Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Citabria on August 19, 2012, 04:36:07 AM
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with the growing genre of attack mode only aircraft seeming to encompass ground attack aircraft that are used primarily to bomb and attack vehicles...
two excellent airplanes to be transferred to this category are the hurri2d and the a20G.
the hurri2d is a dedicated vehicle killer. fighter mode for it is silly.
the A20g (A stands for attack) is becoming the new dweeb ride like the il2 used to be. by transferring it to attack mode only it will lose its external view but still retain all its amazing bomb load and maneuverability qualities. given that the a20 is the go to plane with its 8 bombs for gv killing that is facilitated by its extreme fighter like maneuverability attack mode only would be a good fit.
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No, no, no! Think of all the whines that will be had here on the forums if you remove F3 from the A-20G! :bhead
:lol
Silliness aside, it makes sense that the A-20 and the Hurri 2D should only be in the Attack category. Losing F3 for the A-20G will only rob me of my ability to check out damage I sustained when RTBing. In other words, I don't care if it loses F3. :)
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Remove F3 mode for all planes.
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Agreed, Hurri is no fighter and F3 for A20 is daft.
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I really do not see how much it helps in bombers, either. Especially the American heavies. They seem to have fairly decent overlapping fields of view from the gunner's positions. I understand that this requires changing one's view from gun to gun, but it is not like it is the end of the world.
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I really do not see how much it helps in bombers, either. Especially the American heavies. They seem to have fairly decent overlapping fields of view from the gunner's positions. I understand that this requires changing one's view from gun to gun, but it is not like it is the end of the world.
It spares you the need to jump from position to position, taking time to scan at each, in order to get a all round view as in reality the scanning would be done simultaneously. Bob didn't wait for George to finish looking around in the top turret before looking around with the ball turret.
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Remove F3 mode for all planes.
^^^^^^^ This and fix the DA while you at it.
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+1
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Remove F3 mode for all planes.
It spares you the need to jump from position to position, taking time to scan at each, in order to get a all round view as in reality the scanning would be done simultaneously. Bob didn't wait for George to finish looking around in the top turret before looking around with the ball turret.
Karnak is right. F3 for bombers should remain, unless they bring in the "Death Star" option. If "Death Star" comes in, then you can remove F3 from bombers too. :salute :aok
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Karnak is right. F3 for bombers should remain, unless they bring in the "Death Star" option. If "Death Star" comes in, then you can remove F3 from bombers too. :salute :aok
What is your definition of "Death Star Option"?
Mine is "Being able to fire all guns, within the field of fire, simultaneously" :noid
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Similar to what was in Air Warrior. If I recall correctly (based off of what I have been told and read. Never had a chance to play AW :(), you could crew your bomber (B-17's in particular) with a bunch of people, thus creating what I've heard it referred to as "a Death Star".
F3 in bombers covers what your gunners can "see". As Karnak pointed out, Bob did not wait for George to finish scanning in his Top Turret before Bob would scan in his Ball Turret. Maybe if they implemented a, for lack of a better term, "tunnel vision" type effect when you would scan? I'll use the D3A as an example. As we know it has F3, which doesn't make a lot of sense as you can see everywhere despite only 2 people on board. Now implement "tunnel vision"; You can still use F3, but if you look anywhere where the gunner couldn't see, it would go black or black out area's the gunner can't see. In other words, you jump into the gun and try to look at low 12, it would be all black since the pilot/gunner wouldn't be able to see that area. Now this doesn't mean that single pilot planes get F3. They still stay with out it, but planes with more than one crew member could have this "tunnel vision" type of thing implemented onto them. I think this could prove useful, take away some of the gamey-ness but wouldn't rob people from the eyes of their gunners. They overall keep F3. :aok
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Similar to what was in Air Warrior. If I recall correctly (based off of what I have been told and read. Never had a chance to play AW :(), you could crew your bomber (B-17's in particular) with a bunch of people, thus creating what I've heard it referred to as "a Death Star".
F3 in bombers covers what your gunners can "see". As Karnak pointed out, Bob did not wait for George to finish scanning in his Top Turret before Bob would scan in his Ball Turret. Maybe if they implemented a, for lack of a better term, "tunnel vision" type effect when you would scan? I'll use the D3A as an example. As we know it has F3, which doesn't make a lot of sense as you can see everywhere despite only 2 people on board. Now implement "tunnel vision"; You can still use F3, but if you look anywhere where the gunner couldn't see, it would go black or black out area's the gunner can't see. In other words, you jump into the gun and try to look at low 12, it would be all black since the pilot/gunner wouldn't be able to see that area. Now this doesn't mean that single pilot planes get F3. They still stay with out it, but planes with more than one crew member could have this "tunnel vision" type of thing implemented onto them. I think this could prove useful, take away some of the gamey-ness but wouldn't rob people from the eyes of their gunners. They overall keep F3. :aok
As it works now, all guns on bombers will fire at a target as long as the target is within that particular gun's field of fire. They can all be slaved to one button.
That gets quite "death Star"-esque on the American heavy bombers if you ask me, considering an average of three guns per plane in a three-plane formation, for a total of nine guns that can all fire at the target at the same time with the press of a single button.
That's a lot of lead flying :D
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As it works now, all guns on bombers will fire at a target as long as the target is within that particular gun's field of fire.
Not really. They all fire towards the target, but as their fire converges at D500, they most of the time don't really fire at the target. Firing at D800, most guns of a bomber formation are wasting their ammo if the lead bomber's guns do hit their mark.
In a death star configuration however, it's really all guns with a proper field of fire that could in theory hit the enemy at the same time
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Not really. They all fire towards the target, but as their fire converges at D500, they most of the time don't really fire at the target. Firing at D800, most guns of a bomber formation are wasting their ammo if the lead bomber's guns do hit their mark.
In a death star configuration however, it's really all guns with a proper field of fire that could in theory hit the enemy at the same time
I admit, it was a very generalizing statement.
On the other hand, when is the last time you held still when near a bomber at that range? :D
That being said, I would wager that evasive maneuvers may perhaps put one in a worse situation than staying still as it would put one into a better position to take fire from all of the guns firing, akin to a shotgun blast. :lol
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Remove F3 mode for all planes.
Even for fighters sitting on the runway?
ack-ack
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Even for fighters sitting on the runway?
ack-ack
Just yours :neener:
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Just yours :neener:
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Even for fighters sitting on the runway?
ack-ack
Yes, why not?
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Yes, why not?
why?
ack-ack
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Yes, why not?
I like counting the holes in my plane if I land. and checking out my mossie, damaged or not. just because its sexy :aok
until we have opening canopies and a lean out the cockpit view we need it for taxiing too.
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I like counting the holes in my plane if I land. and checking out my mossie, damaged or not. just because its sexy :aok
until we have opening canopies and a lean out the cockpit view we need it for taxiing too.
Are you kidding? Do you realize how bad that would mess up my hairdo?
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I like F3 mode for big Heavy bombers like the Lanc B17 and B29 but if we had to remove F3 I'd say don't let the medium bombers have F3 like the B25C or B26
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Leave F3 on bombers. When I take out a MossieXVI, during the flight to the target I watch it in F3 view and j*** off.
That being said, I cannot see why A20 is different from the 410 or MossieVI. Even its designation letter indicates it is not a bomber. In my book, no level bomb sight = not a bomber.
As for the Hurri2D, I dont see what difference will it make if it loses the "figher" score option.
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It's bizarre to read that the F3 view is an unfair advantage in a plane that easily sheds control surfaces and more vital parts if stressed, and has absolutely no rear view from the cockpit. :bhead
Without the outside view, there would be NO fight with an A-20 because the pilot won't see you coming, you might as well go shoot offline drones.
Comparisons to the 110s, Mossie, and even the 410 actually make the case to leave the F3 mode in place. Compare the rear view in any of those rides to the rear view in the A20 (or the Il-2 for that matter) and it should be easy to see why the original decision was made to allow an F3 view.
Add to that, in the A-20s cockpit, when I use a combination of the views UP+FORWARD, UP+FORWARD/LEFT or UP+FORWARD/RIGHT, the bandit's plane is still there, but the Icon disappears. (I think it's a sorting bug.) :furious
I don't understand why people think any plane with outside views available, are only flown using the outside view. In practice, it's the only way to track the bandit in your rear hemisphere; the same ability available in any P-51 or Spitfire without F3.
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Easyscor, I don't think the rear view possibilities come into account if you consider the F6F and IL2's case.
+1 to remove F3 on the A20
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What is the problem with F3 mode? These aircraft had more than just one pair of eyes on them. Why not just disable any guns while in F3 view mode?
What is next? Not allowing A20s to pull more than 2 Gs?
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I still think we need AI gunners... I mena, why not? We have AI puffy ack, AI base ack, AI anti-tank guns, AI train ack, and every other kind of ack.
I think it's less realistic to force the pilot to set his plane to autopilot and crawl back into the tail to man the guns and to look behind the plane... especially for an over-armored plane like the IL-2.
Just make it reasonably inaccurate and maybe don't give the pilot a kill tally when the AI gunners shoot someone down... only give them the kill when they're manning the guns themselves.
That way, the pilot can focus on being a bomber pilot instead of being in too many places at once.
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its a bus with wings! leave f3 for A20.
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It's funny how everybody supporting F3 mode doesn't say a thing about F3 being the mode they use to bomb GV and instead deflect the conversation to using it for air to air gunnery.
Sure, it might give you a better chance at deflection shooting but it's real advantage is being able to see ground vehicles in a way that was never possible in real life.
If you want to see ground vehicles in bombers, bank and look out the windows as they did in the real war.
The clowns who are pulling wings off the A20 and other buffs while maneuvering close to the ground are doing so because they are not in the cockpit and cannot see the gauges that would tell them the G loading.
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It's funny how everybody supporting F3 mode doesn't say a thing about F3 being the mode they use to bomb GV and instead deflect the conversation to using it for air to air gunnery.
Sure, it might give you a better chance at deflection shooting but it's real advantage is being able to see ground vehicles in a way that was never possible in real life.
If you want to see ground vehicles in bombers, bank and look out the windows as they did in the real war.
The clowns who are pulling wings off the A20 and other buffs while maneuvering close to the ground are doing so because they are not in the cockpit and cannot see the gauges that would tell them the G loading.
The F6F is hands down a far superior GV killer then an A-20.
I predict that if you take away F3 in the A-20, the GV drivers will be dealing with dweeb Lanc's instead, so be careful what you wish for.
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I predict that if you take away F3 in the A-20, the GV drivers will be dealing with dweeb Lanc's instead, so be careful what you wish for.
good old days :D
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How about F3 mode only works on runway and above 3k AGL (above ground level)?
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I agree that the "attack" classification should be fully implemented to ac that fullfill a ground attack role.......... if their only role is effectively air to ground then they should be made attack only IMO.
I'd go further.
All so called fighter/attack aircraft should (IMO) default to attack mode when ordinance is loaded.
All bomber formations should be switched off when attack mode is selected (Bostons, Ki's, Ju88's, Arado etc etc).
Given above ju88's should be set to Attack mode when torpedoes are selected.
All bomber/attack aircraft should have pilot release of bombs enabled (given above) when attack mode is chosen.
All bomber/attack aircraft should have pilot release of bombs disabled (forced f6) when bomber mode is chosen.
Add attack perks to give 4 categories of perks (Fighter, Attack, Bomber, Vehicles)
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Why not just scrap attack mode and have just fighter and bomber? Menostand :headscratch:
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Why not just scrap attack mode and have just fighter and bomber? Menostand :headscratch:
You will not understand, you use too much common sense.