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General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: HL117 on December 14, 2012, 10:08:07 AM

Title: Penetrating Oils
Post by: HL117 on December 14, 2012, 10:08:07 AM
For all of you with rusty knuckles:



Machinist's Workshop magazine

recently published some information on various penetrating oils that I found very interesting.
Some of you might appreciate this. The magazine reports they tested penetrates for break out torque on rusted nuts.

They are below, as forwarded by an ex-student and professional machinist.

They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrates with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a

"scientifically rusted" environment.

*Penetrating oils ........... Average torque load to loosen*

No Oil used ................... 516 pounds
WD-40 ..................... ... 238 pounds
PB Blaster .................... 214 pounds
Liquid Wrench ...............127 pounds
Kano Kroil .................... 106 pounds
ATF*-Acetone mix............53 pounds

The ATF-Acetone mix is a "home brew" mix of 50 - 50 automatic transmission fluid and acetone.

Note this "home brew" released bolts better than any commercial product in this one particular test.

Our local machinist group mixed up a batch and we all now use it with equally good results.
Note also that "Liquid Wrench" is almost as good as "Kroil"
for about 20% of the price.

Steve from Godwin-Singer says that ATF-Acetone mix is best, but you can also use ATF and lacquer thinner in a 50-50 mix.
*ATF=Automatic Transmission Fluid

 :salute

HL
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: TopGear on December 14, 2012, 10:48:10 AM
ATF and acetone is really good. It was suggested to me about a year ago. It did eat a hole through one container I had it in. Also it does separate so you need to give it a shake before using.  I don't like wd-40 it is pretty much useless. 
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: caldera on December 14, 2012, 10:52:47 AM
Thought this thread was about something else.   :D :bolt:
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: CAP1 on December 14, 2012, 10:59:42 AM
no one tested freeze off?
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Reaper90 on December 14, 2012, 11:30:52 AM
ATF and acetone is really good. It was suggested to me about a year ago. It did eat a hole through one container I had it in. Also it does separate so you need to give it a shake before using.  I don't like wd-40 it is pretty much useless. 

because WD-40 isn't a penetrating oil.....  :old:

WD-40 is a corrosion preventative product.... my understanding growing up using it, Liquid Wrench, and PB Blaster, is that the "WD" stands for "water displacer" or something like that.... like a good sprayable light machine oil that will give moving assemblies a good coating of oil to prevent corrosion. Properly used it's more for protecting and lightly lubricating things that aren't rusty yet, definitely not for freeing up frozen-up and heavily rusted components.

Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Bodhi on December 14, 2012, 11:43:30 AM
The acetone mixture has been around a long time.  The only problem I see, is the flammability is very high.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: pembquist on December 14, 2012, 02:01:23 PM
Now just get somebody to put ATF mix in a spray can. Like kroil, what about just using ATF straight?
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: GScholz on December 14, 2012, 02:35:42 PM
Acetone is a powerful solvent, so more care must be taken with spills etc. Especially around fiberglass and other resin based materials.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Rob52240 on December 14, 2012, 02:38:39 PM
They should have done their test on rusty nuts and bolts, instead of just nuts and bolts.

I go with PB blaster when something's rusty.  I haven't had to look for a better product yet.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: phatzo on December 14, 2012, 02:43:09 PM
no one tested freeze off?
some of the best results I've had have been with the Loctite Freeze and Release, if that doesn't work a small local product called Bolt Off does and vice versa. between the two of them I'm usually undone.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: SilverZ06 on December 14, 2012, 03:33:11 PM
Corrosion X works awesome as well.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Groth on December 14, 2012, 03:51:03 PM
 A 'water displacer' is useful when you have an ignition system wet to the point of not working. Turn off power, spray with WD-40, wait just a bit, then try starting. I used this very successfully on my 125cc Kawa after crossing streams and a Ford pick-up with distributors at front of engine that would quit working in heavy rain(kept can behind pick-ups seat). Even was a small bit preventative if used before hand, but only to a point. It is terrible as lubricant, and will remove any oil/grease from a bicycle chain leading to its early demise. The original formula was pretty flammable, to the point of being used as a 'starting fluid', but they changed the formula and do not try that now. Here in the 'Old South' some swear it works on arthritis... I do not. Your milage may vary.
 JGroth
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: morfiend on December 14, 2012, 04:13:28 PM
 Have been using ATF for this purpose for years now but never thought to cut it with acetone!

      Wonder if methalhydrate works as well as the acetone,going to give both a try next time I need to use some ATF!   We've even used ATF in a hotplate to loosen real stuborn pieces.



    :salute




 
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Volron on December 14, 2012, 05:23:53 PM
no one tested freeze off?

What would you recommend?  This is under the assumption that ye have tested out more than your fair share of products of course. :aok
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: cattb on December 14, 2012, 05:28:12 PM
(http://images10.newegg.com/NeweggImage/ProductImageCompressAll300/A185_1_20120608_6885536.jpg)

one of my favorites for rusted nuts and bolts

otherwise I use liquid wrench or PB Blaster. WD40 seems to be more alcohol then anything else
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: CAP1 on December 14, 2012, 07:50:22 PM
What would you recommend?  This is under the assumption that ye have tested out more than your fair share of products of course. :aok

at the shop, i use freeze off. it's made by crc. if it doesn't work, i break out the torch.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on December 15, 2012, 02:06:06 AM
at the shop, i use freeze off. it's made by crc. if it doesn't work, i break out the torch.

Ahh.. nowadays when I see someone mentioning the torch it always reminds me of my youth and a certain car shop. I ordered them to change my anti-roll bar bushings. They ordered the wrong parts (my car then had 2 different choices on the same year model) and when I pass by the shop expecting the car to be delivered I see a mechanic blowtorching the end of the anti-roll bar red hot and hammering the burning rubber bushing on it.  :banana:
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Masherbrum on December 15, 2012, 10:27:03 AM
at the shop, i use freeze off. it's made by crc. if it doesn't work, i break out the torch.

I use Freeze Off as well.   When I restored my CJ-7, PB Blaster was found to be inadequate.   When Freeze Off failed to work, I broke out the Torch.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: CAP1 on December 15, 2012, 10:31:04 AM
I almost forgot one. the good old whizzy wheel. had to use that to cut the lower rear control arms off of a honda yesterday.
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: uptown on December 15, 2012, 12:33:32 PM
 :lol cattb  :aok my favorite tool in the shop  :old:
Title: Re: Penetrating Oils
Post by: Sombra on December 16, 2012, 08:53:07 AM
Interesting, thank you.

Origins of WD-40 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WD-40) you might find interesting:

Quote
Larsen was attempting to create a formula to prevent corrosion in nuclear missiles, by displacing the standing water that causes it. He claims he arrived at a successful formula on his 40th attempt.[2] WD-40 is primarily composed of various hydrocarbons.

WD-40 was first used by Convair to protect the outer skin, and more importantly, the paper thin "balloon tanks" of the Atlas missile from rust and corrosion.[2][3] These stainless steel fuel tanks were so thin that, when empty, they had to be kept inflated with nitrogen gas to prevent their collapse.