Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: surfinn on January 02, 2012, 07:03:45 PM
-
I would like to see squads with integrity to start showing integrity.
We all have moments in AH were we feel like things are unfair. We all have moments when we felt like the fight would have been differant if there was just one less con on your 6.
Look at al the post in here about collisions and hordes. All of those are a product of you the squads leading us down the path of indifference
I would ask this of all AH top squads.
Institute a honour policy among your squaddies. If there are more than 3 of you, or any other friendly, on 1 con then break off. Fly with honour and make the AH community proud to be one of your squad members not because it took 5 of you to shot one con down but rather it only took one.
I have flown against all of you guys and know the skill level in here is incredible. Now show your true potential and change the game through your own squads. We should not go quietly into the night. We should fight for what we believe in.
-
You might as well ask them to completely disband, surfinn.... some squads thrive on pack hunting and love nothing more than landing big kill #'s by ganging and picking guys already otherwise engaged.
Was that way before, is that way now.... ain't gonna be different tomorrow, or next year.
:old:
-
I don't do honor. Only honour.
-
We should not go quietly into the night. We should fight for what we believe in.
-
My squad has only one member but I still....
:lol
-
I would like to apologize for the 80th Headhunters. I had no idea we've cause such conflict. We will try and minimize our augering, inabilty to drop bombs and willingness to dive into the horde regardless of the odds. And when I say odds I don't mean my squadmates!
We will fly low and by ourselves so as to present better targets to up and coming players so as to encourage their participation.
Oh wait a minute. You asked this of the top squads. As we live in the basement, please disregard.
-
so exactly what are you laughing at the concept or that I posted it?
I've seen you post with intelligence so please don't be a tool
-
I would like to apologize for the 80th Headhunters. I had no idea we've cause such conflict. We will try and minimize our augering, inabilty to drop bombs and willingness to dive into the horde regardless of the odds. And when I say odds I don't mean my squadmates!
We will fly low and by ourselves so as to present better targets to up and coming players so as to encourage their participation.
Oh wait a minute. You asked this of the top squads. As we live in the basement, please disregard.
dammit why do you 80th have to kick our crap around in the basement :t
-
I would like to apologize for the 80th Headhunters. I had no idea we've cause such conflict. We will try and minimize our augering, inabilty to drop bombs and willingness to dive into the horde regardless of the odds. And when I say odds I don't mean my squadmates!
We will fly low and by ourselves so as to present better targets to up and coming players so as to encourage their participation.
Oh wait a minute. You asked this of the top squads. As we live in the basement, please disregard.
:rofl :rofl
And this, gentlemen, is an example of a squad to respect----- it's the very lack of ego and willingness to fight when the odds aren't in their favor that earns a group the title of a "pretty damm good group of toon sticks."
If only they flew fighters........ :x
-
so exactly what are you laughing at the concept or that I posted it?
I've seen you post with intelligence so please don't be a tool
I laugh about the lavish usage of the word "honor" in the cartoon combat context. Sorry, but honor is about more important things in real life than being cartoon fighter #1 or #12 on a con. And posting a line like "We should fight for what we believe in" in all seriousness in the context of a cartoon game... is well.... some might even take offense in that, be glad I find it just... very funny.
Or put in another way: It's a way to big word for the whole thing. Asking for some restraint, or more "fairness" (still very debatable, too) would have done fine.
-
Morals...
-
This from a guy who rage PMed me that I was manipulating my connection on purpose, priceless :rofl
-
I laugh about the lavish usage of the word "honor" in the cartoon combat context. Sorry, but honor is about more important things in real life than being cartoon fighter #1 or #12 on a con. And posting a line like "We should fight for what we believe in" in all seriousness in the context of a cartoon game... is well.... some might even take offense in that, be glad I find it just... very funny.
Or put in another way: It's a way to big word for the whole thing. Asking for some restraint, or more "fairness" (still very debatable, too) would have done fine.
I'm a fan of Arnold Palmer and his school of thought on games:
"Bad golfer, bad person" meaning, you can learn a lot about a person by the way he plays his game of golf or any other game really. Cheater in golf, cheater in life...etc etc. I believe we are being asked to have character.
-
I'm a fan of Arnold Palmer and his school of thought on games:
"Bad golfer, bad person" meaning, you can learn a lot about a person by the way he plays his game of golf or any other game really. Cheater in golf, cheater in life...etc etc. I believe we are being asked to have character.
^^ This.
-
I laugh about the lavish usage of the word "honor" in the cartoon combat context.
Try "sportsmanship" then.
- oldman
-
Try "sportsmanship" then.
- oldman
Don't tell that me, tell that him.
-
In my experience honor and sportsmanship are reserved for the times when we lose like a comfort blanket for failure. The problem is there always has to be a loser for there to be a winner :rofl
-
I'm a fan of Arnold Palmer and his school of thought on games:
"Bad golfer, bad person" meaning, you can learn a lot about a person by the way he plays his game of golf or any other game really. Cheater in golf, cheater in life...etc etc. I believe we are being asked to have character.
Character... yes. But all these things only get so far. In the end, I will be accused again of having no real life morals at all, that I would betray my RL country in a war ... just because I "betrayed" my AH chesspiece by switching sides.
Again: I will relentlessly mock everyone who arbitrarily defines the high value term of honor by the number of planes diving on a con.
-
In my experience honor and sportsmanship are reserved for the times when we lose like a comfort blanket for failure. The problem is there always has to be a loser for there to be a winner :rofl
He is speaking about HOW you win or HOW you lose...admittedly, the MA is not a place to look for equal footing in a fight and, in fact, it almost never happens. That is what the DA is for although that seems to be fading into obscurity. Winning and losing in the MA is function of a lot of things, most of which no pilot can control...now, the few things that you can control will keep you alive a lot longer but for the most part you aint gettin home every time.
-
I dont think you can derive a persons character by one event, maybe if it is a habit....
It makes sense tactically to remain with advantage as well, if ten green dots went down to chase one red, who's got top cover? I'm sure another red will be around soon enough so stay high and engage them.
-
Character... yes.
Again: I will relentlessly mock everyone who arbitrarily defines the high value term of honor by the number of planes diving on a con.
I don't think relentless mocking will change anyone or anyone's viewpoint. I have seen you fly and I don't believe he's talking about a pilot like you...so your actions are already speaking for your character and that is what he's asking. JUGgler talks about the same thing and I will too, on occasion. If you're in a 1 v 1 in the MA and your opponent has 4 buddies lurking, why not finish the fight? If you beat your opponent, you aint gettin home...of course, everyone defines character differently.
-
I don't think relentless mocking will change anyone or anyone's viewpoint.
I don't expect that ;)
-
I dont think you can derive a persons character by one event, maybe if it is a habit....
It makes sense tactically to remain with advantage as well, if ten green dots went down to chase one red, who's got top cover? I'm sure another red will be around soon enough so stay high and engage them.
I'm fairly certain he's not talking about 1 event and there's another old saying..."A person is only as good as they are in their worst moment"...You gang? You're a ganger...we've all done it...we'll all do it again, and again and again. We are being asked to try harder.
-
Honor and sportsmanship lies within each player, how they use it is up to them, Dan i would have to say has honor and sportsmanship to the highest degree as well as many others, several squads hold onto this also you just have to find them :)
-
I don't expect that ;)
Understood. :salute
The only thing I would like to ask everyone to do is treat the new people with a bit more respect. There is too much to learn in this game to take any of it for granted...most people find their way to the MA thinking it will be a game...they are completely unprepared to BECOME the game. Then, we run them off with sarcasm and by making fun of them not knowing jack...not everyone...but alot of folks. Yes, I've done it too...but not in a long, long time and it won't ever happen again. :salute
-
How about "class". or is that too much a reach for you guys?
-
How about "class". or is that too much a reach for you guys?
Im not sure that having class and having character are too different...in fact, I know they aren't.
-
Morals...
...
:rofl :rofl :rofl
-
I would like to see squads with integrity to start showing integrity.
We all have moments in AH were we feel like things are unfair. We all have moments when we felt like the fight would have been differant if there was just one less con on your 6.
Look at al the post in here about collisions and hordes. All of those are a product of you the squads leading us down the path of indifference
I would ask this of all AH top squads.
Institute a honour policy among your squaddies. If there are more than 3 of you, or any other friendly, on 1 con then break off. Fly with honour and make the AH community proud to be one of your squad members not because it took 5 of you to shot one con down but rather it only took one.
I have flown against all of you guys and know the skill level in here is incredible. Now show your true potential and change the game through your own squads. We should not go quietly into the night. We should fight for what we believe in.
The pilots, both sides, during WWI had much the same attitude you suggest and the 12th century knights chivalry code of conduct when they started out in air combat. That noble attitude quickly changed as fellow friends and pilots got shot down from the enemy's deceitful practices, whichever side started it, and that was that.
War is, well you know how it goes.
Go read the book titled, "With The Old Breed" by E.B. Sledge, published in 2010 by Presido Press as to what war is really like, concerning the WWII, Pacific, Marine infantryman.
This game is not real war, but the psychology of the guys playing it, mirrors it.
I have been "killed" in this game every way imaginable as to non-noble action. What comes around goes around.
I often find one on one opportunity to fight. The acronym SA applies before ever entering the fight. If I see one guy, I am good to go. If I see more than one, I avoid it. Finding one on one opportunity happens at 20K or so, not flying low and not flying the predictable path to a furball.
-
Whilst surfinn's request seems a little unrealistic he does have a point.
A few weeks back he was in a pesky I16 and I was in my spit8. He could have dove down and picked me on three different occasions but chose to watch my first fight with tallboy's KI. It was about a minute long and he engaged when it was clear to do so. Then one after another his countrymen kept trying to jump into our fight with their lame bnz attacks, so he backed off and let me kill them one by one and then dropped in again.
I get that it is unheard of and extremely impractical but for that sortie where I would have died very quickly, his actions prolonged my enjoyment. The underlying problem is that people do not respect the enemy pilot it is just a natural human trait of self greed. The saddest part is the hypocrisy of some people who just can't accept stuff when it happens to them yet are the worst for it. After playing for 10+ years it is the people like surfinn that I will remember and return his honour in kind.
-
I have Honor...For example Honesty :D
I will Pick: If you do not pay attention, it is not my fault for taking advantage, nor am I going to try to figure if you are not paying attention.
I will vulch: No one forces you to up from that base, I want the base, you are not getting off the ground if I can help it.
I will run: Sorry I will not take my 190A8 and enter a turnfight with your spit16. If I run it's because I screwed up earlier, still doing it though, and still alive =D
I will HO: Absoutley! Most pilots just point towards the target and fire, I can be offcentered and give it a rudderkick, something that usually isnt expected. Additionally, depending the circumstances...totally a valid tactic. It's like a game of chicken, if you turn first I might get the advantage. (once again this is usually because I screwed up earlier)
I will bomb****: Thats how you call it. If it's red, it's dead, if you do not like it, get your squad to provide fighter cap over where you are GV'ing. If you dont have a squad, either join one or consider where you up a GV, no one forces you to afterall.
I will gang: I apologize that you flew into five of us, but that isn't my fault, pay attention! Or I am sorry we shot down four of your friends and you were left. (good for you btw) Or I'm sorry I'm flying with my squad or in a mission, but preserving your airplane is lower on the list than my teamates, and if I can help it you are not going to get a shot off.
I will (sometimes) be an alt monkey: I'm impatient, but apparently less impatient as many of you. So I will absolutely (if I don't get bored) climb to an altitude that will give me the advantage! You can do this too, it takes a bit of time and patience though. When I'm at my best, I totally follow through with Luche's Idea of flying (the Red BaronII post he did) I want my cartoon pilot to land :) (happens rarely)
I will Horde: there's nothing more fun than upping dozens of bombers for a deep raid at high alt into enemy territory. I wish there was more opposition, but that's up the the enemy, not me. I also like going up against this for what its worth (prolly nothing) Or If I want an under the Dar mission to capture a base (you'd be surprised how often these do not work)
I will camp: Don't up from a camped spawn if you do not like it! If you're offering a free kill, of course I'll take it! I would not expect anything other than that. Spawning there is your choice.
I will use my knowledge to my advantage: I will purposely make sure my Panther or Tiger or TigerII will be opposing you at longer ranges and -->Facing you<-- if I can help it. The better magnification, and armour puts the ball very much in my court. It isn't "gaming the game" it's simple math, your T34/76 is not going to penetrate my front upper/lower hull plate from 2400yrds. I know this, that's the whole point
Likewise I am going to use aircraft as I best see fit. I am not entering your low alt furball with a me262, P51, FW190, Temp, or P47. I might with a Am62, but do not expect me to enter the type of fight you want if that isn't how I'm flying.
So There's my version of honor, thats how I see things, and now everyone can see how I fly :) If you are concerned about these issues you may PM me at MK84 and ask if I'm in the area, then you will not have to question how I fly :D
P.S. I'm so going to take flak for this arnt I? :uhoh
-
I have Honor...For example Honesty :D
I will Pick: If you do not pay attention, it is not my fault for taking advantage, nor am I going to try to figure if you are not paying attention.
I will vulch: No one forces you to up from that base, I want the base, you are not getting off the ground if I can help it.
I will run: Sorry I will not take my 190A8 and enter a turnfight with your spit16. If I run it's because I screwed up earlier, still doing it though, and still alive =D
I will HO: Absoutley! Most pilots just point towards the target and fire, I can be offcentered and give it a rudderkick, something that usually isnt expected. Additionally, depending the circumstances...totally a valid tactic. It's like a game of chicken, if you turn first I might get the advantage. (once again this is usually because I screwed up earlier)
I will bomb****: Thats how you call it. If it's red, it's dead, if you do not like it, get your squad to provide fighter cap over where you are GV'ing. If you dont have a squad, either join one or consider where you up a GV, no one forces you to afterall.
I will gang: I apologize that you flew into five of us, but that isn't my fault, pay attention! Or I am sorry we shot down four of your friends and you were left. (good for you btw) Or I'm sorry I'm flying with my squad or in a mission, but preserving your airplane is lower on the list than my teamates, and if I can help it you are not going to get a shot off.
I will (sometimes) be an alt monkey: I'm impatient, but apparently less impatient as many of you. So I will absolutely (if I don't get bored) climb to an altitude that will give me the advantage! You can do this too, it takes a bit of time and patience though. When I'm at my best, I totally follow through with Luche's Idea of flying (the Red BaronII post he did) I want my cartoon pilot to land :) (happens rarely)
I will Horde: there's nothing more fun than upping dozens of bombers for a deep raid at high alt into enemy territory. I wish there was more opposition, but that's up the the enemy, not me. I also like going up against this for what its worth (prolly nothing) Or If I want an under the Dar mission to capture a base (you'd be surprised how often these do not work)
I will camp: Don't up from a camped spawn if you do not like it! If you're offering a free kill, of course I'll take it! I would not expect anything other than that. Spawning there is your choice.
I will use my knowledge to my advantage: I will purposely make sure my Panther or Tiger or TigerII will be opposing you at longer ranges and -->Facing you<-- if I can help it. The better magnification, and armour puts the ball very much in my court. It isn't "gaming the game" it's simple math, your T34/76 is not going to penetrate my front upper/lower hull plate from 2400yrds. I know this, that's the whole point
Likewise I am going to use aircraft as I best see fit. I am not entering your low alt furball with a me262, P51, FW190, Temp, or P47. I might with a Am62, but do not expect me to enter the type of fight you want if that isn't how I'm flying.
So There's my version of honor, thats how I see things, and now everyone can see how I fly :) If you are concerned about these issues you may PM me at MK84 and ask if I'm in the area, then you will not have to question how I fly :D
P.S. I'm so going to take flak for this arnt I? :uhoh
Yeah, what he said, but could be a she.
If you do not want to be killed---do not play, just observe. LOL
-
Knew I'd get Flak :noid
MK84 is a HE btw, which regardless of the truth is statistically likely :aok
Not wanting to be killed (in game) still makes sense to me (it's sorta a role-play for me) One day I might get good at it
Uhh...the not getting killed part makes sense outta game to for those that may be confused :uhoh
-
Yeah, what he said, but could be a she.
If you do not want to be killed---do not play, just observe. LOL
I thought I alluded to loving the game, I certainly made no mention of not liking it, why would I not play? I do not understand
...and why am I now a She? MK84 doesn't get all cuddly... buy me dinner first...and take me to a movie before you get all personal. ;)
-
Whilst surfinn's request seems a little unrealistic he does have a point.
A few weeks back he was in a pesky I16 and I was in my spit8. He could have dove down and picked me on three different occasions but chose to watch my first fight with tallboy's KI. It was about a minute long and he engaged when it was clear to do so. Then one after another his countrymen kept trying to jump into our fight with their lame bnz attacks, so he backed off and let me kill them one by one and then dropped in again.
I get that it is unheard of and extremely impractical but for that sortie where I would have died very quickly, his actions prolonged my enjoyment. The underlying problem is that people do not respect the enemy pilot it is just a natural human trait of self greed. The saddest part is the hypocrisy of some people who just can't accept stuff when it happens to them yet are the worst for it. After playing for 10+ years it is the people like surfinn that I will remember and return his honour in kind.
this +1 and at the same tome i agree with mk84. i guess what is really being asked for is discretion. if its a 1v1 off to the side dont ruin it for them unless asked or ask before joining. if its tank town /gv furball dont be a tool and roll a formation of lancs thru it just to ruin the fun of others.
-
Whilst surfinn's request seems a little unrealistic he does have a point.
A few weeks back he was in a pesky I16 and I was in my spit8. He could have dove down and picked me on three different occasions but chose to watch my first fight with tallboy's KI. It was about a minute long and he engaged when it was clear to do so. Then one after another his countrymen kept trying to jump into our fight with their lame bnz attacks, so he backed off and let me kill them one by one and then dropped in again.
I get that it is unheard of and extremely impractical but for that sortie where I would have died very quickly, his actions prolonged my enjoyment. The underlying problem is that people do not respect the enemy pilot it is just a natural human trait of self greed. The saddest part is the hypocrisy of some people who just can't accept stuff when it happens to them yet are the worst for it. After playing for 10+ years it is the people like surfinn that I will remember and return his honour in kind.
That kind of action is why I respect surfinn immensely.... the MA could use a lot more of that.
Look, if it's a furball, a "free for all," have at it. Jump in and have some fun, and shoot holes in every red airplane that you can get your guns on.
But if you're flying about and see a friendly engaged with a con off by themselves, by god people have some respect for both the friendly and the con by staying out unless the friendly is asking for help. Fly top cover, make sure no other cons try to mess it up, and let them fight. If there is more than one friendly on a con, just keep going. There are plenty of other bad guys out there to kill, there's no reason to zoom in and try to steal a kill away from someone who's been working trying to earn it.
It's a pipe dream, and totally unrealistic, but if everyone here just tried to remember that and live by it there'd be a lot more respect and a lot less 200 whining.
-
I laugh about the lavish usage of the word "honor" in the cartoon combat context.
vAleric said I was without honor because I masked my energy state and managed to rope him instead of the other way around. I think people twist the meaning of the word to suit their purposes at that particular time.
ack-ack
-
The most honorable people I have ever met,,, didn't talk about it,, they lived it!
-
In the end you can't control how someone else plays, only how you play the game. I don't know that honor is the correct word. I think having respect for other players is important. We all pay the same to get enjoyment from the game.
Going out of your way to ruin that for other players shows a lack of respect for them and the game in my mind. It doesn't take much to ask before diving into a fight, in particular a 1 v 1 that's developed outside of a furball. If the guy asks for help, so be it. But more often then not, they'll ask you to stay out. Just not that hard to respect that as a 1 v 1 in the MA doesn't occur that often.
Does anything go in a big furball? Absolutely. I expect the pickers to be above, that folks will faceshoot in the mob, and that there isn't time to ask much.
I think that for those that have been around a long time, you get to the point where you get to know the folks you've been fighting with and against for so long. Enjoying their company while playing is a bigger reward. I've been 'flying' for 16 years now going back to Airwarrior and I know there are folks who've been around longer then that. I don't feel like I have anything to prove in the game. I enjoy it for what it is, and I enjoy the people. Most of us old folks are history nuts too and this lets us pretend a bit now and then.
I think that anyone who sticks around long enough gets beyond the ego, points, perks, winning the war, I'm the bestest bit eventually. That doesn't mean you lose the desire to compete or to win the fight. But it does mean you put it back in perspective as to what the game is, and what is important in the end. And for me anyway, it's the friends I've made, the history shared, and the fun I've had.
The beauty of CorkyJr is after a long day in the real world, I can slip into his 38 and become 21 again, and feel invincible. I haven't died in 16 years! If only the real world were so forgiving :)
-
In the end you can't control how someone else plays, only how you play the game. I don't know that honor is the correct word. I think having respect for other players is important. We all pay the same to get enjoyment from the game.
Going out of your way to ruin that for other players shows a lack of respect for them and the game in my mind. It doesn't take much to ask before diving into a fight, in particular a 1 v 1 that's developed outside of a furball. If the guy asks for help, so be it. But more often then not, they'll ask you to stay out. Just not that hard to respect that as a 1 v 1 in the MA doesn't occur that often.
Does anything go in a big furball? Absolutely. I expect the pickers to be above, that folks will faceshoot in the mob, and that there isn't time to ask much.
I think that for those that have been around a long time, you get to the point where you get to know the folks you've been fighting with and against for so long. Enjoying their company while playing is a bigger reward. I've been 'flying' for 16 years now going back to Airwarrior and I know there are folks who've been around longer then that. I don't feel like I have anything to prove in the game. I enjoy it for what it is, and I enjoy the people. Most of us old folks are history nuts too and this lets us pretend a bit now and then.
I think that anyone who sticks around long enough gets beyond the ego, points, perks, winning the war, I'm the bestest bit eventually. That doesn't mean you lose the desire to compete or to win the fight. But it does mean you put it back in perspective as to what the game is, and what is important in the end. And for me anyway, it's the friends I've made, the history shared, and the fun I've had.
The beauty of CorkyJr is after a long day in the real world, I can slip into his 38 and become 21 again, and feel invincible. I haven't died in 16 years! If only the real world were so forgiving :)
QFT...
-
It is all about fun. The anonymity of the internet allows all sorts of characters. There are a couple dozen players that I like to see online and there's a couple dozen total tools.
But the game is fun.
As the sages of Wang Chung once said: "Everybody wang chung tonight. Everybody have fun tonight."
-
It is all about fun. The anonymity of the internet allows all sorts of characters. There are a couple dozen players that I like to see online and there's a couple dozen total tools.
But the game is fun.
As the sages of Wang Chung once said: "Everybody wang chung tonight. Everybody have fun tonight."
Yes, I believe everyone should Wang Chung right now
-
QFT...
Says "Mr. Fifth in line to dive in and gang and pick the P-40C fighting the FM2." :)
Just messing with ya, CU. :lol
But seriously, <<S>> Surfinn, wish we could have had a chance to finish any one of those several 1v1 fights we were having.
Most every single time we were away from the rest of the action, and according to surfinn he was trying to call the interloper(s) off. It just ain't gonna happen in the MA when people don't care if their countryman asks them to stay out repeatedlyand they dive in anyway to clear their 12.
Anyway, it's a good dream... however unrealistic.
:salute
-
Ya its a pipe dream but hey its worth a try :)
-
Says "Mr. Fifth in line to dive in and gang and pick the P-40C fighting the FM2." :)
Just messing with ya, CU. :lol
:salute
Yes....with a bit of background...we had been getting GROUND UP by gangers for over an hour...a fella can only take so much :rofl
EDIT: I ask every chance I get...lots of folks can verify it. If I get no answer, I assume their too busy and I will jump in. If they say no, I stay out.
-
Tops Squads :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
Most of the Top Sticks are odd :old: