the pre-rendering frames settings in NVidea, back to 3 or is a higher # better.
Maybe this is the whole problem, it might just be settings in my Nvidea control panel.
No, Semp. I don't have any movies saved or pictures, I deleted them all when I re-installed the game.
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frame rate can can also be determined by refresh rate of monitor you are using, My four year old Dell monitor has a refresh rate of 75 while my Samsung TV omitor is 60 frames.
I know that silly. :neener: If I lower my monitor resolution to 1440x900 I can push the refresh rate to 72 safely...but at the higher resolutions running 512 textures looks pretty darn good...but the monitor doesn't support anything higher than 60Hz refresh at native resolution.
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Frame rate of 75 on my dell is good, but frame of 60 looks better on my samsung TV/Monitor because the colour and picture are superior.
I would rather have a stable 60 frame rate over a higher frame rate.
(and i am silly hurrah and tally ho! :banana: :old:)
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I beleive anything over like 57FPS isn't noticable by the human eye.
I have uninstalled virus software and disabled Active X and all the Java and Adobe crudd. Game is playing great, I started game and for about the first few minutes it flutters , guess its loading things into game, then it plays smooth. Thanks so very much for all the help. Have decided the biggest thing here is windows 7, they have a few bugs to work out. My old system with XP ran with the virus software fine but just isn't up to par with the windows 7 yet.
Thanks again to everyone that helped. Big SALUTE!!!!!!! :salute
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I beleive anything over like 57FPS isn't noticable by the human eye.
I have uninstalled virus software and disabled Active X and all the Java and Adobe crudd. Game is playing great, I started game and for about the first few minutes it flutters , guess its loading things into game, then it plays smooth. Thanks so very much for all the help. Have decided the biggest thing here is windows 7, they have a few bugs to work out. My old system with XP ran with the virus software fine but just isn't up to par with the windows 7 yet.
Thanks again to everyone that helped. Big SALUTE!!!!!!! :salute
I can only disagree, as Windows 7 runs AH great on my hardware, which is less powerful (processor any way) than that which you are using. (And on many other's systems, too). If I had to hazard a guess, it's that Windows 7 version of the CA AV was interfering, as that's the one thing that is likely to be a meaningful difference between your system and most others.
But I'm glad you got it working any way.
<S>
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I have uninstalled virus software and disabled Active X and all the Java and Adobe crudd.
Oh yeah...just took it for granted that you disabled all the active background processes for Java and Adobe...I had to use msconfig to disable them on mine.
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Bad news I'm still getting frame freezes, I have been reading alot on video cards, and I read that stutters or freezes can accur with 128 bit cards. I have a Nvidea GTS250 1gig. Cannot find anything on the bits, LOL could this be the problem. all the Nvidea settings are default and the settings in the game are maxed out, except for the shadows {don't care for them}. My other system I had ran a GTX280 1gig, and I never had the freezes with it. Just wondering if its possibly the card not able to handle everything on max?
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You had a 280GTX and you went to a 250GTS? :huh What did you do with the 280? That's a better card.
What brand of 250 do you have?
I have this one:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150357&cm_re=250gts-_-14-150-357-_-Product (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150357&cm_re=250gts-_-14-150-357-_-Product)
And on my system, I don't have all options turned on...especially shadowing and I'm only running 512 textures.
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This is my gts 250 its by MSi with the twin frozr cooler
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127478&Tpk=MSI%20GTX250
My 280GTX is in my other dual core machine and has no glitches. I figured the cards were close to the same and I could run everything the same on this machine. I run the hi-res pack on 1024 texture setting. I keep shadows turned off. Detailed terrain and bump terrain on. I have disabled these and still get the freezes shutters studders.
This is my GTX280
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127360
it is 512 bit and the 250 shows to 256 bit, I tried swapping them out and it ran the game for about 5 minutes and the whole PC rebooted, the only difference was the 230 used one pci power cord and the 280 used 2 pci cords, I plugged them in and everything powers up fine and the pc will stay on and work fine till i run the game, it runs for about 5 minutes and blam systems shuts down and reboots. seems like a power issue but i have a 750watt power supply.
I'm running version 6 bios, isn't there a power setting i should adjust in there? Or does anyone have any suggestions?
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:O You need minimum of 40 amps on your PCI-E (+12v) connection for the 280...
I'm pretty sure the 250 only requires 24-28 amps on the +12v circuit...
Might want to check the PSU in the new system. I have a Thermaltake 700w modular and it's only putting out 18 amps per +12v leg.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153039 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153039)
That 250 won't handle the 1024 textures and hi res pack at native resolution for some reason...although by all rights it should...I've tried it.
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That 750 watt PSU may not have enough 12v amperage to run all the 12v devices.
Most of the GTX series cards require 650 watt PSU with combined 12v amperage of 36-42 amps.
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sounds like I'll be getting a beter PSU and installing the 280, I want to run the hig res pack. Thanks :salute
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The Corsair TX650 should run that GTX280. How many drives do you run?
The TX650 provides 52amps at 624watts and is certifies 80 plus.
http://www.corsair.com/products/tx/default.aspx
Cost me 107 bucks with tax at BestBuy.
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Hadn't noticed this posted yet.
If Win7 has the Aero-type interface then turning this off (at least while you're gaming) could free up approx 25% of your VC's memory (frame buffers) that wouldn't be available to your game if Aero was left on in the background.
I could see this being more of an issue w/ the GTS250 than the GTX280 but can be an issue regardless.
Hope this helps.
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To turn of Aero all I do is pick a standard background correct?
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Aero turns off automatically when a 3D application is started full screen.
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Aero turns off automatically when a 3D application is started full screen.
If that is true, then please explain why when using EVGA Precision 1.9.1 (which tracks % video mem usage) in the background continues to show my VC's mem usage at 49%-53% when Aero is enabled AND I'm running AHII in full screen mode vs 21%-24% usage when Aero is disabled running under identical conditions. Then when I exit the game (no 3d app/game running) Precision still shows the % VC mem usage discreptancy as it did in previous example?
Now tis not to say that Aero is/isn't "hibernating" when 3d apps run in full screen mode but tis does say that Aero doesn't "release" VC mem that it has addressed unless Aero is actually turned off.
Anything that causes a reduction in the amount of mem available to be used as a frame buffer can be a culprit in causing stutters.
Not being combative here, just stating evidence that can be reproduced.
Hope this helps.
:salute
EDIT: This can be tested w/ Precision. It's for Nvidia video cards.
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If that is true, then please explain why when using EVGA Precision 1.9.1 (which tracks % video mem usage) in the background continues to show my VC's mem usage at 49%-53% when Aero is enabled AND I'm running AHII in full screen mode vs 21%-24% usage when Aero is disabled running under identical conditions. Then when I exit the game (no 3d app/game running) Precision still shows the % VC mem usage discreptancy as it did in previous example?
Now tis not to say that Aero is/isn't "hibernating" when 3d apps run in full screen mode but tis does say that Aero doesn't "release" VC mem that it has addressed unless Aero is actually turned off.
Anything that causes a reduction in the amount of mem available to be used as a frame buffer can be a culprit in causing stutters.
Not being combative here, just stating evidence that can be reproduced.
Hope this helps.
:salute
EDIT: This can be tested w/ Precision. It's for Nvidia video cards.
Better ask Microsoft as this information is from them.
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I will be attempting to change out the power suplies in each system as i do beleive the one i am using does not have enough amps to run the GTX280 card. I will post the results after its done and let everyone know the performance difference and if the freezing stops!!!! Thanks again guys I appreciate everyones ideas and thoughts. :salute
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Actually, what happens when you have Aero running and DX needs to run, then Aero is supended, but it keeps all of its resources locked in memory so it can quickly restart when the DX app terminates.
So, it is not running, but it is not cleanly terminated either.
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OK I replaced my PSU with a 650watt, replaced the 750watt, the 650 has more amps, and installed the GTX280 card. The game has been running and playing with no freezes for over an hour now. I guess the Video card can not handle the Matrox TripleHead2Go with 3 monitors. I have installed the 750 PSU and the GTS250 card in my other machine and it plays the game fine on a single monitor. I guess this resolves my issue on freezes. i will continue to leave game running throughout the day and will play time to time untill this afternoon, then I will give it a true workout. :salute