Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Hardware and Software => Topic started by: EagleDNY on November 22, 2010, 03:41:58 PM
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I'm thinking it is time for me to go with the 3 flat panel setup - I've seen both the NVIDIA SLI and the ATI setups at the hardware shows, but would like to hear from people ACTUALLY USING THEM in AH. If you are using a 3 monitor setup, how about dropping a post in here with what graphics card(s) you are using and what resolution and frame rate you get across the 3 monitors. Also - if you have run into driver or stability issues, please post that as well.
BTW SCUZZY - if you wanted to post a recommendation based on what you guys are using over there, I wouldn't mind reading that as well. I don't know what graphics libraries you guys are using, but if you folks have a preference for ATI or NVidia, I'd like to hear it.
EagleCH
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Hi EagleCH
I'm running a three screen setup using NVIDIA's new 3D Vision Surround Technology (http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/3d-vision-surround-technology-uk.html).
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/header_3d_vision-small.jpg)
I'm just running the "Surround" part i.e. triple screen, not the "3D" part (I don't have the glasses or the monitor refresh rate for that!)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Camel_setup.jpg)
Three Dell UltraSharp 3008WFP Monitors driven by three ASUS ENGTX480/2DI/1536MD5 (http://uk.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=B6fn5EvgG3e6FLA6&templete=2) Graphics Cards.
Combined visible area 52" by 25 1/4", Corner to Corner 58". The two bezels between each screen comes to about 5.7cm or at a pixel pitch of 0.2505 about 230 pixels; giving 1600+230+1600+230+1600 = 5260
So I'm running Aces High at a resolution of 5260 x 2560
I'm currently using these settings
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-1.jpg)(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-2.jpg)
Which gives about 100fps with Vsync off, so plenty of over overhead to keep a rock solid 60fps with Vsync on.
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-3.jpg)
I used to use the SoftTH "triplehead" (http://www.kegetys.net/SoftTH/) software to run the three screens before NVIDIA bought out their drivers, but I'm seeing a 300% increase in fps over SoftTH using NVIDIA's solution.
Setup was fairly straight forward, although you have to change a few settings in the NVIDIA profile for AH. You don't want "Alternate Frame Rendering" selected (or the frame rate is abysmal), and you have to "Force Vsync ON" (or you get tearing on the outer monitors).
Stability wise it's all rock solid, I play for hours on end without problems.
I have been suffering the very occasional "Crash to Desktop", but haven't been able to isolate whether this is related to the three screen setup or something else. See this post for details (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,294754.msg3806335.html#msg3806335).
Not the cheapest setup in the world, but I’m delighted with the performance I’m getting with the NVIDIA setup. :D
There's a few more details and pics about my setup in this post (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,272318.msg3768366.html#msg3768366).
Hope this helps, Regards Sid (aka Conan)
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Hi EagleCH
I'm running a three screen setup using NVIDIA's new 3D Vision Surround Technology (http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/3d-vision-surround-technology-uk.html).
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/header_3d_vision-small.jpg)
I'm just running the "Surround" part i.e. triple screen, not the "3D" part (I don't have the glasses or the monitor refresh rate for that!)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Camel_setup.jpg)
Three Dell UltraSharp 3008WFP Monitors driven by three ASUS ENGTX480/2DI/1536MD5 (http://uk.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=B6fn5EvgG3e6FLA6&templete=2) Graphics Cards.
Combined visible area 52" by 25 1/4", Corner to Corner 58". The two bezels between each screen comes to about 5.7cm or at a pixel pitch of 0.2505 about 230 pixels; giving 1600+230+1600+230+1600 = 5260
So I'm running Aces High at a resolution of 5260 x 2560
I'm currently using these settings
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-1.jpg)(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-2.jpg)
Which gives about 100fps with Vsync off, so plenty of over overhead to keep a rock solid 60fps with Vsync on.
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-setup-Aug2010-3.jpg)
I used to use the SoftTH "triplehead" (http://www.kegetys.net/SoftTH/) software to run the three screens before NVIDIA bought out their drivers, but I'm seeing a 300% increase in fps over SoftTH using NVIDIA's solution.
Setup was fairly straight forward, although you have to change a few settings in the NVIDIA profile for AH. You don't want "Alternate Frame Rendering" selected (or the frame rate is abysmal), and you have to "Force Vsync ON" (or you get tearing on the outer monitors).
Stability wise it's all rock solid, I play for hours on end without problems.
I have been suffering the very occasional "Crash to Desktop", but haven't been able to isolate whether this is related to the three screen setup or something else. See this post for details (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,294754.msg3806335.html#msg3806335).
Not the cheapest setup in the world, but I’m delighted with the performance I’m getting with the NVIDIA setup. :D
There's a few more details and pics about my setup in this post (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,272318.msg3768366.html#msg3768366).
Hope this helps, Regards Sid (aka Conan)
Lol!
With a single Radeon HD5870 or 6870 you can achieve the same triple screen setup for literally a fraction of the price and get 60fps on AH2.
Why on earth have you sunk money to THREE 480's?
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Because I didn't know any better, which is the point of EagleCH post.
I've shared my first hand experience of triple screen setups using both "NVIDIA's new 3D Vision Surround Technology" and "SoftTH triplehead software" to run AH.
I have no experience of Eyefinity, if you have perhaps you like to share the details?
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Because I didn't know any better, which is the point of EagleCH post.
I've shared my first hand experience of triple screen setups using both "NVIDIA's new 3D Vision Surround Technology" and "SoftTH triplehead software" to run AH.
I have no experience of Eyefinity, if you have perhaps you like to share the details?
If I recall correctly eyefinity was already handled by an another thread, I was only wondering about your three premium level cards. Does Nvidia really require you to get a card per monitor or are they just a performance overkill on your part? IIRC Chalenge has mentioned that FSX players can actually need a TRI-SLI setup but AH2 should run maxed with a single 480 / 5870 card even at triple screen resolutions.
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excellent triple monitor setup sid! dont you like em in landscape?
dont be afraid to click that smooth shadow on!
:rock :rock :salute
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3D Vision Surround Technology System Requirements (http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/3dv-system-requirements-surround-technology-uk.html)
You need at least two cards, three maybe over kill on my part, although the EVGA Precision tuning tool shows all three to be working hard when I run AH with my current settings.
Part of the reason I went with NVIDIA was at the time Eyefinity didn't appear to support "portrait" mode or the resolution I wanted; 5260 x 2560, that may have changed, but as I say I have no experience of Eyefinity.
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excellent triple monitor setup sid! dont you like em in landscape?
dont be afraid to click that smooth shadow on!
:rock :rock :salute
"dont you like em in landscape?"
Simple answer; NO
The three 30" monitors side by side (landscape) take up about 85 inch of desk space i.e. most of the room. I found this just emphasizes the feeling of looking through a post box (albeit a very large one) and made me feel sick. Portrait mounting helps keep the aspect ratio similar to one large screen but with a larger field of view.
To give you an idea of the different feel you get with portrait vs. landscape here's three screen shots:
(http://websites.cable.ntl.com/~simon.shaw/forum_pics/ahss2560x1600x100_small.jpg)
Standard 30" Widescreen
(http://websites.cable.ntl.com/~simon.shaw/forum_pics/ahss5000x2560x111_small.jpg)
3 X 30" Widescreen portrait
(http://websites.cable.ntl.com/~simon.shaw/forum_pics/ahss7880x1600x145_small.jpg)
3 X 30" Widescreen landscape
"dont be afraid to click that smooth shadow on!"
Even with the three 480's, "shadow smoothing" will drop the frame rate to only 60fps leaving no overhead for when the action really gets thick, I prefer to leave it off .
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Nice setup Sid. I don't believe you'd get a solid 60 fps with a 5870 at 5260 x 2560. I have a 5970 at 6038 x 1080 and sometimes it dips into the mid 50s. Portrait mode gives you a better aspect ratio for SA because you see up more in each view but you need an IPS panel like yours for the view angles. I use landscape and TrackIR. I just have to move my head a little more to look all around. If you have any issues with your TrackIR mounted so high you could try putting it behind you at head height and just reverse the axis.
Btw have you tried a wider view angle like 110 -120?
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Thanks FLS, around 120-124 Deg "Custom Field Of View" works best for me.
Funny you should mention the TrackIR, I was just playing around with it's position the other day (after the photo was taken), and currently have it stuck to the left hand bezels about two thirds of the way up the monitor (about level with the front of the Camels upper wing in the photo). With the indicator lights turned off, it's unnoticeable and seems to function well, but I hadn't thought of positioning it behind me.
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Good idea mounting it on the bezels. I didn't think of that but it's a similar width.
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I use an eyefinity setup 3 19 lcds with a resolution of 3840 X 1024. I use ati hd 5850 one card with a display port adapter.
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I'm running an ATI 5970 card with 3 24" dell monitors in the "eyefinity" setup. All settings are maxed out. Screen resolution at 5760 x 1080 (1920 x 1080 per monitor), actually 6136 x 1080 with bezel compensation. Frame rate was a steady 60 until I contacted ATI tech support and they had me download a newer driver. I also upgraded cable modem to a faster speed and frame rate runs 100 to 120. Not sure if it was the driver update or the modem upgrade. Anyway, I love the setup. Only thing I'm not crazy about is the image is somewhat stretched across the 2 side monitors making objects appear larger and closer than they actually are. Not sure if this is correctable.
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The side stretching is supposed to be like that. You can get rid of it by running in portrait mode. I don't know how you're getting higher than 60 fps if you have V-synch on, assuming your monitors refresh rate is 60. If you do have V-synch on and the refresh for your monitor is 60 you probably need to install DX9 to avoid image tearing.
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Thanks guys - this gives me some great ideas. The 3-Screen Nvidia setup I can do with 2 decent cards running in SLI mode (now that I know the Nvidia system works that is...). I hadn't thought about the portrait / landscape mode being variable in these setups - that looks like something I'll want to experiment with a bit. I like the wide view, but I have to admit that most of the time I find myself looking up during fights and having more of an overhead would be an advantage.
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fwd-up is one of the most valuable views, so the "best" setup would probably be 3 monitors set up wide, with a 4th set up on top of the middle one. Since you can't do that except maybe with ATI's latest (?), the next best thing is 3 monitors set up in portrait and adjust the FOV to give you a nice vertical view fwd and up.
120 deg would be nice with only 3 view switches giving you full 360 coverage, but you'd still probably use 4 views to get overlapping coverage so nobody slips past behind the frames. A head jitter switch moving your head position a bit to peek behind the bezels and canopy framing might also be a nice touch.
Then again, the only virtual flying I've been doing lately has been in the T-6 sim domes, and they have around 240 deg of coverage with extremely smooth framerates and none of that nasty jitter you can see in AH if you look out over the wing and then roll rapidly. Nifty simulators but a bit above most of our price range :)
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If I recall correctly eyefinity was already handled by an another thread, I was only wondering about your three premium level cards. Does Nvidia really require you to get a card per monitor or are they just a performance overkill on your part? IIRC Chalenge has mentioned that FSX players can actually need a TRI-SLI setup but AH2 should run maxed with a single 480 / 5870 card even at triple screen resolutions.
Frame rates in FSX dont actually benefit that much from tri-SLI and by that I mean once FSX has hit 20 fps the game is smooth. The benefit comes in the way of additional processing of AA and AF which allows you to run more addons like weather products and high end texture mods (custom scenery). I think the really big difference between Nvidia and Ati is with shaders but Im still learning about them (actually Im not really interested in learning more about it).
EDIT: As to the three monitor landscape/portrait setup all you need is SLI not tri-SLI because it needs at least three connectors (and you may be able to use just a single card using the HDMI port as the third connector).
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Sid, That's a nice setup. It's funny because today I was thinking how I would set up 3 monitors for fighter pilot action and you set yours up just as I envisioned. Nice going.
I'm setting up tri-monitors for another flight sim and for flying Aces High in bombers. Consequently, the three 1920x1200 monitors will go landscape. They will be driven by two Nivia 460s in SLI. I have a couple questions though.
1) Is it true that Nvidia only supports horizonal spanning with Windows XP? I hear that horizontal spanning does not work with Vista and with Windows 7. I am using XP 64 bit for this reason.
2) For three monitors, do I set up the 5760x1200 resolution in the video8.cfg file? I tried doing so today but every time I went back into Aces High the resolution had been reset at 640x480. Suggestions welcome. I can stretch normal windows across all three monitors, but I'm not 100% sure I have the Nvidia software set up just right. I have enabled horizontal scanning, however.
Thanks. Looking forward to giving you a triple-monitor bomber to shoot at with your triple-monitor fighter.
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this is with single eyefinity card. i really wish bezels were optionally removable.
http://youtu.be/GNkDX2pcg0U?hd=1 (http://youtu.be/GNkDX2pcg0U?hd=1)
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Sid, That's a nice setup. It's funny because today I was thinking how I would set up 3 monitors for fighter pilot action and you set yours up just as I envisioned. Nice going.
I'm setting up tri-monitors for another flight sim and for flying Aces High in bombers. Consequently, the three 1920x1200 monitors will go landscape. They will be driven by two Nivia 460s in SLI. I have a couple questions though.
1) Is it true that Nvidia only supports horizonal spanning with Windows XP? I hear that horizontal spanning does not work with Vista and with Windows 7. I am using XP 64 bit for this reason.
2) For three monitors, do I set up the 5760x1200 resolution in the video8.cfg file? I tried doing so today but every time I went back into Aces High the resolution had been reset at 640x480. Suggestions welcome. I can stretch normal windows across all three monitors, but I'm not 100% sure I have the Nvidia software set up just right. I have enabled horizontal scanning, however.
Thanks. Looking forward to giving you a triple-monitor bomber to shoot at with your triple-monitor fighter.
Man move up to Windows 7! You can use the same setup. XP 64 was pretty much a hack job for a 64 bit OS. Do you really need a 64 bit OS? I realize about 50% of Windows 7 users are 64 bit now but the majority of them dont even need it.
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Sid, That's a nice setup. It's funny because today I was thinking how I would set up 3 monitors for fighter pilot action and you set yours up just as I envisioned. Nice going.
I'm setting up tri-monitors for another flight sim and for flying Aces High in bombers. Consequently, the three 1920x1200 monitors will go landscape. They will be driven by two Nivia 460s in SLI. I have a couple questions though.
1) Is it true that Nvidia only supports horizonal spanning with Windows XP? I hear that horizontal spanning does not work with Vista and with Windows 7. I am using XP 64 bit for this reason.
2) For three monitors, do I set up the 5760x1200 resolution in the video8.cfg file? I tried doing so today but every time I went back into Aces High the resolution had been reset at 640x480. Suggestions welcome. I can stretch normal windows across all three monitors, but I'm not 100% sure I have the Nvidia software set up just right. I have enabled horizontal scanning, however.
Thanks. Looking forward to giving you a triple-monitor bomber to shoot at with your triple-monitor fighter.
Thanks PapaFox
1) As far as I'm aware Windows 7 is a requirement for NVIDIA's Surround Technology. I use Windows 7 for that reason.
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Requirments.jpg) (http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/3dv-system-requirements-surround-technology-uk.html)
2)Here's a guide to the set up
Having installed the Nvidia Graphics Driver
Right Clicking anywhere on the desktop gives this menu
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/RightClick.jpg)
Windows "Screen Resolution" page looks like this (if any of the monitors aren't active, activate them here).
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Basic-Win-Screen-Res.jpg)
and the NVIDIA Control panel page looks like this
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Basic-Nvidia_setup.jpg)
Also note the options available in the "Manage 3D Settings" - "Program Settings" - "Aces High" look like this (I've photo-shopped the image so all the options are visible without scrolling)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Basic-Nvidia_AH-setup.jpg)
To setup the Surround Mode select "Span Display with Surround" (read all of this post first, you might not want to jump straight into this step)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Surround-Nvidia_setup.jpg)
Follow the Nvidia setup routine pages for setting up the "Display" positions and "Bezel Correction" (Don't worry too much if you can't get the "Display" position correctly setup at stage one, it never seems to work correctly for me, just come back to it after you set the "Bezel Correction")
The Windows "Screen Resolution" page should now look like this (note you can chose to have your desktop "Bezel" corrected or not by selecting the appropriate resolution here)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Surround-Win-Screen-Res.jpg)
Any time you change anything in the NVIDIA Control panel - "Configure SLI, PhysX, Surround" page, after "Applying" the change, I always find it best to re-boot the computer, although you won’t be ask to.
To setup Aces High, simply start, select "Video Settings" from the initial splash screen, and select your new "Video Resolution" in the drop down box (No need to play about with the video8.cfg file)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AH-Video-Setup.jpg)
Now for me, and I suspect this might always be the case, having done the above as Nvidia intend, my frame rate is a whopping 10fps.
Luckily there's an option that improves this for me to 100fps+, but the option is rather hidden away and took me ages to find. That's why I said "read all of this post first"
If you look at the "NVIDIA Control panel" - "Manage 3D Settings" - "Program Settings" - "Aces High" page again with "Span Display with Surround" enabled, it's the same as with "Disable SLI"
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Surround-Nvidia_AH-setup.jpg)
If your in "Span Display with Surround" go back to "Disable SLI" - apply and re-boot (Note I've found it always best to go back to "Disable SLI" first when changing modes here, if you jump from one SLI mode straight to another, It can cause no end of problems)
Now select "Activate all Displays" instead - apply - re-boot
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AllDisplays-Nvidia_setup.jpg)
On the "NVIDIA Control panel" - "Manage 3D Settings" - "Program Settings" - "Aces High" page a new option has appeared: "SLI rendering mode"
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AllDisplays-Nvidia_AH-setup.jpg)
"SLI rendering mode" - "Force alternate frame rendering 2" which is highlighted in black because Nvidia has pre-configured Aces High to run in this mode even though it is different to your global settings, great for a single screen setup, not so great for a surround setup.
Change this to "Single-GPU" and apply (Note this setting gets used in "Span Display with Surround" mode just the option to change it disappears. All my GPU's still appear to be being used, just not in "alternate frame rendering 2" mode)
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/AllDisplays-GPU-Nvidia_setu.jpg)
Now go back to "Disable SLI" - re-boot - "Span Display with Surround" - re-boot - Hopefully your now setup to go - enjoy.
One final last thing, if you find you get "tearing" on the outer monitors (particularly when rolling the aircraft), try selecting "Force Vertical sync ON" in the "NVIDIA Control panel" - "Manage 3D Settings" - "Program Settings" - "Aces High" page.
(http://www.swift72.co.uk/forum_pics/Vsync-Nvidia_AH-setup.jpg)
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Sid,
I'm going to build a statue of you in my front yard and personally keep the birds away. Thanks for a magnificent explanation! I'll report back.
Papafox
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I've a feeling a statue of me would its self keep the birds and everything else away! :eek:
I look forward to hearing how you get on.
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I used 3 1920x1200 monitors in landscape orientation, and they work marvelously using Sid's instructions. When the Dickweeds fly a mission with B-17s, we often have 60 or more planes in the air at one time. It's a thrill flying formation with the three monitors because I can see bombers in position on both sides of me. Too cool. I'll send a sample photo soon. Many thanks for the great instructions once again!
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one more Q;
will increasing the field of view value while on landscape fix the stretching of objects on the peripheral view monitors?
thanks.