Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Terrain Editor => Topic started by: dkff49 on April 12, 2010, 08:10:35 PM
-
I am still playing around with the TE and now have come across a couple of questions that I am having trouble finding the answer to in the wiki or anywhere else.
When applying elevation to the terrain how do you get the different elevations to show on the clipboard map?
For example in any of the maps currently being used in the MA's you can visually see by the colors on the clipboard map that there are elevation changes and where they are.
Also does anyone know how the new strat system effects the way they are laid out in the TE?
edit: one more question: what is an average distance that a spawn would be from a base?
-
<snip>
When applying elevation to the terrain how do you get the different elevations to show on the clipboard map?
For example in any of the maps currently being used in the MA's you can visually see by the colors on the clipboard map that there are elevation changes and where they are.
Load the elevation file, terrain.elv, into Photoshop. I'm not familiar enough with Photoshop to guide you. I think GIMP will also load the elevation file.
<snip>
Also does anyone know how the new strat system effects the way they are laid out in the TE?
For an MA terrain, you need to use the prebuilt cs groups. The old stand alone strat factories won't work for the MA.
-
With the strats now, do you pick only one spot to put them on the larger maps? The reason I ask is with the retreating strats, I am not sure if we can choose the 2 locations for each side or does HT choose the forward location or the rear.
-
The builder picks their locations. It's detailed in the Readme, or in this forum somewhere. Sorry, I don't build MA terrains, so I don't keep up with the details.
-
dkff49 you don't load the .elv file in photo shop instead you use the exported elevation bitmap, as well as your gndtype.bmp, and you can make
a really nice looking CBM.
:salute
midi
-
mrmidi that is a pretty nifty little feature. i assume you use several elevation bmp's and layer them to get the elevation to show on the cbm.
i guess i would need to apply a slightly different shading to each layer to make it show the elevations.
-
Thanks Midi, I forgot about that.
-
Your welcome Easy...
dkff49 I use a couple different filters with the elevation bit map...emboss, invert the colors and so on with a couple copies of the
elevation, and opacity settings..
:salute
midi
-
i see now.
thanks midi
-
dkff49 you don't load the .elv file in photo shop instead you use the exported elevation bitmap, as well as your gndtype.bmp, and you can make
a really nice looking CBM.
:salute
midi
Now I know I am officially being a pain but is it normal for the elevation bitmap and gndtype bitmap to be off center when trying to use those to generate a cbm? Or maybe I just don't understand as well as I originally thought?
I used those to come up with a generic just to try it out and all my bases were off when comparing it to the features on the map. It seems that it shifts things up and to right a little.
I guess if that is normal I will need to just use paint or photshop to shift the pic back to a good position or the other thing i have been playing around with doing is to use the original map and taking the elevation bitmap and using stretch/skew in paint to make the elevation 200% then using photo editing software to lay that on top of the map in the right position. This seemed to work nicely so far but we'll see after I have had a chance to do it with more detail and a wider sample.
-
Now I know I am officially being a pain but is it normal for the elevation bitmap and gndtype bitmap to be off center when trying to use those to generate a cbm?
I'm having the issue of my elevation bitmap is off-center to up & right. Can't figure out what I'm doing wrong.
-
Two things to consider first are the elevation bitmap is size 1024 x 1024, and the ground type bit map is size 4096 x 4096.
Don't know if you already considered that or not but just pointing it out.
A screen shot of what you are looking at helps in figuring out the problem to.
Will try to look into this this evening when I get home.
And no your not being a pain in the but* :)
:salute
midi
-
I did notice that and tried it a few different ways.
I left them both their original size
made them both 4096x4096 and both 1024x1024
resizing before mating them together
resizing after mating them together
and none of these methods worked. no matter what i did they came out up and to right of the center.
-
There are several ways to tackle this. If you have photoshop this is how I do things.
GETTING THE SHAPE OF YOUR LAND FOR A CBM
===================================
1) Take the file you used to create waterc.bmp and use the eyedropper to select water black color. Remember for waterbmp black is water and white is land .. you should only have these two color but when you resize from 16384x16384 .
2) The on the tap nav bar in photoshop click on Select.
3) Change the fuziness to 100 then click okay. This should create a mask of your water areas (black colors).
4) Create a new layer and then fill the masked area you created with a color (blue for water .. remember you will have to change your image mode from indexed color to RGB color before you can actually start using colors again).
5) Resize the file you used to create waterc.bmp to 1024x1024.
Now you have a file that has one layer that is your water and the unfilled areas (which other layers will be seen through) as your land.
ELEVATION
========
There are couple affects you can do here. But for simplicity sake lets just put the elevation in place.
1) Take your elevation map bmp file which is 4096 x 4096 and resize it to 1024 x 1024.
2) Do a select all and then copy it.
3) Go to the file you that you were working on where you created a water layer and just do a paste. This will create a new layer with the elevation image you copied.
When you copy this file it should fit exactly in place since it is 1024 x 1024 and you are placing it into a graphic that is 1024 x 1024.
4) Move the elevation image to be a layer below the water layer. You will see the elevation image only in place which are not filled in on the layer above it (the water layer).
Now you can do all sorts of fun stuff to start creating textures. You can create a layer under the elevation and fill the whole layer green. Then you could take the elevation layer and drop its transparency to say 20% so you can the green through it. You can then dupe the elevation layer (create a new layer with the graphic) drop its transparency and then offset it to give some relief highlights.
But the initial key is to work in 1024x1024 and to setup your water and land area correctly.
-
ELEVATION
========
There are couple affects you can do here. But for simplicity sake lets just put the elevation in place.
1) Take your elevation map bmp file which is 4096 x 4096 and resize it to 1024 x 1024.
2) Do a select all and then copy it.
3) Go to the file you that you were working on where you created a water layer and just do a paste. This will create a new layer with the elevation image you copied.
When you copy this file it should fit exactly in place since it is 1024 x 1024 and you are placing it into a graphic that is 1024 x 1024.
4) Move the elevation image to be a layer below the water layer. You will see the elevation image only in place which are not filled in on the layer above it (the water layer).
Now you can do all sorts of fun stuff to start creating textures. You can create a layer under the elevation and fill the whole layer green. Then you could take the elevation layer and drop its transparency to say 20% so you can the green through it. You can then dupe the elevation layer (create a new layer with the graphic) drop its transparency and then offset it to give some relief highlights.
But the initial key is to work in 1024x1024 and to setup your water and land area correctly.
Unless something has changed the "Exported" Elevation Bitmap should already be 1024 x 1024, the gndtype.bmp file is 4096 x 4096
at least all mine are...
:salute
midi
-
I do appreciate all the help guys but ghostdancer I don't seem to be able to find the waterc.bmp and if the elevation bitmap fits directly over it without adjustment then things will still be offset up and right of the center since my elevation bitmaps all seem to be off this direction.
The way I figured this out was to export the elevation and then make it my CBM after closing the TE back down, reopen the TE, and in the CBM right click and click on show bases. my bases all seem to be off from where they are supposed to be on the CBM but are right on the terrain.
I'll try to come up with a pic of what I am talking about as soon as I get some time, hopefully tonight.
-
Just sent you a PM dkff49
:salute
midi
-
You are correct in that the CBM is scaled in-game, and the east and north pixels are clipped out of your CBM. The number of pixels clipped out depends on the size of the terrain. iirc, something similar, but less drastic occurs to the south and west. It has to do with mapping half a terrain cell around the borders to the bitmap.
Adding to the confusion for some, the in-game icons represent the tower, not the base. They don't scale well, are not for showing the borders of the base, and they change size and even position relative to the CBM terrain as you zoom.
-
Your right Midi I was thinking the ground type map that you use to set vegetation.
dff49 how are you creating land? Are you doing it in the TE? The other method of creating it is to create a waterc.bmp file that maps the land based on what you drew in that graphic file.
-
I have been creating the land in the TE. Is there another method?
-
He's still in the beginning stages of working with the TE GD.
We haven't quite gotten to working with the ground type bit map and the water depth bit map yet.
That's in one of my up coming tutorials after I finish the "Working with Elevations in the TE" tutorial part 1.
OOPs I let the cat out of the bag on the name of the next tutorial :lol
:salute
midi
-
Okay, I see now MrMidi. I thought he was doing it via the waterc.bmp method.
dkff49 yes there is another method MrMidi will explain but basically there are two ways of doing things. You can either do it in the TE or you can use several graphical files that you pull into the program that set your water, land, elevation, and ground type. To go that route you really need a good graphics program such as photoshop or gimp because it requires a lot of graphical work.
-
Now you tell me there's an easier way. I spent 5 hours last night, hand erasing water and painting ground types. :mad:
-
Yes it's an easier way to do all that externally with photo shop but, it's also very easy to mess the whole thing up if your not familiar with
the TE, and is files first.
It is possible to make the entire terrain using just an elevation bit map file and create your ground type, water depth file and the CBM,
before you even startup the TE. However it requires a lot of editing of each file first, then resizing them and so on.
We'll get to all these in future tutorials. My intent with starting my tutorials the way I did was to get people familiar with
the core building process before they start doing custom and nifty things, and getting past the initial intimidation of the TE.
:salute
midi
-
I've got the Elevation bitmap sorta figure out. Have a pretty sweet looking mountain range in the making. In playing with the elevation bitmap, I sure learned that even thou my eyes can't see a difference in the shade, the program sure does.
And a big thank you to you sir. Without your tutorials, I would have never gotten as far as I have with the TE, can't wait for the next part.
-
MrMidi is 110% right in that if you are not used to working in a graphics program you should first learn to create things in the TE. Graphics program can be very tricky.
As RamPytho found out the elevation bmp maps heights to colors. Basically you have 256 shades of black and white. Absolute black is sea level. Absolute white is the highest point in your elevation map. In between these you have 254 varying shades going from absolute white to absolute black.
On top of this depending on what you set your max elevation at each jump in color represents a different shift in feet.
Say you max elevation is 20,000 feet. Divide that by 255 and you will see that each color shift is 78.431 ft. So sea level (black or rgb 0,0,0) is 0 ft while the next rgb color of 1,1,1, is 78.431 and 2,2,2 is 156.862 and so on up to absolute white (rgb 255,255,255) which would be 20,000 ft.
Now if you have a different max elevation set. Say 11,000 ft then you divide that by 255 and see that every of the color shift changes is actually 43.137 ft.
This is good to know and advance stuff but I can not stress how right MrMidi is to say that this can get very, very tricky. Setting gndtype (terrain tiles via a graphic) can even be trickier since different colors tell what terrain to use or what terrain to blend with another terrain.
So follow what MrMidi is doing for now and he will work up to the advance stuff but believe me the advance stuff can get very very frustrating at times. Like when you have worked on a gndtype file for a long bit and then realized you color was just off by 1 value and that is why things weren't working out.