Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: stephen on May 15, 2010, 03:21:41 AM
-
The rockets are VERY hard to aim...
Like the 8" battery, the Rocket pod M4 needs a way of RELIABLY locating just egsactly at what degree it is firing, since when at full elevation, the ground isnt visible, and you cant see where your rockets are falling...
All im asking for is some EZ way to show the pods elevation in degrees, so I can pan the gunsite down, see where my rounds fall, and adjust my aim using the 1st shot to adjust the laying of the gunsite.
Im sure that the Calliopes had a way of judging deppression, and elevation..., shouldnt we a have the same information as well?, mabey even a range meter like the 8"? :aok
-
Actualy after further thought I realise that what is needed isnt so much a way to view degrees, but a "LAND MODE" setting like on the ship borne guns. (so the tank commander/gunner is looking straight forward, yet the rocket pods deppression/elevation can be changed WITHOUT making the gunner look up at the sky during firing.
When I think about it, the same rule should apply to the PT boat, as it suffers from much the same problem, (cant see the fall of the rockets because the site is pointed at blue sky)
Obviously if firing by line-of-site, the crew as a whole wouldnt be looking up at the sky at a 45% angle, they would watch the fall of the weapon, and adjust accordingly.
I really think this would be an OUTSTANDING addition to the game..., and it seems to fall in the realm of (historicaly accurate) :salute
-
this thread...started by the remaining few who cannot aim with the calliope :D
i've had no problem aiming the weapon since i got the hang of it and the M4A3 75mm full HE and calliope mount is my new base destroyer...It rivals lancasters now in destruction. I took out all 3 FH, and the VH at a small airfield yesterday and still had my 50AP rounds left...imagine if i brought the all HE loadout? and i have also sat on top of hills over towns, adjusted my aim with a rocket or two, then unleashed havoc on the towns. The calliope in every way is fine the way it is.
-
I can aim FINE as long as the target is still in the gunsite... HOWEVER, when the target is farther away, there no way to watch the fall of rounds without panning back down, and losing the angle at which the round was fired.
Even mortars have a site that looks straight ahead, so that if the target is under direct observation, the rounds can be seen, and the next round adjusted onto target.
Yes its a fine weapon, but there is room for improvment...
Why you would come out against such an obviouse improvment is beyond me..., but I expect this kind of narrow mindedness.
-
I can aim FINE as long as the target is still in the gunsite... HOWEVER, when the target is farther away, there no way to watch the fall of rounds without panning back down, and losing the angle at which the round was fired.
Even mortars have a site that looks straight ahead, so that if the target is under direct observation, the rounds can be seen, and the next round adjusted onto target.
Yes its a fine weapon, but there is room for improvment...
Why you would come out against such an obviouse improvment is beyond me..., but I expect this kind of narrow mindedness.
try going to f-8 while in the barrel and push up then rotate,,, works for me!
-
tried f8 in the gunners site, did nothing...
-
tried f8 in the gunners site, did nothing...
I use f-8 then i use page up, then i rotate the view with kp#8 works for me! I am trying to perfect it as we speak tho, gonna do some offline firing tests :bolt:
-
There was no "sight" to that thing...it could be "aimed" by facing the tank in the desired direction then adjusting elevation and launching...barrage effect when needed and artillery couldn't be called in. WWII rocket launchers were not precision devices like we have now...it was fire and forget but you didn't have precise control...and the vehicle mount/towed units were not long range devices.
-
Main gun sight, barrel & rockets at maximum elevation, rockets selected,, view adjusted with PgUp and keypad arrows while being in F8 mode:
(http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/584/clipboard01rr.jpg)
As one can see, no problem in observing the target area.
-
I agree to the topic's title, not so much the body of the OP. I remember reading that the rockets at least had tick marks (supposing it was just the same aiming optics used by the main gun) that could be used to aim them. Anything's better than a big red cross.
-
Now your going to tell me they didnt aim the thing...., and your going to tell me that the crew wasnt given a range table so they would know what angle to set the pod for a prescribed distance, nor was there a bubble on-board the tank so they would know that the entire contraption was level.... :headscratch:
OK..., then WHY hook it to the barrel so it can be elevated or deppressed?
You honestly expect me to beleive that our troops in Normandy where just firing rockets off willy nilly, just bounding across the landscape firing off a salvo whenever the urge struck them.
Not aiming at any particular area, nor recieving any targeting information, (distance, elevation, salvo),there wasn't a way of setting the pod to a particular elevation so it could be done repeatedly, no compass, no map...no form of fire control at all..., just some shmuck with a button, and a will to succeed.
The Vets where less like soldiers and more like free spirits.....YEAH!, free spirits spilling thier mirth upon the earth in the form of lite hearted high explosive entertainment for the Germans to enjoy.
(Though in recollection they wouldn't be landing rounds anywhere NEAR the Germans..., because they weren't AIMING.)
I found another way of accomplishing the same thing..., i've started switching to the drivers position in order to see where the rounds fall at hi elevation, so I suppose that in hindsite, its a bit of a moot point now huh?
I agree OOZ662 :aok
-
I found another way of accomplishing the same thing..., i've started switching to the drivers position in order to see where the rounds fall at hi elevation, so I suppose that in hindsite, its a bit of a moot point now huh?
No it isn't, because switching to the driver position is not as efficient. It's cumbersome, as you not only have to switch back & forth, but each time you go back to the gunner you have to re-select the rockets, or you will fire a cannon shell.
With F8 method you can simply shoot, adjust shoot, adjust very quickly.
-
Lusche, the F8 "mode" still elludes me, I got to the gunners station, and hit F8... and nothing happens.
What does hitting F8 accomplish in a GV? By that I mean, how is it diffrent than just sitting in the gunners seat and hitting page up?
-
Lusche, the F8 "mode" still elludes me, I got to the gunners station, and hit F8... and nothing happens.
What does hitting F8 accomplish in a GV? By that I mean, how is it diffrent than just sitting in the gunners seat and hitting page up?
You seem to missed one step in our descriptions ;)
Main gun sight, barrel & rockets at maximum elevation, rockets selected,, view adjusted with PgUp and keypad arrows while being in F8 mode:
F8 is pan view mode. Unlike the standard (f7) snap view, you can freely look around with those keys (or with the buttons on stick, of course). So hit PG up to raise your head, and then hit up arrow (8) to tilt your head down.
BTW, that's also the way "we" GVers can shoot and hit targets with the cannon at extremely long ranges.
-
No it isn't, because switching to the driver position is not as efficient. It's cumbersome, as you not only have to switch back & forth, but each time you go back to the gunner you have to re-select the rockets, or you will fire a cannon shell.
With F8 method you can simply shoot, adjust shoot, adjust very quickly.
ive actually found that switching to the hull gun position when on a ridgeline will help in accuracy when testing to find your target with one or two rockets better than the F8 mode because sometimes you are way too far away to use F8 to keep visual on your target. once i find my target i shoot all 60 fast while only moving the sight little by little and half of town goes down from a distance of a mile and a half away or so.
-
ive actually found that switching to the hull gun position when on a ridgeline will help in accuracy when testing to find your target with one or two rockets better than the F8 mode because sometimes you are way too far away to use F8 to keep visual on your target.
I'm slightly confused. How can you be too far away to use f8 in gunners view? I mean, after all it has much better zoom than the hull gunner position.
-
The rockets are only effective out to 2750 range on the target! no matter how much more you raise the gun 2750 is as far as they will go
I set up offline with a target and shot from 500 all the way to 3000 only hitting the 3000 one time firing over 600 rockets!
I also now have a scale to use to hit targets from 500 to 2750 without any problem.
while i like to use f-8 for this, it is not necessary with the gun pushed up but not zoomed in,, the bottom of the barrel on my screen is still farther than I can hit
this is very simple to do, go off line get the tank out point it north click .target 500 and go to work it took some time to find a base with flat ground extending 3000 out to the north but there are some!
next I went to the south side of town, put up the target then moved away from town till the target was in the building i wanted to hit, after ranging it I moved out another 500 till i got to 2750.
at 2750, if you keep raising the gun, the rockets start falling back at you based on trajectory.
this all took about 2 hours, I marked a piece of paper with the markers and have it on a sticky pad as well, now when i get to town i just put the sticky note up and fire away, you can also now rotate with f-8.
after firing just zoom in as soon as you fire and you can follow the rocket right to target, this is tough the first time or two but once you see it a few times it will become easy!
-
The rockets are only effective out to 2750 range on the target! no matter how much more you raise the gun 2750 is as far as they will go
I set up offline with a target and shot from 500 all the way to 3000 only hitting the 3000 one time firing over 600 rockets!
You should use another method.
I determined max firing range by going to max elevation, firing the rockets and filming it. In the film viewer, I was now able to measure the distance the impact point to my tank:
(http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/8047/clipboard01wz.jpg)
My tank is standing just where it spawned, right in front of the VH of that very base. As you can see, quite some distance: 5.1k
-
Now your going to tell me they didnt aim the thing...., and your going to tell me that the crew wasnt given a range table so they would know what angle to set the pod for a prescribed distance, nor was there a bubble on-board the tank so they would know that the entire contraption was level.... :headscratch:
OK..., then WHY hook it to the barrel so it can be elevated or deppressed?
You honestly expect me to beleive that our troops in Normandy where just firing rockets off willy nilly, just bounding across the landscape firing off a salvo whenever the urge struck them.
Not aiming at any particular area, nor recieving any targeting information, (distance, elevation, salvo),there wasn't a way of setting the pod to a particular elevation so it could be done repeatedly, no compass, no map...no form of fire control at all..., just some shmuck with a button, and a will to succeed.
The Vets where less like soldiers and more like free spirits.....YEAH!, free spirits spilling thier mirth upon the earth in the form of lite hearted high explosive entertainment for the Germans to enjoy.
(Though in recollection they wouldn't be landing rounds anywhere NEAR the Germans..., because they weren't AIMING.)
Obviously my response went right over your head. The calliope was attached to the barrel of the tank so they didn't have to get out and manually adjust the elevation...barrel elevation mechanism is stronger than a man. There wasn't a "sight" on the thing, nothing more than elevation markers and by moving the barrel of the tank the gunner could use the markings in the main gun sight to determine approximately where those rockets were going to land...not like firing a round out of the main gun which is more direct fire than the rockets.
I recommend you study the Calliope and the Nebelwerfer...you won't be so likely to make erroneous assumptions.
-
You should use another method.
I determined max firing range by going to max elevation, firing the rockets and filming it. In the film viewer, I was now able to measure the distance the impact point to my tank:
(http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/8047/clipboard01wz.jpg)
My tank is standing just where it spawned, right in front of the VH of that very base. As you can see, quite some distance: 5.1k
I started to do that! I did film it so as to measure that way, but after playing with it for a couple of hours I forgot!
that said I can effectively use them now, I am not sure I could at the range your talking, also I had the target up while filming so I will look at it and see what the difference is! ty bty for the info!
-
I'm slightly confused. How can you be too far away to use f8 in gunners view? I mean, after all it has much better zoom than the hull gunner position.
The zoom in the main gun view can only go so far lusche. I've effectively hit targets even in an indirect fashion if somebody is spotting (dare i say it was extremely hard to accomplish but very feasible). Through practice i believe i will be able to use an artillery spotter method soon where a dedicated spotter jeep or such tells me the target distance and i find some way to mark my gun (through F3 tank commander mode) to be able to mark my target very fast and be able to fire OVER hills and such without being spotted by the enemy. This will open up new AH GV tactics such as artillery lines to level bases and towns in seconds from barrage fire.
-
The zoom in the main gun view can only go so far lusche. I've effectively hit targets even in an indirect fashion if somebody is spotting (dare i say it was extremely hard to accomplish but very feasible). Through practice i believe i will be able to use an artillery spotter method soon where a dedicated spotter jeep or such tells me the target distance and i find some way to mark my gun (through F3 tank commander mode) to be able to mark my target very fast and be able to fire OVER hills and such without being spotted by the enemy. This will open up new AH GV tactics such as artillery lines to level bases and towns in seconds from barrage fire.
Yes... but you were saying "hull gun is better than gunner's F8 when you are too far away". But the gunner's view is much better than the hull gun in any case - you are stitting higher and the zoom is much better there. I see absolutely no advantage observing your own fire from hull gunner position.
Example: Im sitting on a ridge, town is at the limit of my rockets range. First view is from gunner's sight, second from hull gunner position (max zoom)
(http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/5952/98599615.jpg)
(http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9155/hulll.jpg)
-
the F8 idea works fine, played with it off line and was able to hit a town that was 2.8 away. think i was aiming almost twice as far for rockets to hit than the HE rounds.
-
Yes... but you were saying "hull gun is better than gunner's F8 when you are too far away". But the gunner's view is much better than the hull gun in any case - you are stitting higher and the zoom is much better there. I see absolutely no advantage observing your own fire from hull gunner position.
Example: Im sitting on a ridge, town is at the limit of my rockets range. First view is from gunner's sight, second from hull gunner position (max zoom)
(http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/5952/98599615.jpg)
(http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/9155/hulll.jpg)
yes lusche but this includes moving your gun and approximate ranging that you have acquired. its like resetting your 8" guns to hit the target after land mode aquiring it again.
the F8 idea works fine, played with it off line and was able to hit a town that was 2.8 away. think i was aiming almost twice as far for rockets to hit than the HE rounds.
i've hit towns over 2.8k away by not using F8. and F8 wouldnt help with indirect fire (even though my hull gun wouldnt either)
-
the F8 helped in that when firing rockets i wasn't looking at the sky.
-
the F8 helped in that when firing rockets i wasn't looking at the sky.
theres a point where sky's all you see whiteman
-
yes lusche but this includes moving your gun and approximate ranging that you have acquired.
I'm still not getting what you are trying to say... I look through the gunsight and shoot at my clearly visible target. Just as I would do it with the cannon, only difference is that I'm using the rockets. If I were using hull gunner position, I would not only had worse zoom, but also I would have to jump back to gun, select rockets again, move barrel a bit, shoot, go back to hull gunner position.. Whereas with main gunner & F8 I just stay there, pull triger, adjust aim a bit, pull trigger again.... I don't have to switch positions, don't have to adjust my view past the initial adjustment, no cycling through ammo, with a fully visible and zoomed in target area all the time.
-
I'm still not getting what you are trying to say... I look through the gunsight and shoot at my clearly visible target. Just as I would do it with the cannon, only difference is that I'm using the rockets. If I were using hull gunner position, I would not only had worse zoom, but also I would have to jump back to gun, select rockets again, move barrel a bit, shoot, go back to hull gunner position.. Whereas with main gunner & F8 I just stay there, pull triger, adjust aim a bit, pull trigger again.... I don't have to switch positions, don't have to adjust my view past the initial adjustment, no cycling through ammo, with a fully visible and zoomed in target area all the time.
ok. the horizon in your gunsight only reaches a certain altitude for your gun. say... 40 degrees? what if you wanted to fire at your target at 45 or 50 degrees? you cannot see the target. understand now? i'll try to simplify it more if i need to but i dont think i can no offense intended. unless you are saying the full distance the rockets can impact stays in sight of your gunsight?
-
unless you are saying the full distance the rockets can impact stays in sight of your gunsight?
Yes it does. Look again at my screenshot: I have the maximum range impact point clearly in sight, at maximum barrel elevation.
-
Yes it does. Look again at my screenshot: I have the maximum range impact point clearly in sight, at maximum barrel elevation.
ahh. ok, i missed that part of your post. sorry for the confusion
-
Lusche check inbox pls.
-
Aiming these things just takes practice and time. No one way to do I have found yet. I am working on perfecting a way I think is the best way for me to aim them. But just take the time and go to the TA and practice. I will be back in there today practicing my aim.
BigKev
-
I just wanted a couple tick marks, and an external zoom view for the rockets..., it isn't complicated, though some of you would have it be.
At this point I have to give up... to much B.S. involved in having a simple change made.
Luck and all. :aok