Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: Krusty on May 29, 2010, 06:26:41 PM
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Creative Labs may have made some iffy cards over the years, but my fallback for good quality sound has always been the Audigy 1, the SB Live!, the SB16, etc, going back through the years.
With post-WinXP Windows versions no longer using the old sound API, I'm under the impression these cards no longer work.
In several other threads I hear folks mentioning off-brand (to me) sound cards, and in some other webpages folks mention companies I didn't even KNOW made sound cards! Asus? Apparently they make a sound card!
So a couple of questions:
- What is the major name in good audio in Win7 these days? I don't hear the name Creative Labs tossed around anymore.
- I'm assuming none of these older PCI cards will work at all in Win7?
- What about integrated sound chips? Are they getting better nowadays? The integrated chip notwithstanding, do they give good audio, or does the quality suffer like it did a few years back?
Oh, and a bonus question just because I'm talking about Win7: Does Win7 32-bit still have the same < 4GB memory limitations, meaning if you want more RAM you need to go 64-bit?
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Oh, and a bonus question just because I'm talking about Win7: Does Win7 32-bit still have the same < 4GB memory limitations, meaning if you want more RAM you need to go 64-bit?
Yes.
I'm using a Realtek 5.1 chip on my mobo...with no problems but from what Skuzzy says they take system resources and having them at full hardware acceleration can cause problems, especially in AH. There are others.
I believe the later versions of Soundblaster Audigy cards do work well with Win7 but you don't have the control that WinXP used to give by default. The only other sound card I can think of that you might hear about is Turtle Beach but they are far from "off brand"...at one time they were primarily high end for use in sound editing/mixing. I haven't used one myself but someone around here is with good results.
http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/mtgoddl/home.aspx (http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/mtgoddl/home.aspx)
http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/riviera/home.aspx (http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/riviera/home.aspx)
Creative Labs Win7 driver availability chart
http://support.creative.com/kb/ShowArticle.aspx?url=http://ask.creative.com:80/srvs/cgi-bin/webcgi.exe/,/?st=273,e=0000000000242129124,k=5840,sxi=3,varset=ws:,case=61105 (http://support.creative.com/kb/ShowArticle.aspx?url=http://ask.creative.com:80/srvs/cgi-bin/webcgi.exe/,/?st=273,e=0000000000242129124,k=5840,sxi=3,varset=ws:,case=61105)
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Very interesting info about Win7 compatibility with those existing sound cards! Thanks! :aok
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I think the best card is the HT Omega Striker and I think you would be surprised how clear the audio is and how low the additional load on the CPU is (if there even is a load). The number one thing that bugs me about SB is the incompatibility with system chips and video cards but also Creative always loads a bunch of bloat programs on your system and probably you will never run a single one of those anyway. And then theres CPU load.
You can buy MUCH better sound like M-Audio but I dont know how well the M-Audio cards sound in games.
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If there is a firewire solution that does not load the cpu at all or very very little that would be something that would probably be a really really good thing.
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I think the best card is the HT Omega Striker and I think you would be surprised how clear the audio is and how low the additional load on the CPU is (if there even is a load). The number one thing that bugs me about SB is the incompatibility with system chips and video cards but also Creative always loads a bunch of bloat programs on your system and probably you will never run a single one of those anyway. And then theres CPU load.
You can buy MUCH better sound like M-Audio but I dont know how well the M-Audio cards sound in games.
The solution is really very simple... don't load the bloatware, just the drivers. And the X-Fi's place 0 load on the CPU which is why I bought one.
Admittedly even a driver only installation places the help file and the registration nag in the start menu but they are easily turned off.
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Not every X-Fi is 0 cpu load and I think all of them have some load but its still not a solution if you have any one of the many components that are in conflict with it.
EDIT: I just checked... depending on the situation X-fi uses from 1.5 to 14.24%.
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I think the best card is the HT Omega Striker and I think you would be surprised how clear the audio is and how low the additional load on the CPU is (if there even is a load). The number one thing that bugs me about SB is the incompatibility with system chips and video cards but also Creative always loads a bunch of bloat programs on your system and probably you will never run a single one of those anyway. And then theres CPU load.
You can buy MUCH better sound like M-Audio but I dont know how well the M-Audio cards sound in games.
Thanks Chalenge, I just ordered an HT Omega Striker to replace my Xfi-Extreme Audio PCIE card. I haven't had any problems with it in my dual-boot rig (xp pro and winblows7 x64), but it's definately not as good sounding as my old X-FI Extreme Music that my daughter and grandkids have in their system that I passed on to them. I'm looking for a little more clairity in my old age.
All the Best...
Jay
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Hrm... looks like a nice card. However, as a pilot that still uses a MS Sidewinder 3D Pro Plus (it is not compatible with USB adapters like other MS Sidewinders), I'm also keen on cards that have the admittedly obsolete MIDI/gameport plug.
Opinions on a card that still has this?
Or has it gone the way of the do-do on any new sound cards?
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Hrm... looks like a nice card. However, as a pilot that still uses a MS Sidewinder 3D Pro Plus (it is not compatible with USB adapters like other MS Sidewinders), I'm also keen on cards that have the admittedly obsolete MIDI/gameport plug.
Opinions on a card that still has this?
Or has it gone the way of the do-do on any new sound cards?
Here you go Krusty.
http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/riviera/home.aspx (http://www.turtlebeach.com/products/riviera/home.aspx)
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Thanks
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Krusty I bought one of those and I didnt use it but maybe an hour or so. Unfortunately I cant remember what it was that made me decide to pull it out of the computer but I do know I didnt like it.
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The turtle beach, or the gameport joystick?
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The Riviera specifically. I wasnt even trying to get it to work with AH. I was using it to replace a sound card in a system that I was sending to the PI and I just could not do that (give that crap) to family. Its possible it just didnt get along with the MB (Asus A8N-32 SLI) or something I dont remember anything specifically other than how disappointed I was that a 'Turtle Beach' sound card was that bad.
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Turtle Beach does not make sound cards anymore. They re-package stuff. It could be Yamaha, or C-Media, or Realtek, or anyone else wanting to put a chip on a card.
They are not the company they used to be.
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I found another one that has a joystick port but I dont know anything about it.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2177471&Sku=D10-2092
EDIT: I would hate to find it its a disguised X-Fi.
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I found another one that has a joystick port but I dont know anything about it.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2177471&Sku=D10-2092
EDIT: I would hate to find it its a disguised X-Fi.
That's a C-media chip on it.
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It could very well be the same card then. The Riviera had a self-destruct sticker over the chip but I didnt check it to see what it was... not that I would remember now anyway.
EDIT: I got to thinking about this and I seem to remember the old A8N32 SLI MB had a gameport header. I wonder if any other motherboards do or not?
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Some older ones, but I've been window shopping and having a heck of a time determining if any new i7 boards have it. I don't think they do. I guess I need to save up the pennies and get one of those custom-made sidewinder-to-USB converter boxes. I don't think they were cheap, though.
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Sidewinder? You would be much better off joining the rudder pedal crowd you know. Might even save money buying full CH gear over trying to stay in the 90s control wise. :aok
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My sidewinder came with a USB converter straight out of the box. I reckon any old gameport to usb converter will work.
Sidewinder is the best joystick I've ever had, after 10 years of use zero spiking. How many CH sticks are in use after that time and how many pot replacements etc? :)
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All of mine have made it to 10 years without pot replacement. Im sure Sidewinder is a really good controller for what it is but if its the twisty type controller I think it is... no matter what you do with that stick there will be unintended control inputs (unless of course you turn the rudder axis off).
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Oh, it's definitely twisty, and I got really good at twisty-stick action (as much as one can) but I switched to pedals years back.
Ironically, the pedals are also gameport, but at least I can hack the guts out of a $5 disposable USB joystick and wire the pedals directly into that. I cannot do that with the Sidewinder. It's a long story, but suffice it to say the stick is simulating USB signals through an analog port. Some other Sidewinders were made to take the USB adapter plug, but not this specific model I have.
P.S. I use a USB CH throttle, so the stick is just the left-hand part of a HOTAS setup. It's a comfortable stick, not the best, but has no pots (works based on LEDs and light sensors) so I'll never have to worry about the pots going bad.
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My sidewinder came with a USB converter straight out of the box. I reckon any old gameport to usb converter will work.
Nope. I've got an original Sidewinder 3D Pro and none of the Sidewinder USB (or any other) converters are compatible with it.
There was a guy who built custom converters but you had to send him the money, then, when he had enough orders he'd buy the circuit boards he needed and custom build the converters. I researched this extensively when I built my new machine because I didn't want to give up my Sidewinder but it sounded like wait times were in the 6-12 month range.
In retrospect I'm glad I just bought (several) cheap Saitek stick(s). I played on the old machine with the Sidewinder when I was doing the "just how bad a machine can play AH" tests and it (the Sidewinder) had gotten sloppy after 12 years of daily use... I just hadn't realized it.
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All of mine have made it to 10 years without pot replacement. Im sure Sidewinder is a really good controller for what it is but if its the twisty type controller I think it is... no matter what you do with that stick there will be unintended control inputs (unless of course you turn the rudder axis off).
Yep there may be some unintended control inputs but it also frees me from having a clumsy pedal setup in my feet + having to relearn flight all over again. I tried pedals for a couple of days and my gunnery was destroyed using them.
As long as I'm going to play on-off a couple days per month as I am currently pedals are more of a pain in the butt than anything else IMO.
It's possible to rank way above average in AH using a twisty stick. So it's a combination of good performance and comfort.
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Its those unintended control inputs that scrub energy and make everyone that uses them that much more ineffective.
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Its those unintended control inputs that scrub energy and make everyone that uses them that much more ineffective.
You're right but the problem concerns mostly turn&burn type fighting. Everyone that knows me, knows also that I like to do fast straight hit&run strikes with my brewster. :airplane:
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I think the best card is the HT Omega Striker and I think you would be surprised how clear the audio is and how low the additional load on the CPU is (if there even is a load). The number one thing that bugs me about SB is the incompatibility with system chips and video cards but also Creative always loads a bunch of bloat programs on your system and probably you will never run a single one of those anyway. And then theres CPU load.
You can buy MUCH better sound like M-Audio but I dont know how well the M-Audio cards sound in games.
Well I've tried the HT Omega Striker and I have to agree with you about the clarity of the audio but the sound from VOX is not what I expected! It sounds like I'm talking through one of them cardboard paper towel pipes. I had tried everything to rectify that but haven't found a solution. I finally had to rip it out and slap in an old SB Audigy PCI card. I tried it in both Winblows XP and Winblows7 64 bit with the same results. I'm holding off returning it as I really had some great sound directionality with my headphones and hope I can find a solution to the "pipe" effect with VOX.
All the Best...
Jay