Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Kieren on April 09, 2000, 12:19:00 AM
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Well, ironic.
Here we are with a great release in our hands, and I can't play.
I am tired of getting shot by guys that are in front of me (me on their 6, them shooting away from me).
I was even desperate tonight and grabbed a cannonhawg... forget it, I can't even kill in it.
I got nailed from what appeared to be 1.3 away (he saw 300).
Text buffer at times takes 5 seconds to roll after I type.
To top it all off, when I asked questions of the other party involved, another guy jumps in with smart alek comments. Nerves are on edge, and that just made it worse. Maybe that's what he wanted, who knows. Ordinarily I wouldn't listen, but tonight, well...
This is not intended to be a slam on HTC, as I appear to be isolated in this problem. It may be this marriage just isn't meant to be.
This was exactly the type of problem I began to have elsewhere, and ultimately I totally lost my taste for that sim. I am finding it harder and harder to press "fly" here.
I want to be a good sport, and don't want to spend the bulk of my time whining. I don't THINK I was doing that tonight- maybe I was. Anyway, I may have to put the flight gear away for a while if this doesn't improve soon. I can't even train anyone right now because of the warp I see. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Bummer...
I assume you've run traceroute and have your internet connection optimized..ie no data compression and such?
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Xman
2nd Lt 332 Flying Mongrels
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Look at the topic I just made. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) EXACT same problem. Planes jumping ALL over. Planes instantly changing direction. I've seen it all tonight.
It got so bad I had to log, I just couldn't do anything. Even got discoed once after a 45 minute tank ride to visual range of the enemy base.
bloom25
THUNDERBIRDS
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C:\>ping 216.91.192.19
Pinging 216.91.192.19 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 216.91.192.19: bytes=32 time=115ms TTL=237
Reply from 216.91.192.19: bytes=32 time=107ms TTL=237
Reply from 216.91.192.19: bytes=32 time=135ms TTL=237
Reply from 216.91.192.19: bytes=32 time=111ms TTL=237
Ping statistics for 216.91.192.19:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 107ms, Maximum = 135ms, Average = 117ms
I can't explain it. I pinged it several times. I sometimes see in the 250 range, but that should be ok. I am on ISDN, and I used to see far worse on dial-up and could play then.
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Does your beacon go off - i.e. does it go yellow/red for periods at a time? If that's the case then you definitely have a ISP/connect issue.
My cable company really really is terrible. My connect I'd say every 5 mins gets real bad for about 10 secs. Sometimes I'm even disco'd.
If your connect seems ok, it might be your system. i.e. if it's too slow to keep up or if you are having driver issues.
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Shoot, I wouldn't think my system is too bad.
PII 400 96MB RAM
TNT2 32MB
ISDN
all CH (FighterStick, Pro Throttle, rudders)
Win98
DirectX 7.0a
At a total loss here... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Hello Kieren : I had that problem online once myself . Looking from behind player shooting at you . What was my problem was this . Not so much the connection speed , my isp was more or less timing me out from time to time . I know you most likely know this , but what the hell I say it anyway just in case it will help .
It matters more how the pipe flows than how big . In other words you need a more steady stream of data .
What I did to fix my problem was ( god I hate to give this advice as it cost me lots )
try every last isp that was here with a local number . Well I went through 5 last winter before I found two that worked ok .
The best one takes the most dialups , but at least it costs the least 8-) . Some times 60 rings , but they don't time me out , pulls strong , and most connects at 26400 and I ping AH at about 187 and 250 or so to zone for FA2 with out hardly any warp etc .
Worst was voyager.net , games online were unplayable , so bad wouldn't even load . Funny it had the best connetion rate too .
Next was ATTWORLD.Net , played like you said , I would be behind and they would shoot at me , hehe , funny till it happens all the loving time .
"another guy jumps in with smart alek comments"
Ya I feel you pain there ,
I thought this sim was differant , but am thinking that they all have them . At least FA has its share , I know . I still remembe what "mother" told me , works .
hope your problem works itself out , and a Big thanks for all your help too !!!!
Sincerly airspro
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I've found turning off data compression in your DUN settings can make a huge difference as well...It is great for surfing the net...but causes lag and warping in online gaming...
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Air_spro-
Thanks for the kind words. Yes, I have done what you have said already (this is my 5th ISP!).
Xman-
Where do you set that on ISDN? I am curious (and obviously ignorant). (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Those bouts use to happen to me for days at a time. All you can do is ride them out. I got good at guessing where they would warp to. And as far as range went, I did not trust anything i saw inside of 2000 yrds. It may sound strange but you can get use to it until it clears up. The rubber bullits were the only thing that drove me nuts. But I figured what the hell.
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Kieren...sorry I am the ignorant one when it comes to ISDN..I should have paid more attention to what you had instead of assuming it was a poor ole 56k like I have (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
But if you do find your connect using data compression...try turning it off.
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Xman
2nd Lt 332 Flying Mongrels
[This message has been edited by xman (edited 04-09-2000).]
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Your packats are gett'n fragged at a router, try reducing mtu size heard that helps.
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Originally posted by Torque:
Your packats are gett'n fragged at a router, try reducing mtu size heard that helps.
Torque care to bring the rest of up to speed on how to do this?
Thanks! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
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Sorry to hear about the problems. They sort of figure though.
In case you have not read my initial posts, I am the cheif cook and bottle washer at the ISP that hosts the HTC servers.
Whenever HTC releases updates of the sim, there will be momentary slow downs, as everyone is downloading the new version.
This causes congestion on the server and the connections to the Internet.
To help the game server, you may want to try downloading the game from the HTC web site, as it uses another Internet connection apart from the game server.
Just a suggestion.
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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Skuzzy-
I should have been clearer in the original post- I have been having this problem for about a week now. I have been down this road before, so I'm afraid of where this may lead me. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Its one plane wonder time kieren. Stick to the 1c until it clears up. Sometimes that wont even work. But planes like the P51 are hopeless.
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Minotaur,
Im using MTUspeed to change my packet size.
Im sending out packets of 576 from which I understand is common for ISP's, Windoze defaults packet size to 1500 which most ISP's fragment. It has seemed to have helped.
Do a search for MTUspeed, if you cant find it ill look it up.
ok, found it www.mjs.u-net.com (http://www.mjs.u-net.com)
[This message has been edited by Camel (edited 04-09-2000).]
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Thanks Camel (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
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Hey, checking out the MTUSpeed software... people have made reference to this in the past, but I didn't realize there is software to do it.
Going through the whole system maintenance routine, and will try this too.
Thanks for the help all of you guys! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Well Kieren must of got his connection fixed, because at about 10-10:30 EST tonite he was kickin some major league poody! I had to race to a con to try and get a shot! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) But oh no! There's Kieren "Dak a Dak a Dak a Dak....Boom!" Kieren man, you were hot when we were taking that field. I love flying with ya, but Kieren dude, save some scraps for the rest of us!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I salute you sir!!!!!
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Swager
-XO- II/JG2~Richthofen~
"Damn.....I can't believe I missed that shot!!!"
(http://saintaw.tripod.com/swager.gif)
JG2 "Richthofen" (http://www.busprod.com/weazel2/)
[This message has been edited by Swager (edited 04-09-2000).]
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Swager-
Thanks, but a bigger thanks goes to Camel and all the others that gave me some direction to go. I downloaded the MTU optimizer, and hopefully that did the trick. I found that tonight, though I saw warp at times, nothing was unmanageable. I could even land hits on planes! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Also did a defrag on the harddrive, along with freeing up a bit more space. Heck, I'd polish the screws on the case if it made it connect cleaner. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
BTW, what traceroute program you all use? I'd like to look at a few to see if I can find one that lists all the places my packets go.
Thanks!
*crosses fingers and hopes the bad spell is over for a while*
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np Kieren!
Hope it helps!
I still use "tracert"(in MSdos) to trace, but would also like to hear about another(free hopefully).
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Quick note about your ping post, just in case.
Use -n # after the IP adress for more pings.
example; ping 216.91.192.19 -n 10
Ive nver gone over 100, so dont know how high you can go.
[This message has been edited by Camel (edited 04-10-2000).]
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Sorry I didn't explain it better. BTW Kieren it works the other way to, tweak it up and see how fast that isdn can go, I have a 10 mbp modem it went 1.7 mbps but was mostly corrupt.
Kieren your pingtime seems pretty high for isdn, also I always us alt route (even tho I do ping both at the same speed usually low 80's) alt-route has a few more nodes but it plays cleaner. Get Neotrace ( http://www.neoworx.com/neotrace/download.asp (http://www.neoworx.com/neotrace/download.asp) ) or a similar traceroute apps it will let you identify router that is pork’n your packets When you ping the AH server for a precise view best to ping 100 times and at the fastest ms delay apps will allow. Then you’ll see the packets that frag.
Here is one TJPing http://www.topjimmy.net/tjs/ (http://www.topjimmy.net/tjs/)
[This message has been edited by Torque (edited 04-10-2000).]
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http:www.visualroute.com is what you need (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Saw
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http://www.visualroute.com (http://www.visualroute.com) is what you need (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Saw
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Thanks again!
From the above suggestions I have been able to trace my problems to Sprint; apparently they are dropping the ball. I wonder (aloud) is there any way to force a route?
There used to be a selectable route menu in the other sim- wonder if there is a way to do it manually?
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Originally posted by Kieren:
Thanks again!
From the above suggestions I have been able to trace my problems to Sprint; apparently they are dropping the ball. I wonder (aloud) is there any way to force a route?
There used to be a selectable route menu in the other sim- wonder if there is a way to do it manually?
Ahhhh, good old Sprint. I am not sure what the deal is with Sprint. They consistently have problems on Fridays, somewhere on their network.
But to answer your question, unfortunately, routes are set by the routers, assuming they are using BGP4 (routing protocol).
Routes can only be altered by BGP table updates, or manually by an ISP, assuming the ISP has multiple connections to the Internet, and has portable address space. I think Sprint may not know about the manual part (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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They're prolly having it handled by a Marketting guy (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Originally posted by Camel:
Minotaur,
Im using MTUspeed to change my packet size.
Im sending out packets of 576 from which I understand is common for ISP's, Windoze defaults packet size to 1500 which most ISP's fragment. It has seemed to have helped.
Do a search for MTUspeed, if you cant find it ill look it up.
ok, found it www.mjs.u-net.com (http://www.mjs.u-net.com)
[This message has been edited by Camel (edited 04-09-2000).]
I noticed this one was for Win95. Is MTU switching not required for Win98 or does it just require another utility?
Thanks! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
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Mino,
Im trying to check this out but Im having a bad connection to the internet today.
I installed it like 5 months ago on my machine with Win98se. I remeber reading that it would work with win98 somewhere.
I would love to hear a comment from Skuzzy and what he thinks of this MTU stuff. Like is it worth it, and if it is, what setting might be best?
Thanks
Camel
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Carefull what you ask for. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
The MTU setting can have a dramtic impact on the performance of Internet games, in general.
Most games use packet sizes of 64 bytes. Why? This virtually eliminates the possibility of a packet getting fragmented by a router on the Internet. A very important consideration in the Internet gaming industry.
Actually, due to Windows NT mostly, the MTU used by ISP's today is set to 1500.
For your connection to the Internet, and if your concern is gaming, then 576 is a much better number for Windows machines.
Anything smaller causes some problems with the Windows TCP/IP stack and can reduce performance.
The smaller the packet, the more reliable it is. That is to say, there is less chance of the packet getting fragmented or lost.
Generally, most games will perform better with the MTU set to 576, while general Internet surfing may slow down slightly.
It all depends on what your priority is.
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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Probably setting mtu lower is best for ppl with hi-bandwidth that are located far from server like Kieren.
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Skuzzy;
Absolving you of any liability, can you explain how one might change the MTU size?
Thanks! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Mino
The Wrecking Crew
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First thing i would do is reinitialize you isdn modem. Then i would ensure that you connection is optimized for internet. (setting packets to small on win98 or reg. hack for win95... www.regedit.com) (http://www.regedit.com))
Try using one 64kps channel instead of 2 channels for AH... max thruput is not necessary. Stability is...
That will do it: I used to have problems with my old isdn but now im in bandwidth hell after i moved with 44k connect. The using one channel helped alot so give it a try.
Regards,
DoctoryO
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Kieren,
Just wondering, have you done a complete fdisk, format and rebuild of your PC within the past year? If not, I would go ahead and do that(along with adjusting the MTU size).
You'd be amazed at what a fresh install will do for a system.
G'luck bud! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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banana
308 (Polish) Squadron RAF "City of Cracow"
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Not so much a liability issue Minotaur, I just like to try to get some sleep at night and if post the manual way to alter the MTU and someone messes up, they could leave thier system unbootable. <SHUDDER>
There are so many different version of the MS TCP stack around, it is difficult to say what is the correct way to do it. Most consumers just do not update thier software as well as they should.
How many of you actually use http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com (http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com) on a regular basis? (I hope most do)
Or how many actually check and update video, audio, and other peripheral drivers from the respective companies that supply these items?
Now, dont go nuts here. Sometimes upgrades are bad, depending on the source. For instance, when DirectX 7.0 was released, it introduced a ton of bugs, but then 7.0a finally got it back to being stable.
A general rule of thumb I use is this; When I see an update for my device available, I check the date, then make note to go back 45 days later. If the update has not changed I download and install it. That allows the bleeding edge technology nuts to get the bugs found. There is a reason it is called bleeding edge technology (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif).
Anyway I digress.
About high speed connections..... The faster your connection to the Internet, the more erratic the flow of data will be. Why?
Data on the Internet does not flow smoothly, like water through a pipe, it is more like water over a very rocky terrain, with eddys, and various speeds of currents.
Taking the analogy further, if you take a 12 inch wide stream of water flowing over those rocky terrains, and put it through a one inch straw, the flow of water is pretty constant and smooth, but if you put that same flow of water through a 12 inch straw, you will see all the various currents and eddys caused by that rocky base the water flowed over.
Every time a packet of data is injected into the Internet backbone stream, it causes all the packet latencies to change for all the packets behind that packet.
As you increase your speed of your connection to the Internet, you become more susceptible to those various flows and eddys.
It is generally accepted that the aggregate throughput of the Internet is about 384Kbits/second. Once you get past that point, smooth Internet game play becomes virtually impossible during peak times of Internet usage.
So, while it may not seem intuitive, slowing down your connection speed could actually result in smoother game play.
However, if you are using ISDN, you should be doing well with 128K connections. If you find a 64K connection works better, then I would suspect the ISP has oversold his/her connections to the Internet, or his/her immediate upstream providers are oversold, especially if it is consistent.
Depending on the ISP, you may be able to ask them when thier peak usage times are and try to work around those times. All ISP's have times they consider peak.
For instance, here at AppLink we have 2 times a day, during Monday through Friday, which are high usage times. From (all time are CST/CDT) 4:30pm to 6:00pm is one. Why? Business users are finishing up for the day and the kids have gotten home from school and are surfing.
The next time occurs from 9:00pm to 10:00pm. Everyone is finishing up last minute surfing before going to bed.
Don't be afraid to ask your provider the question. Most providers will answer honestly as they figure you are looking to stay away from those times, which makes all clients happier. Also understanding when the peak times are will help you understand why you might see yo-yos in data flow.
Hope this helps.
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Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
President, AppLink Corp.
http://www.applink.net
skuzzy@applink.net
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I may be selfish here, but this is one of the most useful and informative threads I've read in a while. Thanks everyone for the tips and suggestions! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
[This message has been edited by Kieren (edited 04-13-2000).]
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My turn in the barrel k. Im getting 10 times the disco,s, I had in the old arena. And the warping seems to be getting worse all the time.
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Sorry to hear that easymo! Seems like we're on the ol's see-saw, eh? When you're up, I'm down, etc... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)