Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Volron on September 10, 2010, 04:37:27 PM
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Fuel Availability:
When I first started playing AH in Aug of last year, I recall hitting an airfield and knocking out all the fuel tanks there. When I checked the clipboard map, it showed that the fuel availability at that airfield was at 25%. Maybe I was seeing things? But if all the fuel tanks are knocked out, I think that being limited to 25% would be plausible.
I would like to see if this could be implemented (again if it was there back then). You knock out all the fuel tanks at an airfield, you are limited to 25% fuel from said field. Maybe make the down time the same, or at least half, of what the Ords down time is?
Re-arming at a "porked" airfield:
As it stands, when ever you re-arm at an airfield, even if that airfields ords and fuel have been completely taken out, you get a full resupply on your plane. I was wondering if it would be feasible to make a change to where, if you re-armed at said, porked airfield, that it would affect what you would get when you re-armed? Example: I up a P-47 D-25 with 100% fuel, Center DT, 2 1k lb bombs and rockets, and head to an airfield. After a little bit, we take the airfield but, someone took out all the Ords and fuel (which has happened to most, if not all, of you at one point or another :lol). When I land to rearm my plane, I would not get any ords, my DT and would have to take off with 25% fuel because all ords and fuel tanks are knocked out. The rocket tubes would stay on the plane, in case you wonder what happens to them. :lol
I would like to see if this could be implemented as well.
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I'm in two minds about this, whilst your argument makes sense, I think it would slow down game play.
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I think it makes PERFECT sense. No ords to take off with = no ords to re-arm with. Ditto for the rationed fuel as well.
:aok
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I think it makes PERFECT sense. No ords to take off with = no ords to re-arm with. Ditto for the rationed fuel as well.
:aok
Because then the attacking force would only target the fuel dumps to prevent anyone from taking off. In the old days if you porked the fuel it lowered the available fuel you could take (25%) which caused the porking of all front line bases to prevent the defenders from being to up and defend a nearby base because they didn't have the fuel to make.
ack-ack
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I'm on the fence myself........... :headscratch:
I'm in two minds about this, whilst your argument makes sense, I think it would slow down game play.
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Sure, pork all the fields.....we need to spend more time in the tower watching instead of flying :rolleyes:
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I'm in two minds about this, whilst your argument makes sense, I think it would slow down game play.
I'm on the fence myself........... :headscratch:
I'm not sure either...
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Yep, was there for AH1 when fuel could be taken down to 25%. You could no longer take off from other fields to defend when the porkers were on the loose unless you brought a long range bird. Not very handy, really.
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Agreed re the re arm arguement. IMO re arm pads are a game anachronism left over from AH beta. However if retained they should not re arm material which is not commonly available at the air field.
Re fuel porking down to 25%................. if fuel was rationed volumetrically (or by endurance) rather then a % of capacity then this would be more appropriate. Fuel attrition (as presently mofelled) seems to benefit access to gas guzzling birds which use it inefficiently where as lighter birds (actually using lessfuel anyway) are hit harder. This does not make sense IMO.
Pure volumetric rationing may effect game play so IMO the correct method of rationing would be endurance based using an absolute endurance measure. Presently we have 5 levels of fuel attrition 125% (drop tanks available), 100% fuel available, 75% fuel available, 50% fuel available (disabled), 25% fuel available (disabled)
an example of endurance related rationing would be as follows. (@mil power sea level) using the same % as above
125%= unlimited by rationing, 100%= 100 minutes, 75%= 75 minutes, 50% = 50 minutes, 25% = 25 minutes. E6B maths already sit in the COAD so its not a huge step to implement the actual fuel values available per ac IMO.
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The old fuel porking settings made it possible for one side with a numbers advantage to pretty much keep another side pinned to the mat.
Hard to defend when you can only roll with 25% fuel in la's and Nik's. And when the other side is sitting high over your fields in p47's, p38's, p51's and 190's trying to up an A6m for defence gets really old after a while.
As to rearming more than the field capacity currently is, I can see changing the rearming model ONLY if we go back to being able to pork fuel down to 25% or less. Then changing the rearming model would make sense.
As it is, I just don't see any real point in it. Its work and time spent that gets us exactly what?
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As it is, I just don't see any real point in it. Its work and time spent that gets us exactly what?
The only benefit that appeals to me would be the penalty for an attacking force to completely rampage a base. As it is now, missions roll up, rape the field, vulch until the goon shows up, everyone lands, magically rearms, and rolls down the next field. Should limited rearming be added, those missions would either be stopped cold or forced to take off from the original field, slowing the progress. And it'd be yet another jab at the scorepotatos, which doesn't bother me a bit... ;)
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The only benefit that appeals to me would be the penalty for an attacking force to completely rampage a base. As it is now, missions roll up, rape the field, vulch until the goon shows up, everyone lands, magically rearms, and rolls down the next field. Should limited rearming be added, those missions would either be stopped cold or forced to take off from the original field, slowing the progress. And it'd be yet another jab at the scorepotatos, which doesn't bother me a bit... ;)
Actually it goes both ways. It impairs not only the attacker but also the defender. When ords are porked and the horde brings in GVs, the defender can try to stay alive and to rearm (not that easy, a plane sitting on rearm pad for 30 seconds (excluding taxi time) has a big VULCH ME! sign on top).
IMHO the proposal it would benefit the horde more than the defenders.
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I, personally, have never seen an aircraft successfully land and re-arm at a capped base, so I didn't consider it. Though I suppose it is a good point in that you could entirely disable a front for good. Though, at the same time...that was kind of the intended purpose, when you think about it.
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The Fuel Availability subject seems to be a no go, but the re-arming at porked airfield still seems to be going...
So in the re-arming at porked airfield's subject, why don't we factor out fuel. (Most missions I see, they take 50-75% anyways. I don't see 100% very often, and very rarely w/dt's and 100%) But the ords still play a solid run in this.
Lusche
How exactly does it benefit the horde over the defenders? I am just asking for your reason to that statement. No harm, no foul intended.
An airfield get's attacked by gv's and it's ords are knocked out. You either up a gv, an anti-gv plane or you up from a nearby base w/ords (or you ignore the field all together :lol). The thing is, if the ords are down at the attacked airfield, how is a plane from a different field (or from the same one if they upped w/ords prior to them going down), would have access to something that is no longer available at porked airfield?
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Lusche
How exactly does it benefit the horde over the defenders? I am just asking for your reason to that statement. No harm, no foul intended.
I thought I had already explained that? :headscratch:
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Because then the attacking force would only target the fuel dumps to prevent anyone from taking off. In the old days if you porked the fuel it lowered the available fuel you could take (25%) which caused the porking of all front line bases to prevent the defenders from being to up and defend a nearby base because they didn't have the fuel to make.
ack-ack
Having no DT and %75 max at take off, either fresh or via re-arm/re-fuel pad would hardly prevent anyone from taking off. It might, however, shrink the plane set a wee bit due to range issues. Planes like the La5/7, Spits, and a few other short legged planes wont make the jaunt like a many others.
OH... and that would lend more to the strategic game, too. Or... would that be a travesty to re-supply a base? Remember, the strategic OBJ on a base are only down an hour at the current settings. That makes for a QUICK resupply. ;)
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OH... and that would lend more to the strategic game, too. Or... would that be a travesty to re-supply a base? Remember, the strategic OBJ on a base are only down an hour at the current settings. That makes for a QUICK resupply. ;)
Unless they've changed the settings (and I never saw that they had), downtime varies between 45 minutes and 2 hours. However, since nobody bothers bombing the strats any more, they tend to stay pegged at 45 minutes. A set of supplies will shave 15 minutes off the downtime.
Link (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets)
Note that the downtime is two hours, but the supply convoys come at specific intervals. I believe these work out to a downtime of 45 minutes without any player interaction.
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Unless they've changed the settings (and I never saw that they had), downtime varies between 45 minutes and 2 hours. However, since nobody bothers bombing the strats any more, they tend to stay pegged at 45 minutes. A set of supplies will shave 15 minutes off the downtime.
Link (http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets)
Note that the downtime is two hours, but the supply convoys come at specific intervals. I believe these work out to a downtime of 45 minutes without any player interaction.
Many things have changed and HTC has NOT announced them. Namely, the radar settings. The radar floor settings are DIFFERENT yet again and the radar ring and radar bar have 2 different heights in which the aircraft are detected (experiment and learn for yourself). Also, the ordnance bunkers, fuel tanks, barracks, and radar stay down for a single HOUR now, not 2 hours. Obviously, the destruction of the supply convoys will lengthen the "natural" re-supply times. The AH trainers website is out-dated, be very wary of what you read there.
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Fit fuel to 50% for fully porking a base and take away ord rearm at a field where ord is down. makes perfect sense. and this will bring more porking to the game and less furballing. It would start more teamwork
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Having no DT and %75 max at take off, either fresh or via re-arm/re-fuel pad would hardly prevent anyone from taking off. It might, however, shrink the plane set a wee bit due to range issues. Planes like the La5/7, Spits, and a few other short legged planes wont make the jaunt like a many others.
OH... and that would lend more to the strategic game, too. Or... would that be a travesty to re-supply a base? Remember, the strategic OBJ on a base are only down an hour at the current settings. That makes for a QUICK resupply. ;)
spit8 can last forever on 75% fuel.
semp
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SmokinLoon
It doesn't seem like fuel stay's down for 1 hour. Ords and dar, I would believe, but fuel always seems to come back up well before ords and dar. That's what I have noticed anyways. :headscratch:
When it comes to hitting the Capitol, you now need a group of people to do it effectively (which does add to the fun). But good luck in getting a group of folks to regularly do something like that (or even once in a while outside of Titanic Tuesday). :lol Well, for Rooks, only when Swoops runs his Epic's, does any effort get put into doing damage to the Capitol. :lol I am curious at what percentage the Industrial Center needs to be at before the outlying strats down times are affected. I've heard someone say 30% or less. Maybe someone could clarify?
I am still trying to gauge people's reactions on the ords portion of the subject. If someone intends to launch a big gv mission against a base, ords are usually taken out before the attack. A downside I do see to not being able to rearm ords on your A-20 (example plane), at the field being attacked with it's ords down is, you have to fly all the way to a nearby base to rearm. I was aware of this downside prior to my posting this topic. Probably should have pointed this out in the 1st post. While it does make it a little harder to defend, it also hurts the attackers. I've seen offenses stalled because of lack of ords. Had they just re-armed instead of landing, they would keep rollin (depending). Recently, the groups I've been in have been paying attention to where we launched, attacked and whether ords are down if we take the base. If distance is a little bit of an issue, the mission leads will call for a re-arm and regroup, then head over to take the next base. This has been successful on more than a few occasions, but accomplished at the very least, buying time.
I am quite sure HiTech has thought about whether or not to remove the ability of fully rearming ords at a field that has them down. Would it be possible to get your take on this HT?
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SmokinLoon
It doesn't seem like fuel stay's down for 1 hour. Ords and dar, I would believe, but fuel always seems to come back up well before ords and dar. That's what I have noticed anyways. :headscratch:
When it comes to hitting the Capitol, you now need a group of people to do it effectively (which does add to the fun). But good luck in getting a group of folks to regularly do something like that (or even once in a while outside of Titanic Tuesday). :lol Well, for Rooks, only when Swoops runs his Epic's, does any effort get put into doing damage to the Capitol. :lol I am curious at what percentage the Industrial Center needs to be at before the outlying strats down times are affected. I've heard someone say 30% or less. Maybe someone could clarify?
I am still trying to gauge people's reactions on the ords portion of the subject. If someone intends to launch a big gv mission against a base, ords are usually taken out before the attack. A downside I do see to not being able to rearm ords on your A-20 (example plane), at the field being attacked with it's ords down is, you have to fly all the way to a nearby base to rearm. I was aware of this downside prior to my posting this topic. Probably should have pointed this out in the 1st post. While it does make it a little harder to defend, it also hurts the attackers. I've seen offenses stalled because of lack of ords. Had they just re-armed instead of landing, they would keep rollin (depending). Recently, the groups I've been in have been paying attention to where we launched, attacked and whether ords are down if we take the base. If distance is a little bit of an issue, the mission leads will call for a re-arm and regroup, then head over to take the next base. This has been successful on more than a few occasions, but accomplished at the very least, buying time.
I am quite sure HiTech has thought about whether or not to remove the ability of fully rearming ords at a field that has them down. Would it be possible to get your take on this HT?
Regarding the ord, fuel, barracks, and radar... simply test it for yourself. Take your favorite dive bomber to a V-base and take out the ords or barracks, or even the fuel and watch the clock and check the clipboard map stats (shift-right click on the map at base in question) and it will tell you if it is up or down.
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I am curious at what percentage the Industrial Center needs to be at before the outlying strats down times are affected. I've heard someone say 30% or less. Maybe someone could clarify?
Each time a train, convoy or barge spawns, it first checks to see if there has been damage to the supplier (cities supply factories and factories supply fields). The amount of supplies carried to the destination depends on the amount of damage to the supplier. If the supplier has been damaged by 50%, only one out of every six train cars or convoy trucks will carry supplies.
Math time.
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Sure, pork all the fields.....we need to spend more time in the tower watching instead of flying :rolleyes:
And that is the exact reason why fuel can't be porked ... and it should remain "as is".
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Math time.
I've seen the Industrial Center down to 70-ish percent and when the outlying strats are hit, they only stay down for 45 mins or so. An epic mission that Swoops ran a while back, we knocked the Center down to 14%, give or take a few, and hit all the outlying strats. All that stayed down for hours. I was asking what the percentage of the Center needs to be before hitting the outlying strats would be worth the time.
Regarding the ord, fuel, barracks, and radar... simply test it for yourself. Take your favorite dive bomber to a V-base and take out the ords or barracks, or even the fuel and watch the clock and check the clipboard map stats (shift-right click on the map at base in question) and it will tell you if it is up or down.
Learnin and learnin. I wasn't aware of the shift-right click thing. Always used the right click, then cursor over to base status. :aok
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I've seen the Industrial Center down to 70-ish percent and when the outlying strats are hit, they only stay down for 45 mins or so. An epic mission that Swoops ran a while back, we knocked the Center down to 14%, give or take a few, and hit all the outlying strats. All that stayed down for hours. I was asking what the percentage of the Center needs to be before hitting the outlying strats would be worth the time.
And I answered. But you have to do the math, because I don't feel like it. :p
(Key point being the downtimes of field objects work the same way as the downtimes of the factories. Field objects are supplies by factories, factories are supplied by the city [or the "industrial center," I guess...].)
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Fuel Availability:
When I first started playing AH in Aug of last year, I recall hitting an airfield and knocking out all the fuel tanks there. When I checked the clipboard map, it showed that the fuel availability at that airfield was at 25%. Maybe I was seeing things? But if all the fuel tanks are knocked out, I think that being limited to 25% would be plausible.
I would like to see if this could be implemented (again if it was there back then). You knock out all the fuel tanks at an airfield, you are limited to 25% fuel from said field. Maybe make the down time the same, or at least half, of what the Ords down time is?
Re-arming at a "porked" airfield:
As it stands, when ever you re-arm at an airfield, even if that airfields ords and fuel have been completely taken out, you get a full resupply on your plane. I was wondering if it would be feasible to make a change to where, if you re-armed at said, porked airfield, that it would affect what you would get when you re-armed? Example: I up a P-47 D-25 with 100% fuel, Center DT, 2 1k lb bombs and rockets, and head to an airfield. After a little bit, we take the airfield but, someone took out all the Ords and fuel (which has happened to most, if not all, of you at one point or another :lol). When I land to rearm my plane, I would not get any ords, my DT and would have to take off with 25% fuel because all ords and fuel tanks are knocked out. The rocket tubes would stay on the plane, in case you wonder what happens to them. :lol
I would like to see if this could be implemented as well.
That 25% is the fuel available in the vehicles on base.LOL
You'd have to fly with a rubber hose under the seat !
LOL
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That 25% is the fuel available in the vehicles on base.LOL
You'd have to fly with a rubber hose under the seat !
LOL
LOL What? LOL
(People understand you better when you speak their native language, you see.)
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Sounds good to me. We might be able to see a reset at least once a month if it was put back the way it was.