Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: ScottyK on December 23, 2011, 08:14:43 PM
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Me personally would like to see it increased from 2 to 5. IMO, you could get more people to stay in a furball, mission etc.....and not disengage from a fight.
Flame on.
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Not sure if it would actually do much. You may see an increase in timid flying, if that is at all possible anymore.
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I think you would just see more people hitting the re-arm pad half-way through a flight.
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IMO, thats just gonna drive up the vulching and cherry picking. Would have the exact opposite effect of what you're intending.
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You may see an increase in timid flying, if that is at all possible anymore.
This.
Can You, Scotty, get 5 kills while furballing? Im usualy more than happy with 3... yea im not that pickvulchy type.
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You have seen me fly Debrody and the answer is no. :D
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Just FYI,
If nothing would change in player behaviour, it would cut down landed kills messages to something like 15% of what we have today.
And even if players would fly more uhmmm... 'controlled' and would use the rearm pad as much as possible: Five kills being landed are way out of reach of the 'ordinary' player.
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Anyone can get 5 kills, but you have to fly using good tactics. As in have one or more wingmen all flying together, and have only the designated flight lead going after kills. Everyone else does nothing but keep bandits off of lead (and off of the other wingman). Once the bandit pulls off his attack on your lead, you also break off the attack and get back with lead. Only lead goes for kills, everyone else saves ammo using just enough to get bandits to break off their own attacks on lead.
2-4 aircraft is all that is necessary for this, and it is ruthlessly effective even in big furballs.
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Anyone can get 5 kills, but you have to fly using good tactics. As in have one or more wingmen all flying together, and have only the designated flight lead going after kills. Everyone else does nothing but keep bandits off of lead (and off of the other wingman). Once the bandit pulls off his attack on your lead, you also break off the attack and get back with lead. Only lead goes for kills, everyone else saves ammo using just enough to get bandits to break off their own attacks on lead.
2-4 aircraft is all that is necessary for this, and it is ruthlessly effective even in big furballs.
I disagree with the intitial part: Not anyone can do that, and your statement is almost explainging why not ;)
It need discipline, coordination, knowledge and... skill (for example a lot of players are simply horrible shooters). You could train many players to get to that point (if they were willing), but as is, for the majority of players landing five kills is still a daunting task in most cases.
It only looks 'simple' if you can already do it.
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Like Lusche said, I don't think it would have the desired affect. Although it id get me thinking about a simple change that just might get folks to commit more often and fly a tad less timid.
What if the SYSTEM: messages never indicated who you had shot down? It would still indicate who shot you down and displayed you victories upon landind. Then maybe those folks who are fearful of being laughed at or "whatever about being towered" is so disagreeable to them would feel safe to be a bit more aggressive and less timid.
Me? I like the tower, it just bugs me that my chair is in the corner :aok
Just a thought.
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Like Lusche said, I don't think it would have the desired affect.
:headscratch: I'm a bit slow today :o ... what statement of mine are you referring to?
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An increase to 3 would be good for starters... then in a year up it to 5..... then 6 mos from there REMOVE IT.
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An increase to 3 would be good for starters... then in a year up it to 5..... then 6 mos from there REMOVE IT.
Why 3 now and 5 a year later?
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System: xy got jumped by 3 bandits and got all 3 of them
opinions?
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Always liked the idea that you should aquire a >2 perks before recieving an Attaboy. This would mean that uber planes would be harder to get attaboys with.
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Always liked the idea that you should aquire a >2 perks before recieving an Attaboy. This would mean that uber planes would be harder to get attaboys with.
anybody can pick with any airplane not just the ubber one's. i can get an f4f and land several kills if I so desire. same for some p47's 109 or 190, 205, etc. there's no uber planes or hard to fly planes but the situation you get into that matters.
semp
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Not sure if it would actually do much. You may see an increase in timid flying, if that is at all possible anymore.
I'm sorry spikes, what did you say? i'm too busy looking at your avatar.
? what?
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anybody can pick with any airplane not just the ubber one's. i can get an f4f and land several kills if I so desire. same for some p47's 109 or 190, 205, etc. there's no uber planes or hard to fly planes but the situation you get into that matters.
semp
Sorry, but thats just wrong. Ta-152 is probably one of the more difficult planes to fly, while the spitfire is quite likely the easiest.
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Anyone can get 5 kills, but you have to fly using good tactics. As in have one or more wingmen all flying together, and have only the designated flight lead going after kills. Everyone else does nothing but keep bandits off of lead (and off of the other wingman). 2-4 aircraft is all that is necessary for this, and it is ruthlessly effective even in big furballs.
So - all you need to get a kill is 4 to 1 odds ... ? That's kind of right up there with shooting Buffalo in a pen isn't it?
:uhoh
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Fine the way it is. Let's not change anything.
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This.
Can You, Scotty, get 5 kills while furballing? Im usualy more than happy with 3... yea im not that pickvulchy type.
Really. I never get more then 1 or 2 kills as it is.
Bump it up to 5 and I'd never see my name up in lights. :cry
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So - all you need to get a kill is 4 to 1 odds ... ? That's kind of right up there with shooting Buffalo in a pen isn't it?
:uhoh
No, what you need are tactics that aren't stupid. Mutual support is a basic principle of air combat, and it comes in many different forms. The basic unit in WWII evolved to a flight of 4, with 2 elements. The element lead did the killing, the wingman cleared his lead's 6. And the wing element was also tasked with supporting the lead element.
That's just smart tactics, and it has nothing to do with odds. One of my best ever flights in AH was just me and my wingman against 14 opponents. I got 9 kills, and my wingman shot down the other 5 when they saddled up on me.
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-1000
Just because you can land 3,5,10 a sorti does not mean someone who has been playing 1-12 months can land 2+. And they are the ones who do need to see there names in lights. This little thing can keep them coming back and learning the game instead of getting hammered so hard they quit in disgust at getting killed all the time. Your right, landing 2+ kills isn't hard *if* you know what your doing and how to do it but your forgetting what it was like to land your first 2+ kills and maybe even your first kill.
lots of us have been flying AH (and it's predecessors) for 10-20 YEARS. if we want the young-uns to learn and continue they need a carrot to offset padding our scores.
shdo
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Sorry, but thats just wrong. Ta-152 is probably one of the more difficult planes to fly, while the spitfire is quite likely the easiest.
and yet if i up one which i hardly do i can kill just as easy as with the pony or the c205 or the 109's. it's not the flying itself of the plane but the situation that you get into.
a couple of years ago i got shot down by a guy in a Lancaster that turned fought my spit 9. i was so slow i could barely move he was able to actually get on my six and shoot me down without a gunner. funnest fight i can remember.
you take something like an f4f and compare it to a spitfire, and I am a spitfire dweeb from day one and the f4f should win every time. and yet very few people whine about people upping such easy mode plane.
when you see the 190 just zoom and boom and the 109's trying to just rope everybody or the c205/yak just doing high speed circles that my friend is easy mode. dont even let me started with the p47's or the la7's.
semp
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and yet if i up one which i hardly do i can kill just as easy as with the pony or the c205 or the 109's. it's not the flying itself of the plane but the situation that you get into.
a couple of years ago i got shot down by a guy in a Lancaster that turned fought my spit 9. i was so slow i could barely move he was able to actually get on my six and shoot me down without a gunner. funnest fight i can remember.
you take something like an f4f and compare it to a spitfire, and I am a spitfire dweeb from day one and the f4f should win every time. and yet very few people whine about people upping such easy mode plane.
when you see the 190 just zoom and boom and the 109's trying to just rope everybody or the c205/yak just doing high speed circles that my friend is easy mode. dont even let me started with the p47's or the la7's.
And yet that doesn't mean that the various aircraft in our planeset aren't easier or more difficult to fly. The Ta-152 has a nasty stall, and if you push it beyond its limits, you'll probably be sent to the tower in a flash, as you're left hanging there in flatspin.
Yeah, I could beat you in a footrace if I'm well rested and well fed, while you've been doing hard physical labor for the past week on nothing more than a loaf of bread and some water. But the result of the race doesn't tell you anything besides the fact that you were starting out at a disadvantage.
If you want to test what aircraft are easier to fly, get someone you consider to be your equal, and fight his spitfire in various aircraft starting co-alt and co-E. Neither aircraft has an advantage, so the results of a best 2 out of 3 match will show you what aircraft is easier to fly.
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And yet that doesn't mean that the various aircraft in our planeset aren't easier or more difficult to fly. The Ta-152 has a nasty stall, and if you push it beyond its limits, you'll probably be sent to the tower in a flash, as you're left hanging there in flatspin.
Yeah, I could beat you in a footrace if I'm well rested and well fed, while you've been doing hard physical labor for the past week on nothing more than a loaf of bread and some water. But the result of the race doesn't tell you anything besides the fact that you were starting out at a disadvantage.
If you want to test what aircraft are easier to fly, get someone you consider to be your equal, and fight his spitfire in various aircraft starting co-alt and co-E. Neither aircraft has an advantage, so the results of a best 2 out of 3 match will show you what aircraft is easier to fly.
it will show you the skill of the pilot as there is no such thing as equal in this game.
semp
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-1000
Just because you can land 3,5,10 a sortie does not mean someone who has been playing 1-12 months can land 2+. And they are the ones who do need to see there names in lights. This little thing can keep them coming back and learning the game instead of getting hammered so hard they quit in disgust at getting killed all the time. Your right, landing 2+ kills isn't hard *if* you know what your doing and how to do it but your forgetting what it was like to land your first 2+ kills and maybe even your first kill.
lots of us have been flying AH (and it's predecessors) for 10-20 YEARS. if we want the young-uns to learn and continue they need a carrot to offset padding our scores.
shdo
i have to completely disagree with all of that... because yeah landing 2 victory's is great and awesome the first time but then they just stick to that...then you have tempest/hurricanes/110s/190(205s)/la7s/mossi/hoers and ramers pickers who get 2 kills and run home even if they have enough fuel and ammo for 10+ fights few people rarely step out and actually try to get better at something instead they will useally get a plane with more cannons and fire from even further out next time should they have died
for example 2 days ago i was flying a yak encountered a c205 who has been playing 15+months first pass he hos me and runs into me...i lose my tail his plane is fine i go back up same thing only i lost a wing and he collided with me vertically his plane was fine yet again...i up again and he goes and runs home to land his 2 hos/rams even though he had enough ammo to stick around for another 2-3 fights and fuel for probably 5 and after he landed instead of re upping he ran to a manned 37mm sat in it and waited to try to shoot me down once i chased his buddy over a v-base...
i think when it becomes more important to go land your 2 kills when your plane is fine and you have enough fuel/ammo its a prob...as it takes away allot from combat also you would see a decrease in ramming and hoing as people who really do want they're name in lights wont be willing to risk it as currently they do because a plane can survive 2 collisions and 2 hos but when you get 3-4-5 at 3 rams its a 99% chance u lose an FCC at 3 hos you have about a 75% chance of dieing(should they return fire) at 4 collisions your 99.5% going to lose a FCC and more around 90% for dieing when hoing at 5 rams your dead and at 5 hos you have about a 98% of dieing
as for pickers id say each time you drop in on someones six your chance of dieing goes up by about 15%
point is because of this the people who ram and ho with a 5 victory requirement will have to learn how to do something else to get they're name in lights and pickers wont be landing much either
could this have a negative effect? yes
could this have a very positive effect and improve game play? yes
is they're anyway of knowing the outcome until its implemented? no
are all the hoers pickers and ramers going to whine? absolutely
+1 all and all i like the idea
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Like the idea.
I don't see any problem with it besides forum whines.
While it may make some people fly timid, it would also make some fly more aggressively.
If I knew that it took 2 kills to get an attaboy when I started, I wouldn't have ran home so excited that first time I finally got a kill only to find out you had to get two to get a message. I'd have stuck it out and kept trying for more. If it had been 3...the same.
If it had been four, I'd probably gone to the TA and asked for help. Imagine that?!?
Hmmmm....maybe giving participation trophies isn't a good idea.
2 kill landing messages is pretty close to participation trophies.
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-1
Its bad enough when the weekend arrives and everyone and their dog too decides to HO everything and anything and then run home. Add a 5 kill requirement for name in lights moments and it will get much much worse.
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Its bad enough when the weekend arrives and everyone and their dog too decides to HO everything and anything and then run home. Add a 5 kill requirement for name in lights moments and it will get much much worse.
how exactly would it get worse?
from a current standpoint even a Brewster or an a6 will ho as is right now just for an easy kill to run home and land 2 victory's with a higher kill count you will see more aggressive fights yes..however hoin will most likely decrease as people will come to realise that after the 3-4Th ho they will useally die and never get they're name in lights (as that's what most hoers worry about) so they will have to learn how to do something besides ho/ram to get they're name in lights which would be an improvement? not make it worse?
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Some here do argue from a very lofty point of view...
Landing message for two kills a participation medal? Hardly so.
Only about 25% of all kills are rewarded with a landing message at all. And as the kills/sortie is about 0.5 (bombers excluded) you can easily guess what a tiny fraction of sorties ends up with such a message at all. Currently we are at about 4.5 kills per player per hour (all game modes, incl. manned ack), so if ~25% result in a landing message, we end up in the area of 1 message per hour for the proverbial "average" player.
However, most messages are generated by the 'usual suspects', the small core of 'vet' players (or elite, 'top' or whatever you want to call them). So for the de facto average AH players, even landing "only" two kills is quite an achievement, three would be very rare for him. Not to speak of five.
I have the vague idea that if you raise the requirement to 5, vulching would get much more important, as for the majority of players this would be the only way to ever get their name in lights. Personally, I find the notion of raising the player skill level by such a measure quite amusing ;)
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how exactly would it get worse? from a current standpoint even a Brewster or an a6 will ho as is right now just for an easy kill to run home and land 2 victory's
Well ... it MIGHT encourage some people to learn other merge tactics , but THOSE people will probably seek to learn anyway ... The die hard Ho-ers (like a certain side switcher we both know) will just be motivated to make -MORE- HOs before RTB. Personally -I- Think BOTH planes should recieve FATAL damage whenever they collide, which happens frequently with HOs. NO MORE flying away to do it again! If the HOers KNOW they are going down, they MAY at least begin avoiding collisions.
:furious