Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: funkedup on July 19, 2001, 11:07:00 AM
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Please fix!
(http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix/images/rollrates.jpg)
Yes this is a troll. The guys saying the Fw 190 rolls too slow have selective eyesight and memory. The roll rate may be too slow in AH, but the NACA data supports this only at low speeds. And if you extrapolate the curves above, it looks like the AH 190 may have vastly greater roll performance than real life at speeds above 350 mph.
[ 07-19-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]
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very true.
also true that the spitfire non clipped rolls far too well, as well as many other planes on that list.
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I have seen 3 charts of AH 190 roll rates and none of them agree. Perhaps the first item on the agenda would be to come up with some accurate and consistent measurements :).
Second, perhaps the overmodelled FunkedUp troll-rate could be addressed.
Hooligan
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Tried some offline testing myself on rollrates and dicovered two things.
1. At 250MPH AH FW190A5 rolls 360 degress pretty close to 2 seconds flat.
2. That I suck at offline testing. With a stopwatch in my hand I had an incredibly hard time gauging roll rates and my results were all over the place. I think roll rate in AH is as much of a function of joystick calibration as it is A/C modeling.
In all honesty the 190 is pretty close to a 2 second roll which is 180 degrees per second. Faster than the NACA chart would indicate.
I would like someone else to try this and post the film. Remember to turn auto trim off when testing because it holds the A/C in place for almost a 1 count.
Some of th A/C in AH I believe are over modeled in roll rate especially at high speed.
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Lest we forget, thanks to Jekyll for his hard work on that chart.
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Just to add in my opinion, it seems that for me I can roll the 190A5 slightly faster than most of the guys I face.
I'm not sure if this is lag or if it's because of my joystick: Saitek X36 USB (digital)
I get perfect readouts on my joystick and it goes to full deflection no problem (100% deflection and doesn't jump around)..
Could this produce the various results people are getting with the same plane?
If so, it might be best to make sure the joystick isn't spiking or is in really good calibration before you run the test.
I haven't calibrated my X36 in over a year (can't calibrate it except for in the game actually...) and it's still smooth as glass.
Just thought I'd throw this in.
-SW
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I've heard a lot of guys say that the switch to USB controls changed the way the planes fly and handle.
Merely saying that differing results may have a lot of causal factors.
(BTW, I've got the CH USB stuff on my list of Christmas presents to me. ;) )
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Its simple..did the LW have the USB or analog version..
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LOL!
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Agree 100% funkedup.
Please, fix the 190 and the rest of the planes.
hey funkedup, take 1 min to substract the area of "gained" roll rate from the area of "lost" roll rate of 190 ...
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You're absolutely right funked .. the 190 SHOULD be toned down above about 300 mph. If you recall my very first post on the subject .. way back when I first did the testing ... I mentioned there that the 190 rolled too fast at high speed.
Funny how people never remember comments like those, ain't it :)
Out of interest, how does the Typhoon roll now with the newest FM? Has anyone compared its new rollrate with the NACA curve on the above chart?
Oh, and F4UDOA, you're right about the testing method. I think the most boring 3 or 4 nights I ever spent in AH were offline testing of the aircraft rollrates. By a very strange coincidence, the testing method I came up with exactly mirrored what the NACA engineers did (well, with the exception of the 50lb stick force limit)
5 individual rolls to the left, 5 individual rolls to the right. Each timed with a stopwatch from level trimmed flight.
Timing a single roll simply won't give you accurate results. No matter HOW hard you try, you'll always click that stopwatch either just before or just after you throw the stick over. Doing multiple individual rolls tends to even out these deficiencies.
One other thing to watch for is maintaining an absolutely level attitude during the roll testing. I must have done about 400 rolls which I couldn't include in the test results, mainly because I let the nose drop low during the roll. As soon as the nose goes low, airspeed increases (which generally tends to speed up the roll), plus when you try to maintain attitude by applying up elevator you tend to snap the aircraft around, resulting in a much quicker roll rate than that available by using aileron alone.
[ 07-23-2001: Message edited by: Jekyll ]