Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Aces High Bug Reports => Topic started by: asleep1 on February 28, 2011, 08:32:04 AM
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I have a problem with the accuracy of the bomb drops. They are always short. Now I have been playing for 4 years and I spend the majority in bombers. I run precision bomb runs a lot. I can hit hangers with AR234 at 400mph at 20k with 100% success, Same with all other bombers. I never had a problem hitting hangers with any bomber at any speed or altitude. Having said that, I noticed that days ago the drops from my b29 seemed to be falling short, but I was bombing towns and strats so I did not notice it so clearly. Last night I went on a hanger bombing run over several bases and I found that all my drops were short about the length of 1 hanger. At first I though maybe I was a little jumpy on the drop button. After two misses I really focused on what was going on and yes, the bombs hit short. I started compensating by dropping later and this helped. I also changed altitude from 25k to 20k then to 12k. The same problem existed at all altitudes and speeds. Before you ask, my calibration was exact by speed and no more that 5 feet off in calibrated altitude. There is an obvious bug here. I talked to two other players that flew the 29's a lot and they reported the same problem. They told me they thought this might have been fixed in the last update, but it is not.
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Yea, I flew one B-29 mission and saw this. Couldn't hit anything in it. Yet I regularly fly bombers and drop anything on the field that I want with rarely a miss. The B-29 is an interesting plane but one I will never up again. Just a big, buggy, insanly expensive perk ride that everyone want's a peice of. Fly a B-24 at 10k people wont see you because there lookng for a B-29 @ 30k.
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Dont get me wrong, I love the 29 and plan on many excursions with it. Just need the bombsight accuracy fixed for precision hits.
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Casual observation here, I've never been exact on calibration speed but 5 feet off on altitude. Are you checking your calibration to E6B before drop to make sure you haven't sped up?
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I'm very proficient at bombing. As I stated and the OP stated. The bomb sight is off.
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with a lanc at 12 to 18k i can pinpoint an ack gun with no problem. when i ran the b-29 i could'nt hit the broad side of a barn at 16k.
All airspeed and alt confirmed w/e6b. Thought it was just me having a bad day!
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i seem to be more accurate with the b29 than any other bomber :headscratch: especially with the 4,000lbers.
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See Rule #4
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And before anyone else ask, Yes, my computer is of adequate design(probably top 10% here). I designed it to meet my specific demands and complicated 3D applications. Internet connection speed is 20megs down and 2 megs up, (like this would make a difference, but someone will ask)
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Can you hit in the same circumstances with a Mossie16 or a Ar234?
If "no" then the problem is your calibration during the bomb run. These 3 planes are much faster and will continue to accelerate for a longer time. You cannot just line up on target, calibrate 2 seconds, and drop.
You have to give yourself an entire sector of approach time to steady your speed (if not more distance!)
Any adjustment of throttle, RPM, turning, banking, adjusting course, opening bomb bays... Anything will throw your calibration off. I bombed just fine with it offline. Only thing is most folks don't know HOW to bomb in these faster planes. It takes more discipline to get right.
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Krusty what ever you know about bombing we also know. You can't possibly enlighten us on the art of bombing is what we are saying.
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Don't read a lot do ya krusty. Try giving my first post a CLOSE READING. Yes I am very accomplished in an AR234, I love hitting at 400mph+.
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See Rule #4
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VERY true and sad as well. :aok
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You will not receive any more help with that attitude. You'd be surprised how many people "know exactly what I'm doing" only to find out they are completely off. So you saying, I know what I'm doing, is often not enough for us to believe it. We covered the basis of simple bombing, I still find my note valid that being off 5 feet in altitude is usually accompanied by being off in speed. Had you simply confirmed that your speed was correct without trying to insult us personally, we may have tried to help you more. However, I'm done trying to help you.
Goodbye.
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I think thats what we were both hoping for.
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Thank GOD!
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Posting on the message boards opens the question to everyone. And Like Jay said, a lot of so called "Mr Know-it-all" come in here saying they do everything right so the game must be wrong. By going through ALL avenues in trouble shooting the problem many times it a mistake made by the "Mr Know-it-all". That is "why" you are getting the questions you are getting. If you had wanted to by pass all of these questions, maybe an email to Skuzzy would have been a better course. Much like someone who knows a lot about their home network knows better than to talk to the "help desk" at their ISP and request to be moved up to Tier 1 support.
Instead of jumping down peoples throat that are trying to help you, maybe you could just say "thanks, but I've done that" and let it drop.
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Thanks, I've done that, please drop it. It is all in the first post.
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Everybody else has already explained it.
You seem to still want help/feedback so I thought of something just a moment ago.
Perhaps you recall this thread:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,307251.0.html
And Waffle said it would be fixed. However, I checked both patch 1 and patch 2 change logs and neither have this listed as something that was fixed.
Maybe the problem will be solved as soon as they fix the related issue? (this is a guess on my part)
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wrong again krusty, I use the E6B constantly while in the bomb sight for accuracy, thats why I know what I am talking about. I do not use the instruments.
It is not a problem I am having, it is a definite issue with the bombs hitting short on PRECISE drops. This is the only bomber. I am not new to bombing, it is all I have done for 4 years. I use accurate maps with compass overlay to be assured the best heading. I calibrate for 15 seconds or more. I am stable when i drop. I can hit any target in the arena with any bomber. I use low & slow bombers, I use high and fast bombers with extreme accuracy (234 is my favorite). Please dont tell me it is something I am doing. I made a special effort to check the accuracy of the 29's drops on my last run hitting hangers.
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Well then!... sound like HTC got it right with this bomber which is why LeMay ordered them down to 23k!
Bet thats not why its hitting short though. :uhoh
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There are some small differences in accuracy in planes. I found the B-17 can drop a little short and the B-24 a little long after some testing. If HTC thinks there is a real problem, they'll do something. I haven't found a problem with the B-29 accuracy yet, but I haven't done a thorough test. Sending a film with any bug report is the best way to help HTC.
In the meantime, why not use your organic computer and adjust your drop if there is constant variance?
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Well then!... sound like HTC got it right with this bomber which is why LeMay ordered them down to 23k!
Bet thats not why its hitting short though. :uhoh
now if only we could get your p51 ordered down to 10k!
:rofl
-leaves before gets called a troll- :bolt:
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By the way... what color is your house?
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By the way... what color is your house?
but on a serious note. if theres any bomber that i think has a calibration issue. its the mossie bomber and using that cookie.
in a single b29. i can calibrate my bombsights and hit a hanger dead on with a n00k.
but with the mossie bomber. it doesnt matter how many times i calibrate or how long or how close to target, i can never seem to drop a cookie straight onto a hange :(
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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I had a suggestion for you, asleep, after flying numerous B-29 sorties.
I think I'll keep those observations to myself, in retrospect.
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Whatever guys, asleep1 is making a statement here HTC needs to tune in. Now stop annouying him with the "3rd grade comments" or I'll tune something up.
How many damage points did you get asleep, on that last run 84,000?
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you guys missed it. i was reporting a problem, not asking for your 3rd grade comments
here asleep. i'll try to help ya out.
if you want. msg me and tell me the next time your online.
i'll ether up a b29 and wing up with you or you can ride along with me. and i'll try to tell you how to precision bomb the best i can.
not saying you DONT allready know how to do it. but who knows? maybe you'll find out something you didnt originally know. no harm in giving it a try :salute
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here asleep. i'll try to help ya out.
if you want. msg me and tell me the next time your online.
i'll ether up a b29 and wing up with you or you can ride along with me. and i'll try to tell you how to precision bomb the best i can.
not saying you DONT allready know how to do it. but who knows? maybe you'll find out something you didnt originally know. no harm in giving it a try :salute
LOL!!!! Go Get Him Asleep1 !!! LOL!!
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Someone should make a cartoon on how well Asleep bombs or A VIDEO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (I GOT DIBS ON FIRST)
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Fugitive..
This thread is jam-packed with cartoonable content.
*hint hint* :D
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Asleep: Yes, I read your post, I saw you were using E6B. Sorry for not clarifying my reply by saying my guess is that it's tied in with that bug. It might not be the same exact thing, but it could be a side effect of it.
Have you tried offline where you set the flight flags to see the green "X" where your bombs will drop?
Can you calibrate and then check to see if the bombsight matches the "X", or is that not possible? I haven't tried that in a long time.
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now if only we could get your p51 ordered down to 10k!
It would not help you at all.
Is there an ankle humper squelch mode? :bhead
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It would not help you at all.
Is there an ankle humper squelch mode? :bhead
not ankle humping.
just wanna see if that pony can perform the same way in an level fight like it does when you have a 10k BnZ advantage. ;)
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On the topic of "it's all there in the OP," the OP is lacking a screenshot or, much better yet, film. Thus the OP is pretty much entirely useless. That's the reason people are questioning your "supreme and ultimate bombing prowess."
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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This has been one of my favorite threads in a while. :D
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This has been one of my favorite threads in a while. :D
:aok
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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I give up! UNCLE!!!!!!!!
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Maybe I'm misreading you here, but doesn't this quote confirm the OP,
the + trailed the sight by a hanger length like it does in the Lancaster for me.
while simultaneously refuting this?
There is no bug. You just don't know what your doing.
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Btw...
B-29s, 22,000ft, 3 x 500lbs, delay .05
(http://i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv23/Jayhawk1/ahss19.jpg)
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Thats weird I count atleast 12 hits down there. Anyone else? Maybe it took him two passes and the first pass with salvo = 1 delay = .05 he missed. LMAO
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:rofl
Don't know what you've got against me man, but I was lucky enough to film this as well...
http://www.mediafire.com/?napl62018nk63a8 Unedited video, bombing is a little after 18+ minutes.
note: this is in BOG terrain, but I did make sure to change the fuel burn to 2.0 to match MA settings, that should be seen in the film if you need proof.
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Just ribbing you. But I do count 12 hit sprites.
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oic, now it's all in good fun. :rofl :rolleyes:
9 hits, 3 x 500lbs x 3 planes; watch the film if you need proof.
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Yea Krusty and Ten60 were the only ones that were getting alittle testy. No problem with you.
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I'm gonna tune my guitar now. This is filled with good cartoonable content to.
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i have spent months trying to learn bombing,no matter what my E6b says,or how long I calibrate,keep my alt the same .all my drops come up short in every bomber
I would love it if someone could take my lil hand and show me what the hell I am doing wrong!!
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bern i have the exact same problem. I just learned to drop late...
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so have I but i want to learn how to do it corrtectly
is a 5% bombing accuracy from 20k plus good?
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so have I but i want to learn how to do it corrtectly
is a 5% bombing accuracy from 20k plus good?
First, your bombing hit% is currently 439%. You probabky have the 5% form the ingame score sheet, which uses a different format.
Second, you hardly can use this number as a measure of your ability to hit something, and even less to compare yourself to others. Because the hit% depends mostly on what you are hitting. Lazily dropping a big bomb on a cluster of buildings in the town will give you an insanely high hit % (because you "hit" many objects with that bomb), while taking out an ords bunker with pinpoint accuracy from 30k will give you actually a much lower hit % (only one object "hit")
So you can only judge your precision yourself. Do you reliably hit & destroy what you are aiming for? You do not have to make several approaches, or use significantly more ords than required by the object hardness? Then you are good at bombing.
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i have spent months trying to learn bombing,no matter what my E6b says,or how long I calibrate,keep my alt the same .all my drops come up short in every bomber
I would love it if someone could take my lil hand and show me what the hell I am doing wrong!!
I personally will open my Bombay doors up 4 or 5 sectors before target. That way my speed will stabilize, then about 2 sectors out I start calibrating. This is how I normally operate buffs. I have not noticed what the OP has mentioned about sight being off. I have take the time to get a B29 to 35k and have had good results. But as I said above, I plan my runs in advance, and will usually hit quite a few bases. I have been flying buffs like this for about 7 years now.
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I've already wrote this up in an earlier post that the bombing is 1-2 mph off from the set speed. So until it's fixed suggest you fly at 1 mph faster than your set speed is. If you bomb at the same speed right now you will always be short. :salute
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First, your bombing hit% is currently 439%. You probabky have the 5% form the ingame score sheet, which uses a different format.
Second, you hardly can use this number as a measure of your ability to hit something, and even less to compare yourself to others. Because the hit% depends mostly on what you are hitting. Lazily dropping a big bomb on a cluster of buildings in the town will give you an insanely high hit % (because you "hit" many objects with that bomb), while taking out an ords bunker with pinpoint accuracy from 30k will give you actually a much lower hit % (only one object "hit")
So you can only judge your precision yourself. Do you reliably hit & destroy what you are aiming for? You do not have to make several approaches, or use significantly more ords than required by the object hardness? Then you are good at bombing.
I mix it up sometimes I milk run a town sometimes I help out and hit hangers and or ord, is the 439% my carreer score or a sample taken early in this score period??. i was just calibrating just before I dropped and usually tried to drop a lil late.but then I started reading more in here and asked questions of the few people in game that will help in game.heard about using E6B for the first time in here,I tried setting my speed and keeping my alt just so,open my doors early,all that.I always tried to get my approach and e6B up as I cross into the radar ring.
and when I finally accomplish all these things I drop short...grrrrrrrrr. Of course I got the 5% from the ingame score sheet why wouldn't I? remember i am obviously an Idiot in many of you guys eyes so please keep the explanations simple
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I mix it up sometimes I milk run a town sometimes I help out and hit hangers and or ord, is the 439% my carreer score or a sample taken early in this score period??. i was just calibrating just before I dropped and usually tried to drop a lil late.but then I started reading more in here and asked questions of the few people in game that will help in game.heard about using E6B for the first time in here,I tried setting my speed and keeping my alt just so,open my doors early,all that.I always tried to get my approach and e6B up as I cross into the radar ring.
and when I finally accomplish all these things I drop short...grrrrrrrrr. Of course I got the 5% from the ingame score sheet why wouldn't I? remember i am obviously an Idiot in many of you guys eyes so please keep the explanations simple
At any given point, your score is a result of all actions you made in the current tour, and it's reset at the begging of each new one.
The ingame score sheet is in some areas using some different formats, particularly in the hit% and damage hit% values. What seemed to you as 5% was actually 500%. The web bases score & stats pages do show not only the data in a slightly different format, they often do supply you with more details.
As with most things in game, bombing just takes a bit of practice to get the right feel, to know how & when to do what. You will learn how far away from your target you have to level off, so that you get to have steady speed & alt in time for a calibration, you will even be able to compensate for a few mph difference between actual speed as shown by E6B and the calibrated one (so that you don't have to re-calibrate frantically a few moments before the drop), and so on.
One quick tip: If your calibrated speed matches the E6B value, but you find your altitude being off: No need to recalibrate completely. By just going into calibration mode and leaving it you are calibrating your altitude only. So simply hit U twice, and you have the correct altitude data in a split second.
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ok so I saw a guy that had a 12% ratio so he hit 1200% of everything he dropped on?
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ok so I saw a guy that had a 12% ratio so he hit 1200% of everything he dropped on?
Yes, an ingame score sheet value of "12.0" translates into 1200% on the web score page (which is the one commonly used here in discussions).
But you can't use a phrase like "1200% of everything he dropped on". As i pointed out earlier, the type of target massively influences the hit% achieved. Dropping a bomb into a cluster of town buildings can give you > 3000%, killing an ords bunker with a single bomb will give you like 100%.
You hardly can measure a player's skill /ability to hit with this stat, most of the time it tells you more about his general choice of targets / playing style than about his actual skill level. (Which in general holds true for most things in score)
But i think this is way offtopic for the Bug Report Forum now... If you have further questions, you may better start another thread in the Help & Training section :salute
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Don't read a lot do ya krusty. Try giving my first post a CLOSE READING. Yes I am very accomplished in an AR234, I love hitting at 400mph+.
Sorry to say but Krusty is right, the 29 is very hard to bomb with. We have a squad member who has taken over 8 hours to perfect the bombing in a 29. Its not like any other a/c in this game, you dont just up it, bomb and fly home. Speed and RPM's are a big factor when bombing :salute
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Just got done posting this in the General Disscusion topic about B-29 accuracy
(http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/7091/29bombsiteoff.jpg) (http://img7.imageshack.us/i/29bombsiteoff.jpg/)
Training arena. Perfect Callibration. The Bombsite crosshairs do NOT line up with the training arena's green "bombs will land here" crosshair.
The B-29 bombsite is NOT accurate.
-Smkn-
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Looks like your still accelerating.
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Looks like your still accelerating.
even if accelerating, you drop them at 331 mph calibrated while youre going 331 mph it will hit dead on target if wind variables are out of the question
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See Rule #4
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Looks like your still accelerating.
A second test to remove lingering doubts that acceleration flawed my previous test.
Step 1:
(http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/2972/step1tw.jpg) (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/step1tw.jpg/)
Step 2:
(http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/3991/step2g.jpg) (http://img832.imageshack.us/i/step2g.jpg/)
Step 3:
(http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/3845/step3ac.jpg) (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/step3ac.jpg/)
The facts speak for itself. The B29's bombsite is NOT accurate.
-Smkn-
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Glad I'm not the only one who noticed this. Everybody kept saying "you're not calibrated right." It's frustrating and insulting. Thank you for posting the pictures, Smkn.
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my b1tch is we dont need pictures to see this. I saw a post about all the other bombers possibly being off...but they are off such a small amount you dont noticee it...at all. in the B29 you can notice it. and it is sad. why was it modeled this way?
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"Great job" to smkn & swoops for there pics of the bombsight issue. I really hope that it stays the way it is though since I have already developed my own "substitute" crosshair to use in the 29. I would kind of hate seeing this get fixed after I have spent time correcting it myself.
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I left this topic alone because of all the creepy know-it-alls lurking around in here just waiting to attack.
Looking back, you basically had a meltdown after three posters merely questioned your original post not even a page into it. :lol
Regardless, it looks like you guys uncovered a critical bug so nice job there. :aok
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See Rules #2, #4
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You posted this:
Posting here sucks. I can post that "my house is white, I painted it with white paint, It has white shingles, I love the color white on my house" And someone will ask what color my house is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!ARGHHHHHHHH
Is everyone here really that dense????
Basically after only Krusty questioned your post. I'm just sayin, relax a little bit. :aok
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See Rules #2, #4
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not really griz, I just do not tolerate stupidity well. I recieved suggestions and comments that were actually answered in my original post.
it's caused by some of the elitist attitudes of the "old timers" around here...they see your forum join date an associate that with "are you sure you know what you're talking about?"
you just can't sweat it, because almost everyone finds themselves doing it at some point...if you had posted those pics from the beginning, it may have stopped some (not all) of the questions.
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I guess I should have originally posted this here instead of the general discussions page. This is the result of my testing as you will see from the screenshots that my speed/alt were within 1 mph and 1 foot of alt respectively.
The pipper or green + sign continually lags behind the bombsight reticule for ALL perfectly calibrated runs at ALL altitudes. The error is more egregious at lower altitudes and lower speeds.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,309602.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,309602.0.html)
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Seems your right. Are we sure it has nothing to do with the way a bomb flies/falls?
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Seems your right. Are we sure it has nothing to do with the way a bomb flies/falls?
well, supposedly in the ta that bright green cross is supposed to be the point of impact regardless of speed or alt...in all the photos posted...level bombing with the b-29, that green cross is not lining up with the bomb sight even when it's properly calibrated.
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Yes but the green cross is indicating where the bomb will hit. My point is that perhaps there is something about the way a bomb flies that is accounted for with the green cross but not the bombsight (as I suggested in GD forum).
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Yes but the green cross is indicating where the bomb will hit. My point is that perhaps there is something about the way a bomb flies that is accounted for with the green cross but not the bombsight (as I suggested in GD forum).
if that's the case then someone would have noticed the same issue with the other heavy bombers that have been put through similar messing around in the ta...you been here longer than me, ever see anyone make the same complaint about lancs or b-17s?
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There is a big difference between a B-17 or Lanc and a B-29 not that I think 50mph in calibrated speed would make a big difference but HTC has a penchant for accuracy more than most people give them credit. If its wrong it will be fixed but if its accurate often times they say nothing.
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You posted this:
Basically after only Krusty questioned your post. I'm just sayin, relax a little bit. :aok
To be fair I think if anybody had, he'd have had the same results.
In my defense, I was the one to suggest using the precision bombsight to test out if it's really a bug or just a calibration issue:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,307720.msg3969420.html#msg3969420
I was trying to be helpful, despite the 'tude.
P.S. Gyrene, it has nothing to do with registration dates or post counts. It was the way he was acting that made us ... shall I say... perhaps ... "doubt his bug report." Countless others with not-too-different attitudes and presentation have come in claiming to have found horrible bugs and demanding HTC fix them.... only to be shown they were making some really obvious errors. Some folks will naturally have noticed the pattern and apply it to other regardless of post count or duration of membership.
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SEt your speed in the bomb sight then set the your speed 4 mph faster than bomb sight to get perfect hits.
Vlkyrie1
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See Rules #2, #4, #14
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Oh! An internet tough guy! Im so impressed!
:bhead
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Uh oh, looks like he hurt your feelings too Chalenge. :rolleyes:
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This is a very noteworthy thread with excellent data included! Let's not spoil it and get it locked! :salute
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No little Smkn I wasnt making any such claim (you DID specifically call me out). What I said was it is easily adjusted for. I also stated that you and others do not have your planes stable and in a non-accelerating state. Any pilot can miss by a great deal more than your screenshots indicate by trying to move the crosshair onto the target just before hitting town. Thats lateral compensation and it will screw up the drop.
Checking out your score I cant even see where you used a B-29 online. I can tell you if I only flew the B-29 and I had 26 sorties in it that my damage points would exceed 75 million (easily) yet you dont even have 1 million. Probably the listening should be going the other way dont you think?
Nevermind though. I also fly fighters and from now on you should probably bring a lot of escorts along with you when you sortie out. :aok
Oh! An internet tough guy! Im so impressed!
:bhead
Funny.... thats exactly what I thought.... Wouldn't you agree Mr. Pot?
-Smkn-
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Dibs on the first in for the Bug Reports forum :bhead
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Gents you are aiming from the front of the aircraft, and the bombs are dropping from center / rear of aircraft. This distance is the error you are seeing.
HiTech
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Gents you are aiming from the front of the aircraft, and the bombs are dropping from center / rear of aircraft. This distance is the error you are seeing.
I had wondered about this. The distance seems bigger than the length of the aircraft, but I'm probably wrong. However, IRL, would the bombsight have incorporated this distance error or is this how it was?
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However, IRL, would the bombsight have incorporated this distance error or is this how it was?
Was wondering the same thing.
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While not a perfect line up. It looks like the sight is way more off then just the distance from the Bombbays / Bombsight
(http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/64b20e680067662e9be338729e707a935c29fd09ef5ea140f6782e728944a2516g.jpg)
(http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/5456/errormu.jpg) (http://img38.imageshack.us/i/errormu.jpg/)
The distance from Bombbay infact doesn't look all that farther a distance then any other bomber.
(http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/900/b17b29.jpg) (http://img691.imageshack.us/i/b17b29.jpg/)
Thanks for TWCCajun for being a photographic lacky!
-Smkn-
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Figures I've read were that the Circular Error Probability, CEP, for a bomb hit for a B17 using a Norden bomb sight was one mile. So they didn't really care about 40 or 50 feet of aircraft.
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Special thanks to Smkn for adding such in depth examples and explanations. It would appear the error is greater than the distance from the bomb-sight to the bomb-bay doors.