Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: caldera on October 02, 2010, 02:59:29 PM
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Not a new idea but...
There seems to be a bazillion of these things everywhere you look.:noid How about a factory that can be destroyed, thus disabling or adding a time delay for upping 51s? The current strats don't generate much action and are too far from the front IMO. A 51 strat (being that it is far and away the most used fighter) would be heavily defended and certainly worth destroying.
Epic fights at every altitude could happen - if it was placed relatively close to the front. Put GV spawns into it as well. The current strats - even if they were closer to the front - could never generate the same kind of motivation as destroying the enemy's ability to fly the most popular fighter in the game. And all the 51 drivers would be well motivated to defend it. Furballers and base takers would be in the same space and not really conflicting in their goals. Hot horde on horde action.
I have borrowed some ceramic space shuttle tiles for my protection. You may fire when ready. :)
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No.
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Out :pray
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Waiting for Luche with his pie chart showing usage of the 51 in game...
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I wouldn't mind seeing strats playing a bigger role in the overall game. At present, it requires too many people to effectively knock them down, they are too far away, and they automatically regenerate after a period of time.
Make them more lucrative targets, force countries to resupply them like a regular base, and you can accomplish the same thing without limiting the use of a particular aircraft.
Perhaps having an overall aircraft factory, one that as its damaged, reduces the availability of planes based on ENY - then you might be on to something. For example, a raid that takes down 25% of the factory, stops the availability of perked rides. 40% takes out ENY 5 aircraft, 50% takes it down to ENY 10 aircraft, and so on.
In theory, it could be an effective way of countering ENY....or not. If one side has bad ENY and the others don't, send a raid to balance the tables for a period of time. Course, this is in lieu of my previous suggestion of having strats stay down until resupplied.
Donning my Kevlar, too....
J
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No.
Singling out one particular plane because people like them will never happen. Sorry bud, you're out of luck on this one.
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A small perk for 51 is long overdue. :bolt:
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A small perk for 51 is long overdue. :bolt:
Wont happen though. What happens when Johnny signs up to AH to fly his favourite WW2 plane...but finds out he has to fly something else until he gets perks. He is going to do one of two things, try his hardest to get perks, or just quit the game. HTC doesnt want to loose people, so why perk one of the most popular rides?
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I dunno...I get chased down by Ponys in a Tempest...they can reach 500+ it seems just fast.
As for having to work for perks, why not? Its no different if your favorite plane is the Spit XIV, Tempest, or 262....
The P-51 is a popular aircraft because its lethal in the hands of an average pilot, much like the Spit XVI is the favorite of the noobers and guys who can't fly (like me) because it gives them a fighting chance.
I still the idea of an overall aircraft and tank factory...
Checking my chicken plate...
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There's alot of other "famous" unperked planes to fly. (p-38, Corsairs, Spitfires p-40 flyin Tigers!! etc.)
I wanted my 1st car to be a Corvette, but it wasn't.
That didn't mean I gave up driving cars.
I realized, ya gotta earn it.
A small 5 point perk wouldn't kill anybody.
Or maybe it would, in this "I want it now" generation. :old:
Kinda reminds me of a guy I met who told me he just bought his 17 year old son his 1st car. A brand new 400HP GTO!! :angel:
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Mine was a rotted out 1974 Chevy Impala. Had a 400 small-block and a big back seat!!!
PdP - Perk da Pony (even a couple!)
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The reason no plane factories of would work, well, so long as they are popular, is because it would be used to deprive an outnumbered side of their most needed tools and also undermine the effects of ENY.
Now, if there were factories to get rid of the aircraft types the high number side would have, things in the 20-30 ENY range, that might work. Goodbye C.205, Mosquito Mk VI and P-47D-40 type planes.
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(http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm134/waystin2/nope_logo2.gif)
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That really contributes to the conversation.
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:lol news flash: 51s ain't that great. Do I need to make a list of the planes that outrun,outclimb,outturn,outdive,outroll and outgun the P51s? My advice to you is learn how to fight them. Just as I had to learn how to fight a half dozen different types of spits, 190s and 109s.
Be careful for what you wish for. You could end up with the sky full of F4Us. Then what will you do, perk them too? Hell lets just perk everything.
As far as the aircraft factories goes, it sounds good on paper but if you don't like eny now you'll really love it when the eny kicks in and the only planes you can fly are unavailable because a bomb**** took those out too.
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A small perk for 51 is long overdue. :bolt:
Why should the P51D be perked?
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Why should the P51D be perked?
Easy, it shouldn't.
If the P-51D were to be perked there is a pretty long list of other aircraft that would also need to be perked.
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I dunno...I get chased down by Ponys in a Tempest...they can reach 500+ it seems just fast.
As for having to work for perks, why not? Its no different if your favorite plane is the Spit XIV, Tempest, or 262....
The P-51 is a popular aircraft because its lethal in the hands of an average pilot, much like the Spit XVI is the favorite of the noobers and guys who can't fly (like me) because it gives them a fighting chance.
I still the idea of an overall aircraft and tank factory...
Checking my chicken plate...
The 51 starts to compress at 500+. If they are catching your Tempests you got too low and too slow and put yourself in that position. The Tempest can outclimb and outturn a 51. Are you suggesting a perk on the mustang because it's popular? :lol If you guys have a problem with not being able to kill a P51 then you need to look at YOUR ACMs and BFMs and not look for HTC to pick up the slack for your lack of skills or tactics.
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Ya, learn to fight em, not just say "Perk it!".
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Easy, it shouldn't.
If the P-51D were to be perked there is a pretty long list of other aircraft that would also need to be perked.
In "your" opinion. Easy.
Tfhe 51 is like a plague in this game. In "my" opinion.
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Ya, learn to fight em, not just say "Perk it!".
Will you teach me to fight them? please?
Everybodys got an opinion, mine is perk the 51.
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In "your" opinion. Easy.
Tfhe 51 is like a plague in this game. In "my" opinion.
Hello Boner,
I honestly do not see this plethora (insert pictures from The Three Amigos :D) of 51's you are talking about. What time do you usually fly? I seem to notice a flavor of the month plane from time to time. This month I am seeing a lot of 109G14's and KI-84's. I ain't flaming, but I must say that the 51 hardly needs a perk. It is not at all unbalancing in it's current usage rate IMHO. Where is Lusche when we need a good pie chart?
:salute
Way
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Where is Lusche when we need a good pie chart?
AH Stats 2009 (http://tinyurl.com/2vmz7zz)
Current top plane usage (as well as K/D) isn't really different from 2009
If we perk the P-51D "just because", we soon gotta have to perk the P-47M or the 190D too.
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If we go by what the OP said and he is suggesting this as a vehicle to generate fights, AKA "Hot horde on horde action!" it won't work.
Mostly because this isn't a single team against another team type playing field. There are too many individuals playing the game. single players are here to have fun, not to cap a factory, or to run supply runs. Heck even the bigger squads won't do this. Most squads are all about the attack. They may pork a few bases around the target they plan on attacking but that is only to make the "attack" go easier. It is very rare in these times to see a squad up a bunch of goons to run supplies, or to up a bunch of planes to cap/defend a field.
If we go by Hitech's line "ask for what you REALLY want", then the OP is looking to stop having so many 51's in the air.
Which isn't really fair. As this is a game and some only play to fly the pony. Just as some only play to fly B17's, or 38's. On the other side of the coin, the 51 is one of the most popular planes (according to Lusche's Chart (http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/7052/planeusage2009.jpg)) that doesn't mean that it is always flown by someone like Uptown who knows what to do with it. The same could be said for some spits (a few of our Euro brothers are very good in it) as well as 38's ( and a number of SAPP guys come to mind).
Unfortunately the game is going to go the direction that the majority of players will drag it. These days it's the win the base/war at ANY cost group that is driving the game. Hopefully I'll be able to hang on long enough to see it slip back to the "fight is all important" phase agian.
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520 ways for saying NO to your idea.
http://users.elite.net/runner/jennifers/no.htm (http://users.elite.net/runner/jennifers/no.htm)
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Will you teach me to fight them? please?
Everybodys got an opinion, mine is perk the 51.
Easy. Many ways to catch a pony.
1) Catch him in a dive. (47's, Typhoons, etc...)
2) Make him turn fight. Pony is a little agile, but it aint the best turn fighter. Lots of planes will easily make mince meat of pony in a turn.
Those are the two that come to mind right off the bat. There are probably more (or better) ways of doing it though.
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If we go by what the OP said and he is suggesting this as a vehicle to generate fights, AKA "Hot horde on horde action!" it won't work.
Mostly because this isn't a single team against another team type playing field. There are too many individuals playing the game. single players are here to have fun, not to cap a factory, or to run supply runs. Heck even the bigger squads won't do this. Most squads are all about the attack. They may pork a few bases around the target they plan on attacking but that is only to make the "attack" go easier. It is very rare in these times to see a squad up a bunch of goons to run supplies, or to up a bunch of planes to cap/defend a field.
If we go by Hitech's line "ask for what you REALLY want", then the OP is looking to stop having so many 51's in the air.
Which isn't really fair. As this is a game and some only play to fly the pony. Just as some only play to fly B17's, or 38's. On the other side of the coin, the 51 is one of the most popular planes (according to Lusche's Chart (http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/7052/planeusage2009.jpg)) that doesn't mean that it is always flown by someone like Uptown who knows what to do with it. The same could be said for some spits (a few of our Euro brothers are very good in it) as well as 38's ( and a number of SAPP guys come to mind).
Unfortunately the game is going to go the direction that the majority of players will drag it. These days it's the win the base/war at ANY cost group that is driving the game. Hopefully I'll be able to hang on long enough to see it slip back to the "fight is all important" phase agian.
Thank you for stating your reasons against my idea instead of just saying no with nothing to back it up.
It might not work but then again it might. I read somewhere that another game once had Spitfire factories. Don't know what became of that.
I would like to see less 51Ds in the game - you are right on that point. As one of those individual flyers you mentioned, it gets kinda boring when so many attacks come in accompanied by calls of "high pony" - yawn. I personally don't consider them especially dangerous unless they are tag team BNZ-ing. However, they are consistently the most used fighter variant in the set so there must be something to that. I do think you are wrong that the 51 factory would be treated the same way as the standard AH fare. The number of "no" responses without any explanation in this thread shows me people do care about having their 51s and will fight tooth and nail to keep them.
As far as taking away 51s, I'm not asking for that or for perking them. ENY and perks already limit certain aircraft at certain times, so how would this be different? It will hardly effect the tide of "teh warz" as everyone knows that it's not an unbalancing aircraft, right? The temporary limiting of it should not be unbalancing either. If the Ploesti oil fields or Schweinfurt ball bearing plant were in the game, nobody would exert any special effort in fighting over them. But put the 51D factory in and hell yeah they will fight over it.
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The number of "no" responses without any explanation in this thread shows me people do care about having their 51s and will fight tooth and nail to keep them.
You are simply assuming that players responding with "no" are avid P-51 flyiers. A quick glance tells me: many are not. I for one do fly 51's only occasionally, and personally it wouldn't matter to me if it were perked (I have about the same number of kills in the P-51 B as in the P-51).
I object it for gameplay reasons. I don't see any reason why there should be less 51D's in game. Do you really think a reduction would improve anything?
I personally don't consider them especially dangerous unless they are tag team BNZ-ing. However, they are consistently the most used fighter variant in the set so there must be something to that
So the only reason is: Because it's the most numerous? Well, there will always be a most numerous used BnZ plane. The 47M, 190D are just waiting to takeover that role. At large, players won't do "boring" patrols over the factory. They will just take another plane when there are no 51D's anymore. You really overestimate the will of players to fight for "their" plane, because the affiliation to a certain model is not as strong as you seem to believe.
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I don't support the idea of a single aircraft type factory that can be destroyed to limit availability of a plane. The old 'destroy the spit factory' thing comes from Air Warrior, and did cause more strategic defense as people tried to save the spits - I don't think it would work as well in AH as we have so many different aircraft we could switch to that have the same B&Z functionality, and singling out one plane type seems silly to me.
I do support the idea of having strats as targets that are actually WORTH killing - especially since it usually entails a long mission penetrating deep into enemy territory. I think a better idea would be have 1 - 4 (depending upon the map) generic aircraft plants that if destroyed would raise the ENY of the enemy for a period of time (until the factory is rebuilt / resupplied). If losing an aircraft plant added 3 or 5 points to the ENY, that would create (IMHO) an interesting dynamic to the game.
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My opinion would be if the 51 is perked, then the spits should be as well (I realize yes, the 14 is already) so I don't see either one happening anytime soon. :noid
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But put the 51D factory in and hell yeah they will fight over it.
Hmm.. will you be one of the guys defending your countries p51 factory? :neener:
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I'd agree with adding strats to a specific aircraft, the P-51 wouldn't be one of those aircraft, however.
Not trying to hijack the thread, I do think some type of system that you need to progress through to unlock certain planes, or limiting some of the lower ENY aircraft would be a good. The problem with this is it may discourage the "casual gamer" into playing, as it would take longer for them to make certain things accessible.
How or what that system would be, I have no clue. It doesn't pay for me to think.
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Hmm.. will you be one of the guys defending your countries p51 factory? :neener:
I know I would be :devil :airplane:
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Why would you want to bomb a p51 factory? P51's are usually flown by not so skillful (read easy targets) pilots.
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Why should the P51D be perked?
Because 1Boner gets his bellybutton kicked by the Mustang quite a bit. If you haven't noticed a pattern yet, those that wish planes to be perked are the ones that are usually the target for the planes they wish to have perked.
ack-ack
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The 51 starts to compress at 500+. If they are catching your Tempests you got too low and too slow and put yourself in that position. The Tempest can outclimb and outturn a 51. Are you suggesting a perk on the mustang because it's popular? :lol If you guys have a problem with not being able to kill a P51 then you need to look at YOUR ACMs and BFMs and not look for HTC to pick up the slack for your lack of skills or tactics.
the tempest is best at approximately 10k and 20k, any other altitude and its speed decreases drastically in both higher and lower altitudes. the p51 could easily catch a tempest at sea level in the right conditions.
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the tempest is best at approximately 10k and 20k, any other altitude and its speed decreases drastically in both higher and lower altitudes. the p51 could easily catch a tempest at sea level in the right conditions.
:huh a zero can catch a 262 in the "right" conditions too.
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:huh a zero can catch a 262 in the "right" conditions too.
P40 as well :airplane: :noid
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Because 1Boner gets his bellybutton kicked by the Mustang quite a bit. If you haven't noticed a pattern yet, those that wish planes to be perked are the ones that are usually the target for the planes they wish to have perked.
ack-ack
I have to admit, though, that seeing a "perk the 51D" is refreshing to me . . . at least the object of the whine is the most used fighter. Usually these whines go against the spixteen or LA-7 even though the usages are smaller and K/D ratios tend to be very similar.
Haven't seen the N1K2-J whined about much lately. Perhaps I should start a thread . . . :noid
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I was in the "perk the spixteen" crowd at one time. Those planes just ate me up all the time. I made up my mind one day that I'll figure them out. I flew one for a bit trying to see what they really could and couldn't do. One thing led to another and before I knew it I was racking up spit16 kills right and left. Still do. Most of my kills for quite sometime now have been spixteens and 51Ds.
I guess my point here is, if you're having a hard time with a particular plane..... learn it. Then you'll know what to do to kill it.
When I see a enemy P51 i grin from ear to ear :D
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I have to admit, though, that seeing a "perk the 51D" is refreshing to me . . . at least the object of the whine is the most used fighter. Usually these whines go against the spixteen or LA-7 even though the usages are smaller and K/D ratios tend to be very similar.
Haven't seen the N1K2-J whined about much lately. Perhaps I should start a thread . . . :noid
The P-51D used to be part of the "PERK THE 4" crowd of planes along with the La-7, N1K2 and FW 190D-9. When the Spitfire Mk XVI showed up and some changes made to the P-51D flight model, the Mustang lost its place amongst the Perk the 4 crowd and was replaced by the Spitfire MK XVI.
ack-ack
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I wish to perk ppl who want to perk some planes :bolt:
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I have different parts of my body perked. Does that count? :headscratch:
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:huh a zero can catch a 262 in the "right" conditions too.
i misread the posts... i put that in to make a point. and even with it being out of topic, it is still true :D
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I say perk the people who want the B29
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The P-51 is a popular aircraft because its lethal in the hands of an average pilot, much like the Spit XVI is the favorite of the noobers and guys who can't fly (like me) because it gives them a fighting chance.
:rofl ... in the 9 years I have been playing, I can count on 2 hands the amount of pilots that are really good in a P-51 and on 1 hand I can count the amount of pilots that are truly lethal in a P-51.
You are mistaking noobs using the P-51's speed to exit (or run) away from a fight ... that is their only "fighting chance" in a P-51.
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:rofl ... in the 9 years I have been playing, I can count on 2 hands the amount of pilots that are really good in a P-51 and on 1 hand I can count the amount of pilots that are truly lethal in a P-51.
You are mistaking noobs using the P-51's speed to exit (or run) away from a fight ... that is their only "fighting chance" in a P-51.
......I'm guilty :bolt:
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:furious Perk the Tater planes...... :old: Oh wait wrong thread..... :o
:lol
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Hmm.. will you be one of the guys defending your countries p51 factory? :neener:
Gonna go with "no" on that one. :)
I say perk the people who want the B29
Good idea noob. Can I have the B-29 to bomb it with? :devil
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-1 for perk the plane
+1 for improve the strat game
Tie factory damage to the availability of ammo, fuel , troops, radar, repairs, town rebuilds, Aircraft and Vehicles. It would make for a more interesting game. Allow for fuel to be taken down at an airfield to less than 75%. Separate fuel from drop tanks as a set of destructible object. So that you might have limited fuel but still have an ability to carry drop tanks.
Change the win the war rules to include the total destruction of other country’s ability to manufacture war materials, along with capturing the 40% of their territory.
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Those that whine to have the P-51D perked can never explain how the Mustang causes any sort of unbalance in the game play (reason why plane is perked) other than "I don't like seeing so many people fly them". Why don't you guys just buck up and learn how to fight one and you won't be so worried when you run into one.
I guess the old AH saying holds true after all of these years..."Perk what you can't shoot down." Sad why to play if you ask me.
ack-ack
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Those that whine to have the P-51D perked can never explain how the Mustang causes any sort of unbalance in the game play (reason why plane is perked) other than "I don't like seeing so many people fly them". Why don't you guys just buck up and learn how to fight one and you won't be so worried when you run into one.
I guess the old AH saying holds true after all of these years..."Perk what you can't shoot down." Sad why to play if you ask me.
ack-ack
perk the P51B :aok well...at least for the people who cant shoot me down in it... :bolt:
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Tie factory damage to the availability of ammo, fuel , troops, radar, repairs, town rebuilds, Aircraft and Vehicles. It would make for a more interesting game. Allow for fuel to be taken down at an airfield to less than 75%.
Can quickly make the game a very unbalanced and lopsided one.
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honestly speaking, the P-51D is a lot easier to deal with then the Spit16. But both can be beat with patience and good flying. Planes like th tempest however, are just too powerful to not perk - and thats the difference.
I hate the perk system, it encouages grinding and vulching and other relativly poor behavior - I don't mind vulching per se because its a great way to shut down an airfield - but - if things got perked, then it would encourage the behavior - and that would kill the game.
So I say, quit running to the Perk it button everytime you die to a plane. The 51 and the spit are not unbeatable, learn your plane, and dictate your fight - and if you die - just up again and try again. . . you can only get better if you learn from you mistakes.
I also love seeing 51s, they are fun to fight, and I don not mind people hitting the deck and running - since I am usually headed for the base they are running towards anyway - so sooner or later they will have to fight me. . .
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Why not make a bomber factory? After all those plants are much larger and therefore easier
for new bomber pilots to hit. Plus, if you really want to ruin other people's day, at least make it
people who care about what you fly. :D
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Can quickly make the game a very unbalanced and lopsided one.
I agree with you in the way you used the quote, however, you took the quote out of context . I think adding the factories to the required list for destruction before a country can win the war would add to the fights. It would bring the game more in line with actual WWII battle strategy. I don’t see a down side.