Aces High Bulletin Board
Special Events Forums => Scenario General => Topic started by: WldWeasl on February 01, 2011, 06:15:34 AM
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Just to throw a monkey wrench out there...
Why can't we have a massive GV Scenario...El Alamein or Battle of the Bulge GV style...
We can see who's read more on Rommel or Patton....
WldWeasl
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[EDIT: speaking for El Alamein]
Because GVs as-is are a horribly flawed game device, do not follow the same realistic physics that the planes do, and the terrain and the actual ground-level combat is nothing at all remotely realistic.
Not to mention we don't have half the planes that were present in early Tunisia-type setups.
It would be bad. That's why.
My opinion.
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There was this: http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/200903_tunisia/rules.html
It had as large a contingent of GV'ers as wanted to play.
(http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/200903_tunisia/rules_pics/TunisiaBanner2.jpg)
There was also this: http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/stalins_fourth/rules/main.htm
which included a lot of great GV action. We hope to run it again.
(http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/stalins_fourth/rules/images/logo_main.jpg)
This one, also, had as large a GV contingent as wanted to play:
http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/200910_redStormKruppSteel/rules.html
(http://electraforge.com/brooke/flightsims/scenarios/200910_redStormKruppSteel/rules_files/redStormBanner.png)
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I think Brooke is trying to point out that we DO have GVs in many scenarios... However I'll counter with the following: I played in all those scenarios. There were significant flaws with DoB in regards to 100 planes overhead and any one of them being able to stop a base capture but rules technicalities prevented them from attacking. Krupp Steel had so much cying and whining by sour sport GV players that didn't want ANY interaction with aircraft (despite losing the air superiority battle) and calling out cheat accusations, rules violations, etc. They created a giant stir that really soured a lot of players on including GVs in scenarios.
And Stalin's 4th... well.. I think that's a special one. On the one hand, half the players did NOT want to do GVs. We sucked it up and did our part, but we were flying aircraft 2 frames and GVs 2 other frames. We were not dedicated (and maybe this is the way to go?) But this map had soooo much custom content it was much better for GV battles. Custom tiles, custom terrain, very well laid out bunkers, bridges, etc... It probably took a couple years to make that map. The map no longer works in AH because of several graphics/terrain updates since then. It really would require a remade map (and the guy that redoes it deserves sainthood for putting all that effort in.... TWICE!)
My point is: Yes, we have done some in the past... But there are many complicated issues at hand. It's not just like running an MA mission or anything. There are many complex interactions between the ground vehicles and the aircraft.... Catering to the whims of folks in GVs really isn't fair to the overall combat sometimes.
I guess it's a bit of a rant. If the folks that regularly would join in the GV fight were as mature as some of the folks that design the air aspect of it, we could have a hit on our hands. Other times we're just playing 2 different games that are mutually exclusive of each other.
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DoB still makes me cringe when I think of the setup.
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I had a lot of fun playing in the Tunisia scenario as a Ju 88 pilot. Lots of different types of targets, and fighting at low level, and I liked the novelty of the look of the desert terrain.
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Any North Africa scenario would guarantee 100% of my effort and time, is there a possibility of another Tunisia Scenario any time soon?
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Any North Africa scenario would guarantee 100% of my effort and time, is there a possibility of another Tunisia Scenario any time soon?
Not sure if that theater will appear this year. We don't have all of this year nailed down yet.
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The Tunisia scenario was my first one ever, and after it I was hooked. When it comes back around, I will be there. :cheers:
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Because GVs as-is are a horribly flawed game device, do not follow the same realistic physics that the planes do, and the terrain and the actual ground-level combat is nothing at all remotely realistic.
+1
Vehicles do not have the same fidelity as aircraft in Aces High.
Moreover, I flew the 190F-8 in RSKS, and not once did the rules allow me to target a ground vehicle. Then there was that huge uproar over whether an A-20 was "marking" a ground vehicle with a bomb, or trying to bomb it. If there are more scenarios with gv's in the future, then I truly hope that we don't expect ground combat to occur in a hermetically sealed little bubble, with nasty forum uproars when a bomb or rocket comes a little too close.
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My first was Operation Downfall. Talk about flaws. Still fun and good enough to boost me into Special Events.
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DoB was awesome flew a 110 in that one and had a blast. Also my first major event.
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Krupp Steele was an epic GV battle. I thought it worked pretty good or at least from my perspective it did. I'd like to see a scenario, or at least an FSO, with GV's again.
+1 :aok
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I really enjoyed Stalin's Fourth. Half GV, Half Fighter for my squad anyway. Would be great to do it again where I don't have a dial-up connection allowing me a whopping 14FPS :D
+1 Stalin's Fourth ReMix :aok
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I really enjoyed Stalin's Fourth. Half GV, Half Fighter for my squad anyway. Would be great to do it again where I don't have a dial-up connection allowing me a whopping 14FPS :D
+1 Stalin's Fourth ReMix :aok
Agreed, was a great one! +1
Also had some really great videos too! :) The Terrain was incredible too! I stink in a GV, so M3 dooty was right for me! :old: :rofl
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To run Stalin's again, the terrain update needs to be completed. Making and updating terrains is a huge job, so it doesn't happen quickly, but there are folks working on it. I'd love to play in Stalin's Fourth again, too.
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Agreed, was a great one! +1
Also had some really great videos too! :) The Terrain was incredible too! I stink in a GV, so M3 dooty was right for me! :old: :rofl
I too was on M3 dooty. :cheers:
I'd love to participate in a rerun of this scenario. The terrain was definitely a big part of the fun.
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Yucca made this film of Stalin's Fourth Scenario.
Select "save as" option to download.
http://www.lgmfilms.net/AH/Films/STALIN.zip (http://www.lgmfilms.net/AH/Films/STALIN.zip)
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To me, the biggest issue with our tanks (aside from vulnerability to aircraft, which is a whole multi-tier argument in itself) is the identical sighting systems and the ability to fire out to forever. There are people in this game who can hit a moving tank at 6,000 yards with easily less than ten rounds due to the sight quality and the lack of visual blocks like ground fog or dust clouds. Not only unrealistic, but people being fired upon from that far out don't even know they're being shot at.
Stalin's 4th was different because the terrain was almost entirely flat and FULL of tress and ground clutter. More than once I doddled around a corner in a forest to be looking down the barrel of a Panzer. Though the bridge system could use a bit of reworking (perhaps having to find a slightly-further-away indestructible crossing instead of being forced to fight in LVTs), the ground system in that setup was great.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think there were any large bombs in play either, besides on the level bombers. I don't remember if the Hurricanes were allowed to carry the 2x500lb bombs...even if they were, that's a lot less of a threat to a tank group than an A-20. Anti-tank work was down to precise bombing with smaller bombs and gunnery instead of "dump egg somewhere on field, attempt to count number of kills."
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Aces High
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Aces High
lol?
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Asparagus.
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The game is lacking a lot of early war gv's and planes for a proper scenario. It sounds like fun tho, I would hope to see a good Stalingrad or southern group scenario. But like el Alamein we lack early yaks, the lagg3 and mig warbirds. And as suggested before the gv fighting is a bit lacking.
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I'm quite sure the GVs will play a more "enjoyable" role in scenarios once they are updated to the new control system. In addition to this, HTC will be able to crank out more GVs in shorter time; which could mean a better balanced EW/MW/LW setup.