Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Animal on February 18, 2001, 03:54:00 PM
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Ok, so last week I was thinking to myself why all the LW whinning.
I tried the 109g6 out in the TA against an experienced player (RWY) and kept up with his P-51, he killed me most times but I still gave him a hard time.
I liked the plane so I kept learning its quirks, low 30mm velocity, and all that.
Well after some time I OWNED the TA with that plane wich I believe is MUCH better than the F4U-C and is about as good as the NIKI. The 30mm may only have 60 rounds on the MA but how much cannon do you need to down a plane? a good shot can get in range and put a SINGLE or two 30's on a target to bring it down. Its like flying an Osty, as Creamo remarked.
I then said "ok, so these guys must be all newbies" but no, most of them were actually good. I then tried the G10 and AGAIN I owned the arena.
Whats the deal?
I always thought the 109 was the most porked plane in the arena from reading your crying and whinning. I then check my stats and find out I get killed more by 109 and 190 than by CHOGS, and from memory, I get killed more by 109 than niki (for those who check my stats Ive been killed by niki so many times because I keep trying to take off from a capped field)
109 may not be super uber, but its not whinning material. You guys are blaming the planes other people fly for your deaths, when you should probably be blaming mistakes you made in a fight.
BUT, the 109 is one ugly plane, and I have no intentions of flying that piece of crap. I will go back to my P-38 wich I find much more of a challenge, and go happily LOOKING OUT for CHOGS to kill. Because you know what? THEY ARE EASY KILLS.
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A-freaking-men. Preach on!!
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Yep. G-10 is a monster. Should be perked along with P-51D and F4U-1C and any other late war wonders.
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Originally posted by Animal:
Well after some time I OWNED the TA with that plane wich I believe is MUCH better than the F4U-C and is about as good as the NIKI.
Good troll, Animal (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) a 109G6 as good as a N1K2 and Chog (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) Funny as hell (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Animal in the TA the 109 has 600 rounds of 30mm making shooting and hitting with the 108 wayyy easier, Ive done this in TA too where I had everyone more or less hunting me dow cuz I was terroizing the TA in the G10. Thry this same thing with only 60 bullets and an MA environment full of hard turning nikis, spits and chogs. its not the same with 10X less ammo.
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I realized the ammo issue so I decided to only kill my targets with only one or two 30mm
I killed around 9 guys each with only one or two 30mm rounds. You can kill around 10 people with the 30mm cannon in the MA if you have the skill to do so.
RAM - I can sometimes understand people whinning about the niki, it is a good plane (not invincible tho) but the CHOG? hahaha damn you must be doing something AWFULLY wrong because it is a very very mediocre plane at best. I SEEK OUT CHOGS IN THE MAIN ARENA.
The only hawgs I fear are those flown by KBMAN and TORQUE.. and TORQUE DOESNT FLY ANYMORE.
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109 is a somewhat hard plane to fly due to its Torque..something the F4U SHOULD be like.
I like it, its a good fighter, but not Uber. The G10 can become a helicopter on the vertical when WEP is on, but hey, that makes them sitting ducks too (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
P-38 RULES YOU ALL. ! ! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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TORQUE? lol.
Nothing you cant handle in AH. In fact, you trim the plane well, and you cant even feel the torque.
LOL I bet most of these LW pilots if they switch to the F4U they wouldnt even get many kills.
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Animal every time I fly chog or niki I get a bunch of kills, just yesterday I shamed myself into a quick 7 kill chog sortie. Few weeks ago I had 11 kill niki sortie vs a bunch of people trying to capture my base, and who were vulching at will as ack was dead. There is no way you can make a comparison between 109 ease of killing and that of chog or niki. The 109 locks up immedatly in dive, it cant roll well at most any speed, chog outurns it at most speeds and at all speeds if chog has any E, the niki always outurns 109. The niki and chog each have 900rds of ammo which kills out to 600-900yds, 400yds 6oc shot is an extreme long range shot in 30mm. Animal you are one of the better pilots here, and good E-fighter types can do well in 109. Most cant thats why there are few 109s in MA compared to chog and niki. Average people vote with the planes they fly and damn near half choose chogs or nikis, not 109.
Now I fly the 109 a lot, so it obviously has good points that I find attracive. Its fast and accels well, it has good climb rate, and I do like the 30mm. But those are much much more difficult to use than nikis stupid FM and chogs heavy guns and questionable FM.
On the point of the MK108 30mm cannon, yes its very "efficient" as Hartmann once said, however it has serious limitations, it has terrible velocity-so no miracle 400 yard niki/chog snapshots. It has terrible ROF compared to others. Plus 60 rds dont last that long in MA.
If the 30 is so uber, may I suggest a trade. Any chog/niki pilot who thinks 30mm is uber and unfair, GRUNHERZ would be more than willing to swap armament. You guys get awesome lo-velocity 30mm cannon with 60rds and a veritable death array of 2 MG131, and I get your 4 20mm cannon.
Sorry bout some of the sarcasm, but comparing 109 to niki/chog cannot go unchallenged, it simply doesnt make sense.
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Well the TA is a much easier enviroment than the MA, I gotta give you that..
Alright this is what I'm gonna do. Next tour I will try to fly the 109 as much as the P38 and see the results. Anyways I need the perk points, last tours have been a joke for me since I almost never fly seriously (rolling from capped fields, flying thru CV acks, etc)
I need a challenge anyways so next tour I'll be a semi-luftobble.
[This message has been edited by Animal (edited 02-18-2001).]
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I only used 2 of the 800 rounds of 30mm in the TA..
we believe ya ...
larry.
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i have never whined about the 109 or the 190-a5
the 190-a8, OTOH, is pretty porked IMO
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why would I need to use more than 2 30mm rounds on a plane at 100 yards or less.
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Isn't the 190A8 designed for bomber hunting, and has WORSE performance than the A5? It has a slight better engine, but added armor plating and such bring its flight characteristics down a bit below an A5.
Everyone in WarBirds used to fly the A4 in preference to the A8.
Anybody done imperical testing of our game's two Focke-Wulfs?
Hans.
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yeah why would you want to go around furballing in a plane thats a brick.
Its a buffhunter and ground attack.
sadly, it sucks for ground attack, but we will get the F8 for that.
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Originally posted by Animal:
why would I need to use more than 2 30mm rounds on a plane at 100 yards or less.
You wouldnt need more than 2 30mm rounds. OTOH, if you were driving a CHog, you wouldn't need to get within 100yds. Get anywhere within 500-600 yds and let fly!
Oh, BTW Animal. You MAY find that the guys in the MA actually check their 6 from time to time, unlike many you'll see in the TA.
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When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
Chapter 13, verse 11
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YEAH, they do check their 6, but they will be unable to get me off it.
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Originally posted by Animal:
YEAH, they do check their 6, but they will be unable to get me off it.
no need to do that, the high F4Uc that comes from 25K will wipe your bellybutton instead (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Zigrat, whats wrong with the 190A8?
Its performance in AH (at least the charts, I haven't tested in game for a version or two) exactly matches the performance charts I have from both the english translation of the Focke Wulf Pilots Handbook, and the testing performed by the US after the war.
The only thing I can find is that our version doesn't have GM1, but then again the pilots handbook states that it was very rare for this plane to have GM1. Even then, GM1 was only useful at very high altitude.
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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Just for the record, I cant hit a hangar with the 30mm, even if I've taxied inside it!
I've tried to learn to shoot and kill with the 30mm of the G-6, but its damn hard. Snapshots are practically impossible, you really have to get in CLOSE to kill. I usually end up wasting all of my 30mm ammo, trying desperately to get dead-6 hits from 100-200 yds. I get most of my G-6 kills with the 13mms.
But every once in a month or so, when everything goes right and you RTB with 5 single ping 30mm kills - that feels good. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
And btw, anyone trying to tell the G-6 is über in the MA must be out of his mind!
Camo
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Camouflage
XO, Lentolaivue 34
www.muodos.fi/LLv34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34)
Brewster into AH!
"The really good pilots use their superior judgement to keep them out of situations
where they might be required to demonstrate their superior skill."
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He is trolling, Camo. I'm sure as hell that Creamo has teached him how to do it, because he has hooked some great fishes in a couple of hours (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
[edit]BTW two weeks ago I owed the TA for half an hour raking a 20 kill sortie...
in a zeke. Perk it! Its über!!!
Again, Animal;great troll (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)[/edit]
[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 02-18-2001).]
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The Fw 190A-8 was NOT designed for bomber hunting. I'd like to see someone produce some evidence that it was...
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Juzz did I say it was designed as a buff hunter? said it IS a buff hunter, cause thats the only thing that piece o' crap is worth for. Or you are trying to tell me the A8 is a dogfighter? please.
It is a HO plane. As it was in real life.
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vermillion, on the deck with the boost of the special feature or whatever the 190a8 had, it should produce 2000 hp under 1000 m
at 1000 m (~3000 ft) the 190a5 (8500 lb) climbs at 3900 ft/sec under WEP (8500 lbs/1700 horses)= 5 lb/hp
the 190a8 at 1000 m with a weight of 9500 lb and a power of 2000 hp (power loading of 4.75 lb/hp) climbs at 3100 FPM under wep.
sound fishy to you too?
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lol Animal, go back to your 38 and stay away from our planes...
You no nothing about the 190, I could beat your bellybutton anytime anywhere in my A8 vs your 38. I dunno where this bs you're spewing is comin' from but it sure is pure... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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yawn......ok animal fly the g6 and show us how uber it is...MA not TA...TA is where people practice stuff so 9 times out of 10 when i fly in TA its just to muck around and test stuff.I dont fly thesame in MA.
190A8 is still my favourite
hazed
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I'll bite (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
Huge difference between TA and MA.
Nuff said (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif).
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"All your base/are belong to us"
http://www.thefever.com/AYB2.swf
Keep up the momentum!
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Yes, lets bite. AH's 109G-6 is a truck. Ours is an early G-6, just an heavy G-2. Oh yeah, with 2x13mm deadly MG.
Ah, and dont forget to click the "Outstanding Situational Awareness" and "Always Fly Fast and 5K Above The Foe" buttons while you are in the hangar (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
[This message has been edited by gatt (edited 02-19-2001).]
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I'm definitely not the best pilot on here. I fly the 109F-4 a lot because I noticed that I did just as well in it as any other plane I've flow and I get more perk points doing it. I just looked at my stats and I have a 1.5 to 1 KD ratio in a 109F-4 and a 1.4 to 1 in my favorite plane the P-38. I haven't flown the P-38 as much lately so that accounts for the slightly lower ratio I'm sure. I mostly fly without the external guns. What I feel is the big advantage with the 38 and the 109 is the centerline guns. I think my gunnery is better. The 109 seems to be very competitive in a dog fight. If your trying to disengage your going to have a hard time in a 109F-4 anyway because it's slow. It's roll rate isn't great either. But use it's superior climb combined with a good rate of turn and you'll do well. The 190 in any of the game versions gives me fits. I can't seem to do a thing with it. I almost never fly it.
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I had a 5/1 K/D in the P47D in the main arena.
Its uber (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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If I would have to rack up alot kills in little time and survive, I would pick spitfrie.
with some 30mm 109 it takes too long.. besides I prefer more accurate 20mm anyway (13 shots = kill)
G10 is probably most capable surviver out of 109's.
Though, it can't do maneuvers like spit or n1k2 even closely.. so, once in trouble and you can't accerlate away, its time for goodbye.
Yak does almost same as G10, and far more better.. (its controls feels alot lighter)
though, I still will hit alot better with 109.
109F4 is good, but too slow..
but its good against people who thinks it as G10 and goes for turn fight just to realise that it was F4 after they've been shot down. (if they ever realise it.. hehe ive had people asking me how did I get the 109 turn so good)
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I personally like that G2, its a nifty little machine, very good turner/climber but like all 109's sucks in a dive. That's where the 109 falls short of being one of the best compared to the top 5 a/c...the others can dive out of danger, the 109 can only climb out of danger.
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My main problem with all 109's is the lack of rudder authority or general controls in a dive. Can't do anything with it if the enemy just turns a little when you set up that perfect dive.
The A8, however, responds even at close to 600mph (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif). As does the A5, which I fly now.
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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"All your base/are belong to us"
http://www.thefever.com/AYB2.swf
Keep up the momentum!
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Any post that LW planes aren't hobbled bi-planes with shotguns for weapons is a troll? At least to the luftwhiners. That's a fact.
Just look at the leather clad lw's pouring in in the G6's defense here in such a short time.
The facts are that it's not that say a late war George shouldn't be better than the G6. It certainly is. But to a degree that you guys spend a presidential campaign sized effort to say that the chog and nik are ruining the game? That you must be some expert to fly LW planes? There is that big of diffrence in plane ability? How about this one, "I have to use Combat Trim at low level in the G10." BS.
I started flying the G6 one night, and got like even a kill to death ratio. It's hard to get a plane you've never flown before and do well, but I was very suprised at the G6. I fly til Im dead, and usually have a 50/50 kill death over a tour, mostly in nik, so that was surprising.
Boys, the LW planes just aint that bad. Here's some weaknesses for the G6 I found in only about a hour in it.-
Dismal long range gunnery. Its a in tight wapon thats for sure. I did try to run from a nik, and was hosed at 500 by a huge long burst. I shoulda jinked more, but I know that long gunnery just chaps yer asses. The other planes can waste you from far out, agreed.
Still, a G6 at 200 yrs absolutley decimates aircraft with the .30mm. 2 shells? I dont know, but I was completely amazed a short burst cut it in half. Felt like a Osti to me. I will be going into the TA to test that very soon indeed. Ill get Animal as a drone and the facts will be posted.
It compresses badly, but I found the climb rate more that makes up for it. And it turns great. HAd really good Niki battles in it. Seemed even as I was brand new to it.
Bottom line is the late war planes are better, but not by the huge amount you guys cry about.
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Funny, I haven't seen LW whine about Chog or Niki in a long bellybutton time, maybe save for RAM, but he's not LW anymore.
How about this one, "I have to use Combat Trim at low level in the G10." BS.
Thats right, if CT is in the game I will use it to its fullest--especially against a high N1K2 that can't even beat me with 5k alt, really pathetic some of those niki dweebs I tell ya.
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Oh and btw, we never said our current planeset is 'bad' per se, it's just that we want a better plane thats suitable for the arena, such as the D9--the Allies have the P51 and LW have nothing that can match P51 as an arena plane. What I mean by that is high speed control, good dive, and fast. The current 190s shine in the former but lack in the latter.
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While I am all for more planes of any kind, I have to say I do better overall in the German stuff. I have tried to fly the Mustang a lot in the last tour (just to see what the fuss is about), and in a couple hops back in the 109 was able to kill more effectively and survive more. To each his own, I suppose...
I don't, and never did, think that the LW was that poorly represented here.
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Nath we had GLASSES the other day in the arena clogging the buffer about how the chog was cheating and how he was going to quit.
He then followed a B-17 from a 6'o clock position, SLOW, and OBVIOUSLY the B-17 chewed him up, he started whinning about the 109 being porked, he left the arena whinning about how hes going to quit.
I'm used to arguing with him since high school so I said "alright, I'll just try the 109 out and see how porked it is"
I was expecting a plane that would be a pig at everything, but I found out its even more capable at many things than my P-38.
All this blahblah about how it rolls slow, etc, well thats a moot point because YOU ARE SUPOSED TO BE OUTSTANDING PILOTS and slow roll rate and diving should be just nuisances and not prevent you from killing nikis and (*snicker*) THE CHOG.
When I was a new P-38 pilot I used to whine a lot about many things, because I was doing bad in it. Now that I know my plane and what its capable of, I think its the best in the arena. Sometimes I fly the niki and I dont even get as many kills as in my P-38.