Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Staged Mission Editor => Topic started by: bbosen on August 28, 2010, 08:33:16 PM
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I've written a sophisticated offline mission that works with 3 different versions of Aces High. Details here:
http://techvideoreview.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PacMix01/Ah2PacMixMissionFullPage.htm
This has been an interesting exercise, and I've learned several things that will be important to any mission developer wishing to support old and new versions of Aces High. In no particular order, here are the items I can think of right now (I'll probably add more later as I think of or discover them):
1- All 3 versions of Aces High that I use are truly different from one another in their support for offline missions. Each seems to have its own unique timing conventions for launching a mission; the identical mission source code will yield timing differences of 30 seconds plus or minus by the time the opposing groups can launch and merge into a battle.
2- The battle tactics used by the computer-generated bot aircraft vary WIDELY between versions of Aces High. Some versions fly brilliant bot combat, while others fly stupidly, with many crashes into trees and hills, etc.
3- Because of the timing differences mentioned in "1-" above, it is necessary to custom-tweak any sound files associated with any mission segments so that they play during the associated action. I haven't been able to write just a single version of my mission code that invokes all of the sound effects optimally for the 3 versions. Each must be custom-tweaked, and it takes a lot of time to do so.
4- The Mission Editor seems to "hard-code" the references to resource file locations, which can create a problem when different people install multiple versions of Aces High in different, custom filesystem locations. My first attempts to write this mission caused pain for a lot of people because their Aces High 2.12.4 or Aces High 2.13.1 or Aces High 2.20.3 installations were all located in different filesystem locations from mine, and the mission editor had all of the associated references resolved to my arrangement. Others couldn't see the briefing images or hear the custom sound files.
5- I have learned to work around problem 4- (above) with a standardized, hard-coded file reference system that stores all of the optional files at c:\Hitech Creations\Aces High\misstemp\[MissionName]
where [MissionName] is "PacMix01" for this mission, but will be replaced with a different folder for other missions. At the time of this writing, this method has been implemented only for the AH2.12.4 version of the mission as described on my mission page [see above for the link]. Within the next few days I'll update the published installation instructions for AH2.13.1 to correspond. I like this solution because that path will always be present (up to the "misstemp" component) on any system that has installed recent versions of Aces High according to current prevailing methods.
6- I have found an easy and clever way to allow players to customize the sound files that play during each segment of each mission: At the beginning of EVERY mission segment, I've found it helpful to ALWAYS code a reference to a sound file that will always play if present, and I've standardized on simple, intuitive filenames for those segments. For example, in a Bishops mission at waypoint 1, the file is named "bwp01.wav", and at waypoint 2, it's "bwp02.wav", etc. Similarly, for a Knights mission at waypoint 12, the file name is "kwp12.wav". These files are optional, and if they aren't present, the mission just goes along without them. But if any (or all) of those files are present, the corresponding sound file accompanies the action. I've found that these files can be fairly long; I've had success with a couple that are several minutes each, and they can even overlap for simultaneous play, giving players a lot of flexibility and power to create their own sound effects, radio banter, narrations, foreign language support, etc. Any player that can create an 8-bit monophonic PCM wav file sampled at 8Khz can easily enhance a mission without even learning the mission editor. This is documented in the "PacMix01 for AH 2.12.4" link on my mission page.
7- For each different version of Aces High, it's necessary to use the corresponding version of the Mission Editor. This can be confusing, because early versions of the Mission Editor used a different numbering scheme and it is no longer obvious which version of the Mission Editor originally came out with which version of Aces High. If you get this wrong, you can expect various kinds of confusing problems as each mission is played. In particular, I've found that some plane choices will cause Aces High to hang or crash. This can make it very very difficult to edit old missions in a sensible and productive fashion.
8- The current version of Aces High (2.20.3) expects only a ".res" file as the basis for a mission. When the mission is launched, It then automagically disassembles that .res file back into its source code and component parts, storing those parts in its "misstemp" folder. The arrangement is fairly tidy, and an attempt has been made to make it self-documenting. Kudos. However, these disassembled source code files aren't fully compatible with older versions of Aces High, and sometimes cause crashes with them. They can also crash the old mission editors, so there is no easy solution.
9- In my opinion, all of these complications make it forever impractical to get good use from many of the old missions. There is just no easy solution for anybody wanting to use old missions with newer versions of Aces High, and any mission developer wishing to serve the community by converting the large existing body of old missions for use with newer versions is going to be facing a tedious, difficult challenge that will probably prove ultimately futile when the next version comes out!
10- The existing "Offline Missions List on AHwiki" is so plagued by all of these problems that it can probably never be fixed. Ugh....
11- Every version of Aces High suffers from problems supporting offline missions. Each has different problems. I've had best luck overall with Aces High II version 2.12.4. It isn't perfect, but I like it the best overall.
12- I think I'll write some more missions. When I do, I'll write them first for version 2.12.4. When I add optional support files for mission briefings and mission audio, I'll be writing it for version 2.12.4. I may also compile the missions for other versions, but I don't think I'll even try to coordinate the optional files for them. Once through this tedium is enough. For me, until I see much greater stability, uniformity, and predictability with some future version, I'm sticking with 2.12.4. My website will be updated to inculcate this view soon.
I HOPE some future version will fundamentally change this situation. Until then....
-Peabody-
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9- In my opinion, all of these complications make it forever impractical to get good use from many of the old missions. There is just no easy solution for anybody wanting to use old missions with newer versions of Aces High, and any mission developer wishing to serve the community by converting the large existing body of old missions for use with newer versions is going to be facing a tedious, difficult challenge that will probably prove ultimately futile when the next version comes out!
Ba-da-bing!~ I'm anxious to return to mission designing and building, but I tire of it before even starting just from thinking about this issue.
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And another observation:
13: Warp segments no longer work. I'm not thinking about them anymore. I'm concentrating on what DOES work. The implication: no more historic missions. Really can't be done anymore. Instead, the missions we CAN still write look and feel more like the online experience. The hope: this can recruit more people into subscriptions. Hope so!
-Peabody-
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5- I have learned to work around problem 4- (above) with a standardized, hard-coded file reference system that stores all of the optional files at c:\Hitech Creations\Aces High\misstemp\[MissionName]
where [MissionName] is "PacMix01" for this mission, but will be replaced with a different folder for other missions. At the time of this writing, this method has been implemented only for the AH2.12.4 version of the mission as described on my mission page [see above for the link]. Within the next few days I'll update the published installation instructions for AH2.13.1 to correspond. I like this solution because that path will always be present (up to the "misstemp" component) on any system that has installed recent versions of Aces High according to current prevailing methods.
Done. See here:
http://techvideoreview.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PacMix01/Ah2PacMixMissionFullPage.htm
Regards,
-Peabody-
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Now I can comment on writing missions for a FOURTH different version of Aces High.
Version 2.21, published in mid-September 2010, fixes the problem with warps that has plagued the offline mission community. Many old missions that contained warps started working again, more-or-less.
I say "more or less", because missions flown with version 2.21 differ with respect to take-off timing, require spawn point adjustments, and mission map/plan interpretation differences. Events occur at different times (plus or minus 1 or 2 minutes). Mission plan track interpretations vary by as much as 5 or 6 miles. Bombing targets must be re-specified. Computer-generated drone aircraft fly combat differently, and seem to be less aggressive and less effective than in prior versions (like my favorite 2.12.4). For example, enemy bots crash into the ground a lot when engaged down low.
In short, sophisticated missions require serious, tedious, time-consuming re-writing.
Simple missions probably won't require all of this work, but they won't fly as the original author intended, either.
My 2 cents.
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About a year ago I did a whole lot of tweaking and testing using warps and roll delay. My conclusions were that roll delay timings and warps did not produce intuit results. Maybe it's time to go revisit the issue and see how things work with the new version.
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I think you'll find (as I did) that takeoff timings are significantly changed, which will change the timing of all subsequent events. Also, mission path interpretations are now far more liberal; planes routinely wander several miles off course and tend to fly much lower than the planned mission parameters. It's as if the new logic interprets the mission waypoints as "suggestions", and altitudes as "ceilings", authorizing each bot plane to use a lot of individual discretion as the mission unfolds. If you have time-critical events like radio banter, you'll need to spend quite a bit of your energy fixing everything up.
Regards,
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7- For each different version of Aces High, it's necessary to use the corresponding version of the Mission Editor. This can be confusing, because early versions of the Mission Editor used a different numbering scheme and it is no longer obvious which version of the Mission Editor originally came out with which version of Aces High.
I've installed version 2.12.4 on mine and my son's machine to play LAN games and offline missions at home.
bbosen, You still develop missions for this version, right?
Which is the correct mission editor for game version 2.12.4?
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Yes, I still develop missions for AH2124. This topic is discussed further here:
http://askmisterwizard.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12280#p12604
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Update as of Jan2011:
In January of 2011, version 2.22 of Aces High was released, and a new Mission Editor followed shortly thereafter. I've tested both with complete success. The new editor is able to edit the prior version of all of my offline missions. It was easy to use it to access the new Mitsubishi "Betty" G4m bomber for use in my version of Soda's "Yamamoto" mission for an appropriate update. No changes were necessary this time with regard to takeoff timings, etc. I am very pleased with this version.
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Update as of Jan2011:
In January of 2011, version 2.22 of Aces High was released, and a new Mission Editor followed shortly thereafter. I've tested both with complete success. The new editor is able to edit the prior version of all of my offline missions. It was easy to use it to access the new Mitsubishi "Betty" G4m bomber for use in my version of Soda's "Yamamoto" mission for an appropriate update. No changes were necessary this time with regard to takeoff timings, etc. I am very pleased with this version.
However, it still won't replace my favorite old version 2.12.4, because the "bot" aircraft don't fly with as much intelligence, and route interpretation continues to be "loose". I'm continuing with 2.12.4 as my primary platform, and all of my missions are optimized for that version. If a mission is particularly simple, I MAY include a version tweaked for newer Aces High releases, but I'm making no promises.
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Update as of late Feb2011:
I've been working on a divebombing mission versus a moving carrier task group. This has been an interesting challenge, because I can't see any way to make the Mission Editor aware of the route to be taken by the ships. Furthermore, the operator of an offline Aces High environment can move those ships around and change their assigned routes.
The only solution I've found has been to "hard-code" the bomb drop for a specific geographic location on the map and a specific time after the mission commences, on the assumpution that the target ship will be beneath that spot at that time. This assumption imposes several further requirements and restrictions as follows:
1- Since the ships commence movement immediately after entry into an offline arena, I must assume that the mission will ALWAYS be started at the exact same moment after arena entry. The only practical assumption here is to demand that mission operators must commence the mission just as quickly as they possibly can, which tends to synchronize everything within a few seconds (plus or minus the amount of time it takes to click the mouse a few times and for the computer to load and start the mission).
2- Ships must use the single, unchanged route that comes originally with the associated terrain. No ship route editing is permitted. Since ownership of ships is hard-coded in this situation, the side [Bishop or Knight] of opposing aircraft is implicit too.
3- I have to go through a lot of "trial and error" with the Mission Editor and with flight testing to get the timing and positioning correct.
4- (General Rule): When a mission includes any bombing activity, I always design and test the bombing route first, and get it timed, targetted, and working before adding any escorts or opposition. During the initial test and debug phase, I always assign this activity to the Bishops, even if the overall mission design won't end up that way. This is because it's easier to see and debug the Bishop's activity (this is a quirk of the way the Mission Editor works, and I haven't found any workaround that will permit me to see Knight activities as well as I can see Bishop activity). However, later on, it's frequently necessary to change the bombers to the Knights side, since I want them to be OPPOSED by the targetted naval task force, and if that [hardcoded] entity happens to be owned by the Bishops, then the bombers must be switched to Knight after the debug phase is completed.
5- Each different version of Aces High changes the timing details associated with takeoff, route interpretation, etc. too much to make this kind of mission "portable". It must be written and carefully tuned for a specific release of Aces High. For various reasons, I've standardized on version 2.12.4, so all of my sophisticated missions are written for that version. Once I've got a mission working in that environment, I sometimes try rebuilding it with the current (latest) version, and although the result is never optimum, sometimes it's still interesting or useful, or can be tweaked to usefulness with a reasonable effort. In those cases, I generally publish that newer version without any promise that it will continue to work the next time Aces High is updated.
6- When the mission is flown, the role taken by the single offline operator significantly affects the bomb drop and the liklihood that the moving naval target will be hit by the falling bombs. I've found that when I am flying with the bombers, they generally hit the target. However, if I fly in any opposing role, the bombers can be [easily] diverted enough to drop their bombs harmlessly off of the target.
All of this is now under test in my "Hanna at Scarpantos" mission. A preview of the current state can be seen here:
http://techvideoreview.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/HannaAtScarpantos/HannaAtScarpantosP1Full.htm
:salute
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4- (General Rule): When a mission includes any bombing activity, I always design and test the bombing route first, and get it timed, targetted, and working before adding any escorts or opposition. During the initial test and debug phase, I always assign this activity to the Bishops, even if the overall mission design won't end up that way. This is because it's easier to see and debug the Bishop's activity (this is a quirk of the way the Mission Editor works, and I haven't found any workaround that will permit me to see Knight activities as well as I can see Bishop activity). However, later on, it's frequently necessary to change the bombers to the Knights side, since I want them to be OPPOSED by the targetted naval task force, and if that [hardcoded] entity happens to be owned by the Bishops, then the bombers must be switched to Knight after the debug phase is completed.
It seems that others CAN get the Mission Editor to display Knight routes and additional flights. Evidently there are three buttons at the extreme lower-right-hand corner of the Mission Editor that I just can't see. I don't know why I can't see those 3 buttons, but others that CAN see them report that they are not restricted as I describe above.
:salute
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It seems that others CAN get the Mission Editor to display Knight routes and additional flights. Evidently there are three buttons at the extreme lower-right-hand corner of the Mission Editor that I just can't see. I don't know why I can't see those 3 buttons, but others that CAN see them report that they are not restricted as I describe above.
:salute
The latest version of the ME will resize the main window so that these buttons are visible no matter what resolution you run your desktop at. For previous ME versions ur hosed unless you can resize your desktop resolution to at least 1024 x 800.
- Sudz
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Thanks Sudz! It's good to get confirmation of my suspicions that it was related to display resolution.
:salute
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Thanks Sudz! I can now confirm that this problem is fixed. The latest version (V2.22 patch 3) shows the 3 previously missing buttons on my system. :salute
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Update as of 06Jul2011, using AH V2.24.5:
SOME old missions work, and some do not. My experience indicates that about half of my sophisticated missions, which worked (to varying degrees without crashing) on almost all prior versions of Aces High, now crash or hang my computer with a "White Screen of Death".
Also, the missions compiled with the new Mission Editor (V2.24.5) don't support sound files properly. In any such mission, the first .wav file is played as expected, but the sim "hangs" (White Screen of Death) as soon as that sound file ends.
I hope future versions of the Mission Editor will fix these problems. In the meantime, it's back to 2.12.4 for me.
:salute
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Also, the missions compiled with the new Mission Editor (V2.24.5) don't support sound files properly. In any such mission, the first .wav file is played as expected, but the sim "hangs" (White Screen of Death) as soon as that sound file ends.
This has been fixed for next release.
- Sudz
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:salute
Sudz
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Update as of 12Dec2011: I can confirm that the sound bugs described in the prior few postings have indeed been fixed. My latest experimenting has been with Version 2.26.3. It has another SERIOUS bug: Whenever it is used to edit and compile any changes into any mission, the original source code is corrupted and becomes unuseable. If you don't have a backup copy, the source gets destroyed.
For a temporary workaround, I have had success using an older version of the editor (I use V 2.12.4) for edits, and then I use version 2.26.3 ONLY to compile the results, always making sure I have a backup copy of the source. This (rather cumbersome) technique has allowed me to make newer versions of most of my old missions. However, even after succesfully compiling to v 2.26.3 as described here, the "bot" planes fly low, slow, uninspired combat tactics, not nearly as good as the bots in V2.12.4 flew the same missions. I'm still sticking with V2.12.4 for most of my work.
:salute
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Update as of 23Mar2012:
Using version 2.27.2, I just recompiled my new "Shubin at Guadalcanal" mission from the original source code, which was written for version 2.12.4. I didn't need to make ANY source code changes. Mission timing varied only slightly from the older version. Under version 2124, the bombers almost always hit their designated targets, and fighters fly brilliant, aggressive tactics. Under version 2272, the bombers always miss their targets and generally end up flying low, silly circles around their target airfields until they are shot down by ground gunners.
Using the mission editor for V2272, I couldn't get any of the .wav files to play, so I couldn't hear the mission briefing or audio banter within the editor. However, I had confidence regarding the general performance of those sound files from my experience with them under the mission editor for V2124, so I decided to try the results by simply compiling for V2272. The result was a working mission under Aces High V2272, which is now published on my website. As usual for recent versions, the result is not as good as it was with good-old V2124, but it's better than nothing for those that don't have V2124.
:salute
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Update 10Dec2012
Things are a lot better now, using Aces High 2.28.x.
The BOTS are BACK! Computer-controlled drones now fight sensibly with aggressive tactics like way back in the olden days. I have recompiled almost all of my old missions for compatibility with this current version 2.28.x of Aces High, and only a little bit of tweaking was used (given that my work was based on version 2.26.x for most of this effort). "Offline Missions" are now known as "Staged Missions", and it is possible to fly them online, combining real, live humans with computer-generated bots. With this new version 2.28.x, most of the issues upon which this long thread were founded have been addressed.
It is still tedious to take a sophisticated old mission written for version 2.12.x or earlier and get it compiled and running well under today's v2.28.x, but most of those ancient missions have been abandoned or updated already, so even that issue is less significant.
Many thanks to HTC and the offline/staged mission editor crew for advancing the state-of-the-art to this powerful level.
:salute
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Cheers!~ :rock The water looks good.
Makes me want to jump back in the pool. :aok
Thank you HTC crew!~ :salute
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Update as of mid-December 2013:
Many of the prior posts in this thread refer to my old website at TechVideoReview.com/FlightSimMovies. That web site no longer exists, but its content has been copied to my main web site AskMisterWizard.com/FlightSimMovies. Accordingly, in any of the links above, please replace "TechVideoReview" with "AskMisterWizard" and leave the remainder of any URLs unchanged.
As of this date, the current version of Aces High is V2.31.3. The Mission Editor for this version includes some new and powerful diagnostic aids that automatically report any mission segments that are designed beyond the the capability of the aircraft assigned to fly it. For example, if I design a mission with a segment demanding a rate of climb that is too steep for a P38 assigned to fly it, I am alerted when I try to compile the mission. I find it is then very easy to make minor changes to the route, speed, or altitude of the segment to compensate.
Mission developers are reporting a lot of "crashes" when missions are run offline with this version 2.31.3, even after correcting segments as described in the prior paragraph. I find that I can successfully compile any of my old missions to the complete satisfaction of the Mission Editor for V2.31.3, but only a few of them will actually run to completion offline. Most of them crash after a few minutes of flight. When this happens, the video image freezes, and a brief snippet of sound (generally engine noise) repeats over and over again and again for about 20 seconds before Windows intervenes with a diagnostic frame declaring that the program is not responding, and offering to terminate it. All of my experience of this nature has been derived from missions that are known to compile and run correctly with old Version 2.12.4.
I have tried to determine the cause of these crashes by methodically eliminating optional features from my missions. I chose my "PeabodySimple" mission as the basis for this work because it's my simplest published mission. It is documented here:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PeabodySimple/PeabodySimpleMissionPage01Full.htm
After eliminating every reference to optional media files (.wav and .bmp) I found that this "crashing" problem is still unchanged. Accordingly, I am convinced that the problem is not related to the optional sound and image files that mission editors can put into mission briefings or mission "events".
In a more complex mission I vastly cut down the number of simulated aircraft. Decreasing the number of aircraft participating in the mission from about 100 down to about 15 did not affect the crashes either. I was surprised to find that if I flew the mission in the same way, it crashed at exactly the same point whether the mission was compiled with 100 airplanes, or with only 15.
I was also wondering if the error was related to the terrain in use. As an experiment, I used a very old version of the ndisles terrain with my Peabody Simple Terrain. It crashed in the same manner and at the same point as when I used the current version of ndisles.
Some developers report more success getting missions to run offline than online in the "Staged" arena. Other developers report the opposite. As of this writing, mission developers are searching for patterns to help localize the problem.
I now suspect that the developers at HiTechCreations are currently consumed with other features of Aces High that are more important to their business goals than offline or "staged" missions. I have confidence that at some point these issues will get their attention and will be fixed. In the meantime, although I will use newer versions of the Mission Editor to detect "impossible segments" in my missions as described above, I continue to use old version 2.12.4 as the basis for my mission development, and all of my missions are always compiled and optimized for that version.
:salute
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Bosen. If I understand you correctly your missions compiled in version 2.12.4 will only run in that version of the game or can you build missions in the old editor and run them with the current game version?
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Bosen. If I understand you correctly your missions compiled in version 2.12.4 will only run in that version of the game or can you build missions in the old editor and run them with the current game version?
Yes you can as long bellybutton you compile them in the newer version... Just like when we received a copy of the editor beta several months ago.
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Yes, but what's the point?
Will missions built in an earlier version, but "compiled" in a newer version not have the same instability issue of those built entirely in the newer version?
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Bosen. If I understand you correctly your missions compiled in version 2.12.4 will only run in that version of the game or can you build missions in the old editor and run them with the current game version?
Your first guess is correct. Missions compiled with the Mission Editor that came with V2.12.4 will only run in that version of the game. (Actually, back in those early days of offline missions, the word "compile" is probably an overstatement. The Mission Editor from back then doesn't ever produce a .res file. The actual source code from the .mis file seems to be interpreted directly).
Accordingly, I can NOT build missions in that old editor and then run them with the current game version.
I have to run that old source code through a new editor to get it working with the current game version.
:salute
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Will missions built in an earlier version, but "compiled" in a newer version not have the same instability issue of those built entirely in the newer version?
Yes. Old, previously stable versions become unstable when compiled in a newer version as you deduced. I suspect that some new feature introduced in V2.31.x has a bug that causes these occasional crashes. I have recently seen some evidence suggesting that these failures are limited to Windows XP environments. Take a look in this thread in the "bug reports" section of the bbs for a discussion of this:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,356971.0.html
:salute
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My absolute and utter inability to comprehend anything technical in the OP's post just re-iterates to me, the degree of skill and knowledge that is required for the innumerable contributions made by AH members :salute
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Yes. Old, previously stable versions become unstable when compiled in a newer version as you deduced. I suspect that some new feature introduced in V2.31.x has a bug that causes these occasional crashes. I have recently seen some evidence suggesting that these failures are limited to Windows XP environments. Take a look in this thread in the "bug reports" section of the bbs for a discussion of this:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,356971.0.html
:salute
I run windows 7 and I have so far had better luck offline. There seems to be an issue with the interface to the host for online use. I believe nearly all missions will run full length online if they are AI only (participation optional) but the moment a player joins them, there are issues.
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I run windows 7 and I have so far had better luck offline. There seems to be an issue with the interface to the host for online use. I believe nearly all missions will run full length online if they are AI only (participation optional) but the moment a player joins them, there are issues.
To me, this sounds like TWO DIFFERENT issues.
1 of 2- Offline missions crashing fairly deep within MOST missions (may be limited to Windows XP systems), and
2 of 2- Online missions crashing when a player joins.
:salute
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To me, this sounds like TWO DIFFERENT issues.
1 of 2- Offline missions crashing fairly deep within MOST missions (may be limited to Windows XP systems), and
2 of 2- Online missions crashing when a player joins.
:salute
Indeed. Can you make a sure crash offline mission available to me so I can test it on win7?
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See, it's the skew of inconsistancies like this is what scare people off...
A mass of technical knowledge isn't required to build missions, skins and "to a certain extent" the same can be said about terrains... "But don't get me wrong terrains are a entirely different animal that IS hard when it comes to detail".
What I'm saying is, things are where that it can be like pulling teeth to conk out "detailed" missions. But as we all know HTC has only so many hands and there are bigger fish to fry and sooner or later the mission editor will be the way it was meant to be...
To all people even half-interested in content creation, never give up and don't look away too long, HTC will deliver.
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Indeed. Can you make a sure crash offline mission available to me so I can test it on win7?
Yes. I have a couple of missions that are ready for this test.
1 of 2: A big, bold, complex mission: my new "Rabaul431018" mission. You will need my "NGuinea4" terrain as described in this descriptive page:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/Rabaul431018/Rabaul431018Page01Full.htm
Detailed instructions for Version 2.31.3 here:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/Rabaul431018/For2313/Ah2Rabaul431018ForAh2313.htm
2 of 2: A small, simple mission: My "PeabodySimple" mission, using the well-known "ndisles" terrain. Description here:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PeabodySimple/PeabodySimpleMissionPage01Full.htm
Trimmed-down source code (you should not need this, but it's here for reference) and trimmed-down .res file for 2.31.3 here:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PeabodySimple/For2313/
With Windows XP, both of those two missions run well in version 2.12.4 but crash within a few minutes offline under version 2.31.3. Note that the second one was originally published with lots of supported media files for mission briefing and ongoing radio banter (as described in the third link immediately above) but I made a "trimmed-down" version for troubleshooting (described in the last link immediately above) with all of that extra stuff stripped out. Both versions run perfectly in old version 2.12.4 and both versions crash (identically?) in new version 2.31.3.
It would be very useful to know whether either or both of these missions runs on Win7 without crashing.
:salute
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Thanks Bosen, I'll check this out later today if I can get to it and report back.
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Tried Rabaul mission once on allies and once on axis. It did indeed crash both times. On Allied side, it did make it through the warp but crashed shortly afterward. I'll try it again and will also try the other one.
Win 7 Pro 64 bit
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OK. Thanks. This (of course) indicates that the problem(s) are NOT limited to Windows XP. Whatever pattern is behind this, it isn't yet obvious. Further input is welcome from anybody!
:salute
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Just for contrast, here is a link to a mission that DOES run reliably for me under AH V2.31.3 on my Windows XP machine:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PacMix01/Ah2PacMixMissionFullPage.htm
(Last link at the bottom of the page takes you to the version for AH 2.31.3)
I'm banging my head against the wall trying to determine what's different between the missions that do work versus those that don't. So far, I've eliminated these factors:
1- mission complexity: This large, complex mission works, while my simple "PeabodySimple" one fails
2- Terrains: Missions that fail on the newest ndisles terrain also fail on a very old ndisles terrain, at the same point
3- Number of flights assigned to routes: I trimmed my "Rabaul431018" mission down from many flights to the bare minimum with no change.
4- Media files: My "Peabody Simple" mission fails the same way whether fully loaded with briefing audio, briefing maps, and battle radio banter or not.
5- Graphic detail: I've tried my "Rabaul431018" mission with graphic detail at max and at min. Crashes the same way under AH2.31.3 in both cases.
6- Windows XP versus Windows 7. Credible reports from jimson indicate failure of my Rabaul431018 mission under Win7, and the same mission fails for me under Windows XP.
7- "Impossible Segments": "PacMix01" has segments with errors that are detected by the V2.31.3 compiler, but if I have it compiled anyway, it runs OK. "PeabodySimple" has no such errors, but it crashes.
8- Planeset: All of the planes in "PeabodySimple" (which crashes) are also used in "PacMix01" (which does not crash).
9- Converted Terrains: My "Rabaul431018" mission runs in my "NGuinea4" terrain, which was converted from AH1. My "PeabodySimple" mission runs in the "ndisles" terrain, which does NOT display the "Using Converted Terrain" message. Both missions crash under V2.31.3.
10- Warp Segments: I don't have any warp segments in my "PeabodySimple" mission (which crashes). I don't have warp segments in "PacMix01" either, but it does NOT crash. My "Rabaul431018 mission DOES have a warp segment, and it DOES crash.
That is all!
:salute
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Just for contrast, here is a link to a mission that DOES run reliably for me under AH V2.31.3 on my Windows XP machine:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/PacMix01/Ah2PacMixMissionFullPage.htm
(Last link at the bottom of the page takes you to the version for AH 2.31.3)
I'm banging my head against the wall trying to determine what's different between the missions that do work versus those that don't. So far, I've eliminated these factors:
1- mission complexity: This large, complex mission works, while my simple "PeabodySimple" one fails
2- Terrains: Missions that fail on the newest ndisles terrain also fail on a very old ndisles terrain, at the same point
3- Number of flights assigned to routes: I trimmed my "Rabaul431018" mission down from many flights to the bare minimum with no change.
4- Media files: My "Peabody Simple" mission fails the same way whether fully loaded with briefing audio, briefing maps, and battle radio banter or not.
5- Graphic detail: I've tried my "Rabaul431018" mission with graphic detail at max and at min. Crashes the same way under AH2.31.3 in both cases.
6- Windows XP versus Windows 7. Credible reports from jimson indicate failure of my Rabaul431018 mission under Win7, and the same mission fails for me under Windows XP.
7- "Impossible Segments": "PacMix01" has segments with errors that are detected by the V2.31.3 compiler, but if I have it compiled anyway, it runs OK. "PeabodySimple" has no such errors, but it crashes.
8- Planeset: All of the planes in "PeabodySimple" (which crashes) are also used in "PacMix01" (which does not crash).
9- Converted Terrains: My "Rabaul431018" mission runs in my "NGuinea4" terrain, which was converted from AH1. My "PeabodySimple" mission runs in the "ndisles" terrain, which does NOT display the "Using Converted Terrain" message. Both missions crash under V2.31.3.
10- Warp Segments: I don't have any warp segments in my "PeabodySimple" mission (which crashes). I don't have warp segments in "PacMix01" either, but it does NOT crash. My "Rabaul431018 mission DOES have a warp segment, and it DOES crash.
That is all!
:salute
To add to the hair pulling experience of trying to figure out why crashes sometimes occur and other times do not, with no discernable reason, and to confirm that making a successful mission seems to be done only by accident, my "infamy" mission has added sound files, is built on a custom terrain with custom objects (completely redesigned and relocated briefing rooms, fake carrier runways, etc), and also contains warps and has been downloaded 15 times and I have confirmed testing by 4 players and there are so far no reported crashes when flown offline.
As I have stated before, I have temporarily suspended the creation of joinable staged missions for online use as I am now unable to create a mission that works online.
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BBosen.
I just built an offline mission where all my flight segments were first set at "cruise" to check the timing and it ran fine. When I changed some of the cruise settings to "attack" the mission began crashing. I then went back and changed all the attack segments to patrol and so far no crashes.
You could try this with your Rabaul mission to see if it changes anything.
Perhaps it's the attack segments and not warps that are creating a conflict in the program.
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BBosen.
I just built an offline mission where all my flight segments were first set at "cruise" to check the timing and it ran fine. When I changed some of the cruise settings to "attack" the mission began crashing. I then went back and changed all the attack segments to patrol and so far no crashes.
You could try this with your Rabaul mission to see if it changes anything.
Perhaps it's the attack segments and not warps that are creating a conflict in the program.
Interesting.... I'll test that theory and report back through this thread. Give me a couple of days.... real life is intervening.
:salute
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BBosen.
I just built an offline mission where all my flight segments were first set at "cruise" to check the timing and it ran fine. When I changed some of the cruise settings to "attack" the mission began crashing. I then went back and changed all the attack segments to patrol and so far no crashes.
You could try this with your Rabaul mission to see if it changes anything.
Perhaps it's the attack segments and not warps that are creating a conflict in the program.
Well....I tried this theory and got mixed results using the current version of Aces High (V2.31.3) on Windows XP.
After eliminating all "attack" segments (replacing them with "patrol" segments), my big, complex Rabaul mission crashes less frequently, but it still crashes about 50% of the time. Prior to this change, it crashed about 95% of the time. (Same mission never crashes with old version 2.12.4.)
I have published the updated "V2.31.3 no attack segments" version of this mission on my web site if anybody else wants to exercise it. Perhaps it won't crash on some systems. Here's the link:
http://askmisterwizard.com/FlightSimMovies/AcesHigh/Ah2Missions/Rabaul431018/Rabaul431018Page01Full.htm
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