Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Slade on March 31, 2012, 03:35:55 PM
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Guys,
Rather than complaining about going against hordes I think they are fun and challenging to counter against. Bruv, Joker etc. all great fellows that know how to make the most of having their respective hordes. I salute them. :salute
On the other hand, what are some techniques and tactics one can use in defending a base from a horde once it is upon you?
Thanks for sharing,
Slade
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the many horde!! just 4 of us took A4. Never had more than 6 players on all night.....
Now Joker is in a league of his own. :aok
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Bruv no worries in that instance.
The context is: In cases where you are up against a horde, what are some effective tactics and techniques against it?
Thanks again for sharing.
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The best thing to do is to up from a field in an adjacent field in a FAST and versatile aircraft. The main goal is to stay alive and hinder any bit of the vulch, town destruction, or stave off any of the inbound troop carriers. If you can arrive soon enough, the more enemy fighters you can force to drop ords or break course in hopes of evading the better.
There have been multiple times where I have been in a fast mover (P51D, F4U-4, Tempest, 190D-9, Me262) and have done just that. In the face of what seemed to be 30+ knuckledraggers, I've been able to stay fast and deprive them of some base captures because I was able to hunt down the goons long enough for others to arrive and join the fray. It is so obvious who the points
In the end, it is a lot of fun to weave in and out of all the horde-members while taking them away from their main goal (vulch, CAP base, bust up town, sneak in goons, etc), but for the life of me I can not understand the mentality of "30 vs 1 odds is fun". It is like being a bench warmer on a winning team. But, to each their own.
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Guys,
Rather than complaining about going against hordes I think they are fun and challenging to counter against. Bruv, Joker etc. all great fellows that know how to make the most of having their respective hordes. I salute them. :salute
On the other hand, what are some techniques and tactics one can use in defending a base from a horde once it is upon you?
Thanks for sharing,
Slade
Get yourself a Tempest and a quality wingman who shares your faith in the force. :cool:
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It's simple. Let's take-off and shoot down one con after another :lol
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It's been part of the game since the game. 12 hour limit on changing sides may prevent wild swings in the numbers but when one chesspiece side or the other, either by design or accident, logs on and sees it has the numbers - real estate grabbing in roll-over mode is bound to happen. It's the design of the game.
It's hordely worth dis-cussing. :cool:
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Some things I have tried with mixed success:
- Flying a CHog with ample alt from another base and zooming through the horde cloud just taking out what ever is in the way.
- Upping a turn fighter and ACK hugging.
- Getting a fast plane and going NOE to enme base being used to stage attack and taking them out as they take off. I usually come in from side opposite of my base.
- and the usual: taking out FHangers, ords etc.
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Guys,
Rather than complaining about going against hordes I think they are fun and challenging to counter against. Bruv, Joker etc. all great fellows that know how to make the most of having their respective hordes. I salute them. :salute
On the other hand, what are some techniques and tactics one can use in defending a base from a horde once it is upon you?
Thanks for sharing,
Slade
La7, its fast good guns, very good all around short range low alt fighter
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La7, its fast good guns, very good all around short range low alt fighter
Winner :aok
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Guys,
Rather than complaining about going against hordes I think they are fun and challenging to counter against. Bruv, Joker etc. all great fellows that know how to make the most of having their respective hordes. I salute them. :salute
On the other hand, what are some techniques and tactics one can use in defending a base from a horde once it is upon you?
Thanks for sharing,
Slade
Take down their closest troops and sups and then hunt for the remaining goons/M3s. :aok
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There is no counter.
Sure you can get together with a couple guys and fly for hours avoiding anyone else to pork troops or ammo along a front, but nobody wants to do that.
Maybe you could get 10 guys to cap a likely base in the hopes of being in place to stop them, better yet, you can all wait in the tower while you have a few friends run along the front as scouts to let you know where and when the horde is coming in and THEN you can launch and intercept. But again, nobody wants to tie them selves up doing that.
The only way to slow the advance is to grab a fast plane and scream around and do nothing but hunt goons.... sounds like fun don't it? :rolleyes:
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The only way to slow the advance is to grab a fast plane and scream around and do nothing but hunt goons.... sounds like fun don't it? :rolleyes:
Is, actually. :)
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How to counter a horde?
Leave the game and come back when there's a furball.
Or, depending on the map
Head over to TT and ignore everything else.
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fly with at least 2 wingmen, keep your altitude, make sure you always work as a team to eliminate any bandits that come in co-alt or higher, and basically just pick/rope/pick/rope repeat until you're out of ammo or fuel
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some very good suggestions here slade,
I always go to the source of the problem. If they have an M3 spawn with troops up your basically screwed unless you have an adjoining vehicle spawn and you can kill/slow down their troops.
If they do not have an m3 spawn any horde is beatable with the 262 hunting the goons.
If you have the luxury of a few trusted wingmen the Tempest / P51 (any other fast fighter) can try and intercept early. By early I mean before they get the chance to drop all the hangars. By taking the fight to the enemy you slow them down and occupy their forces, we did this well last night but several other rooks helped man the fort as it were, whilst we raped and pillaged.
As an individual you are pretty much powerless to stop it unless you can get one step ahead and read the map, by making educated guesses as to where they will go next you can look forward to several conversations in white text with the mission organisers ;)
Your only beaten when you resign yourself to defeat.
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fly with at least 2 wingmen, keep your altitude, make sure you always work as a team to eliminate any bandits that come in co-alt or higher, and basically just pick/rope/pick/rope repeat until you're out of ammo or fuel
This ^ like coombz suggest......... get with a couple or few wingmen/players and do not go right at the horde itself (note: unless you can get to them as they are taking off from their own field )
fly past the initial incoming gaggle and fly towards the base the horde is working out of
next set up on the outskirts of the radar circle of said enemy field and swat them down as they are grabbing alt....... keep the high ground and don't get crazy and lose your head
stay with your plan of counter attack...... they will eventually give up and move to another field
you then all can go land your lil lemming hordly scalps.......
what most do is try to take off and fly directly to the first incoming horde or large group...... not giving any thought as to alt disadvantage or what not.......... in doing so these type players get angry and come to the boards fussying about hordes....
my take on it anyways......
just have fun
TC
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slade I'm sure your version of events is different to mine but I will share my AAR so you do not think of me negatively.
We looked at the map and A5 / A219 is a bit of a dud fight. The distance is too great and the defenders at A5 have the luxury of a 5k base one grid back. Even if Rooks did get a partial cap they wouldn't have been able to seal the deal without a troop spawn.
So to liven things up and advance our "score" as you put it ;) we did a commando raid into A4 that dr7 eventually made 14 kills out of camping/defending the spawn in a panther. I was en-route in a mossie around the same time as Tilt single handedly destroyed 75% of town in his M4. I killed A4 dar and then de-acked 7 out of 8 guns in town. I took a pilot wound 1st pass but no other damage, this enabled me to get 5 kills that were trying un-successfully to bomb tilt in between black outs. A typh x2, la7x2 and stuka. The typhoon eventually HOed me to death and my pilot was going to be a goner anyway.
After chatting to some other squaddies to see if we were likely to get some troops going we found that they were porked at v218. Not to be deterred the British stiff upper lip kicked in and we took a 10 minute tea break to re-supply v218.
Meanwhile dr7 was still being a menace parked up in the spawn so I rolled a Tempest and 2x 500lbs (I did have to fly 2 grids to get there and this took another 10 minutes to get to target). Airbull, mike and cobrajet were trying to evade dr7's panther on the ground and tilt/bully managed to rush clear after dying quite a few times.
When I got there 2 sets of buffs were flying around aimlessly, popason (i think he was trying to land?) and another I didn't get the chance to kill. I ignored them and dr7 as I had to get the flag white. Dropped eggs on town then made one strafing pass that made the flag pop. Popason was within range of our m3s so I killed two of his planes to deter him and killed an la7 and typh again near the field. Troops got in and the thing all popped within about one minute of capture.
Cobrajet was getting a little hot under the collar that he didn't manage to smoke dr7 out of his nest, so I re-armed to get my eggs back but unfortunately dr7 was quick witted enough to chance a landing, as we were too far away for him not to take a death so he managed to get out ok! :joystick:
The next run we went down to A6 to start a fight/furball but the only enemy that upped were poor pilots and cptdell's tank was treated to an air show spectacular, in which he gave us a running commentary and we delivered him fireworks. Went back to A4 to land. A5 / A219 was still full dar bars and it seemed nits did not want to react so we came east. Twinboom was pretending to be an enemy plane by spraying rounds at me and giving me check 6's when I called your high hurricane in the clouds. He broke off and disappeared leaving me to fight you all alone in my Tempest.
Admittedly you saw me late (SA?) and did a lazy immelmann merge whilst slow. I went up after you and yanked it in behind. It appeared you panicked in my haste and we went around for one turning circle slow enough for me to crank out all my flaps. When you saw I was still very much behind you, you dove away whilst bunting and I broke off to find some easier targets. I can't remember whether I finished you in the ack a few minutes later or twinboom did but your comments were directed at my tempest for vulching?
You could have kept your height and out turned me, I would have been forced to dis -engage once I had lost the upper hand by stepping out of the fight this ultimately led to yours and A5 's demise. With all the other Rooks piling in and an airfield with M3's much closer to A5 it was soon lost to the horde.
This story is just another 2 hours in the life of a toon pilot. This happens every day on every country. :salute
I rarely vulch if the ack is full up at any field.
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In short If DR7 was asking for help on country and he had one or two more defenders to assist all of that wouldn't have taken place.
On paper it was roughly 5vs5 but we had to fly 2 grids to get any air support. Our 5 all knew what we set out to do even though it was planned on the fly. Only DR7 and the typh/la showed any signs of knowing what was happening. Any dallas or joker style run would be a completely different prospect to defend against.
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Knights had two sets of hordes it was "Brilliant" we had a B26 raid in our base i got six kills :x
Cr was jumping about and shouting he cleared my six i came back and rejoined and then we all ran way :x
My engine broke and i had to ditch :rofl
Bruv we love you by the way, in a manly way though :old:
:rofl
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Some of these suggestions can be highly effective.
Knowing field layouts can pay huge dividends.
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slade I'm sure your version of events is different to mine but I will share my AAR so you do not think of me negatively.
We looked at the map and A5 / A219 is a bit of a dud fight. The distance is too great and the defenders at A5 have the luxury of a 5k base one grid back. Even if Rooks did get a partial cap they wouldn't have been able to seal the deal without a troop spawn.
So to liven things up and advance our "score" as you put it ;) we did a commando raid into A4 that dr7 eventually made 14 kills out of camping/defending the spawn in a panther. I was en-route in a mossie around the same time as Tilt single handedly destroyed 75% of town in his M4. I killed A4 dar and then de-acked 7 out of 8 guns in town. I took a pilot wound 1st pass but no other damage, this enabled me to get 5 kills that were trying un-successfully to bomb tilt in between black outs. A typh x2, la7x2 and stuka. The typhoon eventually HOed me to death and my pilot was going to be a goner anyway.
After chatting to some other squaddies to see if we were likely to get some troops going we found that they were porked at v218. Not to be deterred the British stiff upper lip kicked in and we took a 10 minute tea break to re-supply v218.
Meanwhile dr7 was still being a menace parked up in the spawn so I rolled a Tempest and 2x 500lbs (I did have to fly 2 grids to get there and this took another 10 minutes to get to target). Airbull, mike and cobrajet were trying to evade dr7's panther on the ground and tilt/bully managed to rush clear after dying quite a few times.
When I got there 2 sets of buffs were flying around aimlessly, popason (i think he was trying to land?) and another I didn't get the chance to kill. I ignored them and dr7 as I had to get the flag white. Dropped eggs on town then made one strafing pass that made the flag pop. Popason was within range of our m3s so I killed two of his planes to deter him and killed an la7 and typh again near the field. Troops got in and the thing all popped within about one minute of capture.
Cobrajet was getting a little hot under the collar that he didn't manage to smoke dr7 out of his nest, so I re-armed to get my eggs back but unfortunately dr7 was quick witted enough to chance a landing, as we were too far away for him not to take a death so he managed to get out ok! :joystick:
The next run we went down to A6 to start a fight/furball but the only enemy that upped were poor pilots and cptdell's tank was treated to an air show spectacular, in which he gave us a running commentary and we delivered him fireworks. Went back to A4 to land. A5 / A219 was still full dar bars and it seemed nits did not want to react so we came east. Twinboom was pretending to be an enemy plane by spraying rounds at me and giving me check 6's when I called your high hurricane in the clouds. He broke off and disappeared leaving me to fight you all alone in my Tempest.
Admittedly you saw me late (SA?) and did a lazy immelmann merge whilst slow. I went up after you and yanked it in behind. It appeared you panicked in my haste and we went around for one turning circle slow enough for me to crank out all my flaps. When you saw I was still very much behind you, you dove away whilst bunting and I broke off to find some easier targets. I can't remember whether I finished you in the ack a few minutes later or twinboom did but your comments were directed at my tempest for vulching?
You could have kept your height and out turned me, I would have been forced to dis -engage once I had lost the upper hand by stepping out of the fight this ultimately led to yours and A5 's demise. With all the other Rooks piling in and an airfield with M3's much closer to A5 it was soon lost to the horde.
This story is just another 2 hours in the life of a toon pilot. This happens every day on every country. :salute
I rarely vulch if the ack is full up at any field.
:O Another intriguing chapter in the storybook of my bestest FPH. Such drama, action, intelligence and prowess! Thank you for allowing me to enjoy this adventure with you! Reading short stories like this is most enjoyable.
:old: To all the kids out there..... ---> reading <--- is fun and educational. Read more..... Read more indeed.
:salute Bruv119 :rock ..... :rock indeed.
Edit: Did I mention teamwork? The success of The Few's teamwork vs opposing enemy's just again shows why The Few is the BEST squad in Aces High on my scale. The best indeed. :rock :rock :rock :salute
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Bruv nice posts.
Again, this was something I have wanted feedback on for a while. It was not spawned by my very feeble attempts to down your Tempest at the event and time you are referring to. Sorry for my comments on 200.
Thanks for sharing the detail of how you examine the map strategically. Sometimes I look at a map and if a base is not under attack yet I think "where would I attack if I were them". Country channel speculation also streams.
Rock on! :salute
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apology accepted.
I do grow tired of people attacking me for no warranted reason maybe it is all Midway's fault for alienating the masses (A bridge too far?).
I would hate to turn 200 off but if it is effecting me then I will do the same thing as I advise others to do if they feel the same way and that is to switch it off.
To get one step ahead you have to put yourself in their shoes, I can read dallas like an open book when he gets going and we have some good banter with it. Usually consisting of telling me to go back to school :lol.
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apology accepted.
I do grow tired of people attacking me for no warranted reason maybe it is all Midway's fault for alienating the masses (A bridge too far?).
I would hate to turn 200 off but if it is effecting me then I will do the same thing as I advise others to do if they feel the same way and that is to switch it off.
To get one step ahead you have to put yourself in their shoes, I can read dallas like an open book when he gets going and we have some good banter with it. Usually consisting of telling me to go back to school :lol.
It must be tough being among AH gods, people always trying to challenge the awesomeness of your skills. But I'm sure the rewards are worth the challenges. May I be among you in the distant future.... May I be among you indeed. :cheers: :pray :salute
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:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl Dang Middy, you got some mad sucktion to be locked on to that ankle! :salute :salute :salute
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Pair of 262's work quite fine if there are no M3s available.
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Did a 262 run with the Top Gun guys here yesterday for some base defense. Due to numbers, eventually two bases fell... but not before we racked up 43 Kills landed between 4 pilots with another 15 or so kills ditched out due to damage. It was a ton of fun, and you have to admire the people who kept upping goons in the face of such opposition. :devil :joystick:
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apology accepted.
I do grow tired of people attacking me for no warranted reason maybe it is all Midway's fault for alienating the masses (A bridge too far?).
I would hate to turn 200 off but if it is effecting me then I will do the same thing as I advise others to do if they feel the same way and that is to switch it off.
To get one step ahead you have to put yourself in their shoes, I can read dallas like an open book when he gets going and we have some good banter with it. Usually consisting of telling me to go back to school :lol.
Channel 200 :rofl
I have never attacked you ! even though i have every reason to :rofl
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Here's another gem that seems to be effective. Convergence = 600 (all guns). In this way I have been able to zoom into the horde, lead a plane far in advance while maintaining speed and sometimes they fly into the wall of ugly. Key point here is that I can maintain speed better not having to get in close and loose E to turns and the like.
I successfully implemented this technique in P-47, F4Us and F6's but I imagine P-51d should be find too.
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Guys,
Rather than complaining about going against hordes I think they are fun and challenging to counter against. Bruv, Joker etc. all great fellows that know how to make the most of having their respective hordes. I salute them. :salute
On the other hand, what are some techniques and tactics one can use in defending a base from a horde once it is upon you?
Thanks for sharing,
Slade
Personally, I have loads of fun flying against the hordes...
But, to be honest, I make no effort to "counter" them, or to defend bases from them (although it probably appears that I am).
I'm simply out to shoot down as many of them as I can, and do my best to live and to land my kills. If I can do that, I'm generally having a great time. I seek out situations like this.
The way I handle them is like this... I lift the best plane in the game (F4U-1A, or maybe an F4U-4) and head out to the swarm. I lift from a base that's not under attack, climb on my way to the base being attacked, and level out to head in at 10-12k. Once on the scene, I "hunt" perpendicularly to the flow of traffic, and skirt the edges looking for stragglers. If a base is being attacked from the south, I'm going to make sure I do my fighting in an east/west manner, so that I'm not likely to get dragged into a swarm.
Ideally, I move in, get the attention of a "red" pilot or two, and get them to follow me to one side or the other. Once I'm out of icon range of the main thoroughfare I kill the guys chasing me. Rinse, wash, repeat.
Variations of this strategy will find me loitering near the outskirts of their base, or the one my country is defending. I'll also shift altitudes based on what the opposing team is doing, number of planes, etc. I don't like to be too much lower or higher than them, because it detracts from my ability to draw singles, doubles, or triples away from the swarm. If you look like you have control of the sky, they won't follow you... If you look too vulnerable, you'll probably have 15-20 of them on you at the same time...
I find it works best to be 1000-2000 feet below them, move into icon range just far enough to lure an attacker or two, and then move back out of icon range.
I don't fly with a wingman, and if I do, I don't actually fight with one as a "team".
What does work well though is to have a partner who flies near you, and allows you to fight on your own (without his assistance). If I'm fighting, his job is to stay between me and the swarm, and head off anyone who tries to come out and help my opponent. I'll generally "switch off" with a partner like this... I protect his fight, and then he protects mine. We'll let each other die in a fight like this; that's ok, because the fights are "fair" 1v1's. In a 1v2 or more, it's ok for the partner to join in. The "partner" scenario works very well from an SA point of view as well. We're constantly updating each other on what's going on around us, or which compass direction the "fighter" should try to drag the fight (i.e. "you guys are getting to close to the main stream of traffic; you'd better shift your fight to the east a bit...). Flying like this is tough, because you aren't just reacting to your opponent if you're also trying to drift the fight in one direction or another.
Fights against the swarm are some of the best the game has to offer, IMO. I can almost always shift from one 1v1 or 1v2 to another, until my gas and ammo are depleted. I then rtb, and do it again. Some nights are tougher, to be sure, but I certainly cannot complain that I can't find any fights, or 1v1's, or whatever, because I just go out and make them happen...
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Usually the horde is pretty fun to fly against...a lot of times the whole gaggle is nothing but sheep. This weekend, however, the sheep pen had a lot of goats in it. I had some pretty good success at times but seems like when I'd start to really feeling my oats, some of the mean sticks would be on my arse and it was dodge, dodge, :joystick: dodge :airplane: dodge, scramble to base and flop on the runway.
Bruv and his guys were ruining my horde hunting :eek:
<edit> I've always flown Knight...you have to learn anti horde tactics as a knight or you dont get to have much fun hehe.
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Here's another gem that seems to be effective. Convergence = 600 (all guns). In this way I have been able to zoom into the horde, lead a plane far in advance while maintaining speed and sometimes they fly into the wall of ugly. Key point here is that I can maintain speed better not having to get in close and loose E to turns and the like.
I successfully implemented this technique in P-47, F4Us and F6's but I imagine P-51d should be find too.
Convergeance settings take into account bullet drop so I think you'd just have to lead the same distance, wouldntja?
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I also noticed that in many horde base onslaughts there is a finite set of pilots whose entire focus seems to be the art of the horde-base-vulch. In the past I have been a victim to it my fair share for sure. The basic tactic of these type flyers seems to be:
1. Fly a plane that can dive like a rock.
2. Come in higher than everyone one else.
3. Peck'm off.
4. Repeat.
Alas! I have had great success against them this month so far by:
1. Fly a plane that can dive like a rock.
2. Come in higher than the vulchers (come in from another base to obtain ideal altitude).
3. Peck'm off.
4. Repeat.
i.e. beating them at their own game. ;-) Woohoo!
Keeping my alt and speed up helps too.
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I also noticed that in many horde base onslaughts there is a finite set of pilots whose entire focus seems to be the art of the horde-base-vulch. In the past I have been a victim to it my fair share for sure. The basic tactic of these type flyers seems to be:
1. Fly a plane that can dive like a rock.
2. Come in higher than everyone one else.
3. Peck'm off.
4. Repeat.
Alas! I have had great success against them this month so far by:
1. Fly a plane that can dive like a rock.
2. Come in higher than the vulchers (come in from another base to obtain ideal altitude).
3. Peck'm off.
4. Repeat.
i.e. beating them at their own game. ;-) Woohoo!
Keeping my alt and speed up helps too.
That's one of the things I do as well. I like to feed off the guys that are BnZing the green guys from on high. I think of it as a public service. I'm willing to climb to the altitudes they are not. :D
Wiley.
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La7, its fast good guns, very good all around short range low alt fighter
Is it going to help you 30 on 1 though, thats the senario.