Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Nugget on April 21, 2012, 04:18:48 PM
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despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players. so to help ease them into the game, i'm wondering if ah has ever had, or would consider having, a "beginners arena"? i'm not asking ah to dumb down the game, just a place where beginners can learn the ropes for the first few months.
let's face it, combat flight sims have probably the steepest learning curve of any game genres out there. so when you put newbies in the same arena as people who've been "flying" for a decade, it gets ugly and not so much fun for the noobs. the new guys can go to the training arena all they want, but the fact is they just don't have the skills yet to be effective. in air warrior, that wasn't so much of a problem because you had a constant and large influx of new guys so proportionally, you stood a good chance of meeting someone of similar skills in the sky. in ah, my guess is the influx of new people is probably a trickle. so for a noob like me, i'm probably flying with mostly vets. while i like combat flight sims, i might not stick around too much longer because it's just not that fun getting waxed while i'm just trying not to stall.
with the introduction of world of warplanes, there'll probably be a resurgence of people interested in combat flight sims. if wowp is anything like wot, emphasis on arcade rather than realism, i'm sure quite a few of those people would get bored and graduate up to ah. i hope ah finds a way to attract them.
p.s. i posted in the help forum, too, but not sure which is more appropriate.
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what name do you fly under?
look me up if you ever see me on (I fly under the name Fester) and I will fly as your wingman and keep your tail clear as best I can.
don't worry about getting frustrated.
I've been playing since 1999. can get high rank without even making an effort and this game still frustrates the heck out of me.
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let me rephrase my point... lol
you will never become less frustrated in Aces High no matter how good you get at it. The only thing that changes is what frustrates you.
you will graduate from getting frustrated at never getting a kill. then you get better and get frustrated at only getting a kill once in a whle. then you get even better and you get frustrated when not getting multiple kills or dying while getting multiple kills.
the human condition and perception of misery has no equal in making things frustrating.
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The idea of a beginners Arena has been tried in the past and usually ends up bleeding the new lads out of the main arena and splitting the community in very bad ways.
My (Stolen) Idea of having "Host" squads, which sign up for a system (obviously after some sort of HTC clearance) and are given the 2 weekers automatically is a great way of counteracting the problems most people will have when joining and/or new.
Post your opinion on it here: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,332341.0.html
Kthnx bai.
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let me rephrase my point... lol
you will never become less frustrated in Aces High no matter how good you get at it. The only thing that changes is what frustrates you.
you will graduate from getting frustrated at never getting a kill. then you get better and get frustrated at only getting a kill once in a whle. then you get even better and you get frustrated when not getting multiple kills or dying while getting multiple kills.
the human condition and perception of misery has no equal in making things frustrating.
well said :salute
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i volunteer for the beta but due to the tos i cant tell you which one it is but it's not world of warplanes. i can tell you right away that it sucks big time and that was after one flight. i send an email asking to be removed from the beta tester. ah is not perfect and never will be but the others sheesh.
semp
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Aces High has a few qualities no other games have, there are a quite a few squads that split into genres - some are base takers, some are bomber squads, some are dog fighters, some are tankers.
You have to Ask around and find which squad you would most be interested in learning in a certain area (try for one aspect of the game rather then everything at once). What helped me most was sticking to one area until I could get a firm grasp of the game (just for an example level bombing).
I don't recommend bouncing around squads, rather find one that possibly has in squad trainers, and who can mentor you into the game, I know for example the 367th Dynamite Gang is an all round excellent squad who are capable in each aspect of the game. Sticking to one aspect like Level Bombing for a week, thus is where you soak up as much knowledge as you can and check out the different planes, then you can switch over to tanking and do the same - pick out a few tanks and learn from there, once you get bored of being blown up in a tank - you can hop in a fighter, it takes plenty of time to learn ALL aspects of the game.
When you get frustrated in one aspect, you hop to the next - where its like opening a new book - you have to learn everything all over again, after years of playing I still miss "easy shots" and get blown up to easy myself.
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The idea of a beginners Arena has been tried in the past and usually ends up bleeding the new lads out of the main arena and splitting the community in very bad ways.
The only "beginner's arena" that AH has ever had has been the Training arena. You may be mistaking it for Air Warrior that used to have a newbie arena for new players to get their feet wet in before heading to the main arenas.
ack-ack
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Sorry Ack-Ack, I should of been more specific; To mention HT's previous set of games, especially 'Warbirds'. It has been tried already and shown to have specific results that end up as described above.
It has also appeared in other games as well (of the same era) and destroyed the continuity of the experience there, to mention "Ultima Online" with its "trammel" add-on.
To further add: It is a 'social' problem, and thus needs ways of being inclusive and not exclusive.
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OP join the Vtards , you will feel like a Veteran as soon as you click "Accept"
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OP join the Vtards , you will feel like a Veteran as soon as you click "Accept"
*chuckles*
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:huh :rofl :huh :rofl
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OP join the Vtards , you will feel like a Veteran as soon as you click "Accept"
We want to encourage people to stay not get a bad name before they get a chance to get their feet wet.
LawnDart
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He guys have any of you checked "Nugget" in the pilot stats?
Either this is his absolute first tour or, you are being trolled by someone's shade so he can talk smack about Hitechs's business model. His opening statement coupled with his stats kinda infers he is not what he represents himself as.
"despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players."
The syntact pattern reminds me of another subscriber a while back who insulted Hitech and his business strategies while trying to tell him how to modernise and attract more players. Could be wrong but, it's all too familure. At least he's not trying to suck you all over to WoP based on the Marketing films.
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you dont learn by fighting others that are just learning themselves. You got to seek out better fights to make yourself better. Also, go to the ta with a trainer a few times.
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He guys have any of you checked "Nugget" in the pilot stats?
Either this is his absolute first tour or, you are being trolled by someone's shade so he can talk smack about Hitechs's business model. His opening statement coupled with his stats kinda infers he is not what he represents himself as.
"despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players."
The syntact pattern reminds me of another subscriber a while back who insulted Hitech and his business strategies while trying to tell him how to modernise and attract more players. Could be wrong but, it's all too familure. At least he's not trying to suck you all over to WoP based on the Marketing films.
what the hell are you smoking???? whatever it is you need to cut back 'cause it's making you paranoid! lol. i am no one's "shade." i started in aw aol as nuget (remember, only 5 letters,) played till it died, then a few months on warbirds and ah then quit. haven't been back for at least 10 years so i'm pretty rusty. i'm not sure what stats you're talking about, other than my 14 kills/28 deaths so far. not sure how that can be consider good, especially since i used to be competent back in the day. also, i think half of those kills were because someone augered near me without me firing a shot, which i wish ah would not credit it that way.
also, how am i criticizing ah's business model? the game has been around for over 10 years but fewer than 600 players log on at any given time. a fact that's plain to see. did you not read the last line in my post, about wowp will probably attract newer players to combat flight sims but they will get bored by the arcade feel after a short time? about me hoping ah can find a way to attract those who want something better than wowp? how is that insulting to ah?
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drivel snipped
bustr is saying that you really have no clue as to 1) current numbers of subscribers and 2) no data on the numbers of players AH retains or doesn't retain after the 2 week trial. Basically, he's saying you're talking out your arse when you make comments like you did becuase you have ZERO data to back up your statements.
ack-ack
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bustr is saying that you really have no clue as to 1) current numbers of subscribers and 2) no data on the numbers of players AH retains or doesn't retain after the 2 week trial. Basically, he's saying you're talking out your arse when you make comments like you did becuase you have ZERO data to back up your statements.
ack-ack
I nominate you as Bustr's TL;DR translator.
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I can speek english.
It's the derned spatial associative ripple effect that won't stop in my head when I read or hear speech. Who needs drugs? The patterns just associate themselves and come outta my fingers when I type dontcha know. Just wish I could do better than 3 numbers on the lottery when I look at it. Now with 6 I could have a poni in the front yard to sit in and yell piu, piu, piu at the neighbors. Used to be able to get a Mig in the crate pretty cheap from the Chinese. Anyone know how to yell piu, piu, piu in manderin?
Unless this species of statement uttered repeatedly by new or shade account players over the years is the same as saying 42 is the secret of the universe as a meme:
"despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players."
What is it, once or twice a year about verbatum this is posted on the forum? Do they all belong to the same marketing school fraternity house or something and this is one of their mottos? I liked the shill for WoP better last time around. He was kinda creative.
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bustr is saying that you really have no clue as to 1) current numbers of subscribers and 2) no data on the numbers of players AH retains or doesn't retain after the 2 week trial. Basically, he's saying you're talking out your arse when you make comments like you did becuase you have ZERO data to back up your statements.
ack-ack
no one has current numbers of subscribers other than ah. that's just a stupid argument. as for "data", it's shows exactly how many people are online when you log on. no, it does not show total numbers of subscribers, but after awhile, you can get a sense of how many people play the game each night. after 10+ years, and an on going 2 week trial period, i'd expect more.
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I smell a scorpion bite, CIA flown f16's and other mysterious ailments.
please let it be him. another Voss conspiracy would be quite fun.
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Truth probably is Hitech doesn't lick the bums of games reviewers! :rofl I haven't seen a proper review of Aces High maybe 8 years? And the game has come on so much the old reviews and screenshots don't do the present game justice. He should butter up more, maybe use that RV of his! :D
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This thread is turning into an argument about what we know about retention. I'd like to steer it back to whether a noob arena would help or hurt retention or MA gameplay.
In theory I think it's a good idea and have suggested it in the past. It seems there was some version of a noob arena in AW or Warbirds or a prior HiTech game. Can anyone tell us about it:
Who was allowed in the noob arena?
Who was blocked from the noob arena?
How long were you allowed in the noob arena?
were you eventually forced into the MA?
How many people were in the Noob arena vs how many were in the MA?
Answers to these questions will help the discussion greatly. :salute
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Boing!!!...........Wish Granted.
It's called the late war main arena.
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despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players. so to help ease them into the game, i'm wondering if ah has ever had, or would consider having, a "beginners arena"? i'm not asking ah to dumb down the game, just a place where beginners can learn the ropes for the first few months.
let's face it, combat flight sims have probably the steepest learning curve of any game genres out there. so when you put newbies in the same arena as people who've been "flying" for a decade, it gets ugly and not so much fun for the noobs. the new guys can go to the training arena all they want, but the fact is they just don't have the skills yet to be effective. in air warrior, that wasn't so much of a problem because you had a constant and large influx of new guys so proportionally, you stood a good chance of meeting someone of similar skills in the sky. in ah, my guess is the influx of new people is probably a trickle. so for a noob like me, i'm probably flying with mostly vets. while i like combat flight sims, i might not stick around too much longer because it's just not that fun getting waxed while i'm just trying not to stall.
with the introduction of world of warplanes, there'll probably be a resurgence of people interested in combat flight sims. if wowp is anything like wot, emphasis on arcade rather than realism, i'm sure quite a few of those people would get bored and graduate up to ah. i hope ah finds a way to attract them.
p.s. i posted in the help forum, too, but not sure which is more appropriate.
I would spend a lot of time there
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Boing!!!...........Wish Granted.
It's called the late war main arena.
no it isn't
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This thread is turning into an argument about what we know about retention. I'd like to steer it back to whether a noob arena would help or hurt retention or MA gameplay.
In theory I think it's a good idea and have suggested it in the past. It seems there was some version of a noob arena in AW or Warbirds or a prior HiTech game. Can anyone tell us about it:
Who was allowed in the noob arena?
Who was blocked from the noob arena?
How long were you allowed in the noob arena?
were you eventually forced into the MA?
How many people were in the Noob arena vs how many were in the MA?
Answers to these questions will help the discussion greatly. :salute
AW had newbie arena. Everyone was allowed in. You got points as you got kills. I beloved the top you could get was 10,000 points lifetime. Once you hit this you could no longer get bullets for your.planes. you could still fly around as a target but could not fire back.
I use to go there and help newbies out and even recruited some.to my squad from.there. the numbers were much like the MA as compared.to the TA.
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I don't think I flew there, ever. But then my memory fails me. Eh. :cheers:
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AW had newbie arena. Everyone was allowed in. You got points as you got kills. I beloved the top you could get was 10,000 points lifetime. Once you hit this you could no longer get bullets for your.planes. you could still fly around as a target but could not fire back.
I use to go there and help newbies out and even recruited some.to my squad from.there. the numbers were much like the MA as compared.to the TA.
Lifetime bullets is interesting limitation.
Did the concept work well in your opinion?
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Fighter Ace had a beginners arena. Small island map with limited set of A/C from mid war, tanks and ships to attack. I can't remember if it was two sides or three. Once your score reached the rank of LtC your guns went cold and most would move on to the MA's. Veteran pilots would come in there and be drones for target practice and offer advice.
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Fighter Ace had a beginners arena. Small island map with limited set of A/C from mid war, tanks and ships to attack. I can't remember if it was two sides or three. Once your score reached the rank of LtC your guns went cold and most would move on to the MA's. Veteran pilots would come in there and be drones for target practice and offer advice.
Sounds like FA took that idea from AW.
ack-ack
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Lifetime bullets is interesting limitation.
Did the concept work well in your opinion?
I thought it did, but that's only my opinion.
It gave the newbies a place to get there feet wet with out all the"game" stuff getting in the way. The only pressure they had was what they put on themselves to stay in the air long enough to get a kill. In Aces High there is pressure of trying to beat your countrymen to the kill, not screw up enough to get your countrymen killed, not miss your target and screw up the capture on top of just trying to stay in the air.
It gave the newbies some fights that were thrilling because in most cases they fought again players of their own skill level and so could last longer and get their adrenalin going, which in the long run helped them in deciding to stay and play. Once that "adrenalin" high gets ahold of you it's tuff to do with out. Today the thrill is getting the "global" attaboys when the team rolls another base.
It gave squads a pool to recruit from. Working with the new guys was a good way to learn if a player fit, was a nice guy, willing to learn and put in the time to get better. You know, the type of player you'd LIKE to have on your squad, not just anyone with a pulse and can haul extra bombs to the target field and MAYBE hit something with them.
I don't remember how many points you got for a kill, but by the time you hit the limit you knew your way around the game, the controls, and the basics of flying fighters and bombers. When you got in the MAINS it wasn't such a shock and and the transition was much easier.
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Thought the DA's Fighter Lake was Aces High's Kiddy Pool now. It has that pond furball flavor of the RR Small Europe from AW.
It seems to have a semi perminant population that eventualy graduates 2-3% into the MA over time while the rest are happy HOing each other in Tempests and F4U-4 all day long. They have their own game language, groups, villans and uber sticks they look up to. If you are fortunate to go knights, you are invited to channel 100 for a large support group of very helpful players pretty much having a nonstop party. Sort of like C-land in AW.
That for the most part is our beginners arena by the virtue of squatters rights and a very good 3-6 month Newbie fighter warmup for the LWMA shark pool. Yes very often their best move in the MA is the HO. But at least they can take off and not fly into the ground the first time they pull a turn. And they don't have to be told everthing from the Help file over local channel. That fits the definition of a beginers arena's job.
Sadly many in the MA and DA look down on the place as a garbage dump. Treat those who spend time there as garbage, and tell new players to go there as a personal insult to convey distaste for thier neophyte status in the game. But, it is a beginers arena with a constant population of players willing to fight you and help you through the learning process. It's just not a tamed down version of the MA with a full scale war going on like the RR arena in AW was.
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sounds like FA took that idea from AW
ack-ack
Is that a good thing? Was the AW concept of the beginners arena a success in any way?
I'm not promoting a noob arena.. just offering a reference to something that worked in another venue.
I'm very satisfied with the opportunities offered to improve game play knowledge and ACM skills in our TA.
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I remember the old rank themed rooms on Microsoft's gaming zone 98-2002 ish.
Based on the level of points / score you had would dictate which room you were to fly in. Once past Major you had to play in the big boys room unless you had a bad innings and lost too many planes to get demoted. Killing Generals was big points!!! :D
I remember being pretty nervous fighting the guys with the bigger ranks, I can't remember whether the people in the higher class rooms fought with any more character than the scrubs HO ramming one another. I'm sure in AH the planes get more hate than the player flying them and that was the key difference.
Imagine seeing the rank, ID and Aces rack of a fearsome brute, would you engage him or run?? ;) Here it is just :cry stupid (insert plane) driver.
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Is that a good thing? Was the AW concept of the beginners arena a success in any way?
Yes, it was very successful. The newbie arena in AW was also the training arena and there was also the "AW Training Academy" as a further resource that players could attend (I believe the Academy lasted 6 weeks) if they wanted the extra help.
Not to offend the trainers in AH, all of them volunteer their time and have been a great help to the community and new players but the training program in AW was leaps and bounds better than in AH.
I've always been a big proponent of adding a newbie arena and a similar training program like the AW Training Academy to help new players ease into the game before they are sent off to the MA feeding frenzy. The benefits outweigh the negatives in my opinion.
ack-ack
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Ack-Ack,
We have established AH has a Trainers group, TA, Furball Lake and even Custom Arenas if the Trainers want to put up a mini beginers shooting war a few times a week with a Trainer referee.
Rolex periodicly holds his Basics Seminars. Many DA Monsters willing give freely of their personal time to teach ACM to anyone who asks. And the MA is not the place for a beginner to ask questions like how do I take off or castrai screech "m'aider" histericly as they crash and burn without an armor plated ego.
You do not point out a player's or the game's fault as a vehical to abuse someone for a sporting endevor as many on this forum. So how could Training in AH be handeled better measured directly with AW?
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despite how long ah has been around, the paltry numbers of players at any given time tells me ah is having trouble attracting and retaining new players. so to help ease them into the game, i'm wondering if ah has ever had, or would consider having, a "beginners arena"? i'm not asking ah to dumb down the game, just a place where beginners can learn the ropes for the first few months.
let's face it, combat flight sims have probably the steepest learning curve of any game genres out there. so when you put newbies in the same arena as people who've been "flying" for a decade, it gets ugly and not so much fun for the noobs. the new guys can go to the training arena all they want, but the fact is they just don't have the skills yet to be effective. in air warrior, that wasn't so much of a problem because you had a constant and large influx of new guys so proportionally, you stood a good chance of meeting someone of similar skills in the sky. in ah, my guess is the influx of new people is probably a trickle. so for a noob like me, i'm probably flying with mostly vets. while i like combat flight sims, i might not stick around too much longer because it's just not that fun getting waxed while i'm just trying not to stall.
with the introduction of world of warplanes, there'll probably be a resurgence of people interested in combat flight sims. if wowp is anything like wot, emphasis on arcade rather than realism, i'm sure quite a few of those people would get bored and graduate up to ah. i hope ah finds a way to attract them.
p.s. i posted in the help forum, too, but not sure which is more appropriate.
Just give 1 free month sub, they use to got me hooked. :bolt:
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So Matt as a connoisseur of online game Free Play trial periods. Please rate the last 10 or 20 you have signed up for against Aces High's free two week trial.