Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: Mister Fork on June 04, 2010, 12:00:17 AM
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WELCOME TO OKINAWA 1945
LATE OPERATION ICEBERG
ALLIES - BISHOP
AXIS - KNIGHTS
Royal Navy
Seafire IIC
F4U-1A
TBM
LVT's
PT Boats
USN
F6F
F4U-1D
TBM
LVT's
PT Boats
USAAF
P-38L
P-51D
B-25C/H
B-26B
C-47
M Series
Jeeps
M4A3
IJA
A6M5
Ki-61
Ki-67
Ki-84
NIK2-J
C-47
Type 1 Ho-Ha (Sub SdKfz)
Type 98 Ke-Ni (Sub M-8)
Type 3 Chi-Nu (Sub T-34/76)
Jeeps
IJN
A6M5
LVT's
PT Boats
Arena Settings
Downtimes: 60 minutes
Capture: 30 troops
Enemy Icon Height: 500ft +
EnemyLowIconRange: 0
Radar Dar: 52800
Radar height: 500ft
Sector Dar: 105600
Sector height: 1000ft
All others Ava Norms
STORY
It's springtime 1945 and the Allies are now in full-swing with Operation Iceberg. With the help of British carreir forces, the American Army and airforce are trying their best to ensure the pressure on the Japanese forces occupying the island is not let up. Japan's single and remaining carrier is already a main target of both forces but has managed to elude Allied forces for months.
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Heya Mister Fork,
what does this mean?
Enemy Icon Height: 500ft +
does that mean enemy icons are turned on above 500 ft? and distance range is under 3K ?
or does
EnemyLowIconRange: 0
mean no enemy icon?
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please, oh please, don't bring the nasty icons backs, they hurts us.
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please, oh please, don't bring the nasty icons backs, they hurts us.
how so?
you can't run away? or
hide in the sun? or
hide on the deck? or
you can't fight? or
or won't be able to hide your 2 or 3 or 4 attacking 1? or
what?
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Mighty1,
Actually, there are some concessions that are being made to further the realistic feeling for air combat in the arena. Since its implementation, no enemy icons has received much praise from old and new players of the arena. The fact that there are more than two other players in the arena has been a plus. What I would ask you to do, is to keep an open mind, and wait and see if things like dot dar, and wingman tactics would improve your experience.
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Well, considering no enemy icons is supposed to be a standard setting at this point, Fork probably did a copy/paste from an earlier setup without changing anything.
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I don't know, a lil different arena setting my be a good thing, especially for the newer ex-Fighter Ace players that have came to Aces High.......
I know I wouldn't mind the setup if it had icons turned on for Enemys under 3k ....... and disappearing when below 500ft AGL.......
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New FA people are enjoying the no enemy icons, what's throwing them off is the apparent focus of furballs in the setups. With friendlies at ~2.5k it's pretty easy to pick out the enemies once you get used to it. I'm guessing you haven't been in the AvA when there is a decent crowd?
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Looks fun assuming the icons are still off. I'm assuming they are and the description is in error.
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Icons are off.
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Icons are off.
Sweet <S>
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No enemy icons makes the AvA arena fun and different (i.e. the ONLY arena with no icon setting). To those that want icons, feel free to go to the other 20 arenas with icons on.
To management, please don't succumb to the icon crowd and leave the no icon crowd with nowhere to go.
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No enemy icons makes the AvA arena fun and different (i.e. the ONLY arena with no icon setting). To those that want icons, feel free to go to the other 20 arenas with icons on.
To management, please don't succumb to the icon crowd and leave the no icon crowd with nowhere to go.
just so you know... their are some of us here who flew in the CT / AvsA for many years as it was "WITH ICONS" and only had problems when others came in and decided they needed to change the way things were
the "NO ICONS" only came about earlier this year..... ( like 3 or 4 months ago )
so in doing so it watermelon canned those who loved the arena the way it was before others said it needed "CHANGES" and before people needed to impose "THIER GAMEPLAY WAYS" onto those who already originally participated in this AvsA arena for over 8 years
so take your "NO ICONS" and shove them..... and thank you for taking away the only arena others and myself truely appreciated before the "no icon / supposedly more realistic, but it's not BS" that has just recently came about......
maybe HTC could offer us a CT arena with ICONS ON, since they canned the "Combat Tour" idea........ and we can go back to having a Combat Theatre like we had in the beginning?????
and no thank you, I don't care to fly in the AvsA with no icons......... I'll just stick to only flying KOTH, FSO & Scenarios from now on.....
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abraham lincoln once said, "you cant please all of the people, all of the time!" that being said, we're trying to do the best we can TC. I'm sorry if you don't like the settings and that is your right. most of the people seem to like the setups so we're going to stick with it until public opinion changes. for now it will be no icons but like everything else around here, that could change in time. Thanks for your understanding and we will miss you and I personally hope you might change your mind or atleast stick your head in once in awhile. :salute
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we're trying to do the best we can TC.
Thanks for your understanding and we will miss you and I personally hope you might change your mind or atleast stick your head in once in awhile. :salute
I was not really directing that at you or the AvsA staff Jaeger, I was specifically directing that at those who did not ever really fly in the CT or AvsA until just recently......
I understand why you did it, and as I said before hope it brings ALOT of people in for ya..... :cheers:
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so take your "NO ICONS" and shove them..... and thank you for taking away the only arena others and myself truely appreciated before the "no icon / supposedly more realistic, but it's not BS" that has just recently came about......
Yeah that says "good luck" in the nicest of terms. I especially like the "shove them" part. Coming from a trainer who should have a more open mind even. In case you didn't realize this, 8 years is a lifetime in gaming terms. In order for growth to occur, change must occur. Until the no enemy icons setting was put in place, the AvA was a graveyard, but then you have an excuse for that too don't you? This happened, that happened, this person did something and those people over there did something else. Excuses. I know you haven't noticed this, but there is now some excitement about the AvA, and the Staff members have brought in a group of terrain makers and with the development group everyone is working to try and enhance the future experiences of the people who are enjoying the different environment offered in the AvA.
I really doesn't matter what the past of the arena is or was, what matters is now, especially to the people who are enjoying what's being done in the AvA. What you as an experienced player with some sort of status in AH should be doing is actually trying it out for more than a single 5 minute jaunt without anyone in it. Then offer feedback with how it does or does not fit your desires, not like you did in the quoted statement as if someone took your squeaky toy away from you. And after having actually giving it more than 5 minutes of your precious time, when some unwary soul wanders into the TA and asks you for assistance in situational awareness or aerial combat maneuvers without enemy icons, you can educate them from knowledge rather than ignorance.
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so take your "NO ICONS" and shove them..... and thank you for taking away the only arena others and myself truely appreciated before the "no icon / supposedly more realistic, but it's not BS" that has just recently came about......
Oh jeez, let's go back to big red Icons so the arena can average about two players per day again.
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just because I have a tag hanging on my username does not mean I can not voice my "Personal opinion or view"
just because you may look at the stats of me and see that "TC" may have only tryed out the AvsA for 5 minutes, does not mean I have not flown in there under 2 or 3 of my other accounts, now does it
calling me ignorant is childish as well, gyrene81
and incase you missed it, I replyed with:
I was not really directing that at you or the AvsA staff Jaeger, I was specifically directing that at those who did not ever really fly in the CT or AvsA until just recently......
I understand why you did it, and as I said before hope it brings ALOT of people in for ya..... :cheers:
however I said to others, I specifically quoted and replied to DktrEvil
the only thing I would need to teach people about regarding SA in the AvsA is watch out for the 3 or 4 that are waiting until you get into a fight then come and jump all over you and you will not be able to see them until it is too late.....
they call it wingman tactics...... I call it cheap excuse for not wanting to Fight but wanting to rack up kills....
as for the avsa being a graveyard, from what I have seen the same amount of people are flying their now maybe few more recently, but still nearly the same and at the same time of the day that has always flown there......
I'll be sure and post from now on that when I am not posting in the Help & Training or any other Help forum, that I am posting as an "AH Player" and not as a "Vol. staff member" in the rest of the damn message forums.....
will that satisfy your requirements ?
edit: jimson you got any proof of there being more people since the no icon rule or you just throwing that out there
I see the same amount of people flyin g as did before the newest settings.........
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everyone is working to try and enhance the future experiences of the people who are enjoying the different environment offered in the AvA.
I really doesn't matter what the past of the arena is or was, what matters is now, especially to the people who are enjoying what's being done in the AvA. .
ok, gyrene, you posted the above,
so what do you tell those who participated in the AvsA before, with it being the only arena that has allied vs axis plane sets, but don't care for the "no icons" rule that was currently implemented...... those that do not care for the new change and do not like to fly with no icons off?
what do "THOSE" players have in Aces High to go to to play in the way they could before this change?
is it only to benefit the new comers since the change, and to heck with anyone who enjoyed the arena before the change?
has anyone answered this question? so Aces High might lose 5 or 10 long time players, just to maybe gain 5 or 10 new players?
something to think about...... but I am sure that some have already put away their flight controllers because of this change......
want some suggestions....... fly with "no icons" for 1 week, fly with "icons" for another or heck do it for a month then do the next month the opposite....
that way those that flew in the AvsA before the change can still find enjoyment and those that just recently started flying the AvsA can also have enjoyment.....
then everyone gets a piece of the action.......
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edit: jimson you got any proof of there being more people since the no icon rule or you just throwing that out there
I see the same amount of people flyin g as did before the newest settings.........
I dunno. Maybe my bias causes me to see it that way?
TC, you are about the only one of the people that hates no icons that I respect because you are about the only one I actually saw spend a significant amount of time in there before.
I'm sorry you don't enjoy them as much as I and many others do.
the only thing I would need to teach people about regarding SA in the AvsA is watch out for the 3 or 4 that are waiting until you get into a fight then come and jump all over you and you will not be able to see them until it is too late.....
they call it wingman tactics...... I call it cheap excuse for not wanting to Fight but wanting to rack up kills....
You got any proof that this behavior is any worse than it was before?
I disagree with you assigning dweeb, gamer motives to those who like the settings. My kill ratio sucks as bad now as it did in the MA.
I'm just enjoying dying more now :lol
I see a long list of long time players with very positive comments about it.
If you can show that the AvsA has lost a lot of regular players over this change, that would help make your point.
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Came into CT/AVA in 2001. Liked it before and I like it better now. I don't see how it benefits only new players, and personally I don't see why a no enemy icon setting should run anybody out of an arena that's setup to run Axis vs Allied setups. It does make it more immersive and if my blind butt can see and fight in there anybody can. It's not just the new guys that like it, from what I can tell many of the old timers like it as well. There's just not that many of either.
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TC...Your a trainer..... You should support anything that help increase ones SA.
No icons certainly does.
Just cause you don't like it, don't hold others back.
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TC why don't you try and give it another shot this week? Granted it may be an acquired taste. A few weeks after it was tried with the Midway setup a midwar PTO was ran with the F4U1 P-38G F4F and P-40E against the Ki-61 A6M5 and A6M2. I think that's where the settings really came into their own and it was very enjoyable, much more so than the Midway setup. The F4U is available this week that should make any settings more palatable for you. :aok
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want some suggestions....... fly with "no icons" for 1 week, fly with "icons" for another or heck do it for a month then do the next month the opposite....
that way those that flew in the AvsA before the change can still find enjoyment and those that just recently started flying the AvsA can also have enjoyment.....
then everyone gets a piece of the action.......
Right or wrong, the current AvA community feels that they have momentum and new excitement with this setting.
Going back to icons for a week or more at a time probably not something that would get a lot of support right now.
Maybe a pitch could be made for one night a week?
Call it "newcomer" night or something.
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first off I'm no "new guy" been simming for over 12 years by far in all the sims
same here, but for over 15 years and in all the different WWII games
.....No icons is far more enjoyable....
is a personal preference decided on by each person individually I would say
Icons are for the noobs.....
that's funny, guess I'll stay in the kiddie pool then
let go of your beloved red crutch.
its not a crutch it is a choice, although if you would like I would be glad to come to the AvsA and show you or anyone else,how much of a crutch it is not
Besides TC were have you been?
I been here, I fly as TC in FSO & KOTH, then sometimes in the MA with squaddies if they ask me
rest of time I am flying under my other accts and I fly in almost every arena each month........
AvA has had far more population with out Icons that with in the recent months..
is really each persons personal biased opinion I would say, and to truly say that one would have to monitor the attendance and that just isn't gonna happen, is it
Your a trainer, act like one....
I do not understand why some of you keep attacking me for my Trainer status, really
exactly how does a person suppose to act? I must have missed that post........ I guess I am not entitled to my on freaking opinion, huh?
You should support anything that help increase ones SA. No icons certainly does.
I don't think it helps ones SA really....... its just an Arena setting nothing more nothing less......
In my opinion, it only benefits those who do not have the ability to make it in a 1 vs 1, or 2 vs 1, or many vs 1 engagement ..... as I posted above
and those type of engagements happened in the old Arena settings as well, it was just easier to defend against them because you could see the cherry pickers coming sooner, not just a lil black dot on the monitor
Just cause you cant hang, don't hold others back.
I am not holding anyone back, and what reason do you say I can't hang?
I don't ever recall you smacking me around in the past 10 years in any arena
does anyone else want to verbally attack me........... seems people want to blast names or cutdowns at me.......
EDIT: I am going to take the advice of a Friend, and make an effort to spend some time in there as TC over the weekend
hopefully I will see some of you online :salute
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Hope to see you in there TC. :salute
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:salute TC,
hope it grows on ya!
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Sorry, wife ack had me running errands. :(
ok, gyrene, you posted the above,
so what do you tell those who participated in the AvsA before, with it being the only arena that has allied vs axis plane sets, but don't care for the "no icons" rule that was currently implemented...... those that do not care for the new change and do not like to fly with no icons off?
what do "THOSE" players have in Aces High to go to to play in the way they could before this change?
Amazing that none of THOSE people to whom you refer have not been in the AvA for a lot longer than the last couple of months since the no icons was implemented. The "absentees" have been using other excuses to stay out of the AvA, as in "before <blah blah player> started doing <blah blah> and caused everyone else to leave the sandbox...and johnny did this...and johnny did that...and jenny took a dump in the pool". Like I said that was then, this is now.
From my Mississippi redneck point of view, all ya'll just been using other folks behavior as an excuse for your ya'lls lack of imagination. Sittin on the porch with the big dogs is a lot more boring than playin in the mud with the pups. Just look at all the folks that have quit AH over the years "because it got boring" and it had nothing to do with the AvA.
is it only to benefit the new comers since the change, and to heck with anyone who enjoyed the arena before the change?
has anyone answered this question? so Aces High might lose 5 or 10 long time players, just to maybe gain 5 or 10 new players?
something to think about...... but I am sure that some have already put away their flight controllers because of this change......
Aces High lost a lot more than 5 or 10 with the new graphics update, but look at what's been going on since. Lot's of long time players are still around and new players are joining in. There are more players with over 2 years in AH that are enjoying the AvA settings now than there are people with ~1 year.
want some suggestions....... fly with "no icons" for 1 week, fly with "icons" for another or heck do it for a month then do the next month the opposite....
that way those that flew in the AvsA before the change can still find enjoyment and those that just recently started flying the AvsA can also have enjoyment.....
then everyone gets a piece of the action.......
You make a good suggestion but for one little thing, one of the biggest complaints from all corners has been a lack of consistency in the AvA, be it settings, setups, etc... what you recommend would just add another inconsistency.
I do not understand why some of you keep attacking me for my Trainer status, really
No one is attacking you for your trainer status. We are pointing out what you seem to be missing with that status...it's the fact that words like "AH Training Corps", AvA Staff Member", "Aces High CM Staff", etc... puts the people with those tags on a higher platform than the rest of us lowly players. It means that as a trainer, you are supposedly a respected member of this community and someone who a person should be able go to for help with some aspect of their flying. Strangely enough, for the unknowing people that may cross your path or see one of your diatribes in these forums, what you say about the AvA could influence their decision to not try something they may not have experienced before.
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just so you know... their are some of us here who flew in the CT / AvsA for many years as it was "WITH ICONS" and only had problems when others came in and decided they needed to change the way things were
I am not new to the AvA but I haven't flown for awhile because it was so BORING (lack of participants mostly). I have been a no icon advocate for years (look at my old posts if you like) even when I flew in Warbirds. As a Veteran milkrunner, er, ah, I mean pilot, I am very excited about these settings and hope it leads to bigger and better things. Dare I say, a true no icons for enemy or friend, be still my heart.
the "NO ICONS" only came about earlier this year..... ( like 3 or 4 months ago )
Yes, and I have been giving thanks ever since.
so in doing so it watermelon canned those who loved the arena the way it was before ......
all 6 of em
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Sry TC a bit harsh on my part I was venting.I had thought better of my post and quickly edited it but not fast enough..
We are working twored something very good here that is different from the usual icon settings available in all the other arenas witch I personally cant stand.
If not for the current AvA settings of no icons, I would end my account...
At least there is one arena were some can find sanctuary from Icons...
I think after a week or two you would find it a whole new experience many others have found it to be allot of fun once they gave it a chance including me..
One side note....
No icons definitely helps SA, you simply need much more of it to survive without the big red bill boared.
Anything that helps with SA is good for a pilots skill set. As a trainer you should send some of your advanced students into this arena for improving their SA.
:salute
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I wanted to clarify my previous comments concerning ZERO Icons:
First, I feel it would be useful only when you have Historical planesets (which I tend to fly as much as I can) or in H2H FFA.
Second There is a new setting in AHII that allows you to set the "FullIconRange" from 24000 to 1. I set mine to 1 so nobody sees the extra icon information. This will explain why you might see this information at different distances in different arenas
I agree that numbers in any particular arena are not indicative of anything. Different strokes for different folks. I applaud HiTech for the variety offered to everyone. I personally do not like arenas stuffed to the gills with "spray and pray" types in only 2 or three different types of planes.
I prefer the smaller "Historical" or "Reality" based arenas where the radar, ammo and planesets are limited. I used to fly the CT reguarly and had some good times there. I have since gone to Free Multiplayer only, which are limited to only 8 peoples at a time and I have have a great time there. Once again I applaud HiTech for allowing people this option.
I am presently running an "Allied versus Axis" arena with the settings as real as I can get (no outside view, stall limiter off, limited radar ranges and altitudes and limited fuel and ammo, bases only flash for vehicles and boats , etc). One of the requests I have, is the ability as a CM to turn Icons on or off or shorten their range either for friendly or enemy or both. I flew "Scenerios" when I was in WB (long ago) which had no icons or very short icons and it was A LOT of fun and very enlightening.
I hope AHII will eventually allow CM's the ability to change Icon settings and will also someday set up an arena that is based on more Historical settings like no outside views, limited radar, short or no icon ranges, limited ammo, no flashing bases for fighters and bombers etc. Not everyone would fly this arena but those that did would enjoy it very much.
I miss this type of arena and would return to being a paying customer if one were available.
P.S. I disagree that MA flyers have better SA than CT flyers. I would propose that MA flyers on average have worse SA than CT flyers. There are a lot more inexperienced flyers in MA than there were in the CT. MA flyers are more of the instant gratification mindset and less of SA, Strategy or Realistic mindset, this explains the reason the CT had smaller numbers. To MA'ers it is merely a game of kill or get killed as fast as you can.
An old no icon, realistic settings rant of mine from 2005
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EDIT: I am going to take the advice of a Friend, and make an effort to spend some time in there as TC over the weekend
hopefully I will see some of you online :salute
Most excellent diggit.
TC, as someone here said already, no icons are an acquired taste. But so are beer and whiskey. All of us oldtimers miss the CT and its dynamics, but the ugly truth is that the player base has changed so much that we'll never be able to gather that type of crowd again. Having flown with no icons for a few months now, I'll bet that you and I both would have thought that the old CT would have been even better had the icons been turned off.
Don't know how much opportunity I'll have to get in there this weekend, but I do hope to see you.
- oldman
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no worries Nr_RaVeN , I was a bit harsh to you and DktrEvil, myself.... my apologies for being that way
am done with this thread......
sent some of you a PM that replyed to this thread
:salute
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TC,
The "issues" the CT had at the end (and are now prevalent in the AvA) are in no way linked to icons on or off. All of the stuff that made the CT where we wanted to be is simply largely nonexistent in the AvA at this time. How it evolves will depend on the squads that call it home. If they continue to act as they have then by and large the arena will continue to stagnate IMO...if they understand that they need to maintain some measure of restraint then it might grow...
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Humble,
I don't know what the squads have done to hurt the current AvA. Having flown both CT and consistently flown in the AvA, the only problem that I see, is that there are rarely large enough numbers to do anything other than dogfight. The dogfights in the AvA are by far more intense than in any other arena. This was true even before no icons. The reason being, the fields are close together and a fight is readily available if you have two participants, and no one is trying to hold on or gather their precious perk points.
Tonight I chose to fly against a squad that I respect very much. I knew these guys were good and would protect each other. We were equally balanced on sides, and our choices in planes was equally matched. What occurred was a good ole fashion take you out behind the shed wuppin. I tried to give my countrymen the heads up that we needed to work as a unit and utilize better comm's. Only one out 5 countrymen bothered to tune to vox. The other pilot and I flew winged until I had to go to work, and adjusted our tactics to somewhat gain an advantage. By then the squad split to relieve the lopsided pounding our country was getting (also, possibly to have more of a challenge).
I am not saying that all squads need to split up to accomodate someone else's opinion of fair, just the opposite squads would flock to the arena more often if they had more of a challenge (and not only in dogfights). The whole idea of historical arena to me implies historical tactics. So, I would suggest that when you visit the arena, you dust off your microphone, tune to Channel 1 and be a part of the action. Too many times folks just want to do their thing and act as if the other green dots were just lost misguided souls keeping the red dots busy while they poke around for weaknesses in the setup to exploit. To each his own but without squads the arena is a dismal place.
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Gee... all this rancor about icons.
How come no one mentioned how pretty the new Okinawa map looks? No more "converted terrain" Lego(TM) coastlines. Nice rice paddies. Nice coral reefs offshore. <S> to whomever did that conversion.
PS- I like no icons. Completely changes everything.
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recenley taken an interest in Bombing does bombing strats have any effect on the overall game?
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any chance in this setup running another week?......... I got to log in but did not see but 1 other person in there....
and noone wanted to go there on TT day/night :-/ ......... oh well here's to hoping .........
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recenley taken an interest in Bombing does bombing strats have any effect on the overall game?
Shooter,
Yes, bombing strats does have an effect on gameplay. Until, we see numbers large enough :pray to sustain base capture interests that do not diminish the enemy contact that most players seek, you probably won't see any country advances due to that sort of effort in the AvA.
One large note: AvA bomb sight calibration is old school. This is much more challenging and requires a recalibration when you select different targets. If you are up for a challenge, then you are in for a nice bump in difficulty in the AvA.
Look here for the effect that destruction of strats have: (strategic targets section tells how much it takes to destroy and its effect)
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#ss (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#ss)
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any chance in this setup running another week?......... I got to log in but did not see but 1 other person in there....
and noone wanted to go there on TT day/night :-/ ......... oh well here's to hoping .........
Hmm, at one point we had like 25 or so in the arena on Tuesday night.
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Hmm, at one point we had like 25 or so in the arena on Tuesday night.
and 25 in the AvA generates better fights than 800 in TT. I'm not exaggerating.
My squad CO commented a few days ago as we flew for 30 minutes looking for a fight in an arena with 300 people in it "its easier to find a find in the AvA with 9 people in it than one with 300"
He wasn't joking either.
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Hmm, at one point we had like 25 or so in the arena on Tuesday night.
was in another thread, jimson.......... I had asked if anyone was going to be flying in there on Tuesday night and some of the responses was it wasn't good on TT because of game connection issues or vx issues or something..... so I didn't bother to even fire up the game after I saw the replies to my post.........
edit: was this thread ---> http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,290570.0.html
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was in another thread, jimson.......... I had asked if anyone was going to be flying in there on Tuesday night and some of the responses was it wasn't good on TT because of game connection issues or vx issues or something..... so I didn't bother to even fire up the game after I saw the replies to my post.........
edit: was this thread ---> http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,290570.0.html
I remember that thread, most of them showed up to try it anyway. I didn't notice any issues, Did anyone else?
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the only issue i had was getting drilled(shot down) once to often from the guys in blue!! :D