Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => Achievement System => Topic started by: Moelders on December 23, 2012, 02:58:30 AM

Title: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Moelders on December 23, 2012, 02:58:30 AM
What is your target audience?  Because it's pretty obvious that this is catering to the WoW generation of players.  An achievement for jumping a jeep, spraying 25K rounds, bailing out? Really? Are you kidding me?

Where is the historical content?  Where are the historically based ranks (not shiny stars) (based on actual account lifetime skill)? Where are the medals and ribbons that fighter pilots were awarded (based on single acts of valor)? Instead, what we have is a quick-gratficiation "fix" that does nothing to add to the "aura" and WWII "feel" that this game should be aiming at.

I want to be Major So-and-So, that has the distinguished flying cross and two purple hearts for action over enemy territory during tour XYZ...not whatever you think you are creating.

The achievement system, should be the "long term," record of our achievements and would fill the "gap" that is left after each tour ends (since the tour only keeps "score" for a month).  Some of the stuff you have makes sense, such as "Ace," and "shoot down x number of planes," but then award me a ribbon, that is put on my ribbon rack, not this cartoonish crap and star system.  Preface each name with their rank, that is based on WWII ranks.  

Example, I want to pick Luftwaffe as my main ranking system...I should be Leutnant Olds, or Hauptmann Olds in chat.  I want to click on my "awards" tab, and see a ribbon rack, or medal rack that represents medals from WWII.  If you are going to do this, do it right, please....not this absurd stars and cartoon achievement stuff.


Title: Re: This entire idea is a bad idea
Post by: Chalenge on December 23, 2012, 03:07:29 AM
Really? You're whining because a few more host messages popup?  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: This entire idea is a bad idea
Post by: Moelders on December 23, 2012, 03:08:39 AM
Really? You're whining because a few more host messages popup?  :rolleyes:

Maybe you should read my post? I didn't say anything about host messages.  Reading past the first line typically helps, I know it might undermine your post count "achievement," but it helps in creating a rational response to a topic.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Chalenge on December 23, 2012, 04:37:38 AM
I read your entire post. Your response to my calling you a crybaby pretty much tells the story of your not understanding where HTC is going with achievements.

Maybe show some patience next time (wait and see)?
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Latrobe on December 23, 2012, 05:09:45 AM
I find if there's a feature I don't like or am not interested in (Brewster, achievements) then I just ignore them. I neither fly Brewsters nor do I try to complete these new achievements, and I have a lot of fun flying how ever I please.

Remember, no one is forcing you to complete these new achievements.



I've never been someone who thought that score, achievements, ribbons, or awards determined how good someone was. You don't make a name for yourself by how low your rank is or how many awards you have, but by your actions in the skies. Example, someone has a score of 50 from only engaging with numbers or alt, 1 bomb dropping on towns, and gv spawn camping, and someone else has a score of 1200 because they only like fighters and get into every fight even if they die. The scores say that the rank 50 guy should be better, but the people who play the game know who really is the better pilot because they have fought them both in the skies before.

If you enjoy getting a low score though, then go for it! If you enjoy the achievements, then try and get them! If you want awards and ribbons, good for you! Not sure if HTC will add historical awards and ribbons but there are squads out there that do that stuff. In the end, play how you want and have fun.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: The Fugitive on December 23, 2012, 10:50:35 AM
Of course the achievement system is aimed toward the WoW generation. That is the group that is now coming on board, and must have things familiar to them to help keep them interested. It's all about getting and retaining new subscribers. Us old guys who fly for "history" will stay due to the main theme/content, while others who are looking for the "next game" need a bit more to keep them interested. It's just another side game in the main game.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Karnak on December 23, 2012, 11:24:06 AM
Keep in mind that it is beta and these are just for test purposes.  Also, don't begrudge some silly ones that are there for fun.

I do like your rank reward suggestion though.  It shouldn't just be USAAF ranks, the rank rewarded should be based on who's unit the reward was earned in.

Luftwaffe ranks for German aircraft successes
Wehrmacht ranks for German vehicle successes
USN ranks for USN aircraft and boat successes
US Army ranks for US Army aircraft and vehicle successes
US Marine Corp ranks for US Marine Corp aircraft and vehicle successes
Regia Aeronautica ranks for Italian aircraft successes
FAF ranks for Brewster successes
RAF ranks for RAF successes
RN ranks for RN successes
VVS ranks for Russian aircraft successes
Red Army ranks for Russian vehicle successes
IJN ranks for Japanese navy successes
IJA ranks for Japanese army successes

It might be possible to select what rank you want an aircraft or tank to be scored in for those aircraft and tanks that were used by multiple nations.  The Spitfire Mk VIII, for example, might be scored as either RAF or USAAF.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Stigler on December 23, 2012, 01:16:37 PM
Keep in mind that it is beta and these are just for test purposes.  Also, don't begrudge some silly ones that are there for fun.

I do like your rank reward suggestion though.  It shouldn't just be USAAF ranks, the rank rewarded should be based on who's unit the reward was earned in.

Luftwaffe ranks for German aircraft successes
Wehrmacht ranks for German vehicle successes
USN ranks for USN aircraft and boat successes
US Army ranks for US Army aircraft and vehicle successes
US Marine Corp ranks for US Marine Corp aircraft and vehicle successes
Regia Aeronautica ranks for Italian aircraft successes
FAF ranks for Brewster successes
RAF ranks for RAF successes
RN ranks for RN successes
VVS ranks for Russian aircraft successes
Red Army ranks for Russian vehicle successes
IJN ranks for Japanese navy successes
IJA ranks for Japanese army successes

It might be possible to select what rank you want an aircraft or tank to be scored in for those aircraft and tanks that were used by multiple nations.  The Spitfire Mk VIII, for example, might be scored as either RAF or USAAF.



No Text
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Moelders on December 23, 2012, 01:18:40 PM
Keep in mind that it is beta and these are just for test purposes.  Also, don't begrudge some silly ones that are there for fun.

I do like your rank reward suggestion though.  It shouldn't just be USAAF ranks, the rank rewarded should be based on who's unit the reward was earned in.

Luftwaffe ranks for German aircraft successes
Wehrmacht ranks for German vehicle successes
USN ranks for USN aircraft and boat successes
US Army ranks for US Army aircraft and vehicle successes
US Marine Corp ranks for US Marine Corp aircraft and vehicle successes
Regia Aeronautica ranks for Italian aircraft successes
FAF ranks for Brewster successes
RAF ranks for RAF successes
RN ranks for RN successes
VVS ranks for Russian aircraft successes
Red Army ranks for Russian vehicle successes
IJN ranks for Japanese navy successes
IJA ranks for Japanese army successes

It might be possible to select what rank you want an aircraft or tank to be scored in for those aircraft and tanks that were used by multiple nations.  The Spitfire Mk VIII, for example, might be scored as either RAF or USAAF.

This is it; I like it!
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: ToeTag on December 23, 2012, 01:21:04 PM
I think Molders is mad because he feels like an adult playing a game now...... :rofl
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: pervert on December 24, 2012, 12:28:33 AM
Its not my cup of tea, but I think overall its a pretty good idea and the majority will enjoy or like getting the rewards and maybe learn some history at the same time, it does not bother me having to look at it.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Chalenge on December 24, 2012, 02:59:20 AM
I believe it is impossible to enter into a rank and reward system that centers around nationality without bringing politics of the day into it. The problem does not stem from the reward system itself but the users receiving it taking it and themselves too seriously.

Really.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: bozon on December 24, 2012, 03:38:45 AM
Keep in mind that it is beta and these are just for test purposes.  Also, don't begrudge some silly ones that are there for fun.

I do like your rank reward suggestion though.  It shouldn't just be USAAF ranks, the rank rewarded should be based on who's unit the reward was earned in.

Luftwaffe ranks for German aircraft successes
Wehrmacht ranks for German vehicle successes
USN ranks for USN aircraft and boat successes
US Army ranks for US Army aircraft and vehicle successes
US Marine Corp ranks for US Marine Corp aircraft and vehicle successes
Regia Aeronautica ranks for Italian aircraft successes
FAF ranks for Brewster successes
RAF ranks for RAF successes
RN ranks for RN successes
VVS ranks for Russian aircraft successes
Red Army ranks for Russian vehicle successes
IJN ranks for Japanese navy successes
IJA ranks for Japanese army successes

It might be possible to select what rank you want an aircraft or tank to be scored in for those aircraft and tanks that were used by multiple nations.  The Spitfire Mk VIII, for example, might be scored as either RAF or USAAF.
That is not such a bad idea. You can have a rank in each country and choose which one to present, even if it is not the highest - or none at all. Many online games have "earned titles" and the player can choose one (or none) to display above/below his name icon. HTC can even link the country to the skin of the plane you choose. Fly P51-B in RAF colors and you'll increase your RAF rank. Choose USAAF skin to fly "for" the USAAF.

I dont have strong feelings about such a system either way, but if it brings and keeps more players on board, then I am all for it.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Karnak on December 24, 2012, 11:29:26 AM
Yeah, it would only display the one you chose, if any, not all of them.

Would show up in the chat buffer I'd think.

Pilot Officer Karnak: Blah blah blah blah

Flight Lieutenant Karnak shot you down in a Hurricane Mk II.

You shot down Wing Commander Karnak in a Mosquito Mk VI.


Rank abbreviations might be needed.  Also an option to not show other's ranks perhaps.

The criteria for gaining a rank could be reaching a certain kill total, object damage done total, numbers of achievements or specific achievements.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Karnak on December 24, 2012, 12:35:35 PM
RAF ranks, highest to lowest:

Officer Ranks
RankAbbreviation
Marshal of the Royal Air ForceMRAF
Air Chief MarshalAir Chf Mshl
Air MarshalAir Mshl
Air Vice-MarshalAVM
Air CommodoreAir Cdre
Group CaptainGp Capt
Wing CommanderWg Cdr
Squadron LeaderSqn Ldr
Flight LieutenantFlt Lt
Flying OfficerFg Off
Pilot OfficerPlt Off
Enlisted Ranks
Master AircrewMAcr
Warrant OfficerWO
Flight SergeantFS
SergeantSgt
CorporalCpl
Lance CorporalLCpl
Senior AircraftmanSAC
Leading AircraftmanLAC
AircraftmanAC
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: VuduVee on December 25, 2012, 04:21:11 AM
wow, people will piss and moan about every possible little thing they can, just gotta whine about something. htc tries to do something that may turn out to be good and all the self proclaimed intelligencia wannabes immediately turn into intitled brats who would squeak if they were hung with a new rope. nevermind that a person never has to even look at the achievements. it affects your game in no way. not even a little bit. also i dont know why you would complain, bc imo from my experience with you, the WoW mentality is an exact description of YOU and how you play the game. the fight means nothing to you, just get that kill no matter how you get it. only that almighty kill stat matters. thats right up your alley Olds.
AlBundy
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Moelders on December 25, 2012, 04:34:12 AM
albundy Who are you?  And you obviously have no clue who I am given your antagonistic vile post above.  I made a recommendation, it was far from a whine.  If you have nothing constructive to add to this, why post?  You realize that there are multiple olds and I have used this callsign all of 3 weeks...and I have no friggen clue who you are.  Given you registration date, I was deployed to Afghanistan for an additional 6ish months when you joined, so what exactly is your "experience" with me? Maybe look at your post above, and then maybe you will see how ironic the content is given the manner in which you posted.....especially since your kills per hours of flight reflect the type of player you accuse me of being (one that does not care about the "fight"...)

Merry Christmas.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Debrody on December 25, 2012, 05:03:34 AM
I like Karnak's idea, still, two things just flashed into my mind.
-what if i dont want soundish prefixes in front of my name? What if i dont want to see ÜberHauptGeneralissimus vDallas or Who?  ;)
-There are many people who fly planes of multiple nations. How would that rank system match for them? They just cant get 10 ranks of 10 different nations... i hope you see the oddity in this.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Flossy on December 25, 2012, 07:44:37 AM
I'm getting a little bit fed up of people referring to the WoW mentality!  I play WoW most days and really enjoy it , but I also enjoy playing Aces High. Yes, WoW has achievements which I consider to be mostly just a bit of fun, though there are more 'serious' ones too. It looks like there will also be a good mix of silly and serious achievements in AH too, and I think it just gives another element to the game which I will enjoy but you can choose to ignore if you wish. 

There are idiots in every game, including WoW and AH, so please don't tar us all with the same brush!   :old:
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Moelders on December 25, 2012, 07:56:36 AM
I'm getting a little bit fed up of people referring to the WoW mentality!  I play WoW most days and really enjoy it , but I also enjoy playing Aces High. Yes, WoW has achievements which I consider to be mostly just a bit of fun, though there are more 'serious' ones too. It looks like there will also be a good mix of silly and serious achievements in AH too, and I think it just gives another element to the game which I will enjoy but you can choose to ignore if you wish.  

There are idiots in every game, including WoW and AH, so please don't tar us all with the same brush!   :old:

Skuzzy/Mods.  Please close this thread, it's obvious that my intent is being misconstrued...and people can't see the forest from the trees and are more worried about nitpicking the irrelevant crap out of this post than seeing the recommendation.  Thanks. My Fault, next time I'll leave the distractors out, or as I am quickly learning will just stop posting.  Have a good one, and Merry Christmas.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: JunkyII on December 25, 2012, 09:20:56 AM
In no way have I changed the way I fly, or noticed a change in others flying, since the beta release.

Keyword Beta

 :salute
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: VuduVee on December 25, 2012, 04:34:03 PM
albundy Who are you?  And you obviously have no clue who I am given your antagonistic vile post above.  I made a recommendation, it was far from a whine.  If you have nothing constructive to add to this, why post?  You realize that there are multiple olds and I have used this callsign all of 3 weeks...and I have no friggen clue who you are.  Given you registration date, I was deployed to Afghanistan for an additional 6ish months when you joined, so what exactly is your "experience" with me? Maybe look at your post above, and then maybe you will see how ironic the content is given the manner in which you posted.....especially since your kills per hours of flight reflect the type of player you accuse me of being (one that does not care about the "fight"...)

Merry Christmas.
i probably shouldve at least given the hint of being constructive. but i didnt. seems like i unloaded my frustation with people in game on you.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Karnak on December 26, 2012, 12:42:30 AM
I'm getting a little bit fed up of people referring to the WoW mentality!  I play WoW most days and really enjoy it , but I also enjoy playing Aces High. Yes, WoW has achievements which I consider to be mostly just a bit of fun, though there are more 'serious' ones too. It looks like there will also be a good mix of silly and serious achievements in AH too, and I think it just gives another element to the game which I will enjoy but you can choose to ignore if you wish. 

There are idiots in every game, including WoW and AH, so please don't tar us all with the same brush!   :old:
I also have a WoW account.

I gather from one of HiTech's posts that he has had a WoW account, or another fantasy MMO account with achievements, in the past as well.

If this thread does get closed I'll just move my suggestion based on Moelders' concerns to another thread.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Slade on December 26, 2012, 06:00:48 AM
Quote
Because it's pretty obvious that this is catering to the WoW generation of players.

Not exactly but it IS the trend of most all new games.  Prove it for yourself - just check out the dozens of games on Steam.  ;)

I compliment HiTech for working to incorporate this achievement type model WITHOUT changing the quality of the planes and game play of the flight models.  :aok
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Dragon on December 27, 2012, 12:20:14 PM
I like Karnak's idea.

Although I have not gone through the list, I do enjoy getting and sharing what achievements I have gotten just through normal game-play.  Some have made me giggle and I think that was entirely the point.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Chalenge on December 27, 2012, 03:35:18 PM
Not exactly but it IS the trend of most all new games.  Prove it for yourself - just check out the dozens of games on Steam.  ;)

I compliment HiTech for working to incorporate this achievement type model WITHOUT changing the quality of the planes and game play of the flight models.  :aok

Quoted for mirroring my own realization when I first heard the word achievement mentioned in connection with AH. However. . . until things get adjusted this is just something else that can be gamed.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: Villain on January 07, 2013, 12:09:57 PM
I have been on the Internet since 1992 and have been a gamer the whole time. All the games i have played,including this game the changes are made only for the business part and not the player. Also its the players that say i want change. So to make new player's happy they change things, that's when the game changes and starts to go south, And some quite but others keep playing. And last time i played the modeling of the planes change alot(crying players that can't really play good) It's all about money....What isn't???
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: VonMessa on January 07, 2013, 12:41:49 PM
I have been on the Internet since 1992 and have been a gamer the whole time. All the games i have played,including this game the changes are made only for the business part and not the player. Also its the players that say i want change. So to make new player's happy they change things, that's when the game changes and starts to go south, And some quite but others keep playing. And last time i played the modeling of the planes change alot(crying players that can't really play good) It's all about money....What isn't???

We have a winner!!!

You have achieved the "Truth of the matter" achievement  :aok
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: TheBug on January 07, 2013, 01:47:49 PM
Actually it's all about sex, money just facilitates that.  :banana:
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: VonMessa on January 07, 2013, 01:51:03 PM
Actually it's all about sex, money just facilitates that.  :banana:

Where is your other banana?
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: TheBug on January 07, 2013, 02:15:36 PM
Don't think he would be too welcome here.   :)
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: jimson on January 07, 2013, 05:13:56 PM
Keep in mind that it is beta and these are just for test purposes.  Also, don't begrudge some silly ones that are there for fun.

I do like your rank reward suggestion though.  It shouldn't just be USAAF ranks, the rank rewarded should be based on who's unit the reward was earned in.

Luftwaffe ranks for German aircraft successes
Wehrmacht ranks for German vehicle successes
USN ranks for USN aircraft and boat successes
US Army ranks for US Army aircraft and vehicle successes
US Marine Corp ranks for US Marine Corp aircraft and vehicle successes
Regia Aeronautica ranks for Italian aircraft successes
FAF ranks for Brewster successes
RAF ranks for RAF successes
RN ranks for RN successes
VVS ranks for Russian aircraft successes
Red Army ranks for Russian vehicle successes
IJN ranks for Japanese navy successes
IJA ranks for Japanese army successes

It might be possible to select what rank you want an aircraft or tank to be scored in for those aircraft and tanks that were used by multiple nations.  The Spitfire Mk VIII, for example, might be scored as either RAF or USAAF.

This here is what I would like to see.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: MK-84 on January 07, 2013, 09:08:54 PM
     Could it be possible that having achievements allows new players to show real progress in a game that has essentially an unheard of learning curve?
     And for the long time players...I've never shot down 4 B29's in a single sortie, I've never won the war with my troops, and I havent gotten three seconds air in my jeep. Sounds like unique and fun challenges to me.
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: VonMessa on January 08, 2013, 07:22:47 AM
     Could it be possible that having achievements allows new players to show real progress in a game that has essentially an unheard of learning curve?
     And for the long time players...I've never shot down 4 B29's in a single sortie, I've never won the war with my troops, and I havent gotten three seconds air in my jeep. Sounds like unique and fun challenges to me.

Neither have I.  Every time I think about it, the wife insists that I let her out first...
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: --)SF---- on January 08, 2013, 11:23:01 AM
Poppy seed bagels
Title: Re: Do it right, NOT THIS..please.
Post by: MK-84 on January 08, 2013, 08:10:03 PM
Neither have I.  Every time I think about it, the wife insists that I let her out first...

 :rofl