Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: Brooke on April 13, 2013, 03:30:54 AM
-
I was happy to see the Ki-43 added for historical reasons, but I figured that it would not be a very effective plane in the Main Arena because of armament.
I flew it several times tonight, and it seems like a surprisingly nice plane to me. Very nimble in turn and roll, good climb, and seems to handle much better at speed than a Zero. Importantly, the armament, while of course underpowered compared 2 20 mm cannon or to 6 50's, seems good enough for turn-and-burn fights.
-
All the above, plus the bomb load makes it an effective attack platform.
-
It makes a rather effective anti armour platfom.
-
It makes a rather effective anti armour platfom.
Which loadout do you prefer, the 110 mm AP center mount, or the twin 2000 lb anti-armor cluster munitions?
-
I'm loving it.
The flaps on it are awesome. It seems a tad bit tougher than the Zekes to me. I also like the WEP on it (quick burn, quick charge).
Very light on the stick, has bomb options and a very good range.
I am still able to get 3-4 kills in it with some ammo to spare.
Thanks HTC :salute
-
Excellent fun plane. Had some great fights with shamus and baldeale in ki43s the other night in the ma.
I would say the guns are, if anything, too potent. Check this kill out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYhmnScWy_w&feature=youtu.be
-
Which loadout do you prefer, the 110 mm AP center mount, or the twin 2000 lb anti-armor cluster munitions?
maw I have a code where I use the British cookie bomb :D I use it as a low alt dive bomber.
-
Excellent fun plane. Had some great fights with shamus and baldeale in ki43s the other night in the ma.
I would say the guns are, if anything, too potent. Check this kill out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYhmnScWy_w&feature=youtu.be
Taters! Has to be. Great shot btw>
-
It seems a tad bit tougher than the Zekes to me.
Which is odd considering the Ki-43 was noted to be even MORE lightly-armored and built than the Zero.
-
Which is odd considering the Ki-43 was noted to be even MORE lightly-armored and built than the Zero.
Not less armored, just lighter built. The Ki-43-II actually added a little bit of armor, something the A6M3 is completely devoid of.
The A6M was built tougher though. I imagine it had to be simply by virtue of being a carrier based fighter.
-
Which loadout do you prefer, the 110 mm AP center mount, or the twin 2000 lb anti-armor cluster munitions?
Heehee. I got a twofer last night, of a Panther and a Panzer IV. Those guys stopped clustering together near that spawn point pretty quickly. Then you get to have turney fun with all the late war birds who chase you down to the deck when you make your controlled descent (things fall off) to engage your ground targets, but I have to say that I'm impressed at how hard Shawk fights his F4U vs. a Ki and how well people are adapting to not engaging in a TnB duel with a Ki43.
-
Absolutely loving it. Providing most fun (consistent) fights I've had in months if not years. So many challenges but once you latch on to something within 200 it's a laugh a minute as they try shake you off and that's what it's all about imho and keeps me interested in the game.
Before the Yak T provided the same kind of laughs with it's big cannon and trying to time perfect single shots. Now it's the feeling of being able to turn inside a fly, down something else with just two mg under 200 and knowing that the other guy is thinking "oh sh*t" once you are in close enough. :lol
Never thought I'd be interested in the Ki, big surprise. Be interesting to see who still flying them on regular basis after the two week novelty has died down.
<S>...-Gixer
-
the zero (M32 and b) is still superior for me - 2x20mm is really important to make those reversals count (because they will 90% of the time dive and quickly outrun you) and the more gentle sakai torque.
-
I love using it in anti-tank sortie! :)
-
I'm loving it.
The flaps on it are awesome. It seems a tad bit tougher than the Zekes to me. I also like the WEP on it (quick burn, quick charge).
Very light on the stick, has bomb options and a very good range.
I am still able to get 3-4 kills in it with some ammo to spare.
Thanks HTC :salute
So two gv kills and one plane???
-
I would say the guns are, if anything, too potent.
Untrue.
I think they have been modeled really well.
-
Untrue.
I think they have been modeled really well.
Unless I am gravely mistaken, they are the same machine guns as on the Ki-84, Ki-61 and Ki-67 so they really didn't need to model them again. Just plugged the existing model into the Ki-43-II's data.
-
Untrue.
I think they have been modeled really well.
Did you see the short video clip posted with the coment?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYhmnScWy_w&feature=youtu.be
My comment was moderately tongue in cheek accordingly.
-
This thing flies like a TIE FIGHTER :devil
When it comes to shooting targets... I'm an "angles" and "snap-shots" type of guy... so I gotta get off LW and RAF mentality when it comes to firepower that suits "angles" and "snap-shots" real well when flying this plane :cry
-
This thing flies like a TIE FIGHTER :devil
Meh, the TIE Fighter has been overmodeled since at LEAST XvT, if not earlier to introduce artificial balance for the multiplayer games (don't make me go all nerd on you to prove it).
-
(don't make me go all nerd on you to prove it).
Too late :D
-
Sax is just mad because we tie fighter pilots wax his y-wings daily. :rock
-
:furious next thing you know they will give shields to the TIE fighter
-
Its a fun ride. Handles really well, good climb, acceleration is not bad. The armament isn't heavy of course so you have to get in close. It certainly isn't meant to fight LWA 1944-45 400 mph+ rides but each to their own.
-
:furious next thing you know they will give shields to the TIE fighter
:aok :cheers: :rofl
-
Its a fun ride. Handles really well, good climb, acceleration is not bad. The armament isn't heavy of course so you have to get in close. It certainly isn't meant to fight LWA 1944-45 400 mph+ rides but each to their own.
tsk... if only if we get the _definitive_ Hayabusa (Ki-43-III) :devil
from sources i've seen the Mk III is ~20 mph faster
-
Ammo count has been updated to 540 rounds, good to see HT make the change so promptly.
Finding that using Ki takes patience, patience to pick the right fights. Hard to do in the MA surrounded by late war uber rides. Though lot of fun trying.
<S>...-Gixer
-
Ammo count has been updated to 540 rounds, good to see HT make the change so promptly.
Finding that using Ki takes patience, patience to pick the right fights. Hard to do in the MA surrounded by late war uber rides. Though lot of fun trying.
<S>...-Gixer
Not really, I find diving into a swarm of red and killing 1-3 before I leave or they get a good/lucky shot is quite fun and not all that hard. 40 more rounds means even more kills :x
-
I prefer to find my own fights 1v1 or v2 not gang those already engaged.
<S>...-Gixer
-
Been waiting a long time for the Ki-43, and I've not been disappointed. It's an absolute ball to fly. Thanks, HTC. :airplane:
-
I prefer to find my own fights 1v1 or v2 not gang those already engaged.
<S>...-Gixer
Who said gang those already engaged? I would fight 1 v many in a Ki-43. That little Ki gives the LW monsters fits trying to hit you and its fun to keep rolling and diving hearing the next pony scream pass, guns blazing only to hit a tree that you just swung around.
-
I LOVE IT.
-
On some maps, with mountains, where it's possible to trap enemy cons at the "bottom of the barrel" so to speak, the Ki-43 is superb. The day it was released I did just that and downed a P-39 and a P-38 and an F4U. Had an epic dogfit with another P-38 that lasted for nearly 5 minutes. Can't remember who the pilot was, but he could really haul that lightning around at low-levels. Didn't help that I had to keep dodging passes made by his fellows. Great fun however.
Nevertheless, the Oscar seems a bit squirrely to me. I've found myself flying into unexpected spins which are difficult if not impossible to come out of. This doesn't seem right, because I've not had that sort of problem with any other aircraft that I've flown in game. With its extremely low wing loading dangerous spins shouldn't be a problem.
Anybody else having that problem?
-
Anybody else having that problem?
It's true that the Oscar has some unusual stall qualities. OTOH, unless you are really on the deck, it's slow enough that you can usually recover.
Nothing is as bad as the Spit I's inverted StallSpinCrashBurn.
- oldman
-
I tried it a couple times, the horizontal stability seemed weird to say the least
-
Based on my subjective experience the directional stability certainly feels worse than average. One thing that could contribute to this problem with Ki-43 again is the prop mass. The symptoms aren't nearly as bad as the I-16's but they seem to be there nonetheless. It certainly exhibits such behavior that the prop mass could be the culprit.
-
Nice plane.....I found a P51 who was AFK and shot him up before stupidly colliding.
I'm happy to report I did not fly away undamaged but blew up right away..........which is how it should be.
-
out flew a p47, tempest and 190.
pilot killed one from 400 yards whilst flying rings around them. Haven't managed to stall the thing yet.
was it really this good? because against it's compatriots lets say zero, brewster, hurri 1 it could possibly out turn them all with ease.
-
out flew a p47, tempest and 190.
pilot killed one from 400 yards whilst flying rings around them. Haven't managed to stall the thing yet.
was it really this good? because against it's compatriots lets say zero, brewster, hurri 1 it could possibly out turn them all with ease.
It should and did out fly the hurri and Brewster. The complaints about it were never about its flying ability or characteristics. I don't seem to have an issue fighting one in a Zeke2. However I haven't managed to nail one yet in the Zeke3 or Zeke5....the Oscar gives me fits when I'm in either of them.
And bruv you know the word good is subjective when speaking of aircraft :salute
-
It should and did out fly the hurri and Brewster. The complaints about it were never about its flying ability or characteristics. I don't seem to have an issue fighting one in a Zeke2. However I haven't managed to nail one yet in the Zeke3 or Zeke5....the Oscar gives me fits when I'm in either of them.
And bruv you know the word good is subjective when speaking of aircraft :salute
The Ki-43 proved to be more than a match for the Hurricane and Spitfires it met over Burma/India and chewed up the RAF/Commonwealth/Dutch B-339s (Brewsters) it ran into. Against a A6M2, I think it would boil down to pilot skill, while it should have a little advantage over the A6M3 and A6M5 in a turn fight.
ack-ack
-
the only questionable thing I can say about this plane right now is the hitting power of those 2 guns.
Yes I can shoot straighter than most and a round to the head is a round to the head. I would have thought the Ki-84's MG's would resemble what it should hit like. I would argue they are more powerful.
-
The Ki-43...chewed up the RAF/Commonwealth/Dutch B-339s (Brewsters) it ran into..
Thought I remember reading that the version of the 339 the Dutch received actually fared pretty well against the Japanese, and the Dutch were just overwhelmed by sheer numbers.
-
Are you finding them too weak Bruv? I've got film of me sawing a spit8's tail off with only 15 rounds fired. Definitely wouldn't want to make the 43's guns more powerful judging by that. But then some days my rounds seem to do no damage at all. The curse of playing across the atlantic perhaps?
-
I would have thought the Ki-84's MG's would resemble what it should hit like. I would argue they are more powerful.
They are exactly the same guns and, per HiTech's previous statements, the way AH is coded they will be calling the exact same code as the Ki-84's MGs. Odds are the difference you are noticing are created by the Ki-43's better maneuverability allowing it to get closer and be more accurate.
The Ho-103s are the middle of the pack heavy machine gun. They are better than the German and Italian heavy machine guns, and worse than the American and Russian heavy machine guns.
-
Are you finding them too weak Bruv? I've got film of me sawing a spit8's tail off with only 15 rounds fired. Definitely wouldn't want to make the 43's guns more powerful judging by that. But then some days my rounds seem to do no damage at all. The curse of playing across the atlantic perhaps?
no no I said they seem more powerful than the ki-84 MG's.
Killed some dude from 400 with minimal rounds. Anything from 200 or less dies very quickly. I would have to hit them more with 8x 303's.
If they are the same as karnak suggests then fair enough but doesn't seem like it.
-
Thought I remember reading that the version of the 339 the Dutch received actually fared pretty well against the Japanese, and the Dutch were just overwhelmed by sheer numbers.
The Dutch B-339 was lighter than the modified B-339E used by the RAF and Commonwealth air forces and if provided with enough warning to get to altitude for the intercept did enjoy some success against the Ki-43 and Zekes.
ack-ack
-
I thought that the rounds in the Ki-43's guns are explosive. That would give a good amount of extra lethality to them compared to non-explosive ones on the Ki-84's MG's.
-
I thought that the rounds in the Ki-43's guns are explosive. That would give a good amount of extra lethality to them compared to non-explosive ones on the Ki-84's MG's.
If the rounds in the Ki-43's guns were explosive then the rounds in the Ki-84's guns were probably also explosive. I can't think of a reason for the Japanese to complicate logistics by having different rounds for the different planes. Ki-61's, Ki-44s and Ki-67's too.
As to the Ki-43 in AH, I just downed two B-17Gs by shooting their right wings off. Got proximity credit for an ack kill on the third. I didn't see how many rounds I landed with.
-
In regards to the hitting power of the Ho-103 12.7mm machine cannon, I think HTC has done a great job with it. Poorer armor penetrating capabilities, with a pretty good result on wings and fuselage.
“This combat tends to confirm intelligence reports that state that the Hayabusa's machine cannon, though having poor penetrative powers, had significant explosive effect. A Type 1 fighter that he identified as a ZEKE hit 1 st Lt. Roy Klanrud a P-40 pilot of the 35 th FS. According to Klanrud: “I knew I was badly shot up…I expected another attack which would have been fatal because my elevator and coolant was shot up by a 20mm cannon. Three bullets hit my armor plate and glanced off, clearing out the glass of the canopy on the left side.” More than one American fighter pilot hit by 12.7mm explosive rounds thought he had been hit by the larger 20mm round fired by the Japanese Navy's Zero fighter. A partial explanation for this phenomenon is suggested by findings of Britain's Ordnance Board that tested Japanese army 12.7mm ammunition. A 1944 report said: “The fuse of the H.E./I. [high explosive/incendiary] shell is probably too sensitive for optimum performance.” In tests in India the same type ammunition failed to ignite fuel in a partially filled petrol tin, it was thought because “the blast effect was such that any possibility of petrol or petrol vapour being set on fire was nullified because of this.” Another report concluded the super-sensitive fuse was likely to explode against an aircraft's wing or fuselage skin before penetrating to a fuel tank. Japanese armor piercing ammunition was found to be effective against certain types of Allied armor at least at close ranges on the order of 100 yards.”
http://www.j-aircraft.com/research/rdunn/248th/248th-2.htm
-
If the rounds in the Ki-43's guns were explosive then the rounds in the Ki-84's guns were probably also explosive. I can't think of a reason for the Japanese to complicate logistics by having different rounds for the different planes. Ki-61's, Ki-44s and Ki-67's too.
As to the Ki-43 in AH, I just downed two B-17Gs by shooting their right wings off. Got proximity credit for an ack kill on the third. I didn't see how many rounds I landed with.
I think so too.
HTC modelled Ho-103 well.
-
If they are the same as karnak suggests then fair enough but doesn't seem like it.
I think Karnak's right. Like you, I also sensed that the MGs were more powerful than I expected (I'm used to 202's odd armament), but it's probably because one does tend to get in close with the Oscar.
Heck, you really can't help it.
- oldman
-
no no I said they seem more powerful than the ki-84 MG's.
Killed some dude from 400 with minimal rounds. Anything from 200 or less dies very quickly. I would have to hit them more with 8x 303's.
If they are the same as karnak suggests then fair enough but doesn't seem like it.
Ahhh that makes sense, I misunderstood your meaning. I tend to agree, although, when guys like Karnak hold a differing opinion in WWII data matters I have found him to be much more righter than me almost every time :D
-
I thought that the rounds in the Ki-43's guns are explosive. That would give a good amount of extra lethality to them compared to non-explosive ones on the Ki-84's MG's.
The Ho-103 guns did use explosive rounds but against well armored Allied planes its effects were reported to be marginal.
ack-ack
-
If the rounds in the Ki-43's guns were explosive then the rounds in the Ki-84's guns were probably also explosive. I can't think of a reason for the Japanese to complicate logistics by having different rounds for the different planes. Ki-61's, Ki-44s and Ki-67's too.
I haven't done the world's most-exhaustive study, but I haven't seen any reference to explosive rounds in the Ho-103 except with respect to the Ki-43. Maybe there wasn't sufficient production of explosive Ho-103 rounds to supply all aircraft types, and so they were prioritized to the Ki-43 since there were a lot of Ki-43's and since the Ki-43 needed them to be useful whereas the other aircraft had more powerful cannon and didn't need it. Also, nations at times did things that seemed counterproductive in terms of logistics (especially the Japanese with respect to ammo types).
-
Well, I guess I'll do some testing of the Ki-43's MGs in comparison to the Ki-84's and Ki-61's.
-
I haven't done the world's most-exhaustive study, but I haven't seen any reference to explosive rounds in the Ho-103 except with respect to the Ki-43. Maybe there wasn't sufficient production of explosive Ho-103 rounds to supply all aircraft types, and so they were prioritized to the Ki-43 since there were a lot of Ki-43's and since the Ki-43 needed them to be useful whereas the other aircraft had more powerful cannon and didn't need it. Also, nations at times did things that seemed counterproductive in terms of logistics (especially the Japanese with respect to ammo types).
You might find this site interesting to read. Nakajima Type 1 Model 1 Army Fighter (Ki 43-I) Armament -- A Reassessment (http://www.warbirdforum.com/rdunn43.htm)
ack-ack
-
You might find this site interesting to read. Nakajima Type 1 Model 1 Army Fighter (Ki 43-I) Armament -- A Reassessment (http://www.warbirdforum.com/rdunn43.htm)
ack-ack
Thanks -- it is an interesting read.
Summary for others: the author gives evidence and concludes that the large majority of Ki-43-I's in the war had one 7.7 mm MG with normal rounds and one 12.7 mm MG with explosive rounds (such as 1 AP, 1 HE, and 1 HE tracer loading).
-
Thanks -- it is an interesting read.
Summary for others: the author gives evidence and concludes that the large majority of Ki-43's in the war had one 7.7 mm MG with normal rounds and one 12.7 mm MG with explosive rounds (such as 1 AP, 1 HE, and 1 HE tracer loading).
No, the article is specific to Ki-43-Is. It doesn't address Ki-43-IIs or Ki-43-IIIs.
-
No, the article is specific to Ki-43-Is. It doesn't address Ki-43-IIs or Ki-43-IIIs.
You are correct. I should have been more precise.
-
You are correct. I should have been more precise.
We had a big go around on the forums when that article was first presented here. Krusty claimed it applied to all Ki-43s and others said it was about Ki-43-Is only.
Sorry if I came off as cutting you off at the knees.
-
We had a big go around on the forums when that article was first presented here. Krusty claimed it applied to all Ki-43s and others said it was about Ki-43-Is only.
Sorry if I came off as cutting you off at the knees.
No problem -- in fact, thank you for pointing that out. It's an important point.
I edited my above post to correct it.
-
No, the article is specific to Ki-43-Is. It doesn't address Ki-43-IIs or Ki-43-IIIs.
The reason I posted that link for Brooke is that it mentioned some of the issues with the various guns used on the Oscar, like the unreliability of the Ho-103 cannon.
ack-ack
-
The reason I posted that link for Brooke is that it mentioned some of the issues with the various guns used on the Oscar, like the unreliability of the Ho-103 cannon.
ack-ack
In aces high everything is perfect - Panther tanks, Tigers and King Tigers. If it was realistic we would have engines quitting, engines acting retarded - I can see it would piss off so many people they would quit.
I brought it up a few years back asking for a "realistic" arena, however the idea was shot down based on its already a steep enough learning curve, throw in some major malfunctions and people would rage quit.
-
Perhaps even a bigger issue than mechanical failures was the danger of weather.
-
In aces high everything is perfect - Panther tanks, Tigers and King Tigers. If it was realistic we would have engines quitting, engines acting retarded - I can see it would piss off so many people they would quit.
I brought it up a few years back asking for a "realistic" arena, however the idea was shot down based on its already a steep enough learning curve, throw in some major malfunctions and people would rage quit.
I didn't post it to show there was something wrong with the guns in game. I found the article to be interesting as it explained why the Ki-43 had various gun packages and issues with the guns.
ack-ack