Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Zacherof on January 25, 2013, 10:39:31 PM
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Besides the change in the wing designs for the n, what other differences are there between the 2. Mike model feels more fightable for a lack of a better term. And I'm referring to knife fighting, not BnZ
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The N was intended to escort B-29s to Japan, in other words the N is a flying gas tank with the associated improvement in operational range.
The N can also carry ordnance, which is sometimes useful.
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I now know at this time I should have specified what I was looking for. Let me rephrase, does the n act differently due to the extra weight, and is the mike model a better dog fighter. I feel like the N just doesn't do as well as the M. Flaps feel less capable.
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All jugs feel heavy to me (probably from flying a Pony so much) but the Mary seems much better than any others. Even when I am low on fuel (which is not when you fight a bunch because of the gas hog nature of many 47s) it just feels like a flying brick to me. It is not nearly as quick and I am always low on energy - not that I am the best at e management, but I am not the worst either.
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N accelerates faster in dive, seems to have more rudder and elevator effect....does lil better at low speed. M overall much better fighter.....kinda like La7 with 50's (N also a brick without wep, so don't go into a fight with over-heated engine)
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You can add fuel to the M so it's closer to the N weight, then it's easier to compare them.
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The "M" accelerates better
The "N" holds energy better
has better rudder authority
floats much better
rolls better
is a more stable gun platform
and basically owns the "M" in all things but running :aok
it also does all this more gracefully than the "M"
and so it is sexier, which counts for a lot :D
:cheers:
JUGgler
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The M is faster and will hang on the prop longer. It's essentially a D-40 with a high power engine.
The N was designed as an escort fighter for long range missions to Japan. Slightly slower than the M in a WEP drag race. Seems a little better going down hill than the M.
The key to both is WEP. When it runs out, the M is a more capable dog fighter and the N becomes the biggest brick of the P-47 line. Last time I brought down Juggler (rare occurance) in his N, it was because he ran out of WEP.
In summary, M is better if you want to go up. N is better if you want to go down. All either will let you do vs any other jug is escape some fights where you'd normally get run down.
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Alright thanks
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I watched Redbull one day throw around a P47N on the deck as if it were a spit.
I spent a lot of time on the P47M. Pop the flaps at the top of the loop or near the bottom and you are golden. Pop the flaps in a turn and you had better make the shot. The N is the same but damn that weight. And be willing to use that high speed dive to seek a better position in both.
The N is a slick plane for sure but even with 25% fuel it still weighs a lot. The N climb rate even with 25% fuel is awful where as the M and the D40 can with WEP be real good although still way short of a spit as an example. The M accelerates well with wep and to me a little faster than the N with 25% fuel although I have not timed it.. If you get caught climbing in the N, it want pitch over as fast as the M. The M snaps rolls better than the N and rolls quicker.
I have just in the last couple of days moved to the P38. The P47M stick time really helped with the P38 albeit I have embarrassed myself by augering in a couple of times, maybe even three in the P38 after forgetting the 38 has limited dive speeds as compared to the 47.
Try the M, it can teach you a lot.
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M and N have the exact same engine. The exact same horsepower.
N has a heavier dry weight, just from the wing and hardware...
N has squared wingtips, but also plugs in the wingroots to extend wingspan slightly. This means overall it has a bigger wing area. Often this is not much of a benefit because of the extra weight, but I am sure there are some circumstances when you're stalling out with full flaps that this plane will do better than the M will.
N guns are slightly wider apart. The extra plugs of wing are added at the wing root. Shouldn't matter too much, but to be noted as a difference. Hit at convergence and you'll still hit.
Only real differences when folks claim the M is faster, accelerates better, or hangs on prop better, are often due to fuel weight in the loadout. M never flew with AH's ficticious overload-ammo setting, and I don't think they ever flew with 8 guns. Try it with 6 guns+267rpg and the weight savings will really make it shine. M vs N, the M will always have a slight edge, but this is based almost entirely on weight savings. If you get a heavy M and a light N, the tables can turn.
That said, this is just a hypothetical matchup between and M and an N. They're really close enough that (all other things being equal) it will come down to pilot ability. Very generally speaking, take the M to dogfight, and take the N for long range escorts, ground pounding, or multi-role missions.
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I'm going to have to try the smaller gun package then. never thought about that
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M and N have the exact same engine. The exact same horsepower.
N has a heavier dry weight, just from the wing and hardware...
N has squared wingtips, but also plugs in the wingroots to extend wingspan slightly. This means overall it has a bigger wing area. Often this is not much of a benefit because of the extra weight, but I am sure there are some circumstances when you're stalling out with full flaps that this plane will do better than the M will.
N guns are slightly wider apart. The extra plugs of wing are added at the wing root. Shouldn't matter too much, but to be noted as a difference. Hit at convergence and you'll still hit.
Only real differences when folks claim the M is faster, accelerates better, or hangs on prop better, are often due to fuel weight in the loadout. M never flew with AH's ficticious overload-ammo setting, and I don't think they ever flew with 8 guns. Try it with 6 guns+267rpg and the weight savings will really make it shine. M vs N, the M will always have a slight edge, but this is based almost entirely on weight savings. If you get a heavy M and a light N, the tables can turn.
That said, this is just a hypothetical matchup between and M and an N. They're really close enough that (all other things being equal) it will come down to pilot ability. Very generally speaking, take the M to dogfight, and take the N for long range escorts, ground pounding, or multi-role missions.
There ya have it. It could not have been said any better.
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Leave the ammo in the hangar if you like but leaving the extra guns is a mistake in my opinion. The gun weight is an afterthought to a plane that weighs over 10000lbs.
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Leave the ammo in the hangar if you like but leaving the extra guns is a mistake in my opinion. The gun weight is an afterthought to a plane that weighs over 10000lbs.
I look at it one of 2 ways: If I'm going in to a furball and the wee bit less weight may make a legit difference in my ability to maneuver, etc, then I will leave the extra guns and ammo behind. However, in the case of the long range/high alt escort duty or the ground-pounder role I will always take the extra guns and ammo. While flying escort in most cases your shots will be at high speeds and a gun solution will only be available for a split second and that calls for the maximum amount of damage in the shortest amount of time. I also set my convergence out a wee bit further than typical for me because I will take the "deterrent" shot at greater than normal distance to get an interceptor to break. In the case of ground pounding there should be no explanation needed. :aok
The P47x is a versatile plane without a doubt.
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If your flying the jug to dogfight you've already messed up,, leaving guns at home might save your life for an extra few seconds while taking them with you might give you a kill sooner than not! I love to fly the jug,, but I fly it with plenty of fuel and ammo!,, I fly it high and use its speed and guns to kill whatever I can find below it!,, I like the M and the D-40, for gunning and the N for heavy destruction TheN will turn better than the M at slow speeds. But if your slow in a jug,,, you better hope your fighting another jug! :airplane:
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N guns are slightly wider apart. The extra plugs of wing are added at the wing root. Shouldn't matter too much, but to be noted as a difference. Hit at convergence and you'll still hit.
The guns are quite significantly wider apart. Sometimes I feel that if I saddle up on a yak9 and shoot from point blanc the bullet streams will safely pass on each side around the yak. Does not matter much at convergence, but definitely matters when hitting outside of convergence. For me the N is the least fun of all the Jugs. Then again, the D11/25 are the most fun so maybe I am not a good example.
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If your flying the jug to dogfight you've already messed up,
Crap!!! I've been doing it wrong for years!
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Crap!!! I've been doing it wrong for years!
:noid I love to kill spixteens with them,, and I have,, not many times,, but I have,, that being said,, the Spixteen driver wasn't very good at his job!!! and to have died to the jug should be wake up call!! :bhead
I fly the jug because it is heavily armed and pretty darn fast,, I was never great at dog fighting anyway, and my gunnery isn't all that great,, so as many guns and as much motor as I can get is the plane I want!
next tour I will dog fight the jug the whole month just to see the end result tho,, I doubt it will be pretty tho!!! :O
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The guns are quite significantly wider apart. Sometimes I feel that if I saddle up on a yak9 and shoot from point blanc the bullet streams will safely pass on each side around the yak. Does not matter much at convergence, but definitely matters when hitting outside of convergence. For me the N is the least fun of all the Jugs. Then again, the D11/25 are the most fun so maybe I am not a good example.
Yup....gunnery is TONS different, I find it lots easier to hit stuff with the other jugs, but I still usually fly the N
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The guns are quite significantly wider apart. Sometimes I feel that if I saddle up on a yak9 and shoot from point blanc the bullet streams will safely pass on each side around the yak. Does not matter much at convergence, but definitely matters when hitting outside of convergence. For me the N is the least fun of all the Jugs. Then again, the D11/25 are the most fun so maybe I am not a good example.
+1 on that, it's been my main issue when converting to the jug from the p51.
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just got another 262 kill with the Jug M that is just to much fun!!!!! :airplane: :airplane: :airplane:
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To the OP, the M jug climbs waaaaaay better and accelerates waaaaay better due to the N's extra weight. The difference is not marginal, it's huge.
p47m v. p47n???? Fly the Mary when you want to kill planes. Fly the Nancy when you want to carry ords.
Oh and go light. Only if you plan on landing 8 or more kills should you take the full fuel and ammo in the Mary. Otherwise, go with 75% fuel and the light ammo package. DO NOT rtb when you're down to 10 minnutes of fuel and 200 rounds per bank. This is when you are most lethal. This is when you are a Spit47. :devil
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All these years and I don't think to try that. I know what I'm doing tomorrow now.
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For some reason I can't modify my post. Anyways, I take back what I said about the N jug as a jabo plane. At 50% fuel, it gives you about the same flight time as a D40 at 100% fuel, but climbs about 100ft/min better on wep. The N jug may be my new fav jabo.
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The N with 25% fuel, a full load of ammo two thousand pound'ers, a five hundred pound'er, and ten rockets is one slow climber but if you get there without being jumped, you can ruin some GV red guy's night.
Once in awhile, I mind myself in a perfect 47 furbal where me and everybody else is on the deck in a crowded sky and I can pitch the P47 up in WEP climbing, low, hard, rudder assisted turn just off the deck with a pop of flap at the top. Kind of like flying in a shallow soup bowl. That is some kind of fun till the WEP runs out. The N seems to do well because it heads to the ground like a rock.
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At 50% fuel, it gives you about the same flight time as a D40 at 100% fuel,
50% in the N is the same flight time as 75% in the D40.
but climbs about 100ft/min better on wep.
...and much worse on MIL. The N completely relies on its WEP for fighting or fleeing, never waste it on the climb out unless you have a long long travel to the target during which the WEP can cool. If you arrive at the target with little WEP time left, you would have been better off coming in a D40.
The N jug may be my new fav jabo.
The D40 will get you and your ord faster to the target. N will get you out of there faster.
Of course, if you were smart and saved your WEP, the N makes a better fighter after releasing the ord.
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I kill everyone equally well in both. And I haven't logged in for six months up until a week ago
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Bozon, the climb on the N is equal to the D40 when off-wep when at similar weight loadings. The main differences are the charts on the N include full fuel so folks always claim it's way worse. It's not. It's like comparing a P-51D with 100% fuel and 2 DTs to a P-51B that has 25% internally.... sure the charts will look different, but it's not a useful baseline to establish!
As for the convergence, if you think it's THAT bad, it's in your head. They aren't that much further out than on the other jugs. The plug/insert into each wing was only something on the order of 10 inches. The guns themselves are staggered over more distance than that!
In ANY plane if you're saddling up on a yak point blank when your guns are set to 300, you're not going to do crap. That's just a sad fact of jugs, ponies, and about 1/3 the planes in this game. Even in a standard jug you're only going to barely hit one of his wingtips.
And if you're monkeying your rudder about to get a 10-yard shot with guns set to 300, so that ONE of your wings' guns hits the fuselage or cockpit, while wasting all your E and half your ammo, you're just doing it wrong.
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Bozon, the climb on the N is equal to the D40 when off-wep when at similar weight loadings. The main differences are the charts on the N include full fuel so folks always claim it's way worse. It's not. It's like comparing a P-51D with 100% fuel and 2 DTs to a P-51B that has 25% internally.... sure the charts will look different, but it's not a useful baseline to establish!
I am not looking at the charts. My baseline is 50% N vs. 75% D40 which gives the same flight time on MIL. I haven't touched the N in ages, so to my recollection, the N is the slower climber. More weight and more wet area for the same power does not look promising for the N. Easy enough to test tonight.
As for the convergence, if you think it's THAT bad, it's in your head. They aren't that much further out than on the other jugs. The plug/insert into each wing was only something on the order of 10 inches. The guns themselves are staggered over more distance than that!
The overall wingspan increased by about 10 inches (per wing), but that included chopping the wingtips to square them. The added inner section was 18 inches, which means that the baseline of the guns was increase by 36 inches (0.9 meter). This is not huge, but not insignificant either.
And if you're monkeying your rudder about to get a 10-yard shot with guns set to 300, so that ONE of your wings' guns hits the fuselage or cockpit, while wasting all your E and half your ammo, you're just doing it wrong.
I try to follow old spit ace "screwball" tactic: kick the rudder so you have one set of guns pointing at the pilot's head and the other set up his oscar.
J/K, if he is 10 yards in front I do not waste any ammo. I just skillfully ram him.
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The overall wingspan increased by about 10 inches (per wing), but that included chopping the wingtips to square them. The added inner section was 18 inches, which means that the baseline of the guns was increase by 36 inches (0.9 meter). This is not huge, but not insignificant either.
The wingtips weren't chopped so much as redesigned entirely. They didn't just (literally) stick plugs on the wing of a 47D. The entire thing was redesigned to act as a wet wing. It was built new. For example, the ailerons are actually larger than those found on the D/M. They reach out further.
As for the gun emplacement, from what I've been able to tell, trying to overlay wing profiles from the D40 and the N, the innermost #1 and #2 guns on the N start about where the #3 and #4 are on the D so that they're superimposed over each other.
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The wingtips weren't chopped so much as redesigned entirely. They didn't just (literally) stick plugs on the wing of a 47D. The entire thing was redesigned to act as a wet wing. It was built new. For example, the ailerons are actually larger than those found on the D/M. They reach out further.
As for the gun emplacement, from what I've been able to tell, trying to overlay wing profiles from the D40 and the N, the innermost #1 and #2 guns on the N start about where the #3 and #4 are on the D so that they're superimposed over each other.
:airplane: A little info on the developement of the "N", might help with this discussion!
The P-47N version of the Thunderbolt was the last version to be manufactured in quantity. It was a specialized long-range version built specifically for service in the Pacific theatre.
Four P-47D-27-RE airframes (serials 42-27385/27388) had been taken off the production line at Farmingdale and fitted with the Pratt & Whitney R-2800-57(C) engine driving a larger CH-5 turbosupercharger. This engine could produce a war emergency power of 2800 hp at 32,500 feet with water injection. These aircraft had been redesignated YP-47M and served as the prototypes for the P-47M series.
However, the war in the Pacific required fighter ranges even greater than did operations over Germany. In pursuit of better long-range performance, in mid-1944 the third YP-47M prototype (42-27387) was fitted with a new "wet" wing of slightly larger span and area. The aircraft was redesignated XP-47N. For the first time in the Thunderbolt series fuel was carried in the wings, a 93 US gallon tank being fitted in each wing. When maximum external tankage was carried, this brought the total fuel load of the XP-47N up to an impressive 1266 US gallons. This fuel load make it possible for a range of 2350 miles to be achieved.
The new wing also incorporated larger ailerons and squared-off wingtips. These innovations enhanced the roll-rate of the Thunderbolt and improved the maneuverability. The dorsal fin behind the bubble canopy was somewhat larger than that on the P-47D. However, the increased fuel load increased the gross weight of the aircraft. In order to cope with the increased gross weight, the undercarriage of the XP-47N had to be strengthened, which increased the weight still further. The maximum weight rose to over 20,000 pounds.
The XP-47N flew for the first time on July 22, 1944. Such was the USAAF confidence in the Thunderbolt design that they went ahead and ordered 1900 P-47Ns in June 20, 1944, even before the first XP-47N had flown.
The P-47N was destined to be the last version of the Thunderbolt to be manufactured. The first P-47N-1-RE appeared in September of 1944, and 24 were delivered by year's end. The P-47N-5-RE and subsequent batches had zero-length rocket launchers added. The R-2800-77 engine was installed in late production models such as the P-47N-25-RE.
The P-47N gave excellent service in the Pacific in the last year of the War, particularly in escorting B-29 Superfortress bombers in raids on the Japanese mainland. P-47Ns were able to escort the bombers all the way from Saipan to Japan and on many other long, overwater flights.
A total of 1667 P-47Ns was produced by the Farmingdale plant between December 1944 and December 1945, when the Thunderbolt line finally closed down. 149 more P-47Ns were built by the Evansville factory. V-J Day cancellation of 5934 Thunderbolts brought production of the type abruptly to an end.
Performance of the P-47N-5-RE included a maximum speed of 397 mph at 10,000 feet, 448 mph at at 25,000 feet, and 460 mph at 30,000 feet. Initial climb rate was 2770 feet per minute at 5000 feet and 2550 feet per minute at 20,000 feet. Range (clean) was 800 miles at 10,000 feet. Armanent included six or eight 0.50-inch machine guns with 500 rpg and two 1000-lb or three 500-lb bombs or ten 5-inch rockets. Weights were 11,000 pounds empty, 16,300 pounds normal loaded, and 20,700 pounds maximum. Dimension were wingspan 42 feet 7 inches, length 36 feet 4 inches, height 14 feet 7 inches, and wing area 322 square feet
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:airplane: A little info on the developement of the "N", might help with this discussion!
Not really. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude. It's just that we know the basics of the history. It would appear the discussion has run its course.
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I guess that means you got what you wanted out of the discussion?
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Not really. I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude. It's just that we know the basics of the history. It would appear the discussion has run its course.
WEEEElllllll...as long as KRUSTY is happy...(I thought it was very interesting :aok)
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Bullplop. The topic had run its course, all questions had been discussed, pros and cons weighed, and even a side topic about the wing differences was discussed. Then the thread was dead for 2 weeks and he copy+pastes some wikipedia answer of stuff that was already known or covered. Relevant, yes. Helpful, no. 2-week-dead-thread, yes.
So I'm sorry if I'm coming across as rude. Icepac and bj229 are just coming across as intentionally flamebaiting by trying to throw it back in my face. My point is still more than valid and if earl feels slighted let him speak up. He can post plenty of helpful topics and I've seen him do so before. This topic had run its course and was in the archives for 2 weeks.
Any additional comments after 2 weeks are of a high probability to be breaking #2, #4, or #10.
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I was just asking what criteria you used to determine that "discussion has run it's course".
Are you the guy who determines that for everybody else?.......because it seems that way from the posting.
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Krusty if you were actually trying not to be rude, you wouldn't have posted anything at all. He posted something he thought was relevant to the thread and you beat him up about it. If anyone is baiting, it's you.
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Bullplop. The topic had run its course, all questions had been discussed, pros and cons weighed, and even a side topic about the wing differences was discussed. Then the thread was dead for 2 weeks and he copy+pastes some wikipedia answer of stuff that was already known or covered. Relevant, yes. Helpful, no. 2-week-dead-thread, yes.
So I'm sorry if I'm coming across as rude. Icepac and bj229 are just coming across as intentionally flamebaiting by trying to throw it back in my face. My point is still more than valid and if earl feels slighted let him speak up. He can post plenty of helpful topics and I've seen him do so before. This topic had run its course and was in the archives for 2 weeks.
Any additional comments after 2 weeks are of a high probability to be breaking #2, #4, or #10.
:airplane: No problem Krusty and the info I provide did not come from Wikipedia, although in looking at their info on the "Nancy", most of it came from a web site which "Jug" lovers use. Good info and I really thought it might be helpful to someone who just came into the game. Good topic though and we need to see more of them.
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Well, historically, the 47 N had wing tanks (internal) to be able to escort B29s. :rock
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And it's FAR cooler :aok
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Bullplop. The topic had run its course, all questions had been discussed, pros and cons weighed, and even a side topic about the wing differences was discussed. Then the thread was dead for 2 weeks and he copy+pastes some wikipedia answer of stuff that was already known or covered. Relevant, yes. Helpful, no. 2-week-dead-thread, yes.
So I'm sorry if I'm coming across as rude. Icepac and bj229 are just coming across as intentionally flamebaiting by trying to throw it back in my face. My point is still more than valid and if earl feels slighted let him speak up. He can post plenty of helpful topics and I've seen him do so before. This topic had run its course and was in the archives for 2 weeks.
Any additional comments after 2 weeks are of a high probability to be breaking #2, #4, or #10.
First of all 12 days is not two weeks.
Second, 12 days will break no forum rules whatsoever, particularily as slow as the forums have become over the past few years and even more so in this forum which tends to be even slower moving.
It's no wonder you have little credibility given your propensity at exaggeration.
You're just mad because someone questioned the all knowing Krusty and you didn't get the last word.
Finally, to start with "not to be rude" meant you knew you were being rude and went on anyway.
What a clown.
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Because of this thread I tried out the p47m with 8 guns 50% ammo. I love it. With a long wep time it feels almost as fast as a 51. What I shoot at and hit goes down. Now my question. If I take 100% ammo and fire off half of it, will I still have a weight penalty?
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You're only talking about a couple hundred pounds in a 14000 pound plane
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Because of this thread I tried out the p47m with 8 guns 50% ammo. I love it. With a long wep time it feels almost as fast as a 51. What I shoot at and hit goes down. Now my question. If I take 100% ammo and fire off half of it, will I still have a weight penalty?
No, the flight model calculates your current weight depending on fuel and ammo on board.
I always take the full ammo load. I am an extremely bad shot, so I go trigger happy till the counters show 1000 and then start to aim before shooting. 1000 on the counter is about the amount of the reduced load.
Why leave ammo in the hangar when you can throw it at the enemy?
You're only talking about a couple hundred pounds in a 14000 pound plane
The straw that broke the camel's back?
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The difference with the smaller ammo package is about 400lbs. That's nothing to scoff at.
I always take the 75% fuel and the 8x.50 small ammo package for hops that are only a sector away and I frequently land with less than 5min of fuel. I fly the jug enough to notice the subtle differences. The least subtle would be how the center of gravity moves to the nose when you don't have fuel in your aux tank. Makes swinging the nose down at the tops of loops easier.
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I found if I take the full load of ammo then use half of it on the first pass, I am at the perfect fighting weight. :airplane:
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If you ask this question on country channel, most responses will read like this.
The N is obviously better in all ways because M comes earlier in the alphabet than N.
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You are all forgetting the best 47 fighter, the 47-11, it's a beast when it's light. I've killed many spits and corsairs in dogfights with the -11
Skyhawk
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You are all forgetting the best 47 fighter, the 47-11, it's a beast when it's light. I've killed many spits and corsairs in dogfights with the -11
Skyhawk
Yeah....but it's slower, and without wingies, a challenging plane in the MA environment
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Yeah....but it's slower, and without wingies, a challenging plane in the MA environment
Slower?! It is the FASTEST jug (without WEP, under 25k...)
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Pfft! N puts it away, AND, it compresses badly in dives. (At any rate, Spixteen catches D11, doesn't catch N?)
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D-25 is kinda pokey, but if I was to rank at the most potential:
Knife Fighters:
D-11, M, D-25 (Best of both worlds)
BnZ:
D-40, N, D-25
Deackers/Attackers:
D-40, N
Ea. are different in my opinion.
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doesn't matter what fuel load out or ammo you take in a jug......it makes no matter to my KI84 :t
this is a small pun IE jab and not meant to be taken personal or insulting to any player person or plane
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It dosen't matter which jug you take out.
First you simply have to throw yourself out there and get shot at for awhile. Jugs are not like spits which I've only met one player in all these years who couldn't fly them. Jugs require stick time before you can make them dance. Problem with giving them the proper amount of stick time, they get addictive becasue victories in them are so spectacular and satisfying. And so to is defeat when you let your guard down.
Long time ago I used to be YUCCA's squadmate. He would take me out in the bushes with the D40 and N to dance with spitfires on the deck, 25% fuel, dropper and all 8 guns fully loaded. We never climbed over 5k becasue we were trolling for spits. Some of the time I'd land with him. Much of the time I finaly got nailed and he'd land later with scalps from taking on 2-3 spits alone.
You gotta spend the time and get to know the Jug or everything in this post is meaningless. By the time it's meaningfull, you need to join Juggs Anonyumous. Looks like we have a number of JA members not yet recovered sharing in here.
Right now I'm pissed at Messiah because he caused me to relapse. I hate 3 v 1 in the bushes in a Jug.......I don't care if I won. It's the never ending conga line of all their freinds wanting a peice while HOing on every pass........and I'm stuck in the bushes with those ideots trying to get out of Dodge as the only green guy in the sector. Jugs are revenge magnets.....don't fly Jugs...everybody with a slingshot wants a peice of you once you can out fly the bottom feeders in their training wheel rides.
INK is sneeky. He flys the Ki84 and everybody expects it to be some uber stick and acts appropriatly. Show up in a Jug and everyone in the furball wants the fat kid becasue the fat kid is always the worst at everything........Messiah you CREEP!! I told you I hate Juggggs..........
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It dosen't matter which jug you take out.
First you simply have to throw yourself out there and get shot at for awhile. Jugs are not like spits which I've only met one player in all these years who couldn't fly them. Jugs require stick time before you can make them dance. Problem with giving them the proper amount of stick time, they get addictive becasue victories in them are so spectacular and satisfying. And so to is defeat when you let your guard down.
Long time ago I used to be YUCCA's squadmate. He would take me out in the bushes with the D40 and N to dance with spitfires on the deck, 25% fuel, dropper and all 8 guns fully loaded. We never climbed over 5k becasue we were trolling for spits. Some of the time I'd land with him. Much of the time I finaly got nailed and he'd land later with scalps from taking on 2-3 spits alone.
You gotta spend the time and get to know the Jug or everything in this post is meaningless. By the time it's meaningfull, you need to join Juggs Anonyumous. Looks like we have a number of JA members not yet recovered sharing in here.
Right now I'm pissed at Messiah because he caused me to relapse. I hate 3 v 1 in the bushes in a Jug.......I don't care if I won. It's the never ending conga line of all their freinds wanting a peice while HOing on every pass........and I'm stuck in the bushes with those ideots trying to get out of Dodge as the only green guy in the sector. Jugs are revenge magnets.....don't fly Jugs...everybody with a slingshot wants a peice of you once you can out fly the bottom feeders in their training wheel rides.
INK is sneeky. He flys the Ki84 and everybody expects it to be some uber stick and acts appropriatly. Show up in a Jug and everyone in the furball wants the fat kid becasue the fat kid is always the worst at everything........Messiah you CREEP!! I told you I hate Juggggs..........
:lol
if I was sneaky I would fly the 16....and shoot at people from 2K :D
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.....don't fly Jugs...everybody with a slingshot wants a peice of you
:O
See, that is where you are going wrong. Fly your Jug but get a P38 driver as a wing-man to be bait. Pickers can't see the 47 with a 38 around. :D
What I miss about the 47 is that dive speed and that butt load of bullets.