Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Saxman on March 09, 2010, 06:19:01 PM
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The post about WEP duration in one of the other forums got me thinking about this:
The R-2800-8(W) with water injection wasn't introduced into the production line on the F4U-1 until after the switch to the bubble-top canopy, with all these F4U-1s built with the bubble canopy being redesignated as 1As. Very few, if any, Birdcage Hogs used the 8(W) unless they were retrofit in the field.
Since we now have the F4U-1A, WEP should really be removed from the F4U-1.
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I tend to agree with ya. Little to no differentiation between the two versions now (a little bit of horsepower here or there), this suggestions would make them more individual.
That would make the -1 a much better candidate for "early-early" setups, and the 1A more suited for "early" setups in events/setups.
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Now that's the sign of a true Corsair fan. Make it accurate above all else. Very cool to see.
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<---waits for AKDogg to jump in here and defend his bird :bolt:
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funny it never crossed my mind even after reading the VF-17 biography and the mentioning of that. In fact i think some of VF-17's early -1A's didn't have WEP either, but lets not go there.
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but lets not go there.
Too late dumba** :D
Now that's the sign of a true Corsair fan. Make it accurate above all else. Very cool to see.
I'd be even more impressed he actually flew the 1A. ;)
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Meh, fans want it to be good :)
I'm a fan (to pick another example) of the 109 line, and I'm perfectly happy that the F-4 lost the gondolas, that the G-6 lost the 30mm and galland hood, etc. Makes for a better chronological timeline of representative planes.
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I'd be even more impressed he actually flew the 1A. ;)
Actually I do fly the 1A. :P
funny it never crossed my mind even after reading the VF-17 biography and the mentioning of that. In fact i think some of VF-17's early -1A's didn't have WEP either, but lets not go there.
The 8(W) was introduced early enough in the "1A" line, though, that it should definitely still have WEP since most were built with this engine.
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Actually I do fly the 1A. :P
The 8(W) was introduced early enough in the "1A" line, though, that it should definitely still have WEP since most were built with this engine.
I meant -1 I made a typo in my haste to be a smarta**. :D
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While you're at it the VF-17 birdcage skin should be removed as well. VF-17 never flew the birdcage corsair in combat. They had transitioned to the 1A before they were deployed.
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While you're at it the VF-17 birdcage skin should be removed as well. VF-17 never flew the birdcage corsair in combat. They had transitioned to the 1A before they were deployed.
This is true VF-17 deployed on the USS Bunker Hill for Carrier Qualifications with F4U-1s. None of which saw combat as they were replaced with 1As when the squadron went operational in the Solomons. Gee Whiteman thanks for piping up. :D
Actually there are a couple famous VF-17 F4U-1 photos in most books. I think that's why people assume they flew the -1 in combat.
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LOL don't be too hard on him Shifty. I'm a big fan of VF-17 and have wondered for a while how we got the birdcage skin (which I use btw).
IIRC it was the Charger that VF-17 flew the -1's off of for the most part including their carrier qualifications. They did use Bunker Hill towards the end of their training phase but most of their carrier work was aboard Charger.
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Gee Whiteman thanks for piping up. :D
hey i mentioned the -1A not the -1 :o, i figured if Krusty hadn't noticed that skin never flew combat nobody ever would. this my vote to keep it in, unless some one wants to skin another VF-17 -1A to replace it or we could be consistent and skin a VF-17 4-Hog that didn't fight either. :D
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LOL don't be too hard on him Shifty. I'm a big fan of VF-17 and have wondered for a while how we got the birdcage skin (which I use btw).
IIRC it was the Charger that VF-17 flew the -1's off of for the most part including their carrier qualifications. They did use Bunker Hill towards the end of their training phase but most of their carrier work was aboard Charger.
My Jolly Roger by Blackburn book is on loan at the moment to a JG-11 guy... You may be correct I'm going by Ospry's Corsair Aces of WWII I can't find any mention of the Charger just the BH.
<S>
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They Qualified on Charger and shipped out to the Pacific on Bunker Hill. They were unloaded at Pearl Harbor and loaded on the Prince William and headed for Espiritu Santo.
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Hey, don't blame ME! I love a lot of planes, the corsair just doesn't grab my attention like, say, a 109 or a p39 or something.
:banana:
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I clipped this from the htc F4U-4 plane info. website. If anything, the -1 and -1A may be ok with WEP and need to be upgraded with the same hard points as the -1C.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/F4U-4 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/F4U-4) :
Throughout 1943 and 1944, and into the beginning of 1945, Vought continued upgrading the F4U Corsair's "1-Series." The F4U-1, 1A, 1D and 1C, however, all shared the same core, and modifications and updates were often implemented in the field on earlier variants as they were introduced in the factory on the later models (for example 1As still in service were retrofit to carry the same wingroot pylons and four rocket tab positions used on the 1C).
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I clipped this from the htc F4U-4 plane info. website. If anything, the -1 and -1A may be ok with WEP and need to be upgraded with the same hard points as the -1C.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/F4U-4 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/F4U-4) :
No, it isn't ok with WEP. No birdcage Corsairs I'm aware of ever carried the 8(W) engine. They all used the 2800-8, which didn't have WEP.
Also, the 1A doesn't need to be upgraded with the pylons. If you read more closely, the 1A wasn't factory built that way. It was essentially a field mod.
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If anything, the -1 and -1A may be ok with WEP and need to be upgraded with the same hard points as the -1C.
Like the 1D, the aircraft was fitted with two main pylons inboard of the landing gear, and rocket tabs for four 5" HVARs on each wing, for a total of 8. The wing-mounted fuel tanks were eliminated, and even more of the fabric-covered wing surface was replaced with metal.
It says like the 1D the aircraft was fitted with two hardpoints. Not like the -1 and -1A.
Reading is fundamental.
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The various improvements to the F4U-1 were the bubble canopy, the center rack, and the -8W engine. Those improvements were gradually "standardised" to the point where giving it the "A" designation came along to differentiate it from the earlier configurations. The upgrades did not all happen at once, and many a/c had some but not the other improvements.
So the F4U-1 with the -8W would represent either later models of that version, or older models that had the engine swapped out from an -8 to a -8W.
The "birdcage" F4U-1 soldiered on well into 1944.
So I think its "correct" to have it with either.
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I'd go for a de-WEPed Birdcage.
But it would be nice if they could be the "land-based" version without arresting and wing-folding hardware. Woo hoo. :aok
Sax would know more about that than I. :D
Best.
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I'd go for a de-WEPed Birdcage.
But it would be nice if they could be the "land-based" version without arresting and wing-folding hardware. Woo hoo. :aok
Sax would know more about that than I. :D
Best.
I've been wanting that as a clipboard option in the 1A. It's not a field mod, either. The majority of Corsairs (FG-1As and FG-1Ds) produced by Goodyear were factory-built that way.
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lol, take the wep away and then see what I do in a -1a. You guys wouldn't have a chance then. 2 main reasons I fly the -1. 1 because it has a eny value of 25 which we rarely hit. 2nd reason is to give u all a chance.
BTW, like someone mentioned here in this post, the -1 did have wep in the later because of improvements. Originally they didn't when they first came out but was added shortly after.
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lol, take the wep away and then see what I do in a -1a. You guys wouldn't have a chance then. 2 main reasons I fly the -1. 1 because it has a eny value of 25 which we rarely hit. 2nd reason is to give u all a chance.
BTW, like someone mentioned here in this post, the -1 did have wep in the later because of improvements. Originally they didn't when they first came out but was added shortly after.
Dogg,
Everything that I can find points to WEP not being introduced into the Corsairs until AFTER the change to the -1A. I can't find anything that shows the 8(W) engine was ever used operationally in the -1. It would be FAR more representative for HTC to remove WEP from it.
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A big doh! for shifty, the quote I clipped was from an HTC F4U-4 page. That is an -4 not a -1 in the title.
Lol I agree, reading is essential, especially the heading. :confused:
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!!!!
Let's not do anything hasty. Just in my second month or so of flying the -1 and I love the damn thing. Let's debate this for a while and then quietly let it drop...
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!!!!
Let's not do anything hasty. Just in my second month or so of flying the -1 and I love the damn thing. Let's debate this for a while and then quietly let it drop...
If something is incorrect the sooner it gets fixed the better. The -1 didn't have the water-injection R2800-8(W), this wasn't introduced until the 1A.
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So, if a -1 were field upgraded with a -8(W) it would become an -1A designation? If this is true, then yes, technically speaking -1's never had a -8(W)? So, this thread may be more like compairing apples to oranges?
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The key difference between the -1 and early 1As was the replacement of the canopy with the partial-framed bubble and the stall strip on the leading edge of the right wing. Sometime after this change Vought began fitting the 1As with the 8(W) engine in the factory.
Any -1 Birdcages with 8(W)s would have been retrofit in the field later, but because of HTC's own policy on field mods that doesn't justify WEP on the -1 (otherwise we may as well get the dive brakes on the P-38J).
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well if it does happen my perk reaper and I will be climbing a bit higher.
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I still remember this story as "Trapped by Zekes at Rabaul," but in any case, it says WEP was just installed in Feb 1944.
While returning to base on 19 Febuary 1944, Kepford spotted a low Japanese seaplane. Although he was alone (his wingman was forced to abort earlier, and Kepford was retained to cover bombers on-route to Rabaul), Kepford dived down and flamed the plane. He was then attacked by a flight of three Zekes, which dived onto him with a massive altitude advantage. Kepford took full advantage of the newly-installed water injection WEP to stretch out the chase, but the Zekes' energy advantage allowed them to slowly narrow the gap. As the lead Zeke opened fire, Kepford decided to "go for broke." He dropped his flaps and landing gear and nosed down until he was skimming the waves; as the Zeke roared over him, he pulled his Hog's nose up and opened fire. The Zeke's stabilizer crumpled under the snapshot, and the plane crashed into the waves. As Kepford pulled in his gear and flaps, the remaining two Zekes bracketed him . . . he was facing 2-to-1 odds, low and slow, and he was heading back in the direction of Rabaul. Kepford ran his throttle as far open as possible, and after gaining some speed he cut across the path of the port Zeke. The Japanese plane dropped to wavetop level, opened fire, and sharply turned to fall onto his six . . . at which point the Zeke's left wing caught a wave top, and the plane cartwheeled across the ocean surface, disintegrated, and sank. The third Zeke was left behind as Kepford dashed for home, landing on fumes in his fuel tank.
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Which what we have is a later-production F4U-1A c.mid to late-1944.