Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Wolfala on September 03, 2010, 03:12:28 PM
-
Friend of mine Doug Lampe from Louisville KY was flying left seat.
DUBAI, United Arab Emirates — A UPS 747 cargo plane with two crew aboard crashed in Dubai shortly after takeoff Friday, the company said.
The United Arab Emirates civil aviation authority said the bodies of the two crew members on board were recovered.
The plane went down inside an Emirati air base near a busy highway intersection about 10 miles southeast of Dubai's international airport.
UPS spokeswoman Kristen Petrella said the Boeing 747-400 went down at about 8 p.m. in Dubai. Flight 6 was en route to the UPS hub in Cologne, Germany, she said.
An Associated Press photographer saw smoke rising from the crash site, which was shielded from the highway by walls. Migrants laborers from a nearby camp gathered along the roadside to watch.
A large section of the plane was visibly on fire before it crashed.
-
Sucks.
Sorry for your loss Wolfala.
:salute
-
indeed me too :salute
-
:salute
-
:salute
-
:salute
-
dam! sorry for your loss sir.
-
My condolences, Wolf. Always tough to lose somebody.
-
:salute
-
very sorry for your loss, mate
-
Sorry for the loss :pray. I work for ups and that was all everyone was talking about last night.
-
Sorry for the loss :pray. I work for ups and that was all everyone was talking about last night.
Can imagine - first fatal for the company in its history. Were there any specifics for where the fire was prior to impact?
-
Can imagine - first fatal for the company in its history. Were there any specifics for where the fire was prior to impact?
http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?ContentBlockID=b2f98f1d-e874-4cf3-af4e-9216e290a654&
This article said they reported a fire in the cockpit.. Sorry to hear of this loss.. :frown:
-
Sorry for the loss of your friend and his partner in the cockpit.
Fair skies and tailwinds forever. :salute
-
:salute
-
:salute
-
:salute
-
:salute
-
Sorry to hear of this...
-
Sorry Wolf.
-
Nobody really knows any details, this is quoted straight of the ups employee site though.
Updated: September 4 at 4:30 p.m. ET
At the request of the families, UPS can now confirm that two of our crewmembers, Captain Doug Lampe of Louisville, Kentucky, and First Officer Matthew Bell of Sanford, Florida, lost their lives in the crash of Flight 6 yesterday, Sept. 3, in Dubai, United Arab Emirates.
The two pilots were flying a 747-400 en route to Cologne, Germany, when it crashed near Dubai International Airport shortly after takeoff.
“This is a terrible tragedy, and all of us at UPS extend our deepest sympathies to the families and friends of both of these crewmembers,” said UPS CEO Scott Davis. “Our thoughts will continue to be with them during this difficult time.”
The UPS Family Assistance Team is working with the victims’ families to help them in their time of need.
Captain Lampe, 48, has been with UPS since 1995. First Officer Bell, 38, has been with UPS since 2006. Both crewmembers flew out of UPS’s Anchorage, Alaska domicile, or pilot base.
The aircraft, tail number N571UP, was just three years old, entering UPS service off the Boeing production line in September 2007. The airframe had flown 9,977 hours, completing 1,764 takeoffs and landings. It was up to date on all maintenance, having just completed a major inspection in June 2010.
UPS owns 12 747-400s, eight of which are new, and four of which have been purchased from other carriers and adapted for UPS use. The aircraft, which has a payload capacity of nearly 258,600 pounds, is used on long-range international routes, such as the regular Dubai-Cologne routing.
The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) is dispatching an aviation investigation team to assist the General Civil Aviation Authority (GCAA) of the United Arab Emirates in the crash investigation. The GCAA will release all information on the progress of the investigation.
NTSB Chairman Deborah Hersman has designated senior air safety investigator Bill English as the U.S. accredited representative. His team will include NTSB specialists in the areas of human performance, fire, operations and systems. The team will also include technical advisors from the FAA, Boeing, UPS, GE, and the Independent Pilots Association.
A UPS team has arrived in Dubai at this time and will cooperate with authorities in the investigation.
“We established an internal command center within minutes of learning of this tragedy. It will be staffed around the clock with experts from every part of our operation,” said UPS Airlines President Bob Lekites. “Safe, secure operations are our top priorities for our employees, our customers, and our public stakeholders.”
UPS is aware of news reports concerning this tragedy, including reports based on conjecture and hearsay. Such reports are neither helpful, nor necessarily accurate. As a result, UPS must only convey information that has been confirmed. Future updates will be available on UPSers.com.
-
Dang Alex. I'm sorry for the loss of your friend and his co-worker. RIP to the two men. :salute
-
:salute
-BigBOBCH
-
Sorry to hear about the loss of your friend.
-
I am sorry, Wolfala. May your friend fly forever on wings. :angel:
-
:salute. Condolences
-
I knew Matt. Someone you know living and dying in your nightmare doesn't have words.
-
I knew Matt. Someone you know living and dying in your nightmare doesn't have words.
Services are looking to be sometime after the 20th.
-
:salute
-
Sorry for your loss. Here some news on the possible cause of the accident:
http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/10/10/09/0023211/FAA-Reports-Heat-In-Cargo-Holds-Can-Ignite-Laptop-Batteries
-
Sorry for your loss. Here some news on the possible cause of the accident:
http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/10/10/09/0023211/FAA-Reports-Heat-In-Cargo-Holds-Can-Ignite-Laptop-Batteries
"lithium batteries are sensitive to heat and can ignite in-flight if transported in cargo compartments that get too hot"
Lithium:
Melting point 453.69 K, 180.54 °C, 356.97 °F
Boiling point 1615 K, 1342 °C, 2448 °F
Critical point (extrapolated) 3223 K, 67 MPa
Heat of fusion 3.00 kJ·mol−1
Heat of vaporization 147.1 kJ·mol−1
Specific heat capacity (25 °C) 24.860 J·mol−1·K−1
:huh, are they flying to close the the sun for the cargo to get that hot?
-
Sorry for your loss. Here some news on the possible cause of the accident:
http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/10/10/09/0023211/FAA-Reports-Heat-In-Cargo-Holds-Can-Ignite-Laptop-Batteries
Maybe the TSA will back off on the bull shi searches. Wishful thinking.
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/bag_check.png)
-
the fact is, that none of this is necessary. it isn't doing anything except pissing off people.
if they TRULY wanted to prevent this kind of thing......then handle any possible attempted hijacking as the isrealies did back in.....1977? 1979?
then they can install the same blast proof doors and bulkheads, and blast proof cargo containers. but...then that'd be too easy, and sensible.
-
:pray to the friends and family.
-
the fact is, that none of this is necessary. it isn't doing anything except pissing off people.
if they TRULY wanted to prevent this kind of thing......then handle any possible attempted hijacking as the isrealies did back in.....1977? 1979?
then they can install the same blast proof doors and bulkheads, and blast proof cargo containers. but...then that'd be too easy, and sensible.
And heavy, do you realize what those kinds of reinforcements weigh? In addition to that, you'd have to have them made, and put up with the worse gas mileage that you get from them. All of that blast-proofing would possibly make the buisiness unprofitable. Perhaps better ventilation, such as vents that allow air to fly through the cargo bay, cooling the cargo down to near the ambient temperature.
-Penguin
-
And heavy, do you realize what those kinds of reinforcements weigh? In addition to that, you'd have to have them made, and put up with the worse gas mileage that you get from them. All of that blast-proofing would possibly make the buisiness unprofitable. Perhaps better ventilation, such as vents that allow air to fly through the cargo bay, cooling the cargo down to near the ambient temperature.
-Penguin
NOPE. THEY're already in use. just not here.
-
the fact is, that none of this is necessary. it isn't doing anything except pissing off people.
if they TRULY wanted to prevent this kind of thing......then handle any possible attempted hijacking as the isrealies did back in.....1977? 1979?
then they can install the same blast proof doors and bulkheads, and blast proof cargo containers. but...then that'd be too easy, and sensible.
Exactly what sort of blast proof cargo containers are you referring to? Do you mean built into the airplane on passenger airframes or freight containers you'd see loaded onto FedEx airplanes?
-
Exactly what sort of blast proof cargo containers are you referring to? Do you mean built into the airplane on passenger airframes or freight containers you'd see loaded onto FedEx airplanes?
i had seen somewhere containers......the containers external shape conformed to the cargo compartments of the aircraft they were made for.......i was pretty sure i had seen this for the israelis, as they did these measures to prevent terrorist activities.
i could be wrong, as i can't find anything right now though........
-
There may well be but AFAIK are not in widespread use. There are cargo containers that are designed to fit in airplanes that are in widespread use with freight haulers all over the world but with any meaningful explosive you're not going to be afforded much or any protection in the event of a blast without getting prohibitive with weight/volume. It's not uncommon to bulk out before you weigh out (meaning you can't fit any more stuff in the airplane but are still under Max Takeoff Weight) depending on the airframe and cutting into that isn't really a good option for the operators.
I don't disagree that there are many things wrong with the TSA but that's another thread for another time and place.
Sticking our heads so far up our collective tulips when it comes to making everything safe that we can see out our mouths isn't a good option either. I never was concerned with a bomb on my airplanes but you can be damn sure I care about lithium ion batteries and know how I intend to fight the fire should it present itself. The point is you can't bomb-proof an airplane and still expect it to fly. Even some of the reinforced cockpit doors have fallen off of their hinges (this happened to me) swung open with a loud thwack a few knots before V1 coming out of DCA (this too happened to me) resulting in a bug-eyed flight attendant staring into the cockpit and a bottle of water rolling down the aisle. Made it over halfway back too...
-
:salute
-
I'd rather not speculate on terrorism or over-anti-terrorism in this thread, that's a whole other can of worms (for the record, I think "bomb-proof containers" for improving current aircraft safety makes as much sence as eating raw chicken packed into a latex to prevent you from getting sick after eating it. Either our entire bodies are designed to handle eating a raw chicken here or there, or they just aren't.).
I am more curious about the matter Oak brought up though, are they seriously considering the cause of this crash to be a large shipment of lithium batteries that overheated??? (as oak pointed out, I know cargo holds get cramped and stuffy, but my very basic chemistry knowledge tells me that the UPS flight that went down was then more of an oven on wings than a Boeing 747... and if memory serves me, didn't it also crash at night and experience trouble imediatley after TO and at low altitude?) Either there's something about lithium batteries onboard aircraft that is a serious safety issue or this is a wild goose chase.
-
There may well be but AFAIK are not in widespread use. There are cargo containers that are designed to fit in airplanes that are in widespread use with freight haulers all over the world but with any meaningful explosive you're not going to be afforded much or any protection in the event of a blast without getting prohibitive with weight/volume. It's not uncommon to bulk out before you weigh out (meaning you can't fit any more stuff in the airplane but are still under Max Takeoff Weight) depending on the airframe and cutting into that isn't really a good option for the operators.
I don't disagree that there are many things wrong with the TSA but that's another thread for another time and place.
Sticking our heads so far up our collective tulips when it comes to making everything safe that we can see out our mouths isn't a good option either. I never was concerned with a bomb on my airplanes but you can be damn sure I care about lithium ion batteries and know how I intend to fight the fire should it present itself. The point is you can't bomb-proof an airplane and still expect it to fly. Even some of the reinforced cockpit doors have fallen off of their hinges (this happened to me) swung open with a loud thwack a few knots before V1 coming out of DCA (this too happened to me) resulting in a bug-eyed flight attendant staring into the cockpit and a bottle of water rolling down the aisle. Made it over halfway back too...
UNderstood.
i should apologize.....i think i inadvertently hijacked(no pun intended) this thread into an argument, and that was crappy of me. for this i do apologize to all of you.
-
This accident wasn't terrorism. I'd bet every paycheck I'll ever receive on it.
Lithium Ion Battery Fire:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJCZ4ayioCU
How the fire actually started and what actually fueled it is still speculatory at the moment and while lithium ion batteries simply being shipped no matter how in what bulk don't present an issue in and of themselves there is potential a hot cell that's in a powered computer for example can be stuck in an insulated area.