Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Gattsu250 on July 27, 2010, 03:09:29 PM
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I returned to AH2 and i'm trying these japanese planes.
This is not a topic of what plane is better but i need help for compare them and know if the playstyle is different.
First, sorry for my bad english but im not native jejeje
-Speed: the Ki-84 is slighty superior in speed. climb rate and acceleration. And the WEP is very useful.
-Flaps??: the Ki can retract Flaps (have 2 notches) below 168mph and is said that are more effective... The N1K can retrac aprox. 250mph (have 4 notches)
-The Ki-84 have best maneuverability. But who have better E-retention?
-The N1k solve the problem of dive.
-I dont feel the 20mm cannons 99 Type 2 of the Niki very good.... I think that the 20mm Ho cannons and the 13mm machinguns are better for deflection shots and have better rate of fire and velocity.
-I think the KI-84's wings and motor are very well armored, but i dont played long enought with the N1K for know it...
Thx for help
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I've been flying the Ki-84 mostly this month. It is a beautiful, fun aircraft to fly and I will find it VERY hard to go back to flying a Spitfire after the scenario is done and that is saying something.
The Ki-84 is so underestimated by the AH majority. No way it should be 20 ENY! it is like a cross between a Spit 16 and a 109 K4, It has one of the best climb rates in Aces High and I would say it is a better overall plane than the Niki.
It's biggest downfall is the high speed area and diving capabilities, to master it you need to never go fast, just bait the enemy to come up to you and climb them into submission. If you lock the flaps in earlier and keep the fight in the vertical it can outturn almost anything. I've found myself beating bad brewster and zero pilots if they have too much Energy and do not control it well enough.
It is also a tough bird for being Japanese, the MG'S are 2 x 50cal size so they do pack a punch if you can get up close and personal around the 200 mark I have made kills with just a few of these.
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I've been flying the Ki-84 mostly this month. It is a beautiful, fun aircraft to fly and I will find it VERY hard to go back to flying a Spitfire after the scenario is done and that is saying something.
The Ki-84 is so underestimated by the AH majority. No way it should be 20 ENY! it is like a cross between a Spit 16 and a 109 K4, It has one of the best climb rates in Aces High and I would say it is a better overall plane than the Niki.
It's biggest downfall is the high speed area and diving capabilities, to master it you need to never go fast, just bait the enemy to come up to you and climb them into submission. If you lock the flaps in earlier and keep the fight in the vertical it can outturn almost anything. I've found myself beating bad brewster and zero pilots if they have too much Energy and do not control it well enough.
It is also a tough bird for being Japanese, the MG'S are 2 x 50cal size so they do pack a punch if you can get up close and personal around the 200 mark I have made kills with just a few of these.
I have also found my self in the Ki a lot.
I would say the ONLY thing the Ki-84 lacks is the "Dive" you cant chase anything fast down.
you pretty much nailed it.
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I'd add the note that combat trim will kill you in a Ki-84. It tremendously aggravates the effect of speed on the elevator authority. With combat trim on you can't pull a blackout at 400mph and with it off a blackout is easy to pull.
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Thx for help, i like to read some NIKI pilot opinion
The NIK roll rate is awful...
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Try the Ki-61
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Try the Ki-61
Ki-61 falls short to both the n1k and KI in MHO, although a very nice plane in it's own right, used as a BnZer it's great. any thing else and the KI-84 will eat it right up.
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Ki-61 falls short to both the n1k and KI in MHO, although a very nice plane in it's own right, used as a BnZer it's great. any thing else and the KI-84 will eat it right up.
I think it maybe the best Japanese airframe, albeit it is abit lacking in engine power. And it seems to do okay against average Spits, so I don't know why the Ki would hold any special terrors for it.
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N1k vs KI84 = good fight w/ the KI having an advantage.
I disagree about the KI having better snapshot potential. If you get used to the guns on the N1k its definately going to hit harder.
I fly the n1k more like a F4U then anything, I dive in and saddle up right away. KI84, Id rather be e- so I can sucker them into a vertical fight after I get E=
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Best way (as a P38 Pilot) to fight a good Ki84 in a slow vertical fight is to get in the 200-250 mph range, there the P38 has flaps available and the ki84 does not. The Ki-84 has great maneuvering flaps for low speed handling and can perform very well in the vertical.
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I think it maybe the best Japanese airframe, albeit it is abit lacking in engine power. And it seems to do okay against average Spits, so I don't know why the Ki would hold any special terrors for it.
I haven't done a lot of flying in the 61, or studied the numbers on it, but from what I remember I would much rather have the 84.
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I haven't done a lot of flying in the 61, or studied the numbers on it, but from what I remember I would much rather have the 84.
KI61 has better gun platform, can dive fast, and has good highspeed handling.....its a tough bird if its above you
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KI61 has better gun platform, can dive fast, and has good highspeed handling.....its a tough bird if its above you
Thats what I remember the speed factor, me being a turny tard I like the Ki better :D
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Thats what I remember the speed factor, me being a turny tard I like the Ki better :D
Yea but she wont turn at high speed :aok
What speed do you merge at?
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Ki-61 falls short to both the n1k and KI in MHO, although a very nice plane in it's own right, used as a BnZer it's great. any thing else and the KI-84 will eat it right up.
I get into it with Lute on Squad Vox over this. Give me the Ki-61 10 times out of 10. I don't BnZ either. :rock
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I get into it with Lute on Squad Vox over this. Give me the Ki-61 10 times out of 10. I don't BnZ either. :rock
Yea I hardly ever BnZ with a 61 just because its like a K4 with those guns in the cowl....great for reversals
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last night in the DA I went up against the 61 while I was in 84, like I remember it stood no chance, it was very easy to control the fight, the 84 is the better plane. at least it is for me.
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Thx for help, i like to read some NIKI pilot opinion
The NIK roll rate is awful...
Use a bit of rudder during your roll, and the roll rate improves a good deal. Rarely do I have trouble following a better rolling plane, because most don't have enough elevator authority to roll and pull (doubt that is the right way to describe, but best way I can think of to state it). If I get into a flat scissors, for example, usually I am able to start using a little more of a verticle or corkscrew and stay with them.
KI 84s are usually trouble simply because they keep going up and up and up, and you can't ever really seem to get co-alt with them.
I use the Nik most of the time simply because it is fairly good at everything, but it really doesn't excel at much. Speed is most certainly a disadvantage as even if I am winning a fight the bad guy usually turns on the burners and is able to get away, and conversely if you start losing about the only thing you can do is hope to stay alive long enough for an overshoot or stall them out.
(Now to wait for someone to tell me I use it all wrong.)
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As member of the BANZAI squad from FA I fly the George a lot Nik1 K84 Frank and the k61d Tony.the problem that i am having lately is the compression of the George in a dive.Combat trim off, throttle at 75% ,and one notch of flap,and every time I rolling to a fight from alt I cant pull out, so this must be operator error any suggestions?
Also the Tony vs the Frank, or George not a chance in FA have not tried it in here.
Best Sparks
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61 is a very fun plane to fly and very underestimated. I've just recently started flying the Ki-84 and it's very fun...definitely shouldn't be the 20 ENY that it is!
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As member of the BANZAI squad from FA I fly the George a lot Nik1 K84 Frank and the k61d Tony.the problem that i am having lately is the compression of the George in a dive.Combat trim off, throttle at 75% ,and one notch of flap,and every time I rolling to a fight from alt I cant pull out, so this must be operator error any suggestions?
Also the Tony vs the Frank, or George not a chance in FA have not tried it in here.
Best Sparks
I've never had a problem flying the Tony, I guess it depends on who's in the Tony. :joystick:
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Quick question, but I read that the Ki84 Hayate can turn inside a Zeke. :O that true? :headscratch:
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nope, but it will go faster.
And if there is a good pilot in one it can give most spitfires the treatment.
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Ki-84 = P-38 with training wheels.
The Ki-84 is a fun plane to fly, nonetheless. As previously mentioned in the above posts, it is often underestimated and has awesome climb, turn, and roll rates. Exploit those attributes and you should have no trouble fighting any plane in the game, save for the jets of course. Since I fly the P-38, I try to do one of two things:
1) Stay above the Ki and maintain an altitude advantage. Swoop in and make BnZ passes. Extend away in the vertical, and stall him out with his engine torque if he follows me up.
or, as Raptor mentioned,
2) Try to keep a speed of 200-249 IAS while scissoring him and get on his six to make a shot. Or go for a deflection if need be.
I dont fly the N1Ks. However, I prefer to use method #1 with fighting N1Ks, or get as slow as I possibly can and use scissors to get deflection shots. As a P-38 pilot, I am usually either fighting at a really fast speed, or really slow for the overshoots.
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For folks interested in historical matchups involving Ki-84's, N1K2's, and Ki-61's, there is the scenario Philippine Phandango starting Saturday, about the battles around Leyte Gulf post US invasion.
Ki-84's, N1K2's, Ki-61's, A6M5b's, Ki-67's vs. P-38's, P-47's, FM-2's, F4U's, B-25's, and B-24's.
More info is here (including times):
http://ahevents.org/scenario-current-or-next.html
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I love the KI. It matches up pretty good against almost anything that you will come across. I like the fact that it is soooo much more maneuverable than the NIK. But...you cannot compare the armament. The KI will hit you hard, but the NIK will put you down for the count almost 90% of the time regardless of where you hit.
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Also, Bruce Campbell is awesome. (Sorry -- I had to comment on the above avatar.)
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The Ki-84 is so underestimated by the AH majority.
It's underestimated because it falls to pieces if you sneeze and accidentally deflect the aircraft from straight and level.
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N1K will work the Ki-84 in a vertical turn fight, actually, it will work everything accept for B239's for some reason I have yet to find out, in a level or decending turn, the N1K is outclassed by the turners, but when the turns go vertical the N1K just leaves anything else spining towards the ground
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It's underestimated because it falls to pieces if you sneeze and accidentally deflect the aircraft from straight and level.
Only if you don't know how to go slower than 500mph.
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I've flown both planes but out of the two I prefer the ki-84 better roll snd it turns better then the nikky I think its slower but the gauges in both planes make me think their slower than they really are
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Only if you don't know how to go slower than 500mph.
What can I say? I'm so lacking in skill I make up for it by running away. Ki-84 isn't great for running away in. N1K2 is better for HO-ing, then you don't have to run provided you survive.
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What can I say? I'm so lacking in skill I make up for it by running away. Ki-84 isn't great for running away in. N1K2 is better for HO-ing, then you don't have to run provided you survive.
thats why i fly it
:noid
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Jay,
On WEP the Ki-84 peaks at ~390mph, the N1K2-J at 369mph. On the deck the Ki-84 peaks at 344mph and the N1K2-J at ~321mph.
The Ki-84 is the fastest thing the Japanese have.
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N1K will work the Ki-84 in a vertical turn fight, actually, it will work everything accept for B239's for some reason I have yet to find out, in a level or decending turn, the N1K is outclassed by the turners, but when the turns go vertical the N1K just leaves anything else spining towards the ground
The 84 is outstanding in the vertical and I'd go toe to toe with the N1K anyday in it.
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The 84 is outstanding in the vertical and I'd go toe to toe with the N1K anyday in it.
oh hell ya :aok
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in a vertical turn the N1K will out perform, but flying streight up the Ki will have the upper hand
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No way! We'll just have to go to the DA and do some testing :D
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No way! We'll just have to go to the DA and do some testing :D
:aok