Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: saggs on August 29, 2011, 09:51:36 PM
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... ... may still need some refinement.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6b54bZepoA&feature=player_embedded
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Wow... that's alot of water. That would be so wierd, to watch a fish swimming by your windshield :lol
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I prefer the LiveLeak title :
"New Jersey National Guard are some kind of highly evolved underwater fish soldiers"
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=888_1314627483
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I prefer the LiveLeak title :
"New Jersey National Guard are some kind of highly evolved underwater fish soldiers"
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=888_1314627483
:rofl :rofl
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Yeah... I have the utmost respect for the National Guard (and all Military). But I cannot understand what on earth they where thinking. There is no way they thought they could have made it through that, (at first I kept looking for the snorkel on the truck... nope) and now they have 8+ people stranded instead of just the one. (not to mention 2 ruined trucks.)
If the stranded guy was in trouble due to hypothermia, exhaustion, slipping under etc before they could get a boat/raft to them.. Then why not just send a strong swimmer out to him/her with some kind of floatation device to keep them above water and awake/aware. If the water is not too cold surely the individual could hang on for another 15-30 minutes till they could get a boat out there.
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My only question is why take the guy that cant swim?
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Im guessing they miscalculated how deep the water truly was. If you look at that red brick building That the camera shows, it gives the illusion that The water in that area wasent very deep. The trucks prob headed towards that, thinking they were going to get out of the water. Instead they went even deeper.
Bet they wished the military still used DUKW's instead of selling them all off to tour guides :rofl
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Im guessing they miscalculated how deep the water truly was. If you look at that red brick building That the camera shows, it gives the illusion that The water in that area wasent very deep. The trucks prob headed towards that, thinking they were going to get out of the water. Instead they went even deeper.
Yea but when water starts coming over the hood, and you don't have a snorkel, extended CC breather etc, common sense says you put it in reverse and rethink the plan.
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That was too stupid for words. :bhead
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See Rule #6
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You guys can call it stupid if you like, but at least these guys were out trying to help people.
I'm glad they are trying to help, but they FUBARed it. End of story, like I said, now instead of one civilian stranded they have 1 civilian and 8 NG guys. :rolleyes: They jumped into the situation without thinking it through and made it worse.
And the ones who are saying they "ruined" these 7 tons....that is the most uneducated spout of garbage I've heard in a long....long long time. Our modern vehicles can handle WAY more than that. Give me a few minutes and I will post a video of a humvee COMPLETELY submerged and still driving. Not to mention it does NOT ruin those engines. Not one bit. Will it need some heavy maintenance? Yes. But they are not "ruined"
I think you are the one who is ignorant. Those diesels will likely need a complete overhaul, new valves, push rods, rockers, milled heads, sleeves, con rods, wrist pins, pistons, crank may be bent... the works. Have you ever seen what hydrolock does to an internal combustion engine? When you try to compress an incompressible liquid (Water) at a 20/1 ratio... it leads to lots of stuff breaking and bending. IF they where lucky, then the water choked the intake and stalled it before water got in the cylinders and destroyed the engine, but I wouldn't count on it. Not to mention all the corrosion and accessories that don't like water either.
I'd like to see how many of you would have the BALLS to look at what you believe to be an impossible situation and even THINK of making the attempt seriously.... These guys did it.
I'm not questioning their "balls" I'm questioning their common sense. And FYI I was a whitewater river guide for 5 years, I am very well trained in fast water rescue, and have rescues many people stranded on a rock in the middle of, or floating un-contained through class 3 whitewater. I know how, and have done many fast water rescues, you could say I have both the balls and brains. :old: Like I said, why not just send a strong swimmer with a PFD to the guy to keep him together mentally and physically til a boat can get there?
At that point, you're already committed. :rofl :rofl :rofl
Committed to keep going forward, into even deeper water? :headscratch: Really why? Do NG trucks not have reverse anymore? At the point where water is just cresting the hood, you could still back out and probably have no more problems then a soggy air filter.
As for the HUMVEE video you talk about, I have seen it, or ones like it.
Those HUMVEEs have: snorkels, extended CC breather, extended diff breathers, extended fuel tank breather, dielectric greased electrical terminals, sealed starter, sealed alternator, sealed weatherstripping, and probably a whole lot more. In short they are purpose built for deep fording. A stock deuce is not, which is why those 2 are now bricks until they get rebuilt engines, diffs, interiors,starters, alternators.. etc. On the bright side the tranny will probably be OK with just a flush though. :)
Like I said I have the utmost respect for the military, as everyone should I believe. But that respect does not make them infallible. These guys did a massive SNAFU that is the fact. Do I hold it against them? Not at all, we've all had massive SNAFUs. It happens. I just posted it for a laugh, and nobody got hurt, so I think it's OK to have a little laugh at their expense.
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Am I the only thinking screw the truck getting air, how are the humans breathing? Not only that what happens if you hit dip in road whole truck goes under.
:headscratch:
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EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCXLVjdnDlE&feature=fvst driving COMPLETELY under water. Modified vehicle, but not by much.
It doesn't take "much" to get a diesel to operate underwater. A snorkel and extended breathers are the only real necessity to do it occasionally, Point is that these trucks do not have it.
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See Rule #6
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:rolleyes:
WOW. I guess pulling on a pair of BDUs with a flag on the shoulder makes one immune from criticism for poor leadership and decision making now. That's not patriotism, that's stupidity. Maybe I'll wear BDUs everyday now, so no one will give me crap when I screw stuff up, and I do screw stuff up. Everyone does, how come we can't acknowledge it, just because they are in uniform, they are still human. There are idiots and morons in every organization, the military is no exception (even the Marines)
The military is not infallible... those boys screwed up. Even if you don't agree with me, I bet their CO does. :D
I do not see experience with this block of text. I see 'look at me and all of my rafting experience!' -- I see nothing but a brag.
Don't mean to brag. Only was amused that he implied I don't have the "Balls" to go in the water and rescue some one. When I have done exactly that dozens of times, and not in nice calm, still water either <- OK maybe that last part was a little brag. :lol relax buddy, now I'm just trying to push your buttons. Most tasks aren't about having the "balls" to do it. It's about having the skills, knowledge, experience, and tools (or ingenuity to make the tools) to do it. I'd say these boys only hit 2/4 on this particular task.
I'm fairly certain the boy in uniform has more merit than you do in such a situation.
Well since he seems to think that ingesting water into a diesel engine will do not real harm to it, I'd disagree.
Again, just because he wears BDUs he suddenly know everything about everything. :rolleyes: I freely admit, that I know very little about a lot of subjects (computers, textile weaving, women, Asian culture to name just a few). Just so happens that as luck would have it, in this case I do know a bit about both the mechanics of internal combustion engines, and water rescues. I know there are lots of gearheads and on here, ask them if you think I'm blowing smoke, odds are pretty good that those engines are toast.
Anyway, I just though it was an amusing video so I shared it. Now I see that it's going to turn into a macho G.I. Joe pissing match about how the military can do no wrong, and since some of them have "Balls" :rolleyes: they don't need common sense. So I'm out :bolt:
P.S. And how do you know that I don't wear a uniform on occasion as well. Maybe like say for a weekend every month, and 2 weeks a year. ;) Maybe I do, but I just don't feel the need to brag about it to the whole intardnet by making it my screen name, and slipping into the conversation how I "man the .50" (whose bragging now)
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See Rule #6
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The LMVT doesn't have a hood so they probably didn't realize it until they were past the point of no return. Point of fact its just like a dang yankee to praise someone on second and then start calling them stupid the next without so much as offering any help they can possibly offer. Not every person in the north is like that but these two idiots are for posting it on Youtube.
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See Rule #6
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duh! :rolleyes:
and proof that stupid knows no borders:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXWXO7JNxk0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXWXO7JNxk0)
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It doesn't take "much" to get a diesel to operate underwater. A snorkel and extended breathers are the only real necessity to do it occasionally, Point is that these trucks do not have it.
Guess you didn't notice the air intakes on them.
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This right here, they were doing what they could and they sure dont need a bunch of BS from folks just sitting there with a camera........and also thats an LMTV not a duece anda half.
5000lb capacity is 2.5 tons.
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5000lb capacity is 2.5 tons.
(http://m35a2.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/1.jpg)
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Well to put more lives in danger beacause of a single idiot just does not make sense. This is assuming they drove off into that water.
I know idiots are a protected species but sometimes you have to think about others.
If this was a levee break then the stranded probably had no chance to get to clear ground but if they drove off into that water.... let'em sink or swim.
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I looked at video one more time and noticed that they are LVT's so no harm done. :rofl
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Not once did I say the water would mess up your STANDARD Diesel engine.
Not ONCE did I SPECIFICALLY call you out, SAGGS.
Again, I have experience with these vehicles. Like someone pointed out, these trucks were very much equipped to handle serious water. Watch the video again. Shame that they were so close to.
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I like what this guy said: "Everyone with some smart arse comment realizes, of course, they were caught when a levee broke and flooded them. Might as well try and use the means you have to get out of the situation until you get help."
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It would explain why (if you look back at the beginning of the video), there is NO place where there isn't a large amount of water.
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Im no official, but I think two basic fundamentals were ignored in the video that the NG guys shouldn't of overlooked. The first being, and I think has been a rule as long as the US military has had motorized vehicles, that one vehicle crosses a submerged water crossing at a time. The second being, when the military issues you something that it says is good for use in up to 15' of water, you obviously haven't been in the military (or know anyone who has been) if you think it's hunky-dory to plow through the first 14-foot deep puddle you find without a second thought.
Am I wrong?
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:rolleyes:
WOW. I guess pulling on a pair of BDUs with a flag on the shoulder makes one immune from criticism for poor leadership and decision making now. That's not patriotism, that's stupidity.
Exactly..These guys are National Reserve and we can all thank them for that, but it doesn't mean they are immune to criticism for not using common sense. This bad decision on their part was lucky enough to only cost the tax payers a vehicle repair bill. What happens if this kind of decision is made during a war zone that gets them all killed?
Better to criticize them now vs having them make stupid decisions when it really maters and lives are on the line. Granted many people did die during that storm just luckily not due to this.
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military intelligence... :neener: :bhead
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military intelligence... :neener: :bhead
stop making up stuff! :rofl
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Am I the only thinking screw the truck getting air, how are the humans breathing? Not only that what happens if you hit dip in road whole truck goes under.
:headscratch:
Nah NG aren't fitting with that module that needs oxygen to operate :D
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"How is that possible?"
"It's the Army, bro"
LOLOLOL :rofl
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I like what this guy said: "Everyone with some smart arse comment realizes, of course, they were caught when a levee broke and flooded them. Might as well try and use the means you have to get out of the situation until you get help."
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It would explain why (if you look back at the beginning of the video), there is NO place where there isn't a large amount of water.
These guys didn't do it on purpose. They got trapped there and decided they might as well keep driving while the truck is running.....
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Something similar happened after Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.
Some national guardsmen got their truck stuck while transporting congressman Jefferson to his home (which was loaded with hidden cash from bribes). Well they got stuck too. Prosecutors ended up finding hundred of thousands of dollars in cash in the freezer.
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These guys didn't do it on purpose. They got trapped there and decided they might as well keep driving while the truck is running.....
You really don't believe that do you? "If" a levee broke and flooded the area to that degree, fast enough so they got trapped with their engines still running, the water would have been moving at a pretty rapid pace and not standing still. These guys were trying to be cowboys and it didn't work out.
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Since I wasn't there, I'm not going to assume I know everything <hint hint>
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Since I wasn't there, I'm not going to assume I know everything <hint hint>
Finally some one making some sense.
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I'm going to let this debate die. The levee broke a few hours before that. They took what they thought to be the best route out.
I'm done arguing.
It's like winning in the Special Olympics...you're still retarded.
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Was that comment necessary?
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I like to point out things.
I didn't hate on those with special needs, yet those who act like they should be in that category. One of my best friends had down syndrome when I was in high school. I helped him mom around the house.
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I see.
Ok.
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"How is that possible?"
"It's the Army, bro"
LOLOLOL :rofl
aww beat me to it. I thought those trucks were gettin ready chitty chitty bang bang.
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It doesn't take "much" to get a diesel to operate underwater. A snorkel and extended breathers are the only real necessity to do it occasionally, Point is that these trucks do not have it.
whats that behind the cab?