Shotgun sounds fine. Bird shot. Too far away? No problem, just a little spray, he is in pain, he leaves or crumples to the floor. Too close (attacking) he goes bye bye. And yes, if I was invading a house (I wouldn't) the oh-so familiar sound of a shotgun cocking would get me out in a pinch.
But if you are looking for a scare effect, there are rifles with pump action as well. For having just a really big gun, try a muzzleloader :aok
My neighbor had a fully loaded glock in his truck, just in case (notice I said HAD) Someone stole the loaded thing last Halloween.Glock is intimidating with that snapping sound it makes when the action closes.
Hope this helps.
In response to ripsnort:Kinda tough to get those in a condo though...
Gun-safe :aok
1: The cha-chink cocking sound is farking intimidating, and may scare a thief away so he does not need to shoot.
2: Scatter shot has a better chance for hitting if he has to aim and shoot in a hurry
3: I also told him to get bird, not buck shot. Not because of lethality issues, but because i would think they would be less likely to go through the walls into the condo next door to him and possibly hurt an innocent neighbor.
Thoughts on this?
Protect the weapons please. Gun safe in the house, perhaps an alarm system. If you travel with a gun, take it OUT of the vehicle when you leave the vehicle unless you have your eyes on it when you've left the vehicle.
This is a good point. I ended up supplying the criminal element with a lot of firearms when my collection was stolen several years ago. Most of mine were weapons criminals wouldn't make use of, WW2 era rifles and such. Still, I wish I had done more to keep them from falling in the wrong hands.
You have to strike a balance between security and quick access. If I need a gun I want it in my hands immediately.
Perhaps keep it out of the safe only when you are home?
This is a good point. I ended up supplying the criminal element with a lot of firearms when my collection was stolen several years ago. Most of mine were weapons criminals wouldn't make use of, WW2 era rifles and such. Still, I wish I had done more to keep them from falling in the wrong hands.That is a great point. Personally (Since I've had kids in the house) I use one of these for my pistols, it's beside my bed and I've rehearsed access while laying down....3.2 seconds. :)
You have to strike a balance between security and quick access. If I need a gun I want it in my hands immediately.Perhaps keep it out of the safe only when you are home?
Oh, and yes, I told him to get an alarm system instead of a gun, but he feels violated and unsafe. He insists on a gun, not a 'wimpy alarm'.
*shrug* He may come down and think normally after a few more days.
And yes, I think an alarm is a better idea than a gun, since most robberies are when no one is at home. Home invasions are rare.
Me, I don't even have a gun, tho i do keep my old SCA wooden sword under my bed in case anyone needs a beatdown. I also have very young kids, so the thought of an easily accessible gun makes my skin crawl.
(cough, New Jersey, cough.)QFT.
Also other states too. I don't have the actual case information but there have been a few that had to do with what the statutes were and whether or not the intruder was actually a lawful threat. Know the rules boys and girls.
a minute or two later after the threat has subsided kill him. Kill him outright and swiftly.
Wait, what?
People have shot intruders in their own house, and have been succesfully sued by the intruder they shot? WTF :mad: :mad:
Ok, not gonna get political on this.
As for Golfer and the kill thing. I would just change everything to 'incapacitate'. You're shooting to render that threat unable to harm you. As long as you understand your laws, shoot to incapacitate as quickly as possible. Put as many in center body mass until the threat is no longer a threat.
I've been in several situations where law enforcement during a string of home invasions, while people were home, advised the homeowners exactly of what I passed on.
You don't ever shoot to injure, you shoot to destroy.
That isn't bad advice.
I never said go kill the guy who isn't a threat to you, far from it.
Jayhawk, when your taught to shoot, it's center mass, double tap, empty clip, now at nightime you don't have the time to pick a shot that won't kill them, you center mass, shoot to kill, one thing i was taught up front is that you don't pull your firearm unless you plan on using deadly force, it's not a toy to scare them with, ya shoot to kill
There is a THICK LINE between self-defense and Mayhem. Only moron would take some of the advice being given out in this thread.
Morally:
It's wrong to kill unless in self defense. If you disabled the intruder and you're in no imminent danger, you call 911. You don't go and murder.
That is why you always shoot to kill, never to wound. If the person is wounded and is absolutely no threat, then call 911.
Be careful though as anyone you do not know that is in your house without permission is a threat unless they are completely unconcious.
If you have any qualms shooting someone then do not get a gun for protection.
On the other hand....
I think Jayhawk explained it better than I did.
So you suggest I go and knock a neighbors kid I didn't recognize at first, unconscious?
Everybody should have qualms about shooting someone, whether you're actually do it or not.
On the other hand, you guys are all such experts when it comes to killing, I'll just shut up :aok
Friend of mine had his condo recently robbed, and he's really mad and is talking about getting a gun to protect his house.
Note that he was not home when the robbery occurred.
He asked me what he should get for a gun. Originally he was talking about a desert eagle, but i talked him off _that_ ledge. I would think that's the last thing he wants for home defense. Note tho that neither he or I are gun owners, tho i was in the rifle team in college which is why he asked me.
I suggested a shotgun, for several reasons.
1: The cha-chink cocking sound is farking intimidating, and may scare a thief away so he does not need to shoot.
2: Scatter shot has a better chance for hitting if he has to aim and shoot in a hurry
3: I also told him to get bird, not buck shot. Not because of lethality issues, but because i would think they would be less likely to go through the walls into the condo next door to him and possibly hurt an innocent neighbor.
Thoughts on this?
As for Golfer and the kill thing. I would just change everything to 'incapacitate'. You're shooting to render that threat unable to harm you. As long as you understand your laws, shoot to incapacitate as quickly as possible. Put as many in center body mass until the threat is no longer a threat.
It's a good thing LLogan knows exactly what I was talking about.
Nothing beats a nice short-barreled shotgun for home defense. In a hallway you could still miss with a pistol. With a 20 gauge loaded with 8 shot.....you couldn't miss if you tried.
Sure you could, if you don't know how to shoot or panic in the moment.With knowing how to shoot being implied... :huh
No matter what the person buys, he needs to practice and get comfortable with it.
With knowing how to shoot being implied... :huh
My favorite home defense weapon, despite owning a Mossberg 590, is my Rossi SRS in .357 Magnum. It's a direct clone of the Winchester 1892 Trapper.
Eight rounds (101 grain Remington frangible ammo) in the magazine. Lightning fast action, quick pointing and exceptionally lethal.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5208/5280844751_d9486bdd28_b.jpg)
Sure you could, if you don't know how to shoot or panic in the moment.
No matter what the person buys, he needs to practice and get comfortable with it.
.22 will kill someone just as easy as a 45 lllogggan
.22 will kill someone just as easy as a 45 lllogggan
If i had to choose a home defence weapon it would be a PTRS-41. (no i didnt get it from one of those call of duty games, or as i say call of nerds) Its a large caliber-gas operated anti tank weapon. it might blow a limb or two off but it will teach him to never come back!
(http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i336/igotafro/PTRS-41.png)
.22 will kill someone just as easy as a 45 lllogggan
If i had to choose a home defence weapon it would be a PTRS-41. (no i didnt get it from one of those call of duty games, or as i say call of nerds) Its a large caliber-gas operated anti tank weapon. it might blow a limb or two off but it will teach him to never come back!
(http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i336/igotafro/PTRS-41.png)
A robbery is a crime done person-on-person with a weapon.
What you described is a burglary.
To remember the difference just remember the scene in "Pulp Fiction" where the Brit gets up in a crowded eatery...pulls and points his weapon and shouts "THIS is a ROBBERY".
If he fears another burglary THE BEST thing to do is call around for estimates on a home security system. The second a window gets broken, a door opens or a sliding glass door is comprimised the signal goes directly to the local PD or sherriff's office and they dispatch an officer or officers ASAP. He NEEDS this kind of system.
If he fears a home invasion or robbery (as in someone has broken into his home and is brandishing a weapon) the best thing to do is have a handgun or shotgun at a "fallback position"...someplace he can quickly run to and lock the door while he's getting his weapon. The BEST thing in addition to this is having a large dog...German Shepherds are fantastic for this. The second the glass in the door breaks or even someone lurking around the house the ears go up, the dander gets up, rows of sparp scary teeth are open and the bark-alert of a big dog makes even the boldest of robbers turn and run for easier pickings. All for the price of some water, dogfood, the occasional rawhide treat, and some well deserved ear and belly rubs (actually they are family so there's a ton of respect and love there but that's another thread).
That dog will give his/her life to bite the 'nads off anyone entering the house without consent of the master. That gives you plenty of time to get to the fallback position to get armed.
"Beware of Dog" signs are a good deterrent even if you don't have a dog--but get one anyway. We have two shepherds and the sight of 4 ears and rows of frightening teeth barking "somebody's here" through the small door window would be a great deterrent--and when you have deterrants bad guys leave and look for easier pickings.
I have a 45 cal semi at my fallback position. If they get over the fence, get by 2 adult GS dogs and still are in my house--they have earned the right to have me aircondition them with .45. Yeah, the next trip is to Hope Depot to get the paint and patch for the holes in the wall and bloodstains on the floor after the law enforcement reports are complete.
Morally:
It's wrong to kill unless in self defense. If you disabled the intruder and you're in no imminent danger, you call 911. You don't go and murder.
Legally:
If something like that occur and involves anybody reading this forum, you may be charged with conspiracy to murder, or if you do it yourself, with 1st degree murder.
Don't talk about responsible gun ownership and give crapy advice like that.
.22 will kill someone just as easy as a 45 lllogggan
Yea i guess if 50cent can get shot 9 times by a 22 they must suck :neener:
but seriously I'll take a 22 over a 45 anyday because I've shot a 45 quite a few times and they arent nearly as accurate
If i had to choose a home defence weapon it would be a PTRS-41. (no i didnt get it from one of those call of duty games, or as i say call of nerds) Its a large caliber-gas operated anti tank weapon. it might blow a limb or two off but it will teach him to never come back!
(http://i1088.photobucket.com/albums/i336/igotafro/PTRS-41.png)
If I was moving out to the ghetto tomorrow, this would be my home defense weapon.
http://www.taurususa.com/video-theJudge.cfm
Nah Ive shot alot of larger pistols we own a .357 magnum revolver...kicks like a mule but it's pretty accurate.
The thing with 45 is it isn't accurate at least from what I've seen...I was shooting a prison guards and I wasn't impressed at all.
Maybe because our .357 has about a 6inch barrel and the 45 is like 2 inches.
The thing literally couldn't hold a 24" spread at 25 feet.
And it wasn't just me shooting it the owner of it couldn't even do any better and he was in a war and a guard.
I expect a gun to hit exactly where I aim it and I know my 22 does :D
WINS^
Yea i guess if 50cent can get shot 9 times by a 22 they must suck :neener:
but seriously I'll take a 22 over a 45 anyday because I've shot a 45 quite a few times and they arent nearly as accurate
rig your house to trap the intruder inside until police (or u with firearm) get there
Yea i guess if 50cent can get shot 9 times by a 22 they must suck :neener:
but seriously I'll take a 22 over a 45 anyday because I've shot a 45 quite a few times and they arent nearly as accurate
Nah Ive shot alot of larger pistols we own a .357 magnum revolver...kicks like a mule but it's pretty accurate.
The thing with 45 is it isn't accurate at least from what I've seen...I was shooting a prison guards and I wasn't impressed at all.
Maybe because our .357 has about a 6inch barrel and the 45 is like 2 inches.
The thing literally couldn't hold a 24" spread at 25 feet.
And it wasn't just me shooting it the owner of it couldn't even do any better and he was in a war and a guard.
I expect a gun to hit exactly where I aim it and I know my 22 does :D
I am glad this discussion came up, I live in the state of the Petit family (well, at least the good doctor is still alive). I would like to get a gun but I am hesitant in a house with 2 kids, not to mention I am concerned an intruder could obtain the weapon.
Has there been ANY progress on the 'smart guns' (either biometric or even a simple RF tag device) being made available for the home market? If so, how reliable are they?
I didn't go through the entire thread so forgive me if this was mentioned already. Take a look here:
http://www.taurususa.com/video-theJudge.cfm (http://www.taurususa.com/video-theJudge.cfm)
A friend of mine just bought this for home/car defence and it works very well.
Good Luck
I am glad this discussion came up, I live in the state of the Petit family (well, at least the good doctor is still alive). I would like to get a gun but I am hesitant in a house with 2 kids, not to mention I am concerned an intruder could obtain the weapon.
Has there been ANY progress on the 'smart guns' (either biometric or even a simple RF tag device) being made available for the home market? If so, how reliable are they?
Well, spoke with my friend today and he's giving up on the gun idea, he said he's going to invest in pepper spray and a house alarm.
Out of all of my wepons I think that a shotgun with a pistol grip loaded with buckshot should do the trick. Put a flashlight on it as well.. :salute(http://www.gunstar.co.uk/images/Large/A2750.jpg)
This would mangle someone pretty good, also scaring the crap out of everything else.
Not a fan of pistol grip shotguns, hard to handle for non-experienced and even some experienced. Collapsible stock is a better choice in my opinion.
I haven't read all the replies, but if this hasn't been posted yet...
African Walking stick. Quite harmless (If not using the club end) and yet very effective.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPNua_SL_fo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPNua_SL_fo)
Oh, I forgot that every person who attacks you to rob you is going to be trained, and can pull the cane out of the air as you swing it at mach speed towards his/her head. It's easy, you swing it at them, it hits them, they don't back down, you hit them more, hit them with the ball end, they're unconcious, you walk away and claim self-defense (you'd win, supposing it was all actually necessary). Simple as that.
But yeah, I could probably knock Santa cold with one of those things, not ever having a moment's experience with a cane or combat stick.
It is simple, Newton's first law, INERTIA. (Also Newton's Third Law could be incorporated, too: Ball hits head, head snaps the opposite direction). :aok
Well the pointed end is likely to leave welts, bruises and trauma. The ball end will likely do much worse, especially to the skull. Any self-defense will have drawbacks, you don't get something for nothing.
Are you telling me that you see no difference in defensive capabilities between a stick and a gun?
However, IMO, a firearm is going to have a much much higher chance of delivering a incapacitating hit vs. a walking stick.
No, not at all, you misinterpreted what I said.
Of course, it is a lethal weapon, a walking stick is a non-lethal object of self-defense; which has it's perks, you can't die from being smacked in the thigh a couple times but a bullet to the thigh will cause tearing, possible rupture of the femoral artery, broken bone, etc. A gun can be aimed most anywhere on the body for death to occur (head, chest, arms [arteries/veins], legs [same]. The walking stick pretty much either has to be hit hard enough on the chest to cause an arrhythmia or palpatations, or smacked right on the noggin (prefferably in the temple) for there to be even the chance of a lethal blow (supposing you don't have bleeder's disease or leukemia).
Once again, it goes back to picking your poison. Lethality for effectiveness and a chance of getting severely wounded or even killed, or non-lethality for less effectiveness but less of a chance of dying, youself.
I was simply offering the walking-stick as an alternative to a gun.
Sure, but I was simply stating that without training, a stick would not be something I would trust my, or my family's life too.
Alas, accidental gun deaths are a matter of everyday life. So long as you have it locked away in a safe, you're fine. As soon as you leave it out, it is no better than protecting your family with a stick, especially with children.
I have to disagree here. If you understand your weapon, and ensure your family understands gun safety, keeping a firearm unlocked is perfectly safe. It's when that gun is seen as a toy or it isn't truly understood that it becomes dangerous.
Ahh.... No. A typical .45 ACP round delivers around 5 times the energy of a common 40 grain .22 Long Rifle round.
Beretta 92FS w/ 135 grain Hydra-Shoks. I carry my mine with me at all times.