Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: pervert on February 04, 2010, 07:28:41 PM
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For the Stuka I know this has been up a million times before but if my kids have taught me anything its that repeating yourself gets results :)
I don't see how adding it as an option will be any different to say the IL2 which is the uber dweeb ride of tank busting. And it would give the plane a purpose in the late war arenas.
Lets face it even if you want to fly the plane usually the ords at that base are down, or theres a ton of air cover and the minute your spotted you get hoed to death. :aok
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IIRC the issue is that our Ju87, with big cannons added, is not the same aircraft as the actual Ju87 with big cannons. It would be akin to asking for cannons to be added on a P-51D on the basis of 100 P-51/Mustang IA's having been equipped as such.
wrongway
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IIRC the issue is that our Ju87, with big cannons added, is not the same aircraft as the actual Ju87 with big cannons. It would be akin to asking for cannons to be added on a P-51D on the basis of 100 P-51/Mustang IA's having been equipped as such.
wrongway
Ju 87D-3 + 2x BK37 = Ju 87G-1
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Those aren't big anyways.
Big might start at the 50m BK50 on the Me410 57mm Ho-401 on the Ki-102-Ib or the 57mm Mollins gun on the Mosquito FB.Mk XVIII.
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IIRC the issue is that our Ju87, with big cannons added, is not the same aircraft as the actual Ju87 with big cannons. It would be akin to asking for cannons to be added on a P-51D on the basis of 100 P-51/Mustang IA's having been equipped as such.
wrongway
Aww come on, now I want one :D
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IIRC the issue is that our Ju87, with big cannons added, is not the same aircraft as the actual Ju87 with big cannons. It would be akin to asking for cannons to be added on a P-51D on the basis of 100 P-51/Mustang IA's having been equipped as such.
wrongway
What if we only put them on the Pony-B?
:bolt:
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Those aren't big anyways.
57mm Mollins gun on the Mosquito FB.Mk XVIII.
GIMMEEE!!!!!!!!!!
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I don't see how adding it as an option will be any different to say the IL2
It won't be... I'll bet the Il2 will still get more use due to the greater amount of rounds it carries, even with the larger of the 2 caliber guns it carries.
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I agree with Del.
Ju-87 with the gun pods had very short ammo clip. Like 8 rounds each.
iL2 is a much better platform IMO.
Now there are a lot of big guns I'd love to see in AH someday. Including the anti shipping 57mm on the mossie etc.
But I really don't see the point for the ju-87.
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It won't be... I'll bet the Il2 will still get more use due to the greater amount of rounds it carries, even with the larger of the 2 caliber guns it carries.
I didn't say it would be better just that it wouldn't upset existing game play by being super over the top at killing gvs. Just because something gets more use doesn't mean it will be to the taste of all players.
I agree with Del.
Ju-87 with the gun pods had very short ammo clip. Like 8 rounds each.
iL2 is a much better platform IMO.
Now there are a lot of big guns I'd love to see in AH someday. Including the anti shipping 57mm on the mossie etc.
But I really don't see the point for the ju-87.
I could counter this by saying the spit16 is a much better platform for killing people than any other plane, would you then stick around in game if the spit 16 was the only plane you could fly? The point is a simple upgrade could breath life into a plane that seldom gets any use because of the style of gameplay of the MA. In short variety is good.
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IIRC the issue is that our Ju87, with big cannons added, is not the same aircraft as the actual Ju87 with big cannons. It would be akin to asking for cannons to be added on a P-51D on the basis of 100 P-51/Mustang IA's having been equipped as such.
wrongway
Just requires a simple choice in the hanger as to what loadout you take same as il2
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But I really don't see the point for the ju-87.
Because some of us only Fly Luftwaffe.
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Because some of us only Fly Luftwaffe.
With all due respect to JG11, who I got to know very well, that is a self imposed restriction. Except for a few scenarios, the up-gunned Ju87 will see little use. I'd rather see the Ju88 redone and its fighter variant added long before the Stuka gets done.
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The misinformation and lack of information on this one is funny...here is the 8 pages of discussion on the plane and options in question that could have just been bumped to save a couple of you the embarrassment:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,278221.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,278221.0.html)
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With all due respect to JG11, who I got to know very well, that is a self imposed restriction. Except for a few scenarios, the up-gunned Ju87 will see little use. I'd rather see the Ju88 redone and its fighter variant added long before the Stuka gets done.
Theres nothing wrong with self imposed restrictions Del, for a lot of people its thier main reason for keeping an interest in the game. I know in the case of the Stuka and the ground attack role its something I would like to get into to widen my scope in the game above fighters.
I fly it from time to time but my options to fly it are restricted because any GVer in his right mind won't attack a field with ords up to have himself carpet bombed by low Lancs, so where theres GVs theres no ords I cannot fly or I fly from another base and have to drop my ords to dogfight someone which, amusing as it is, isn't the reason I upped in the first place.
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Comparing the tankbuster Stuka with the IL-2 and the Hurri 2D, I see quite some usage due to it's gun setup:
It has by far the highest MV (30% more than the IL-2, almost twice that of the Hurricane) with a round power right between them. THis will be a snipers weapon...and probably a nightmare for flakpanzers.
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I agree with Del.
Ju-87 with the gun pods had very short ammo clip. Like 8 rounds each.
12 rounds ...still short! but worth putting in game.
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Theres nothing wrong with self imposed restrictions Del, for a lot of people its thier main reason for keeping an interest in the game. I know in the case of the Stuka and the ground attack role its something I would like to get into to widen my scope in the game above fighters.
I fly it from time to time but my options to fly it are restricted because any GVer in his right mind won't attack a field with ords up to have himself carpet bombed by low Lancs, so where theres GVs theres no ords I cannot fly or I fly from another base and have to drop my ords to dogfight someone which, amusing as it is, isn't the reason I upped in the first place.
Does that mean that a player who only flies Japanese would be justified in demanding the Ki-102-Ib and that their argument claiming it was equally valid as, say, a Beaufighter despite its almost zero combat record would be correct?
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Comparing the tankbuster Stuka with the IL-2 and the Hurri 2D, I see quite some usage due to it's gun setup:
It has by far the highest MV (30% more than the IL-2, almost twice that of the Hurricane) with a round power right between them. THis will be a snipers weapon...and probably a nightmare for flakpanzers.
This would be a good argument if the IL-2'S 37mm cannon had trouble penetrating the armor of any GV in AH... but it hasn't. As long as there is no GV with enough armor to push the NS-37 to it's limits, the Shturmovik is holding all cards compared to the 87G.
Once upon a time, there actually was such a situation: When the Il-2 had only the 23mm option. At that time the Hurri D had a performance advantage when engaging Tiger & T-34/76. Today, with the overpowering 37mm, the Hurri D gets more selected for sentimental reasons ;)
And as a Wirbel driver, I would be glad if the cannon bird upping for me was a Ju-87 G. Slow, vulnerable and only little ammo. Much less dangerous than a Il-2 or a B-25H.
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Ju-87 G-1 and D3 are the same except that the G1 has the cannons. +1
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And as a Wirbel driver, I would be glad if the cannon bird upping for me was a Ju-87 G. Slow, vulnerable and only little ammo. Much less dangerous than a Il-2 or a B-25H.
Hello! I'd drive the Stuka up behind you while your looking at the sky boom! :rofl Stukas can drive on the ground at full speed! :D
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Does that mean that a player who only flies Japanese would be justified in demanding the Ki-102-Ib and that their argument claiming it was equally valid as, say, a Beaufighter despite its almost zero combat record would be correct?
I see what you're getting at but not the relevence sorry.
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I must agree with the above, the G series of the stuka saw a lot of combat. So I don't see the point about bringing combat service into this with a totally different plane.
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I am pointing out that the fact that you don't have a German tank buster is 100% irrelevant.
The aircraft should be added or not on its own merits, not anything else.
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This would be a good argument if the IL-2'S 37mm cannon had trouble penetrating the armor of any GV in AH... but it hasn't. As long as there is no GV with enough armor to push the NS-37 to it's limits, the Shturmovik is holding all cards compared to the 87G.
Once upon a time, there actually was such a situation: When the Il-2 had only the 23mm option. At that time the Hurri D had a performance advantage when engaging Tiger & T-34/76. Today, with the overpowering 37mm, the Hurri D gets more selected for sentimental reasons ;)
And as a Wirbel driver, I would be glad if the cannon bird upping for me was a Ju-87 G. Slow, vulnerable and only little ammo. Much less dangerous than a Il-2 or a B-25H.
There is no doubt that the IL-2 overall is the more effective anti-tank aircraft. But I think the 87G would still have its merits. It would have the best ballistics for superior long range shots. That is certainly appealing - not just for tankbusting. ;)
BTW, does the flak 18 have better armor penetration than the NS37 ?
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I am pointing out that the fact that you don't have a German tank buster is 100% irrelevant.
The aircraft should be added or not on its own merits, not anything else.
What do you consider the 'merits' of the existing stuka?
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+1 for the stuka , aswell as the mossie 57mm molins gun!!
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It won't be... I'll bet the Il2 will still get more use due to the greater amount of rounds it carries, even with the larger of the 2 caliber guns it carries.
Not to mention it's ability to take hits.
But yes, I'd like to see the gun pods on the Stuka. I love that plane and a small clips not a problem. No more so than the Hurri IID.
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What do you consider the 'merits' of the existing stuka?
N00k :aok
Saw a 2 weeker ask the other day if it would kill a tank. :rofl
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What do you consider the 'merits' of the existing stuka?
I wasn't arguing against the Ju87G, I was arguing against the argument being used to support it. I don't think that argument is valid and I think it might weaken the case for the Ju87G.
As to the Ju87G, I think it has more validity than the Il-2 armed with 37mm cannons and really see no reason for HTC not to add it when they update the Ju87. I'd also like to see an actual Battle of Britain/France/Norway/Poland Ju87 added when they are updated.
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I wasn't arguing against the Ju87G, I was arguing against the argument being used to support it. I don't think that argument is valid and I think it might weaken the case for the Ju87G.
As to the Ju87G, I think it has more validity than the Il-2 armed with 37mm cannons and really see no reason for HTC not to add it when they update the Ju87. I'd also like to see an actual Battle of Britain/France/Norway/Poland Ju87 added when they are updated.
Sorry I think I misread/misunderstood your original post :salute
N00k :aok
Saw a 2 weeker ask the other day if it would kill a tank. :rofl
I like to offload the nuke as soon as I can :D thats if you can even get to a decent height to drop her! Also makes up for my rubbish aim :lol drop it within half a mile and BOOOM result lol
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how many gay antelopes were hurt in the process of dropping said bomb with your aiming skills?
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how many gay antelopes were hurt in the process of dropping said bomb with your aiming skills?
In your position of 'Bruv119 Archbishop of Gay Antelopes' and one of the first members of the Gay Antelopes, you should know the stats on this matter and that it is not to be discussed in public in the full glare of non Gay Antelope members! :lol