Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: TDeacon on April 19, 2012, 03:47:34 PM
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In order to make it harder for people with single accounts to use the film viewer as a reconnaissance mechanism, I would like to see the AH client maintain control of all film files created during that session, until the client exits. After exiting, a player could still open them on the same or on another machine, but at least there would be a significant delay before they could use the information in the films (login, re-transit to the battle, etc.).
This is a quick-and-dirty idea, so I may have overlooked something here, but in principle the idea would seem to have merit.
MH
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I'm pretty sure thats the way it is. You can't open the film viewer while the game is loaded.
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And BOING! Yet another wish granted!
You cannot open the film viewer, while the game is running.
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And BOING! Yet another wish granted!
You cannot open the film viewer, while the game is running.
(http://i499.photobucket.com/albums/rr355/swatpeace/skuzzywish1.jpg)
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If I tell you how "they" get around this will you delete my post? :(
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IMO that request smells of 100% paranoia and "OMG! SPIEZ!" type reactions. The only way this is a problem is if you're set up in a permanent spawn camp type situation -- in which case shame on you and you deserve to be hunted down!
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IMO that request smells of 100% paranoia and "OMG! SPIEZ!" type reactions. The only way this is a problem is if you're set up in a permanent spawn camp type situation -- in which case shame on you and you deserve to be hunted down!
Or you do this just ditch the plane & walk away.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,331728.0.html
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IMO that request smells of 100% paranoia and "OMG! SPIEZ!" type reactions. The only way this is a problem is if you're set up in a permanent spawn camp type situation -- in which case shame on you and you deserve to be hunted down!
There are other issues too!!! People are paranoid that other are ditching their planes inside radar rings to make them flash so that other waste their time hunting for them instead of the attack which is surely going to be hitting someplace soon.
Why that is such a big problem I can't really see, but to some it is. Of course some might see using the film viewer as a "chxxt" to locate the "ditcher" as a bigger problem too.
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Campers... paranoid score potatos... mudhens looking for the tank outside of base-flashing range... the list goes on.
You shouldnt limit your viewpoint like that. Really.
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And BOING! Yet another wish granted!
You cannot open the film viewer, while the game is running.
You guys are forgetting about LANs. You can have a second computer running the film viewer. So it's back on the table.
BTW, this is a GV-specific issue, due to their relative immobility. Some of the trolls apparently don't realize this, as they don't GV.
MH
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You guys are forgetting about LANs. You can have a second computer running the film viewer. So it's back on the table.
BTW, this is a GV-specific issue, due to their relative immobility. Some of the trolls apparently don't realize this, as they don't GV.
MH
This has been bought up before.
I would say if it could be fixed it would have been.
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This has been bought up before.
I would say if it could be fixed it would have been.
Leave the film files open after writing to them. When the AH client shuts down, close them all.
MH
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I like to watch netflix while playing ah, so a big no to the wish.
semp
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Leave the film files open after writing to them. When the AH client shuts down, close them all.
MH
That could lead to a lot of film files being open at once on one AH client.
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IMO that request smells of 100% paranoia and "OMG! SPIEZ!" type reactions. The only way this is a problem is if you're set up in a permanent spawn camp type situation -- in which case shame on you and you deserve to be hunted down!
This.
You guys are forgetting about LANs. You can have a second computer running the film viewer. So it's back on the table.
BTW, this is a GV-specific issue, due to their relative immobility. Some of the trolls apparently don't realize this, as they don't GV.
MH
See Krusty's quote above. :bhead
I bet you quit playing baseball when you got too old to play tee-ball.
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You guys are forgetting about LANs. You can have a second computer running the film viewer. So it's back on the table. BTW, this is a GV-specific issue, due to their relative immobility. Some of the trolls apparently don't realize this, as they don't GV.
You don't even need a LAN, just the ability to create a virtual machine. (i'll say no more) ...
:angel:
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This.
See Krusty's quote above. :bhead
I bet you quit playing baseball when you got too old to play tee-ball.
Krusty’s quotes are a reflection of Krusty’s personality, and I’ve learned to ignore them. They typically involve jumping to conclusions in an area where he has little experience, followed by off-the-wall overreactions. I guess I'll add you to the list.
MH
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You don't even need a LAN, just the ability to create a virtual machine. (i'll say no more) ...
:angel:
Hmmm; I didn't think of that...
MH
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That could lead to a lot of film files being open at once on one AH client.
True; but I don't see why that should be an issue. I'm not a Windows programmer, but I would think that the system load would be similar whether they are open or closed. How many films does the typical player make each day? The only issue I could see would be that if the client didn't shut down normally, those particular films would be lost. That shouldn't happen very frequently.
MH
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If it can be done... it will be done, and there's no way to stop it.
Even on a game people want to build themselves a prison of laws and statutes rather than have any common sense or moral character. :furious :old:
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If it was seen as a real problem the films could be stored online and only available after a certain amount of time goes by. HTC has taken reasonable care to see that this sort of thing doesnt happen and yet someone found a way around it and got vocal about it on 200 and now we have it out there. This is not the first time it has been brought up and wont be the last. :bhead
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HTC has taken reasonable care to see that this sort of thing doesnt happen and yet someone found a way around it and got vocal about it on 200 and now we have it out there. This is not the first time it has been brought up and wont be the last.
Probably not ... I do agree a REASONABLE attempt has been made to keep people from backdooring intelligence with films ... But there are just TOO MANY players who aren't "Reasonable." the ONLY way to prevent them from exploiting EVERY advantage they can discover or concoct is to call what they do, what it is, and get rid of them ... That's not happening. (I'll say no more)
:salute
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If it can be done... it will be done, and there's no way to stop it.
Agreed ... So you just cast the doers into outer darkness ... Lots of precedent and a really great recommendation are available for this technique! (i'll say no more) ...
:devil
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Krusty’s quotes are a reflection of Krusty’s personality, and I’ve learned to ignore them. They typically involve jumping to conclusions in an area where he has little experience, followed by off-the-wall overreactions. I guess I'll add you to the list.
MH
OK then, why dont you tell me what prompted you to make this complaint in the first place. I dont see how sombody watching their last sortie on film would help with anything except find a spawn camper. And because you came to the Bbs to make such an nitpick of a wish I figured you are pissed that sombody killed you in what you figured was a great position hide. If you call that "jumping to colclusions" so be it.
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OK then, why dont you tell me what prompted you to make this complaint in the first place. I dont see how sombody watching their last sortie on film would help with anything except find a spawn camper. And because you came to the Bbs to make such an nitpick of a wish I figured you are pissed that sombody killed you in what you figured was a great position hide. If you call that "jumping to colclusions" so be it.
OK, in the first place, it’s not a “complaint”, it’s a “wish”, posted in the appropriate section of the Forums, via a reasonably-toned presentation. Use of the first term carries disparaging overtones; the second doesn’t.
Secondly, the “wish” was motivated by my desire to point out a design oversight and improve the game. What HTC does with it is up to them, but I at least want to make clear that it is a real exploit using a LAN. Obviously, they do care to some degree, or they wouldn’t have disabled the film viewer when the AH client is running.
Thirdly, you have, without any evidence, concluded that “you are pissed that someone killed you”, and that this motivated my post. This is the definition of jumping to conclusions. BTW, all of this is pretty obvious.
P.S.: Since you may not GV much, you might ask why might this matter to GVers? True that it’s just a silly game. However, in the context of the silly game, it matters because the “hide-and-seek” element of GVing is a major game element, and if you can’t do that, then its just 2 lines of GVs shooting at each other. To give a specific example, in a subsequent Tiger II sortie in the same area, I find from a different film after “landing” that 2 Bishops had run along the ridge to the left, and come down in our rear, presumably hoping to kill one of the 2 Tigers we had there. In fact, they may have done so, as I had stopped that film at a point where one of their vehicles was closing in on a Tiger I, and had reached a point about 100 feet behind it. Had I or the other guy used this exploit, we could have ruined their effort.
MH
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OK, in the first place, it’s not a “complaint”, it’s a “wish”, posted in the appropriate section of the Forums, via a reasonably-toned presentation. Use of the first term carries disparaging overtones; the second doesn’t.
Fair enough.
Secondly, the “wish” was motivated by my desire to point out a design oversight and improve the game. What HTC does with it is up to them, but I at least want to make clear that it is a real exploit using a LAN. Obviously, they do care to some degree, or they wouldn’t have disabled the film viewer when the AH client is running.
You assume that is the reason for doing so.
Thirdly, you have, without any evidence, concluded that “you are pissed that someone killed you”, and that this motivated my post. This is the definition of jumping to conclusions. BTW, all of this is pretty obvious.
Lets face it, 99% of "fix this bug/exploit" wishes get posted shortly after somebody feels said bug/exploit was the reason they died, especially if in a perk vehicle.
P.S.: Since you may not GV much - I don't, you might ask why might this matter to GVers? True that it’s just a silly game. However, in the context of the silly game, it matters because the “hide-and-seek” - read as "spawn camp" element of GVing is a major game element - hence why I don't GV much, and if you can’t do that, then its just 2 lines of GVs shooting at each other - god forbid both sides actually fight each other . To give a specific example, in a subsequent Tiger II - mostly used in spawn camping sortie in the same area, I find from a different film after “landing” - should I read that as "got flanked and killed"? that 2 Bishops had run along the ridge to the left, and come down in our rear, presumably hoping to kill one of the 2 Tigers we had there. In fact, they may have done so, as I had stopped that film at a point where one of their vehicles was closing in on a Tiger I, and had reached a point about 100 feet behind it. Had I or the other guy used this exploit, we could have ruined their effort. - Maybe you should have. If your going to close out the game and watch the film anyway to figure out what the enemy is up to, why wait? Aparently SA and communication don't do the trick anymore.
MH
see red text.
Sorry, but this seems like a problem only for GVers who spawn camp.
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Due to the fact that HTC requests that we do not describe methods like this any further discussion is really pointless. Just bear in mind that creative individuals have found away to exploit this outside of Gvs and without ending sortie. I wont say anything else about it. Knowing HTCs intent by blocking the film viewer from running whilst the game is running and then going around it in this way should tell you something. Years ago I was talking to lyric about this very thing and I mentioned that I realized why the film viewer doesnt show field gunners. That led to this discussion. Soon we had a list of names that we knew were using the exploit. Its fairly easy to test users that way. And though it has been brought up there doesnt seem to be a way to fix it outside of heavier network loads and more warp and lag. Maybe Hitech is more clever than we are and comes up with something some day.
Enough said.
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SMERT SHPIONEM !!!! :huh
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Due to the fact that HTC requests that we do not describe methods like this any further discussion is really pointless. Just bear in mind that creative individuals have found away to exploit this outside of Gvs and without ending sortie. I wont say anything else about it. Knowing HTCs intent by blocking the film viewer from running whilst the game is running and then going around it in this way should tell you something. Years ago I was talking to lyric about this very thing and I mentioned that I realized why the film viewer doesnt show field gunners. That led to this discussion. Soon we had a list of names that we knew were using the exploit. Its fairly easy to test users that way. And though it has been brought up there doesnt seem to be a way to fix it outside of heavier network loads and more warp and lag. Maybe Hitech is more clever than we are and comes up with something some day.
Enough said.
You need to read my post more carefully. I did not use the exploit myself. I realized that the exploit could be used, and reported it. At the time I reported it, I actually didn’t know that the film viewer wouldn’t run at the same time as the client. I reported it publicly, because it wasn’t obviously cheating, but was something which I thought should not be allowed, and which I thought they might agree with me on. So I am clean on this one; what’s with the negative waves??
With respect to the solution, you are ignoring my suggested solution (off the top of the head; I’m sure I could think of others) with respect to locking the film files until exit.
MH
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see red text.
Sorry, but this seems like a problem only for GVers who spawn camp.
Here you go again (sigh).
1) If you look at the *&@#$I!! film, you will see that no Knights (the side I was on) were spawn camping. FYI, spawn camping is positioning your GV within firing range of a spawn point.
2) "Hide and seek" refers to GV movement over the terrain in an attempt to gain position over the opposing GVs, which is what the 2 Bishops in my anecdote were doing. It is exactly analogous to the ACM maneuvering, but done over a larger area, and requires the use of cover. It requires the cover to be effective, so “God mode” film viewer usage ruins it.
3) Given the previous point, it should be clear to you that 2 lines of GVs shooting at each other (your quote is “God forbid two sides actually fight each other”) is analogous to 2 planes on the runway shooting at each other (no maneuvering), and hence is less interesting as a game.
4) “Landing” meant safe landing; I haven’t lost any Tiger IIs yet. Responding to your other distortions is probably a waste of time, as they don’t even make sense in the context of your post. However, it is particularly irrational to criticize me for posting a request to remove an exploit, and at the same time criticize me for failing to use that exploit myself.
In conclusion, I fail to see why you are posting in this thread at all. Your previous comments make it clear that you know little about AH GV usage, and appear to harbor resentment towards those who do. Exploring why that is would be interesting. Are you concerned about resource diversion towards an unwonted (for you) element of the game?
MH
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Leave the film files open after writing to them. When the AH client shuts down, close them all.
MH
Another wish granted long ago.
HiTech
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Another wish granted long ago.
HiTech
Excellent. That's probably what Skuzzy should have said in his initial response. And I should probably tested this more carefully before posting the wish; I thought I had, but just now did so again, and it works as HT says.
MH
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You need to read my post more carefully. I did not use the exploit myself. I realized that the exploit could be used, and reported it. At the time I reported it, I actually didn’t know that the film viewer wouldn’t run at the same time as the client. I reported it publicly, because it wasn’t obviously cheating, but was something which I thought should not be allowed, and which I thought they might agree with me on. So I am clean on this one; what’s with the negative waves??
With respect to the solution, you are ignoring my suggested solution (off the top of the head; I’m sure I could think of others) with respect to locking the film files until exit.
MH
so you posted a solution to a problem that didnt exist, then criticize others for not being more careful in their analysis. . that is funny.
semp
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You need to read my post more carefully. I did not use the exploit myself. I realized that the exploit could be used, and reported it. At the time I reported it, I actually didn’t know that the film viewer wouldn’t run at the same time as the client. I reported it publicly, because it wasn’t obviously cheating, but was something which I thought should not be allowed, and which I thought they might agree with me on. So I am clean on this one; what’s with the negative waves??
With respect to the solution, you are ignoring my suggested solution (off the top of the head; I’m sure I could think of others) with respect to locking the film files until exit.
I wasnt accusing you. Like Hitech said he cured that problem and the new exploit circumvents the fix.
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so you posted a solution to a problem that didnt exist, then criticize others for not being more careful in their analysis. . that is funny.
semp
Yes, I should have tested the alleged exploit more carefully first; my error. :o
However, I don't think I criticized anyone for performing careless analysis of the exploit. Instead, I criticized directly or indirectly a couple of posters for collateral statements in connection with the main issue, and that criticism was valid.
MH
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I wasnt accusing you. Like Hitech said he cured that problem and the new exploit circumvents the fix.
Yes, but the thing I reported apparently isn't a new exploit. It's instead one of the exploits that they already dealt with. Whatever you are referring to beyond this ("the new exploit") is not something that I am aware of.
MH
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Yes, I should have tested the alleged exploit more carefully first; my error. :o
However, I don't think I criticized anyone for performing careless analysis of the exploit. Instead, I criticized directly or indirectly a couple of posters for collateral statements in connection with the main issue, and that criticism was valid.
MH
well perhaps pay a little attention to what challenge said. any allegations of cheating or discussions of cheating will get you suspended or banned. if you discover any other "exploit" perhaps you should send it directly to ah instead of posting in here.
semp
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well perhaps pay a little attention to what challenge said. any allegations of cheating or discussions of cheating will get you suspended or banned. if you discover any other "exploit" perhaps you should send it directly to ah instead of posting in here.
semp
You *do* have a reading comprehension issue don't you...
MH
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You *do* have a reading comprehension issue don't you...
MH
I. can see you do.
semp
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now, now, let's not get all pesonal, mmmkay? :old:
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no it's the fact that tdeacon gets too defensive sometimes. like challenge mentioned before you allegations of cheating arent allowed or even discussions on how to cheat. then tdeacon became defensive saying he never used. he seems to have misunderstood the term that you cannot bring up allegations or discussion on how to cheat in the game that in itself can get you banned or suspended.
it turns out the allegation he made was fixed many years ago. but he still gets defensive instead of just acknowledging that he made a mistake which he did but he cant let it die. as he mentioned it here.
Yes, but the thing I reported apparently isn't a new exploit. It's instead one of the exploits that they already dealt with. Whatever you are referring to beyond this ("the new exploit") is not something that I am aware of.
MH
see he misunderstands that he cannot discuss or make allegations of cheating on the bulletin boards at all. any problems just send the film or give htc a call.
semp
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Woooo!!! lets all hack our front ends to make it see what we want it to see!!
Wait, thats been fixed; but does it carry over to the forums? :D
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None of this has any effect on the "1) Go to flashing base. 2) Up a Storch or whatever. 3) Make a short film. 4) End sortie. 5) Save film. 6) Exit game. 7) Locate enemy by viewing the film. 8) Launch Game. 9) Kill enemy." method and there is nothing HTC can do about that so long as they have the film viewer.
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In order to make it harder for people with single accounts to use the film viewer as a reconnaissance mechanism, I would like to see the AH client maintain control of all film files created during that session, until the client exits. After exiting, a player could still open them on the same or on another machine, but at least there would be a significant delay before they could use the information in the films (login, re-transit to the battle, etc.).
This is a quick-and-dirty idea, so I may have overlooked something here, but in principle the idea would seem to have merit.
MH
Another whine has been recorded.
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None of this has any effect on the "1) Go to flashing base. 2) Up a Storch or whatever. 3) Make a short film. 4) End sortie. 5) Save film. 6) Exit game. 7) Locate enemy by viewing the film. 8) Launch Game. 9) Kill enemy." method and there is nothing HTC can do about that so long as they have the film viewer.
but the real question how many people would bother to do that?
semp
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but the real question how many people would bother to do that?
semp
more than those that switch sides for easy perk points :noid
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more than those that switch sides for easy perk points :noid
all you have to do is look at the numbers and see the fluctuation and see that more often than not the winning side had an influx of players that just logged while the other two sides I guess they decided to give up and log for the day.
semp
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but the real question how many people would bother to do that?
semp
the real question is why would someone be hiding to begin with, and the 2nd real question is who would care enough to find him?
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but the real question how many people would bother to do that?
semp
Given the whopping two to five minutes needed, quite a few if it allowed one to not waste time looking for that ditched P-38 that is causing the base to flashing.
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If there 10K within the tower you don't even need to up a plane to find them.
Just roll tape.
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Given the whopping two to five minutes needed, quite a few if it allowed one to not waste time looking for that ditched P-38 that is causing the base to flashing.
the real question is why would someone be hiding to begin with, and the 2nd real question is who would care enough to find him?
my question was more towards how often does it happen. the only time i have done it was when a base was flashing for over 30 minutes. i lfew around and found some guy who probably fell asleep and crash to make it flash. now the second time i checked was to figure out how the in the heck the vtards captured a base when i was 5k and saw no goons. in looking at the film, i had been looking around for a goon for well over 30 minutes when it turns out they had brought 2 lvts and drove them for over 40 minutes and captured the base.
ever since then when i see a base flash I'll look around but sure as hell not gonna log off and look at the film. some may, me I would rather spend my time hoing and vulching :).
semp
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no it's the fact that tdeacon gets too defensive sometimes. like challenge mentioned before you allegations of cheating arent allowed or even discussions on how to cheat. then tdeacon became defensive saying he never used. he seems to have misunderstood the term that you cannot bring up allegations or discussion on how to cheat in the game that in itself can get you banned or suspended.
it turns out the allegation he made was fixed many years ago. but he still gets defensive instead of just acknowledging that he made a mistake which he did but he cant let it die. as he mentioned it here.
see he misunderstands that he cannot discuss or make allegations of cheating on the bulletin boards at all. any problems just send the film or give htc a call.
semp
Semp,
The point you are missing here is that I was not complaining about cheating in this thread. I had no reason to believe that anyone was doing this, and I was not posting in response to a trivial online “death”. All I was doing is posting a suggestion for game improvement in “Wishlist”. When you and others assume that I was complaining/whining about cheating, and then reprove me for making cheating complaints in the forums (which you correctly point out is not allowed), I object.
On the single occasion when I reported strange gameplay to HTC, I did so via a private email to HTC, which was dealt with offline. This was several years ago. So I know the drill.
True that my response is defensive, but I don’t like be reprimanded in public for things I didn’t do. If I say nothing, then the misstatements become accepted as fact and my Forum reputation (such as it is) is damaged.
This should be comprehensible to you, if you step back and look at the OP.
MH
(EDIT: To illustrate my first sentence, go back over the thread and read just my posts. Should be easy to do because of my pink-colored avatar.)
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In order to make it harder for people with single accounts to use the film viewer as a reconnaissance mechanism, I would like to see the AH client maintain control of all film files created during that session, until the client exits. After exiting, a player could still open them on the same or on another machine, but at least there would be a significant delay before they could use the information in the films (login, re-transit to the battle, etc.).
This is a quick-and-dirty idea, so I may have overlooked something here, but in principle the idea would seem to have merit.
MH
here in this sentence you implied that people used it. you dont actually say it but you clearly implied it. when it was brought up to your attention that allegations arent allowed then you got defensive. not only that even after you found out that it couldnt be done. you kept being defensive about why you posted your ideas. you should've just let it die.
not only that but you kept insulting others with your "reading comprehension" insults when the obvious that you had been wrong was brought up to your attention.
but you like to get defensive and keep arguing a point that everybody else can see is not the correct one except you. and here we are on page two, where you still arguing and basically ruining your own "forum reputation" without the help of anybody.
sometimes the bast answer is not to answer. :salute :bolt:
semp
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here in this sentence you implied that people used it. you dont actually say it but you clearly implied it.
I implied that someone *could* use it; not that they were. This thread started out as equivalent to Fester's thread "Sound bug on GV Engines" posted in the Bug Reports Forum. Both were/are intended to improve the game, and not to make accusations.
As far as the rest of this back-and-forth goes, I started out with a friendly, reasonable thread, and Forum trolls like yourself insisted on turning it negative and personal. I ignored it initially (see my first 3 posts) but eventually responded, as ignoring doesn't seem to work with you guys. Next time you post to someone else's thread, I suggest you think before you do this, but doubt that you will.
(NOTE to Skuzzy; it you want to delete or lock this thread, I certainly would have no objections).
MH
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see there you go again. instead of just letting it die you keep defending your post which was wrong to beging with.
I got a question for you how can you "improve the game" by proposing to include things that are already in the game.
and for your information this is not your thread. and when you post a thread in here be ready for people to quickly point out if you are wrong or not. and stop with the name calling it only makes you look silly.
semp